sriracha john Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statement A transexual man is preparing to file a lawsuit with the Administrative Court against the army's statement in a conscription certificate (Sor Dor 43) which exempted him from service for having a ''mental disorder''. Samart Meecharoen, a 22-year-old student of Ban Somdej Chao Phraya Rajabhat University, said the document, issued two years ago, deprived him of career opportunities as a private firm turned down his application for a part-time job, citing it as the reason. His petition to the court, supported by the National Human Rights Commission, the Lawyers Council of Thailand, the Rainbow Sky Association of Thailand and the Saphan Group representing same-sex lovers, will be submitted to the court on Nov 10. If the court accepts the case for consideration, it will be the first of its kind in the country. Continued here: http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/02Nov2006_news16.php ------------------------------------------------------------- Good luck, Khun Samart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leisurely Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Mental disorder? blimey, it'll be suggested that gays can be cured next What absolute knackers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted November 2, 2006 Author Share Posted November 2, 2006 Long time didn't see your great post, Sir Raja John! Thank you, Oleg. but, I don't think we share the same opinion on this particular issue in the same way... which is ok. We agree on many other areas and that's great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvk1951 Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 I fail to see in the article where it is stated that the 'mental disorder' is related to katoyism. Would that be specified in the Sor Dor 43 or was this relationship contrived in the minds of the publicity seekers? Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statementA transexual man is preparing to file a lawsuit with the Administrative Court against the army's statement in a conscription certificate (Sor Dor 43) which exempted him from service for having a ''mental disorder''. Samart Meecharoen, a 22-year-old student of Ban Somdej Chao Phraya Rajabhat University, said the document, issued two years ago, deprived him of career opportunities as a private firm turned down his application for a part-time job, citing it as the reason. His petition to the court, supported by the National Human Rights Commission, the Lawyers Council of Thailand, the Rainbow Sky Association of Thailand and the Saphan Group representing same-sex lovers, will be submitted to the court on Nov 10. If the court accepts the case for consideration, it will be the first of its kind in the country. Continued here: http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/02Nov2006_news16.php ------------------------------------------------------------- Good luck, Khun Samart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 I fail to see in the article where it is stated that the 'mental disorder' is related to katoyism. Well spotted - it doesn't. "I cannot accept it [the mental disorder statement] because I don't have a mental problem. In fact, I'm a normal guy who feels like a woman," said Mr Samart, who called himself Nong Normal guys don't feel like a woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxexile Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statement whilst a person has every right to change whatever it is about themselves that they are not content with , and to live in a society where such people can live freely and without persecution or discrimination , it can hardly be accepted that someone who wishes to be castrated , have their penis removed and have an artificial vagina fashioned out of what is left can be conidered as having a completely ordered mental state. it might seem ordered to them , but to the rest it is certainly disordered , and it is certainly an aberration of normal function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statement whilst a person has every right to change whatever it is about themselves that they are not content with , and to live in a society where such people can live freely and without persecution or discrimination , it can hardly be accepted that someone who wishes to be castrated , have their penis removed and have an artificial vagina fashioned out of what is left can be conidered as having a completely ordered mental state. it might seem ordered to them , but to the rest it is certainly disordered , and it is certainly an aberration of normal function. I totally agree, but the politically correct amongst us will have a hissy fit when they read what you have written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted November 2, 2006 Author Share Posted November 2, 2006 I fail to see in the article where it is stated that the 'mental disorder' is related to katoyism. I fail to see in the article where it is stated that the 'mental disorder' is related to katoyism. Well spotted - it doesn't. It does. Complete reading of the article is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 What do you mean "Normal guys don't feel like a woman"-- I have several friends who are normal and they all say they feel like a woman--some feel like a new or different woman everynight of the week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmart Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statement whilst a person has every right to change whatever it is about themselves that they are not content with , and to live in a society where such people can live freely and without persecution or discrimination , it can hardly be accepted that someone who wishes to be castrated , have their penis removed and have an artificial vagina fashioned out of what is left can be conidered as having a completely ordered mental state. it might seem ordered to them , but to the rest it is certainly disordered , and it is certainly an aberration of normal function. I think a lot of katoeys elect to keep their "meat + 2 veg" and just keep eating lots of oestrogen. But, I'm, erm..... no expert. Honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Um, I am familiar with this case, and it is an ongoing case from the plaintiff's rejection by the military for conscription. When they rejected him, the reason given "because of mental disorder" was stamped in his official records. It is this evaluation which he is challenging. I wonder if he wins if he'll have to do the military service. In any case, not all kathoeys do the full postop thing. Let's try to keep stereotypes to a minimum here. "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 it can hardly be accepted that someone who wishes to be castrated , have their penis removed and have an artificial vagina fashioned out of what is left can be conidered as having a completely ordered mental state. Agreed - must be a first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxexile Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 (edited) totally agree, but the politically correct amongst us will have a hissy fit when they read what you have written. the politically correct are more mentally disordered than any transexual. Edited November 2, 2006 by taxexile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naka Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 (edited) Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statement whilst a person has every right to change whatever it is about themselves that they are not content with , and to live in a society where such people can live freely and without persecution or discrimination , it can hardly be accepted that someone who wishes to be castrated , have their penis removed and have an artificial vagina fashioned out of what is left can be conidered as having a completely ordered mental state. it might seem ordered to them , but to the rest it is certainly disordered , and it is certainly an aberration of normal function. Very well stated, Taxexile. Normal guys don't feel like a woman. True ... And normal guys don't look like women either. And how come the pollies are not spouting off about THIS HUB! It's almost a monopoly. Naka. Edited November 2, 2006 by naka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 totally agree, but the politically correct amongst us will have a hissy fit when they read what you have written. the politically correct are more mentally disordered than any transexual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmart Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Was a time when "flat feet" would have sufficed to evade National Service. Having a rich / influential family usually helps too. Apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxm88 Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Don't ask, don't tell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neeranam Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 In 1973 the American Psychiatric Association removed homosexuality from the revised Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) after intense debate.[1] They stated that homosexuality "does not necessarily constitute a psychiatric disorder." Effectively, this saw its official acceptance as a viable sexual orientation and saw the increase in gay liberation throughout the Western world.Many other associations across the world followed suit soon after. The American Psychoanalytic Association made similar steps and began accepting openly homosexual men and women. However, it wasn't until 1992 that the World Health Organisation ceased to classify homosexuality as a mental disorder, followed by the UK Government in 1994, and the Chinese Psychiatric Association in 2001. From Wikipedia.Katoeyism is a different kettle of fish, IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxexile Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 mental d. [DSM-IV] any clinically significant behavioral or psychological syndrome characterized by the presence of distressing symptoms, impairment of functioning, or significantly increased risk of suffering death, pain, disability, or loss of freedom. Mental disorders are assumed to be the manifestation of a behavioral, psychological, or biological dysfunction in the individual. The concept does not include deviant behavior, disturbances that are essentially conflicts between the individual and society, or expected and culturally sanctioned responses to particular events. i think we need to agree on exactly what is meant by a mental disorder , before this discussion can proceed. transexuals and homosexuals perhaps fall into the deviant category , rather than the mentally disturbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Gender dysphoria is the mental condition associated with transexuals .... strangely after the surgery they no longer have that condition. <normal men don't care what vehicle other people drive! > Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxexile Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 normal men don't care what vehicle other people drive! saving up for a hummer are you jd ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sting01 Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Transexual to fight 'mental disorder' statementA transexual man is preparing to file a lawsuit with the Administrative Court against the army's statement in a conscription certificate (Sor Dor 43) which exempted him from service for having a ''mental disorder''. Samart Meecharoen, a 22-year-old student of Ban Somdej Chao Phraya Rajabhat University, said the document, issued two years ago, deprived him of career opportunities as a private firm turned down his application for a part-time job, citing it as the reason. His petition to the court, supported by the National Human Rights Commission, the Lawyers Council of Thailand, the Rainbow Sky Association of Thailand and the Saphan Group representing same-sex lovers, will be submitted to the court on Nov 10. If the court accepts the case for consideration, it will be the first of its kind in the country. Continued here: http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/02Nov2006_news16.php ------------------------------------------------------------- Good luck, Khun Samart Khun Samart (Wan) already won a court judgement against the military (one year ago), since that the military law of conscription was modified. Wan, that I am honored to call a friend, is one of the most equilibrate person I have met since I am Thailand. Being also a succesful student in university. Do not be mistaken, we are not talking about someone in the sex industry ... And the story about job opportunity is a true one. The problem about gender disorder is here in Thailand it's way easier for a guy to wear a dress and pretend to be a lady reincarnate than to work to clean the taxy cars in a gaz station (at least it pay more). But there is also the fact the disphoria (medical name of the gender disorder) is a disease existing since the huminity exist and everywhere. Mostly people who have it are more sexless than you can imagine (mostly sex repulse them), are trully feeling bad being what they are, and simply need to be considered as normal human. It's a very sensible subject, in more in that particulry case I know the person as friend (not sex friend), but does sensibility is a value here ????????? I doubt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chownah Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Smoking tobacco is certainly not a natural thing...I think its a mental disorder....don't you agree.......same with enjoying drinking distilled alcohol.....to the point of disfunction....definitely not natural....another disorder........... Chownah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TokyoT Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Here, here – I must also point out that farming has to be about the most unnatural of all things. I mean when was the last time you saw plants growing in straight rows in nature? Along comes man and tries to put order into such a natural thing. Next thing you know we will try to place cows and such into barns rather than allowing them to run wild and free like nature intended. Farmers certainly must be the most unnatural of breeds – attempting to place order in a naturally chaotic system. Nasty disease those buggers must have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ijustwannateach Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 I think in general diseases and disorders are defined as being things which physically prevent one from leading a normal or healthy life, but all of these words are very loaded with preconceptions and social prejudices. It's obvious in the case of a cold, say, which inhibits one's respiratory function- but does a "disorder" which only debilitates you because of the societal judgement attached to a stamp on a piece of paper count as an illness? I Don't Think So. And let us pity those posters so ashamed of their feelings that they must disguise their fascination for kathoeys as an obsession with political correctness, and hope they find themselves soon. "Steven" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leisurely Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Well said "Stephen". I am normally not at all PC, however I feel that there is an awful lot of homophobia disguised at humour there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidjtayler Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Valid points steven and leisurely but we are sneaking away from the topic a little ... whether 'katoyism' is a viable disorder .... and the posters from Tokyo and Chownah just prior summed things up nicely ... just what is the norm and how is a 'disorder' classed .. very subjective area ... what's one mans trash is another mans treasure.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 And let us pity those posters so ashamed of their feelings that they must disguise their fascination for kathoeys as an obsession with political correctness, and hope they find themselves soon."Steven" I have no issue with my dogs playing with katoeys, especially the beefy ones as it cuts down on their food bill. Only kidding! In all seriousness, I do believe that true homophobia runs deeper than cheap humour. Perhaps the inability to accept others who are 'different' is in itself a mental disorder? That said, the pendulum may have swung too far in that the PC brigade tend to demand automatic acceptance of 'differences', sometimes denying critics comment which should be their right within reason. The latter is as bad as the former, in my humble opinion. What is wrong with live and let live...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmart Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Is "katoeyism" even a word, nevermind a bona(sic)fide mental disorder? Maybe should ask over at the "Ladyboy 69" forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeaceBlondie Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Sometimes I agree with that billboard that showed a sexy, female, feminine, vagina-possessing woman who was unnaturally smoking a cigarette, and the ad said "You've come a long way, baby." Imagine that, inhaling tobacco fumes directly into her lungs! Then she probably drank alcohol, sat in a plastic chair, and ate hormonally enhanced protein. All so unnatural, and she thought she had come a long way. Good luck for the feature of this story; I hope she wins the lawsuit and becomes a successful woman....with or without her meat and vegetables. She's certainly not mentally ill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts