boomerangutang
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Posts posted by boomerangutang
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On 8/27/2016 at 9:16 PM, Doctor1 said:
Hello, i have a question regarding the bordercrossing at mae sai/tachilek. i got a 14 days thai visa and planed to cross the border to myanmar and spend a couple of days in kengtung. But since ive read all these comments about these visa problems im not sure if ill do it. do i get a 14 days visa for myanmar at the border that is valid for kengtung? (Without having to book a guide for 1000baht a day). Can i return to thailand after 3-4 days and getting a 14 days visa again?
Thanks for help
E-visa won't help for Tachilek. E-visa is only good if you fly in to Mandalay or Yangon. You can, however get a Burmese visa at their consulate in Chiang Mai - and that would be useful at Tachilek. You can also visit the cities north of Tachilek in Shan state with a regular visa-on-arrival you get when crossing the bridge. Regardless, you must visit the tiny tourist office north of the immigration office on the Burmese side of the bridge. If you don't, and you get the standard 'VIP pass' for Tachilek (without the notation allowing you to travel north), you won't legally be allowed to leave Tachilek. Talk to them first.
As for guide: I'm quite sure, that you can go to the northern cities without the required guide IF you have a proper visa. With a regular visa-on-arrival, you are required to hire an officially sanctioned guide, and pay that person Bt.1,000/day, half of which goes to the Burmese Travel office. I think you're also required to pay the guide's food and lodging, but not sure. Hope that helps.
It may now be possible for a farang with proper visa to take a bus westward from Keng Tung. If so, that's a new development. A Burmese guide told me so, but you should get a 2nd opinion.
Thai Imm still won't issue VIP passes (day passes) for farang. They issue for Chinese if in groups and with a guide, but not for regular farang like you and me. It's a dumb-ass rule, and the only reason I can see for it is Thai officials want everyone to spend money in Mae Sai, and not go over and spend any money in Tachilek. .....that was a reason mentioned by a Thai official at the border. It's petty, to say the least.
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Thais are as superstitious as Indians and Haitians and Central Africans. It's silly at best. Sometimes harmful (example; a Thai royal drowned because no servants were allowed to touch her).
They know all about 1,000 silly no-no's because they date from ancient times. But they don't have any courtesy edicts about modern issues, such as phones, loudspeakers and motorized vehicles.
They drive rudely, are rude about using phones (hang up re; wrong numbers), and play loud sounds/music which annoy neighbors. Wats are as bad, in the loud noise dept, as regular people.
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Attitudes by border guards vary, up and down. Currently, it's at a down nadir, mostly because of the paranoid junta. Recently, when entering Thailand from Burma at a land crossing (Tachilek) the Thai official told me I needed to get a new passport or he wouldn't let me enter next time. (I cross often, and have a multi-entry). I didn't argue, as that can never do any good. However, I still have over 30 blank pages in my passport. Even so, I made the 7 hr. trip and paid nearly $200 to get a new passport.
That's the thing about Thai bureaucracy. Not only is it subjective (if you're with a respectable-looking, rich Thai, you get better service), but there is no recourse for a farang if he feels cheated and/or treated unfairly.
Another recent story: An American friend of mine had a problem with his 90 day reporting. He called me up (I was again vacationing in Burma) alarmed. I cut short my Burma trip, rushed back to thailand (2 hrs traveling) and accompanied him to the Thai Imm office. This time he got lucky, and got a different official to look at his papers. She smiled and said all was fine. ....just added proof, if any were needed, of the subjectivity of Thai Imm. Problematic.
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Go Iceland!
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I asked a uniformed official at the Thai side of the bridge when VIP passes would next be available. He just grinned, shrugged his shoulders, "mai lu"
At the SE side of the bridge, where people enter Thailand, it's actually worse than it's been for years. Cattle guardrails force people to squeeze up against others - not something that sweaty travelers particularly like to do. Pelvises rubbing against fatty bums. Thanks to Thai Imm authorities for making it about as uncomfortable as possible.
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Some good questions above.
I can't answer all, but I'll take a stab at some:
If you want to visit Keng Tung or Meng La (Chinese border), you first go to tiny office on left (north side) of Burmese immigration office. Tell them of your plans, and they'll likely say you need to commit to hiring a Burmese guide for Bt.1,000/day (not all of that fee goes to the guide). I think you're still expected to pay an added amount for the guide's food and lodging, not sure. Then, exit the tourist office and go to the Imm office next door and be sure to tell them you want to travel north. There's no added cost, and they will put a notation in your cardboard 'visa' to that effect.
I spoke to a guide who took a farang up to Meng La. They got stalled at Keng Tung. The first officials they spoke with said 'no onward journey.' The 2nd official (next morning) said 'ok' but it took some money to grease his palm. None of that should have happened if the travelers had gotten permission in Tachilek prior to going north.
I don't know about legality of taking a Thai car anywhere in Burma. However, 2 miles east of the bridge (near small bus station), alongside the main road, are some rental places. You'll have to cajole a bit to find the right driver, but they're all friendly. They all drive those 4-door white Toyotas compacts with steering wheel on wrong side. They probably got them for free from Japanese hand-me-downs.
Here's a tel# of a Burmese guide who speaks fluent English, but he isn't fully certified as a guide. In other words, he's as good or better than any guide you'll find in Shan State, but he hasn't been able to afford to get a guide license, and the bureaucracy is formidable. He's taken visitors to the two towns north of Tachilek, and all's worked out well. Slim, tel# 0991376462
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Stupas in Burma (and elsewhere) are usually 8 sided, partly because it's easier to build an 8 sided structure than one with seven sides.
The big gold-colored Stupa on the hill north of Tachilek is 8-sided. A discerning person might ask, "If a stupa symbolizes seven days of the week, then why does it have eight sides?" What happens at the Tachilek stupa (and probably all the others in Burma) is; two of the sides represent Wednesday. One side for Wednesday day, and the adjoining side for Wednesday night. Conundrum solved.
What would be interesting would be construction of Asia's first seven-sided Stupa (I assume none exist). To do so, each angle would have to be 51.43 degrees. It wouldn't adhere to the classic model, but it would coincide with seven days of the week.
Towns everywhere are always looking for unique tourist attractions to attract more tourists = more money. Hey Tachilek city fathers: How about a 7-sided stupa ?!
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I was more referring to the fact that I'm not sure I've ever seen you post in the Chiang Rai forum except to bemoan the rules and regulations surrounding the Mae Sai day passes. Perhaps you have and I missed it - my apologies if so.
Also, I think the exception that some take to your posts is that they are so often coached in negative and derogatory language that others don't seem to use. 'Pollution floating in a water tank', 'Lance the pustule and release the phlegm' - does this not seem a bit much for a minor disagreement on an internet forum about obscure visa regulations?
Either way, have a nice day, and I hope (probably vainly, considering what we all know about bureaucracy in general) that Mae Sai will once and for all clarify their position on day passes for you soon.
I have a lot of posts in the C.Rai forum which don't bemoan anything. Many relate to nature and the environment. You can look up other members' posts - there's a function which does that, if you so choose.
As for the pustule comment: that was aimed at me being the pustule - in reference to someone else speaking their mind, and thereby figuratively getting relief. Perhaps the analogy was too yukky. I'll try to tone it down in future postings.
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Boomerangutang, I think if you'd just let this Tachilek day pass issue go, you'd probably be a happier person for it. You're probably not going to be able to get a day pass for Burma now - it's a shame, but there's not much you can do about it. Why let this exceedingly minor issue bother you so much? I just do not understand.
As for anyone who doesn't want to participate in a forum just because someone might disagree with them - the mind boggles.
I hadn't posted for weeks, and then a few days ago I wrote a sentence asking if anyone had any new info. Any new info?
As for anyone who doesn't want to participate in a forum just because someone might disagree with them - the mind boggles.
Maybe your mind is easily boggled. But if you read what I wrote, you'll see I'm referring to lots of folks who would ordinarily like post on the Chiang Rai forum, but who instead stay away because there's one poster who bugs them. I also usually stay away, but I know, as soon as I post after an absence, it's likely a particular poster will try to pick my post apart. I don't much mind. I've got plenty of other things I can be doing which are enjoyable. It's like a bit of pollution floating in a water tank. It affects the whole body of water.
I thought I would speak up for those who have left the forum. Appreciate it or don't appreciate it, your choice.
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I call things as I see them. I don't try to sugar-coat things. I don't feel a compulsion to try and shield Thai behaviors from view from farang or from Thai views. Because I'm not Thai, doesn't mean I can't see or mention unflattering things I observe about Thailand.
I can say a lot of glowing things about Thailand. But, for example, if I see trash strewn in public parks, I'll say there's trash strewn in public parks.
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Well, it's good to get it out in the open. Lance the pustule and release the phlegm - and hope it gets you on the path to well-being.
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I am not protecting anyone's sensitivities but I am personally offended by what some write, time and time again. If someone writes something which is questionable at best, I think others have the right to question the veracity of such proclamations. People are free to hate Thailand as much as they want, I guess, but that doesn't mean their beliefs are objective or justified. If you could manage to post in a more civil, less derogatory manner I wouldn't feel the need to respond.
If an objective person looks at your multiple responses to posters like myself (and others) they will see a pattern. You won't see it, because you're subjective. I have opinions, you have opinions. The difference is, my opinions are directed to topics. Yours are often directed at posters like a thought-policeman.
I'm giving voice to the many folks (nobody knows the number) who simply won't post anymore on Chiang Rai forum because they don't like personal aspersions thrown their way.
I come back to post once in awhile, but I always know VF will be quick with a subjective put-down.
He's like a self-appointed shielder for all Thai people and for all facets of Thai culture. Do Thai people need him for that role? You tell me.
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Will27: "]From what people have posted, seems it can change from one day to the next so any answer given is pointless really."
Boomer responds: not necessarily pointless. Someone on this thread may have heard a policy statement from a Thai-side border official - which said something like, "VIP passes are now allowed."Note: Policy on the Burmese side doesn't flip-flop. It's only the Thai side which is uncertain, week to week.
"Does anyone know the current status of VIP day-passes?" Why isn't it possible to leave it right there without all the other BS and putdowns?
You see what you want to see. What are the put-downs? Are you the self-appointed Protector of Thai Sensitivities?I'll let you in on a little secret, VF: there are more than a few farang members of T.Visa, in and around C.Rai who don't want to participate in the Chiang Rai forum because you're so quick to shoot other posters down. You don't think you do it, but that's how it manifests. You have some posters (who are likely your personal friends) who can do no wrong in your view. There are other posters, myself included, who you're quick and ever-ready to find fault with. VF, try taking an objective view of the hundreds of prior posts on the Chiang Rai forum. You, VF, won't see the pattern, but others with an objective perspective, will see it.
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Does anyone know the current status of VIP day-passes? I assume they're still not available for all farang, but avail for Asians in groups (with Thai guide), but I don't know. Thailand is becoming more of a police state, week by week. Concurrently, Burma is becoming more open and democratic.
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Anyone with direct knowledge of the latest border situation, is welcome to post their findings. I'd like to know if VIP/day-trip visitors are allowed and if it's allowed for non-Asian farang. Some posters have insinuated (on this thread) that the border inconsistencies / flip-flops in policy are subjective to individuals (me, for example). I don't think so, because I've heard about other farang with border problems/inconsistencies. It is possible the Thai-side authorities have mug shots of people (in their office) of specific people to stifle, but I don't think so.
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Does that apply to anyone else?
It applies to anyone with pale skin, freckles, hairy arms, pointy noses. It probably doesn't apply to Chinese, tho I didn't ask about that this time. I did ask a few weeks ago, and the officer told me the restriction only targetted farang, and not Chinese traveling in groups IF and ONLY IF that group has a certified Thai guide. I would assume that criteria still holds, though it's like Donald Trump's opinions .....changing week to week.
Will the border be open on Chakri day, April 6? The day is a government holiday in Thailand. I think the border will be open, but I want to be sure before making plans.
Thanks for any help.
It should be open every day.
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Latest from the border: VIP passes not available.
I asked the woman officer when that might change. She just smiled, shrugged her shoulders and said, "Bangkok."
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Last week: border guard on Thai side said no VIP passes. I didn't ask him about Chinese (it slipped my mind). Maybe that's a side biz for someone at the border: sell masks depicting Chinese men and women. 50 baht each. Put on the mask, get in line with a Chinese group, and you can stroll around the Tachilek tourist market for awhile. If you get caught, what will be the charge? "impersonating a Chinese tourist" ?
Coming back to Thailand, it's still commotion, with people trying to negotiate a cattle-guarded narrow space with luggage. Even without luggage, it's not easy to pass someone in a 20 inch corridor without pressing your body against the other person. There are so many things wrong with the border crossing, it's ridiculous.
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I'm sure that if you're not a visa runner you can still cross the border as usual...., even with your car if you want. However, now you will probably be required to get exit stamps for Thailand, the usual entry/exit stamps for Myanmar and another entry stamp for Thailand upon return, right?
How can you be sure (?), if the border guards aren't sure from week to week. Doubtful about cars, though I'd be glad to be proven wrong. A farang driving a car in Tachilek is as common as a swimming meet (note: there is no swimming pool in Tachilek). I have, however, driven a motorbike in and around Tachilek, but if I told you how I did it, I'd have to report you to Dick Cheney's waterboard office.
Also, how can Thai guides be allowed to operate in Myanmar? That is beyond their jurisdiction and considered illegal work. Wouldn't the guides need to be Burmese? In which case the Burmese would be the ones applying such a rule (which I doubt, although they did have a rule like this up until 2013 when the border became truly international).
Good point. Yet you're assuming there's a modicum of common sense among border guards. There's not. And, in case you're wondering, Chinese tourists in groups are given privileges not afforded the rest of us. Thailand is under a self-appointed government who make no bones about giving privileges to Chinese - tourists, businesses, defense contractors, real estate developers, and banks. The border scenario is just a tiny portion of that.
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I posted on another thread (same topic) that I and another farang asked for VIP-passes at the border, 4 days ago, and were both told by separate Thai officials that we could get them. Do I get a 'Like This' from Villagefarang for posting this? Sceandugenga gets 'likes' from VF for every one of his posts, and I never get any from VF. Boo hoo.
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Maybe there's collusion with car repair shops. The worse the roads = more damage to shocks, springs, tires, rims, etc. = more work for mechanics.
There's a road near me (northern Thailand) which gets fixed twice each year. A month after each fix, it's just as bad or worse condition.
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At this time, VIP passes (day trips) across that border are possible. I'm basing that news on the fact that me and another farang asked the border officials, and were told we could do VIP for the day. That's the latest, but doesn't necessarily mean it's fixed, because the VIP policy has flipped flopped on and off for the past 4 months. In sum: If you travel to Mae Sai, you can take your chances, but don't count on it as being a sure thing. You may try calling Mae Sai immigration ahead of time, but you'll need to speak Thai, and I don't have the tel#.
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This has been a very useful thread for visitors in the past and I think the VIP problem is now well documented, I'd really like to see it move on unless someone personally makes a crossing.
It seems like it can change from 1 day to the next, so recent experiences shouldn't be taken as gospel.
It probably doesn't affect that many living in Thailand, but it does have an effect on visitors here.
We had 4 friends over from Oz last week, and they would've liked to pop over into Mae Sai for a look
and shop, but with all of the uncertainty, decided not to go.
Maesai is on the Thai side.
Tachilek is on the Myanmar side.
There really isnt much to see or do in Tachilek .
Everything that you can buy there m you can but cheaper across the border .
The eating places are grotty .
The only reason to go there is to say that youve been there
You go where you want, I go where I want. Fair enough? Or would you like my opinions on places you like to go? Didn't think so.
Admitting that the main purpose of the cross border trip is to purchase counterfeit, pirated or otherwise illegal products and bring them duty-free into Thailand hardly sounds like the kind of argument which would go over well with Thai authorities.
On the one hand we want rule of law and certainty and on the other we want to break the law and not be punished. That sounds like an interesting predicament.Thailand is counted as among the 'dirty dozen' countries ww which are most involved with fake and pirated items. That's among nearly 200 countries ww.
Let's not get 'holier than thou' here. As Luke mentioned, we're mainly talking about border crossing policies.
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