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aussiestyle1983

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Posts posted by aussiestyle1983

  1. QF pilots are underpaid by comparison with many of the world's airlines. $350-400K for an A340/B747 is not a lot when compared with airlines in other countries.

    The pilots have always been the soft targets for airline managements because they just want to keep flying and get the job done. Other unions, loaders and flight attendants, particularly, don't value their jobs and won't back down so the management does. It's why cabin managers earn $150K, and loaders $120K+.

    Back to the discussion though, and Joyce is running the airline into the ground and growing Jetstar, the LCC arm of QF. When the bulk of the flying is being done by Jetstar, it will be rebranded Qantas, all/most staff will be paid less than half (Jetstar A330 Captain on less than $200K currenlty), and the bottom line will be dramatically improved.

    Hi F4UCorsair,

    If the Qantas pilots are being paid 350 to 400 000 per year then I think you will find that is probably towards the higher end of pilots salaries world wide. They are obviously subject to tax in the region of 50%, but net wise it's still good money compared to some other airlines across the globe.

    I hope Qantas does survive, but as it stands things are looking very uncertain at the moment.

    That's the Captain khaosai, and not all Captains are paid that, only those on A340 and B747. I can assure you it's not at the top end compared with many countries. It is good gross money compared with some SE Asian, African, and South American airlines, but not Cathay, Dragon and Singapore, along with most of the European airlines, and they have more friendly tax systems than Australia. I don't begrudge them a cent, incidentally.

    If anybody is being paid too much in QF it's the loaders and flight attendants because they have militant representation.

    Pilot salaries represent a very small percentage of the operating costs of an airline, and if the guys/girls up front cost less than a grand an hour, including salary, super, sick leave, etc., it's only a couple of $$ per seat per hour, not much to have the best trained crew in the world taking care of you. Consider the cost of an aircraft, upwards of $300 million (lease cost $30 million pa), fuel burns of 10 tonnes an hour, maintenance costs, etc., and if a crew cost a total of $700,000 a year for flying 1000 hours, it is nothing!

    Incidentally I consider the best trained crews to be Brits, Australians and Kiwis, bar none.

    Hi,

    Some good points there but I still think your way off the mark with overall pilot salaries. Legacy carriers will of course be well paid but most airlines will offer nothing like those terms and conditions to their crews.

    Do Qantas operate the 340 ?

    You state that the British, Australians and Kiwis are the best trained crews. Are those military pilots. I have flown with many nationalities who have been as proficient as any of those nationalities you mentioned, albeit in the airline industry.

    No. Qantas do not and have never operated the A340.

    The widebody jets Qantas operate are: B747, B767, A380, A330.

    I have not liked the Qantas product for some time. However, a few years ago, I flew a 1 hr domestic flight on an old 767 from MEL to SYD. I was provided with a warm cheese sandwich and a bottle of wine - free - on a 1 hr domestic flight. Best domestic service I've had. Nonetheless, I have always flown Thai from SYD to BKK but now that they have switched their more modern / comfortable A340-600 aircraft back to the old 747-400 with minimal underseat legroom because of the retrofitted IFE boxes - I will be flying Qantas on my next trip to BKK. I scored a SYD-BKK return ticket on Qantas (A330-300) for $580 AUD which is $300 less than the cheapest I usually pay on Thai. The Qantas A330 economy seat configuration of 2-4-2 suites me better than the Thai 747 which is 3-4-3 (only the last 3 rows where the fuselage tapers in have 2-4-2) so my wife and I can have a window and isle together without having to possibly sit next to an unpleasant passenger. Anyway, this will be my first Qantas International flight in years so I will see how it goes but I have noticed that Thai is on the way down so I have no problem in trying Qantas. I also get 30kg luggage allowance on Qantas compared to 20-25kg on Thai.

    BTW My Thai wife and other Thais I know try to avoid Thai because their cabin crew / airport staff seem to have an attitude towards their own Thai passengers and show more respect to foreigners. I have observed this.

  2. Some have argued that there is racism and discrimination against Filipinos in Thailand. They have valid points (eg: lower pay compared to others, worse conditions). Some have argued that what happens to Filipions in Thailand is not racism or discrimination. They have valid points (eg: they do earn more than they would back home, it happens to people of other nationalities as well).

    I say it is what it is. There is nothing that I can do about it. When I was teaching in Thailand I knew that I was a foreigner and thus a visitor. It was not my business to question how others were treated (or what they accepted). It was not up to me to make the rules. I chose to accept my pay and conditions and so did the Filipinos. Whilst I did not think that some of their salaries compared to others was fair, they often had a go at me. I was the only Westerner in a staff room with 18 Filipinos and 1 Thai. I was outnumbered 18 to 1. They would all speak in their native language all day - who knows what they were talking about. I found it difficult to pick up Thai as I was hearing Filipinos talk all day. This is why I did not care on the last Friday of the month when it took me three times as long to count my pay - as we all had to count our pay in the staff room before we left. It is what it is.

  3. Another example I remember is that grades / classrooms were re-located one year so that the white / Western looking teachers were based in classrooms on the ground level so that when there was a lot of parent activity around the building it would be the white looking farang that was seen! Meanwhile, the Filipinos taught in classrooms above ground level so that they could not be seen. Very, very sad. I believe that the school positioned teachers in parts of the building that would, like I mentioned above, 'bring in business'. Those were the words of the head of foreign teachers (very white Thai / Chinese lady).

  4. I agree with pastafarian - onlycw was just telling it how it is. And discrimination is very 'in your face' in Thailand.

    What Scott said above is very corect and indeed very, very sad: "One of our best assistants is rather dark and the Director still limits her public activities and says it is because she is 'too' dark."

    This happened where I worked too (and still does from what I hear - to no surprise). The white / Western looking foreign teachers were given less teaching periods per week and often had their marking / paperwork activities given to others so that they could stand around the front gate before and after school to 'bring in business'. The Filipinos were given more office work and were basically kept inside. This is reality in Thailand. A lot of Thai people do judge people according to skin colour - the lighter the better. Money is what is on the school director's mind and the activities of individual teachers is planned around just that.

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  5. So no, the whole degree v. non-degree debate is BS. You do not need a degree in anything to be a good teacher. There a plenty of non-degreed teachers with students who are more capable and produce better grades than teachers with degrees in non-related fields such as engineering or plastic surgery. But this debate will always exist and there will always be jealousy, hypocrisy and stupidness shown as long as things regarding qualifications and pay scales remain they way they are. If non-native English speakers with degrees who get paid half of your salary have a go at you just remind them that you too are a visitor in Thailand and you do not make the rules. Tell them to take in up with management or the government and see how far they get.

    Is 'stupidness' even a word?

    This is rather humerous, albeit a bit sad. It is opinion not fact. You offer no credible evidence for your assertions. Pay scales reflect training and skills to a certain extent. The logic linking non-native English speakers with teaching and being a visitor in Thailand escapes me-it does however illustrate non-sequitur very nicely. On a positive note you have illustrated you "stupidness" with aplomb. Well done!

    You are wrong. Where I worked, the pay scales are fixed and do not change (you get one set pay rise after 1 or 2 years, that is all). The foreign teacher pay scales are still the same as they were from 05-07 when I worked there. I am often in contact with many of the teachers I used to work with, and I visit whenever I am in town. Both native and non-native English speaking teacher's pay remains the same, including the huge difference between native and non-native English speakers. All non-native English speakers have degrees and get paid the same, and all native English speakers get paid the same whether they have a dozen PhDs or no higher education at all. That is fact. The pay scales at the school DO NOT reflect training and skills to any extent. I know it does not work like that at most places but it is like that where I worked and it is sad IMO. I guess this school doesn't believe in rewarding performance, dedication or recognise other things such as inflation and cost of living increases. I do know that Khai Dao now costs 10thb up from 5thb a few years ago and bus fares have risen so I for one would not want to be stuck at that school long term. And what I was linking (that you missed the point entirely) is that some of the non-native speakers who get paid less hold a grudge against the native English speakers who get paid more instead of holding the grudge against the locals who make this happen. Rather than holding a grudge against a fellow foreigner / visitor in the Kingdom for something they have no control over hold it against the ones that make it happen. BTW, Dr Robert, are you a Dr because you have a PhD from Khao San Uni?

  6. So no, the whole degree v. non-degree debate is BS. You do not need a degree in anything to be a good teacher. There a plenty of non-degreed teachers with students who are more capable and produce better grades than teachers with degrees in non-related fields such as engineering or plastic surgery. But this debate will always exist and there will always be jealousy, hypocrisy and stupidness shown as long as things regarding qualifications and pay scales remain they way they are. If non-native English speakers with degrees who get paid half of your salary have a go at you just remind them that you too are a visitor in Thailand and you do not make the rules. Tell them to take in up with management or the government and see how far they get.

    Is 'stupidness' even a word?

    Google it ;)

  7. I never intended to teach when I first arrived in Thailand. One day I was walking down a street in BKK with my wife and a lady from Siam Computer approached me and the conversation went like this:

    Lady: "You are white?"

    Me: "Yes."

    Lady: "You speak english?"

    Me: "Yes."

    Lady: "You can teach?"

    Me: "I'm not sure."

    Lady: "You want teach job?"

    Me: "I'll give it a go."

    I went to an interveiw the next day and got offered a job. I didn't believe how easy it was (but I was not happy with the pay) so the following day I went into a large mall and got a job that paid twice as much so I quit Siam before I even started. It was that easy. No agency needed. Use your looks and dress well. No degree & experience required at that time.

    So, you're saying Siam is good or bad?? wink.png

    They are good in that they enlightened me as to how easy is was to pick up work - that they were looking for me because of my good looks; that work would find me even when I wasn't looking lol. However, to expect me to travel 2 hours each way across BKK to teach a 2 hour private lesson for about 220 per hour or whatever the poor rate was back then... I'll let you work it out wink.png Anyway, thanks to them, I got into teaching and eventually completed 2 degrees back home which I would not have otherwise done.

  8. Basically, the last two times we have visited BKK and got a check up she has been told to get them pulled but we did not have time. I asked her specifically what the dentist said and I get the impression that she can't tell me because she doesn't listen / cannot translate the technical terms or that Thais don't understand each other lol. Anyway, I had all 4 pulled in one go so i'm not worried about her getting 2 done, she is 29 so I don't know how developed the teeth are. One of the teeth she was told to get pulled is starting to be felt and is just under the gum, the dentist told her that the second tooth may be deeper but that is the only useful info I can get from her. I was thinking then to at least allow a week. If the x-rays will take time and you need to book in advance, I will try to schedule a long time between the outbound flights and make an appointment to get that done and tell them that we will be back in a few weeks for the treatment. I have read that some have just walked in to places without appointment, had the x-ray done on the spot and then had the teeth pulled 2 hours later and that was it, but the e-mails I get from different places make it sound like we have to keep going back a few days later for this and that and cannot give me a avergae timeframe to be there.

  9. My Thai wife needs to have two wisdom teeth removed. We are allowed a free stopover during a transit through BKK in a few months. We would just like to know how much time we should allow in BKK to get the entire procedure completed. I believe there would be an initial consultation / x-rays / then the removal and I guess a follow up to remove stitches / check-up. I have contacted a few places by e-mail but their responses only talk about costs and don't mention how many days / weeks we will need to stay. So basically, how much time should we allow in BKK? A few days? One week? 10 days? 2 weeks? Longer? And... Do they always use stitches that need to be taken out later or do some places use dissolvable stitches? Obviously we don't want to rush our trip and leave BKK to soon in case something goes wrong so all we need is a timeframe from first visit until the dentist would say all clear! Thanks in advance!

  10. I never intended to teach when I first arrived in Thailand. One day I was walking down a street in BKK with my wife and a lady from Siam Computer approached me and the conversation went like this:

    Lady: "You are white?"

    Me: "Yes."

    Lady: "You speak english?"

    Me: "Yes."

    Lady: "You can teach?"

    Me: "I'm not sure."

    Lady: "You want teach job?"

    Me: "I'll give it a go."

    I went to an interveiw the next day and got offered a job. I didn't believe how easy it was (but I was not happy with the pay) so the following day I went into a large mall and got a job that paid twice as much so I quit Siam before I even started. It was that easy. No agency needed. Use your looks and dress well. No degree & experience required at that time.

  11. I know a few people that have been granted waiver letters by the TCT without having completed a degree. In certain circumstances they look at each application individually and take into account other qualifications as well as work experience and teaching experience. This is usually only done for native English speakers though and not regularly.

    Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

    A similar thing happened to me around 2006. I was able to get a WP and TL without any degree. All I had was a TEFL. Like mentioned above, it comes down to each individual application. Since then I completed 2 degrees in order to return to Thailand and teach one day should I require them but I doubt that I will. However, if I do, I plan to do the CELTA despite my past experience. A co-worker of mine just completed the CELTA in Sydney and the company who ran the course already found him a job. I woudln't do just any TEFL as there are a lot of options - go for something with a good reputation like the CELTA. Good luck!

    BTW, I have a Cert IV in Training and Assessment as well as I work as a workplace trainer / assessor now. Whilst training is different to teaching, it is more similar to teaching that most other roles and I would be bring this up and use examples rather than saying you have no experience at all regarding an application / interview.

  12. I would like to think that after coming back to Aus to get a degree that I could find at least some schools/language institutes or whatever that will take into account my quals and the fact that they are REAL!

    I had a very similar experience to you. My first teaching experience in LOS was at the place with the name of a tobaco company. Others teaching there put me in touch with a large private Catholic school chain that was equally if not more dodgy... Anyway, after 2 years of teaching, I returned to Australia to earn a degree. I studied through Open Universities Australia whilst working full-time in Oz and after 4years of studying I have ended up with 2 bachelor degrees, one from Griffith and one from Macquarie. It's good to read a post from someone who had a similar experience. I don't know if I'll ever use the degrees for anything or even return to Thailand (hopefully I can use them for something as I spent about $15,000AUD and used 4 years of my life), but if I do return to Thailand to teach at least I know I will have a real degree behind me...

  13. Dan141:

    This is my experience from about 5 yrs ago. I only had a TEFL cert but I was already living in Thailand on a 1 yr Non-O visa based on marriage. I was approached by a Thai lady in the street one day to work so I decided to give it a try. I heard that I could get a work permit on a Non-O and I was able to, as well as a teacher's license - without a degree. I asked at immigration in BKK and at the school (which has hundreds of foreign teachers so should know) if I should convert my visa to a Non-B for work but both the school and immigration said if you're married to a Thai and can get a Non-O, it is always better to keep the Non-O because it is not dependent on your employment situation; you will lose the Non-B if you quit work or get fired and have to do the entire visa process again, whereas you can work if you like or not on the Non-O. When I actually renewed my 1 yr Non-O six months later in Singapore the embassy gave me the same answer to the same question. I had letters from the school and MOE ready in case I decided to apply for a Non-B, but no, the Non-O was stated to be the better visa as it allows more flexibility. So, I was able to get a TL and WP on a Non-O visa and would do it again. I will not even consider a Non-B if I can get a Non-O because the Non-O is not dependent on my working / employment circumstances whereas the Non-B is.

    I'd go to Laos, or anywhere where you can get a 1yr Non-O, get the Non-O, and then let the school get you the work permit. If it doesn't work out, you can still live in LOS on your Non-O...

  14. It's good to come back after 2 weeks in Honkers and find this thread going again...

    I will go for the Griffith degree, because as about 95% of people I have consulted including those in here, a double major with 2 proper majors from a uni ranked only 2 or 3 places lower in Australia and 100 lower in the world versus a degree from a slightly better uni but with a dodgy sounding major could do more career wise...

    As for post-grad study. I was accepted into UOW Wollongong Post-grad cert in Education (TEFL or TESOL) at the same time I was considering starting this degree. They accepted me based on my 2 years of full time TEFL teaching in Thailand. However, the Grad Cert was only 4 classes / units and equv to only 6 months of full time study. I then found this degree through OUA. I asked language schools in Bangkok what they would think if a potential employee came to them with eith a 3 year BA in any field or just a 6 month Grad Cert in Education but no Bachelors degree. All schools I consulted told me they would take the BA first because it is evidence of more time in university, whereas skiping the Bachelors first and doing the Grad Cert, allthought in Edu and thus relevant, it would look like a short cut.

    Do you think it was the right decision to do a 3 year BA that can be used as a foundation for anything or do you think it would have been better to just jump straight into the Grad Cert? The Grad Cert becomes a Grad Dip after 6 classes / units (2 more) and then into a full Masters in Education after 8 classes / units (another 2). Even if I got the Masters in Education, it is only a 1 year full time degree based on the study load so I still think a 3 year BA might do more for me.

    I am still thinking about slowly doing the Grad Cert, then 2 more units to get the Grad Dip, the another 2 to get the MEd. After all, a Masters degree in Education with a TEFL / TESOL major would really help out career wise there.

    Still, do you think I should have just done that given I have the chance to go straight into the Grad Cert, or, was it a more wise move to get a BA first?

    I just think that the BA can be used to help get into any career and be used as a building block, where as anything in Education, post-grad or under-grad, is really only good if I want to teach... Nonetheless, if I keep studying, 4 years full time study total for a BA and a Masters in Education (TEFL) is still no too bad...

  15. Xangsamhua: Thanks for your useful reply. It's good to see the same names in here that I used to chat to over 4 years ago now...

    There are no minors so to speak, just two majors with the Griffith degree and one major with the Macquarie degree. A lot of units / classes overlapped as core unis for both degrees - I was unsure which one to get when I started so I carefully selected my units so I could qualify for both then decide later. There are 2 Education electives (education psychology and education history), about 4 philosophy electives, and a few classes in SE Asia, Terrorism in Intl Politics, and one in English writing (not that my quick spelling in here reflects that). There are more education units available now, but when I started, there were only 2 so that is all the education units I could do without altering the degree pathway.

    But Thanks to all the good advice in here, I am really leaning towards Griffith. Like you said, the double major would show / reflect what I actually did and am qualified in. I don't need to use it to prove I went to a specific uni because of ties, so that won't matter. I 'd rather say to a potential employer 'I have a double major in sociology and history & politics' than 'don't laugh, my major is something you would have never heard of before...'

    I wish I could have done more education electives or a minor in EDU, but when I started it wasn't available. Only the 2 EDU classes I did and the one in English writing were relevant to teaching english. OUA now offer a Bachelor degree in primary education through Curtain uni (I think) which is good.

  16. I would not say I have had a change of heart about my feelings towards many things in Thailand - I just decided to get the degree long ago because I am still young and though it would come in handy one day. Also, given that my wife is Thai, if we ever live there again and I need to work, the degree will help out. I got the liberal arts degree because I thought it would be a little more flexible and I could always study more and build on it in case I did not want to teach - a strictly education degree limits your career choices more from what I have heard.

    It seems that others are also telling me to get the degree with the double major because it will look better than a degree with one major. Maybe if I consider that I'm not sure what I want to do or will end up doing, at least a degree with two recognised majors will look better on my CV than a degree with a dodgy sounding major that does not reflect what I actually did at uni...

  17. JusMe: Thank you ever so much for your reply, and for your lesson! How much do I owe you? ;) Also, I like how someone as intelligent as you seem to be managed to type out such a informative post but forgot to add the source of the information. That almost amounts to Plagiarism :) Maybe next time you could be more useful if you just answered the original question, which you almost seemed to miss entirely in your quest to illustrate your knowledge of the English language (spelling / grammar Nazi is the term I have heard used in this forum here before to describe such a poster but I will not go that far)  I thought the question I asked was simple, obviously I was wrong…

    Scott: Thank you for your reply. That is what I was thinking. What is the point in having a degree if people will scratch their heads at the sound of the major? And, I guess, two majors is better than one. It’s good to hear from someone who hires teachers – because that is when it will matter.

    Otherstuff1957: Thank you for your reply. It seems that there is agreement between yourself and Scott that having two proper majors will be more useful than a degree from a slightly better ranked university. In regards to the following quote you made:

    “However, if you think you might go back to Australia in a few years, then the Macquarie degree would be better for you in the long run.”

    I am in Australia now. I used to teach in Thailand and returned to Australia to study and get a degree just in case I return to Thailand in the future to teach – which is probable. In Australia, the name of the university does not matter. In fact, I the majors matter more here. I just thought that would be more of an issue in Thailand. When fellow Asian teachers I used to work with ask me “will your degree be from a famous university?” – that is why I wonder if it would be better to get the degree from the better university. All though Macquarie University graduates get the highest starting salaries for their first job after graduation in Australia, I don’t intend to use my degree here. It is only a backup option in case I return to Thailand and find getting a WP / TL more difficult than last time when my TEFL was enough.

    Any more input / ideas would be useful.

    Also, I forgot to mention, the GPA on each degree will be slightly different because the GPA will take into account only the classes I did at that university – the classes I took at the other university will all be granted as credit from another provider and will not be considered in the GPA. The Macquarie GPA will be 3.87 / 4.0 and the Griffith GPA will be 6.25 / 7.0

  18. I forgot to add, the degree might be used when applying for teaching jobs in Thailand. I'm not sure of the exact degree requirements now coz I last taught there 4 years ago, but I'd like anyone's opinion as to what degree might look better on the CV or help in regards to employment should I go down that path again...

  19. Hi all,

    I haven't posted in here for a while. I just finished my degree and am now faced with a dilema. Basically, using the same 24 units / classes that I completed, I can get one of two degrees. The same units make up both degrees so there won't be any difference in that regard. However, I have to choose between a degree from a better / higher ranked uni but with a dodgy sounding major (Macquarie Uni BA in Society, Life & Learning) or a degree from a slightly lesser ranked uni (Griffith Uni BA with a doubble major in Sociology and History & Politics). Macquarie is ranked about 8 in Australia and about 190 in the world whereas Griffith is about 11 in Australia and about 300 in the world. I know Thais crap on about whose degree is better based on what uni is ranked higher, so I'm not sure which one to end up with. I was initially going to go with the Macquarie BA but I don't like the name of the major and it does not really reflect all the politics / sociology units I did. I'm starting to lean towards the Griffith degree now. Even though the uni isn't ranked as high, I get a double major and both majors (Sociology + History & Politics) are two normal liberal arts majors. So, what would you or should I do? Go for the degree from the better ranked uni, or get the degree with the better major names? Remember, both transcripts will both list the same classes because I carefully chose my classes to qualify for each degree - now I just have to pick what one to get? What will matter more in Thailand and in the West (Australia), the University name or the major name? Thanks for any feedback and it's good to be back after 4 years of study...

  20. Thanks for all the feedback. Maybe I should have been more clearer. I only want to leave BKK airport on the return leg, from HKG BKK CNX. So I will need to check in international at HKG as everything in Intl from HKG. When I get to BKK, I assume I would be kept in a transit area because I am connecting to CNX. Since I will allready have all my boarding passes from HKG check in, I assume, I thought I could just walk straight to passport control as if BKK was my final destination and the come back through domestic security area before departure to CNX. All my bags would be checked through so I would not need to worry about them .etc. So yeah, I only want to leave BKK airport on the way back from HKG to CNX.

    I always do this in KL during stopovers, I just walk in and out of passport control with no issues, however that is a different airport and intl to intl flights. Also, does the CIQ sticker means something like clear immigration quickly or something? I only have 65 mins in BKK on the way to HKG so I asume that is pushing it although Thai say international / domestic connections (to CNX & HKT) on TG only need 55 mins...?

    But yeah, I only want to leave BKK on the return to CNX. I know I will have to go through passport control in BKK to do this, I'm just nopt sure if I am expected to wait in the transit area in BKK and then clear immigration in CNX, coz obviously if I leave the airport in BKK i'll pass passport control there and just need to re-enter the airport as if I am on a domestic flight. I'm just not sure if this will be an issues or not.

    Thanks again.

  21. I will be flying from Chiang Mai to Hong Kong through Bangkok, with all flights on Thai. I am just curious, where do I pass through immigration /passport control?

    Also, I have to do a few things in BKK on the way back to CNX. I have the option to book a 10 hour connection in BKK which will give me enough time to get things done. I would just like to know if I can leave BKK airport during that transit time? I mean, I'm not sure if I'll have to wait in the BKK transit area and clear immigration in CNX. I was hoping I could just pass through immigration in BKK and leave the airport? I am assuimng my bags will be checked through and I'll allready have boarding passes... If any one knows if this is possible or how to do this I'd love to hear...

  22. "Not to forget the disaster after the airport blockage of the Yellow Shirts two years ago..."

    That is still in my mind. My Thai mother-in-law had to extend her allready long vacation in Australia because the Airport takeover started 2 days before she was due to return to BKK.

    1.5 years later, and here we go again. It seems as if everytime I have anything to do with Thailand planned, the shit hits the fan. I don't think I will visit there for many years now - and my Thai wife feels the same.

    I was due to land in Bangkok tonight with my wife for a 2 month vacation. Until about 2 weeks ago, we were still comming. But after the latest round between the reds and the army began, we said stuff it. It just won't be the same. We will now go to the USa and feed their economy for 2 months and we have been given full refunds for everything we had booked in LOS - including non-refundable flights on Thai. Whilst I want Thailand to recover from this, it only has itself to blame for the consequences of its actions. Som nam na...

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