makavelithedon
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Posts posted by makavelithedon
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Hi, there was a big article on Satree a year or so back in one of the newspapers with an interview from the Thai Ed. guy who runs the English Department. Being blunt unless its all you can get and desperate to work in Phuket I wouldn't touch the place. They have an appalling reputation by what I've heard I can gather and work the teachers real hard. The days of Phuket attracting people who would put upwith anything just because of the location are gladly, on the whole, long gone.
A friend of mine owns one of the language schools on phuket (and places a lot of teachers in schools) and there all pretty tough gigs. She deals with constant petty complaints on a daily basis far more from anywhere else and is slowly palming them off entirely. On the other side most school principles have to try and deal with mass over cramming- with schools that were designed for 350 pupils having to accept 1000+!! You figure it out.
Then you will probably get a Satree teacher here reckon its great!!!!!! If you want any other information on the phuket scene by all means PM me.
Warm regards,
Mak
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Metering is definetly the way to go. Tuk Tuk fares in Phuket border on western nations. I don't buy that tosh the governor said either in regard drivers not using them. I have never had it in Bangkok and if they wouldn't switich it on or try and haggle a fare, how hard is it to just refuse point blank, get out and get in another??
The taxis in Bangkok, and Tuk Tuks in Phuket are everywhere. On a positive at least the governor has raised the issue even if as with most others it is probably hot air!
Mak.
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Hi All,
I wondered if some of you with experience in this area could give me your 5 cents worth. I have lived in Phuket on and off for the best part of 3 years and realistically despite its ever increasing faults/problems etc is where my girlfriend lives and the only place she is happy to live which I understand.
I am from the UK so property prices/problems and everything else property is a constant part of our daily lives like it or not! I would like to know if you think it is still possible to get value in Phuket though? Is a land purchase and build the wise course here considering what appears the skyward craziness that seems to be house prices here by the week?
Any views opinions on this crazy and probably unique housing market would be appreciated.
Mak
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Hi all,
I would imagine there are quite a few teachers at the moment who are doing the daily grind in a frustrating gig thinking 'I've had enough of this I need a break from teaching here and want somewhere that pays me a semi-decent wage where I can actually save a little'.
I would appreciate any of the regulars who still engage on the forum and are themselves actually elsewhere at the moment to give me some guidance if they would.
I am in this position of wanting and needing a change having recently quit at the end of the school year worse off than before I started (and I'm not a spend thrift). Problem is after setting out with the 'we are in demand everywhere' myth and mindset and skimming the endless language school vacancies on Dave's esl etc , reading the horror story posts about places such as Korea (which appear endless) not to mention the mini-soap opera in getting a work visa there now apparently. I've ended up in mental no mans land!! It quickly ends up feeling like 'you are in demand everywhere as long as you don't expect more than a bowl of the white stuff everyday'!
I also can't be the only one who has the added complication of trying to find somewhere in which my girlfriend (Thai) can go on a tourist visa or 4 through a 1 year contract.
Anyone in the same conundrum happily or well, working elsewhere feeling at least 25% better than before they jetted off, your pertinent suggestions would be greatly appreciated for this jaded soul!!!!
Mak
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I'd just like to know with the huge shortages in Native teachers throughout Asia as it is, how this minister thinks he is going to tempt so many to switch? I've done a year plus at primary level and the six 2- hour trips to immigration where you are treated worse than a dog (and that's hard here) along with pay- which can only be considered a joke and non-existant anything else in benefits and who would want to even do it?
As with most non-brothel addicted teachers I'm off elsewhere. Until standards are raised about 1000% it's as described by so many others here-nothing more than hot air by another Thai politician.
M.
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Hi Steven,
Thank you for the reply. I know the average wage bit and I wouldn't want to be anywhere near Tokyo or one of the major cities. I wanted to go there primarily to save money not get ripped off left right and centre. 1-2 years was more my aim if I liked it enough to want to return after an initial 12 months. I have heard much of what you said before but its good to hear it again for some consitency of an accurate picture of the place.
Looks like Korea is a better bet I'll just have to sift long and hard through the reported mountains of unscrupulous language schools!
I would be glad of a few more pertinent replies if a few other people of such experiences reside here!!!!
Thanks again,
Mak.
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Hi all,
This is quite a complex post so apologises. I have been teaching in Thailand for 12 months and have returned home to visit family. I had little in the way of problems, taught in a variety of different roles and situations but was at home mostly with 7-12 year old children. Sure I had the frustrations with where I saw improvements that could have made a huge difference etc, but was left alone with a free hand the whole time with no interference from anyone which I know many don't get the luxury of!!! I therefore don't wish to be negative or moan in this regard.
I knew however, quite early on that this was a much tougher gig than I was prepared for as most teachers would vouch for no doubt. I still found it highly enjoyable and a great learning experience but there was no way I was going to do it long term in Thailand with the money on offer. So it is time to look elsewhere. I was also fortunate enough to have a friend who runs a language school- so saw much more of the ins and outs in a shorter period of time than most do and can!
What makes it a little harder is that my gf is Thai so I have to consider visa entry when looking for her also! I think with Korea she could probably come in and out on 3 month holiday visas for an initial 12 month period, with Japan however I'm not sure it's so easy.
I have been looking mainly on tefl.com at Korea, Japan and Hong Kong and as anyone with some experience and the apptitude will know there are plenty of jobs out there but quality is a different matter all together!
The boards seem packed with 'we don't want people who are just in it for the money type language schools' even though that's ok for them and exactly what there in it for, or 30 teaching hour a week contracts leaving you feeling 75 at the end of every week including Saturday work of course!
I have considered Japan (which appears a good balance between hours and pay) however the very recent listings 'the most expensive cities on the planet to live' put it at the top in places 1,2, and 3!!!!! Realistically I can't see me saving 1/2 a 90,000 baht salary there but I have read a fair bit of contradictory advice about it so could be dead wrong!
Hong Kong would be best as my gf has been to China 3 times for long periods with her university studies so I think they would be more understanding in visa matters, however there seem very few jobs here available on the internet other than for Masters educated teachers, although I probably just don't know where to look!
Other than that Korea appears great at throwing you all the trimmings, but you try finding a non-bonus, non-free flights non-bottle of wine and box of chocolates, 20 hour a week gig with solid salary and it's like trying to find Thaksin admitting responsibility for a screw up on an interview, just ONCE in his career!!
If anyone has any recommendations of where to look or experiences of schools I could contact which were actually fun, enjoyable, understanding, supportive......................I think you get what I mean, I've waffled long enough, the pertinent advice would be greatfully appreciated:
Regards
Mak
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I am a resident here in Phuket,
I have been to Patong 4 days running to try and get a perspective on such a bizzare ocurrance. 99% of Phuket goes on as normal and yet this 6 meter strip of beach front is obliterated and you are aware countless people have lost there lives and numerous families will never be the same again. Very hard to comprehend.
Not being a regular on this forum , I wondered how intelligent the conversation and debate would be as I glanced over the posts in regard the Tsunamis, and low and behold it doesn't take long for the usual feeble excuses, comical tongue in cheek rose tinted acceptance and rubbish as to why it is perfectly ok to live in the gutter on a constant basis to pop up.
All the 16 and 17 year old girls who put up with having to service old selfish beached whales every night for a pittance is acceptable because it's somehow helping all the poor Thai's out who have lost so much. As long as every able bodied man who comes on holiday from now to April walks this route I'm sure the high season wil be rescued. Pathetic.
Sadly, with so much commercial destruction on Patong's beach road and off shoots it would have been the ideal time for the government to have come in and financially supported a rebuilding program that reflected the natural beauty and potential the island once had and showed. Sadly, they won't and Patong will end up being re-constructed along exactly the same lines, playing to the bottom of the food chain-real shame.
Still life goes on..................lets just hope it goes on with those touirists who do venture giving a finer example of human empathy and respect than most one can witness here on there 2 weeks in the sun on any given day pre-tsunami disaster.
Mak
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Hi all,
I would appreciate if someone could recommend the best place to start when learning Thai?
I have lived here nearly a year and work has prevented me finding time to take classes, so I know some spoken Thai although very little.
I would appreciate a few pointers in which is the best way of going about learning, take written class or conversation firstly? I have been informed that by learning to write greatly improves speach and pronounciation but have no idea how long it takes to learn the skill with a teacher. The most cost effective way would be appreciated as classes don't come cheap where I am at around 6000 baht for 20 hours!
Many thanks,
Mak
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No I don't need to. Thankyou. It was merely a hypothetical question. Thanks anyway for the reply.
I was more interested in if it was legal or if their was anything in their statute covering a mail application whilst still in Thailand- nothing more. As one who is fortunate enough not to have encountered the hassles many of the guys here do I have not had to try any or all of the angles and so, other than asking for advice on bog standard B toursit etc etc have little knowlege of what appears extremely inconsistant and complex visa procedures.
regards
M the stupid.
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Many thanks guys I think that kind of clears it up!
Just out of interest does anyone know if it is possible to send a passport home to where a 1 year cat B visa was issued through the likes of DHL etc for a renewal application etc! As long as you provide the relevant letter from a prospective employer etc. I know the Embassy I used were much more liberal and understanding shall we say, than the likes of Penang - Then, have it shipped back. As long as it was early on in a 3 month cycle you would not be an overstayer???
Regards,
Mak
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Hi all,
I wonder if some one can clarify this situation (and yes I have checked the relevant info pages before posting without luck) in regard a Work permit and category B extension.
I have a friend who originally arrived on a tourist visa and has renewed via the neighbouring countries a couple of times.
He has now travelled to Penang and got a straight forward plain Jane 3 month cat B visa. He wishes to work for a language school and has all the relevant paperwork. However the owner (who is Thai) is adament that if she applies on his behalf for a 12 month work permit as a teacher that he will not have to then renew the visa, the labour office will stamp it for the period of the WP! Is this correct?
There was talk in the local paper where we both reside of there being a different channel and procedures for teachers but this appears just to straight forward and logical to me for Thailand!!
Can anyone clear this up?
Warm regards,
MAK.
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Hi all,
I wonder if you can give some advice on how you go about obtaining a work permit when a teacher, but not employed directly by a government school?
As a hypothetical-If you have a non-im multi B visa and work for a language school who places you in a number of different schools or training scenarios with varied weekly hours, is it still possible to easily obtain a work permit and teachers license (someone please explain that one) as long as you don't mind the fee which I believe is ridiculously expensive but there you are?
I am aware a huge amount of teachers work without one and it does seem an area where the authorities in general appear to have some empathy but knowing Thailand the thought of looking over ones shoulder with the possibility of being deported for this just does not appeal personally.
Any advice in this area would be appreciated.
Mak
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Ajarn,
I don't feel my points are broadly negative, I merely feel it inappropriate for those who are not in Thailand with a desire to teach and integrate as if they are emmigrating from the outset to be in the teaching profession here. Furthermore if I put myself in the position of a parent I certainly would want to feel a teacher was committed in this regard. I really can't see this as negative just how it should be for a person anywhere to be in the position a teacher of this type holds in Asian society.
As regards backpackers, of course it is a great way to see the world or a large portion of it and you would need pockets the size of the current Thai P.M. if you expected to cover so much ground and stay at the Holiday Inn!!!!
I am not criticising those who travel in this fashion in anyway, and I have done a bit myself a few years ago BUT I didn't take a teaching position for a few months at the expense of children. If this appears negative so be it I suppose.
Finally, because of the broad nature of this site and the mixture of individuals here (of which I feel makes it so interesting) many have no experience or interest in talking teacher shop and why should they!!!
So I suppose this thread has taken a very one sided view of teaching on the whole where were all portrayed as having to do better!!!I am realistic enough to know however that their are many internal hands played by the Thai side of the profession and much bad press is because of unfounded stories born of lower wages/threats to status and whatever else you care to mention. That is why I felt your comments in this regard were quite obviously made from great experience and depth of living here. Many Thanks.
And I apologise in advance for any unchecked grammatical errors I have just about given up trying to correct on the P.C I am allocated if I could afford it I would have launced into the street about 15 times over the last few days!!!
Regards,
Mak.
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'And Mac, our definitions differ around backpackers, maybe. To me, a backpacker is simply anyone who lives lightly and simply, and the same if they travel, like out of a backpack. I have found many to have very respectable traits'.
Yep, I think our intrepetation certainly is different Ajarn, I must say it seemed a tad strange with the other points you raised with the rest of your thread- Apologies.
To me they are those simply looking to extend their stay by whatever is the easiest means possible before moving on, a 'year out traveller' type if you like. The very essence of that make them IMO not only unsuitable for this job but should not be suitable for TEFL or other courses of this nature.
The trouble is if you look at many of the companies advertising these courses around the net this appears the very market they seem to be pitching at!!!!
I think the governing bodies of these courses should become much more stringent with not only the enrolment criterion but the whole application process for being a registered provider. This irresponsibility is making the job here for any genuine foreigner with long term aspirations more and more impossible.
In the province I am currently residing, there has been a debate for the last few weeks in the local paper in regard to backpacker types and the problems a school with it first intake of native speakers has had. They have been very dissapointed to put it mildly, and this is not just teaching attitude or motivation, but smoking in front of children and coming to work dressed like you were going for a day at the beach! In other words, not an ounce of understanding or respect for the culture or the profession they appear to have latched onto in order to earn enough for the next place of interest.
I just wonder what sort of reception, support and time the teacher who applies at this school for the new year will get now?
To me, a fake certificate used by an experienced and proven teacher to gain a work permit simply pales into insignificance compared to this type of person!
Maybe just another stone in the pond!
Regards,
MAK
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Ajarn, whilst I agree with nearly all that you have posted, especially you reference to grammar, I am surprised as to your comments or lack of them in our primary role in teaching here!
I also found your reference to backpackers a little surprising, but bow to your experience in the matter. I would however add that their primary reason for being here is travel and not a long term commitment to a place they have wished to settle. It is not uncommon for a head of English to have to go in and speak to a class of 11 year olds on a monday morning and tell them their English teacher won't be coming back to teach them for the rest of the year as they have decided Japan or South Korea had an apparently great dance scene! Not the best way for those with honest and a long term commitment to build a sense of professionalism and respect here!!
Yes grammar is important to a non-native speaker as they don't have the trial and error time luxury we posses in our step by step understanding and learning of our own language nor the native interaction that goes with it. However, most of the Thai teachers as mentioned elsewhere in the thread have and do do a very good job in teaching the mechanics of the language. The problem here is the shocking use of the language's primary use-SPEECH and PRONUNCIATION.
Much of Thailand's economy is built on tourism and the interaction with tourists many who although they know English is not their native language either of at which point it is even more important to be clear and precise!! What possible use is it to know a noun phrase from a subject complement if you cannot be understood?
I realise that a blend of the two- along with writing a listening all play in the development of learning, but the empahasis for native speakers who are fairly neutral and competent speakers and I emphasise competent, is improving this area more so than the rest, of which Thai native speakers appear to be doing a very competent job of. That in no way detracts from the fact our grammar should be of a good standard for when it is needed, but it should not be the focal point of our work here.
In reply to some of the other comments on this thread in regard those fortunate enough to hold BA's or MA's in Educational fields. In an ideal world of course this would be the best route to take. But if you look around the educational websites it is quite evident that the need for teachers to meet the recent demand in the global economy to interact with the world's global tongue is so great there simply isn't enough of these highly trained professionals to meet the demand in their own countries let alone that of Asia, and never will be! Couple that with the fact many teachers who are brought up teaching in their own country bestow upon themselves a responsibilty to teach and try and improve the standards of their own children and you end up with us amateur-professionals and very few exported highly trained and gifted people teaching here.
All one can hope for I suppose is that at least a teacher tries his/her best and knows the area in which they should be working and those they should certainly not! I also think as a graduate of the TEFL type program that the course should be double its current length and have a far higher failure rate but I have no doubt bored everyone long enough and apologise if I have gone way off the thread's main topic!
Regards
Mak.
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Thanks for clearing that up so swiftly!
Mak.
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Hi all,
After returning from a visa run to Penang recently, the customs/passport official- on returning to Thailand stamped my passport with the usual triangular date stamp etc but then proceeded to stamp NON on top of it!
I just wondered what this meant? Is it as simple as being non imm or as he just made life a little more difficult?
I have a non imm B with the multiple 4 trip option.
Many thanks
MAK
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Hi Robert,
I would like to add a reply (of which I hope is a little more sober) in regard to your original thread.
I have recently taken some courses here in Thailand so that it ensures I have a good grounding in becoming a teacher. I have the genuine pieces of paper you were originally mulling over, although I admit that they have no relevance to teaching English, and I have never had the slightest interest in a career of which they are of use!!
After reading your opening remarks I thought yeh ok, you have had a fair amount of experience elsewhere, and as many teachers will know (bar the few we can count working abroad with a BA in Education) the degree is only of any relevance for the paperwork in this field.
The main difference between us though is that I DO WANT TO TEACH first and foremost, It has just taken me a long time to realise that this is what I want to do!
To say that the root of the huge number of problems in the Thai education system is simply down to a load of backpackers (degree or otherwise) is hugely simplistic and pathetically naive. However, I think first and foremost unmotivated people e.g backpackers or others short of cash, who have not the slightest interest in teaching others are certainly dragging down the reputation of foreign staff. Your statement in not wanting to really do it therefore would greatly deter me from being positive in regard to you teaching in the "normal school system".
Most private schools here though would take you with your experience- to teach business people or those wishing to learn as adults etc and the money is very fair why not try that avenue and you may find that with a more flexible schedule you actually start to enjoy it? Please leave the educating of children to those of us who have a desire to do it and integrate (where accepted) into the Thai school system with all it entails-Degree, no degree, PHD, MA or otherwise!!!
I would also advise you if you have not done so already, to enrol on the CELTA teaching programme and the other short courses that are of great benefit. They can always improve a teacher however long they have been teaching, not to mention increase your prospects in the private arena.
As I have stated previously though, there really is no reason why you would not have a job at such establishments as Nava english school within 30 minutes if your in the likes of Bangkok, and they will help you with the legal stuff like the work permit if your prepared to pay for it, you do not need the 60,000 baht a year salary or whatever it is now- teachers have a special application system according to one of the private schools I visited where these rates don't apply!
Hope some of this helps,
Regards
Mak
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Reading more of the issues regarding a tightening of the rules for Westerners, and trying to look ahead as a novice here. Could someone please tell me if you have 400000 baht in the bank that you will be able to remain in Thailand pretty much with just a visa renewal application?
I am just wondering if I will be able to take private students on an hourly basis to tick over so to speak and I also have approx 24,000 baht per month investment that I can use if necessary, even if not desirable I'd rather teach and leave it at home. I guess the main point I am driving at is if one deposits 400000 baht leaves it in their Thai account, that as long as you have your head down you will just have to apply for a b class Visa once a year?
I'm just looking ahead at worst case scenario, that pretty much all native English teachers have to leave if the schools will not pay or be able to afford the enforced minimum wage hike?
If I have this wrong apologies but these Visa/residence matters are only approx 4 days from birth for me! Any comments greatly appreciated.
M.
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Thankyou for your replies. Could you please clarify if it is possible that if granted with the non-immigrant type B visa you mention/recommend that another type visa can be issued via the school of employment applying through the local government office or would an employee still have to hop in and out to remain regardless, thus meaning a maximum stay of 12 months?
Or does it change when a Thai school/university are involved and if say you are working there as long as you wish then as long as they apply correctly for you it becomes an indefinite non-immigrant residence?
Many thanks yet again,
M.
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Hi all,
As a new member and having searched the board and read about the pending visa changes I thought it still best to ask for advice!
I am 32 and an English E.U national. I am visiting Thailand for the third time in twelve months (both previous occasions less than 1 month each time) in late December 2003.
I will be studying at a teaching school for 6 weeks, followed by placement teaching very soon after that. Could you please advise on the best type of Visa to apply for? I have been informed that a multi entry Visa is best applied for in my native country at the local Thai Embassy via details of my training in Thailand which the school will help with.
Further to this when working for a school I have read that they will then apply to the relevant government department for a work permit/visa for as long as you are teaching?
Any advice would be appreciated, especially seeing this will roll in to next year when the changes will be implemented, and also any comments on the changes that you see this making to a teacher would also be very interesting.
I would like to add I am not visiting Thailand for part of a 6 or 12 month 'year out holiday' nor to be another troublesome Farang catalyst for genuine expats as I have read so many times in skimming recent posts and have the highest regard for this area of the world. I have no interest in any sordid tourist activities nor wish to travel and conduct oneself with anything less than the utmost respect and professionalism whilst a temporary resident in this country, even if preferably in a longer than normal capacity.
Therefore, any pertinent replies from any of you guys would be very very greatly appreciated.
Warm regards
M.
Phuket Looks Gloomily To The Future -tourist Chief
in Phuket
Posted · Edited by makavelithedon
Hmmmm, I wonder how much of this to believe. Only last week I enquired about the availability of a property in a newly built complex I've seen under construction just as a barometer to whats happening on the island. It's nowhere near finished. I was informed that every unit is already sold they range from 7-14 million baht and are only apartments and IMO offer little scope for appreciation in the short or medium term!!!!
This would be in stark contrast to those quoting the island as finished???? I realize that this isn't your 2 week hotel and all punter, but still it cuts across that being spouted by the governor.
As for comments made in regard it being over-developed, expensive and showing all the hallmarks of a mini-Bangkok to come, I couldn't agree more, it's exactly why I have said adios after approximately 3 years! The rate of expansion and all the ills of a Hong Kong or Singapore are quite evident, and the traffic congestion appeared to be worstening by the week.
It's just a shame that the people in charge of the island haven't learnt by our mistakes with places of such beauty that have been ruined before. It would be a good time for reflection on where they are taking the island but sadly I don't see anything of a positive nature happening until it's way to late and then if ever.
Mak