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kuffki

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Posts posted by kuffki

  1. The most sensible option in my opinion would be to raise minimum wage in proportion with inflation. ie if inflation is at 5%, raise minimum wage by 5% and not to the same level across all country but respectively for each province.

    One is still left with an inadequate minimum wage. The fact remains that the current minimum wage is inadequate.

    Just like any other country in the world.

  2. While the intentions of some people here is noble, many need to try to own and run business in Thailand and i do not mean just internet "i have a business"

    I own some hotels, and i can tell you, some people come for job interview in boxer shorts, without a shower, un-brushed hair, dirty cloths etc.

    Some staff simply come to work and sit there doing nothing, and when i say nothing i mean NOTHING.

    1 housekeeper i had, it took her 6 hours to clean 1 room and mind you she was on double the minimum wage.

    I have written out point by point instructions on what needs to be done daily and still same employees do nothing. Some can not even answer the phone.

    And some here believe those should get a pay rise? if anything, their pay should be half.

    There is no work ethics in Thailand, no loyalty or desire to succeed especially when it come to unskilled labor.

    I have 3 times the needed staff because they simply do not care, raising their wage will not make them work or care any more or harder, all it will do is cost me more money but than i will fire half of them.

  3. 300 baht is less than the minimum Hourly wage in places like Britain.

    OK, you can't compare like for like but with inflation , especially food inflation 300 baht goes nowhere. Its just about enough to feed a Family. It probably buys what 150 baht did a couple of years ago. I really feel the Poor here are becoming Poorer.

    Failure to implement this could really lead to some serious Social unrest IMNSHO.

    Minimum wage is enough to feed 1 person in any country in the world. Did you want Thai unskilled labor get minimum wage to be enough to buy BMW and take yearly holidays to Bahamas.

  4. Much of the opposition to the minimum wage proposal simply reflects the rage and mean spiritedness of the Sino Thai political and business establishment who have built their fortunes on monopolies,protection and low wages.The current government has a genuine mandate and , though the devil is in the detail, will no doubt in due course implement its election pledge - though I suspected in an adapted form.

    More enlightened elements in the elite such as the outgoing Finance Minister saw merit in the proposal as this interview from 2010 makes very clear:

    http://www.smh.com.a...0811-11zup.html

    Longer term (because countries like Bangladesh will dominate this niche) unless Thailand wishes to continue as a low labour cost lower added value economy this measure needs to be implemented along with radical reforms in the educational sector

    Actually opposition is from people who own business and know what they talking about compared to either theoretical assumptions and employees who could not care less if business went out of business, because their brain does not grasp the concept that they will be unemployed.

    I am yet to meet 1 employee who got pay rises, bonuses and everything else during high times for the business but offered anything in return for the tough times.

  5. The most sensible option in my opinion would be to raise minimum wage in proportion with inflation. ie if inflation is at 5%, raise minimum wage by 5% and not to the same level across all country but respectively for each province.

    With all due respect this is not very sensible. If you were to do this then the workers would remain at the exact same position as they were. If wage increases equal inflation then the worker stays the same and does not better his standard of living. :jap: Which is the whole point of the exercise.

    What needs to be done is develop a model that equates increased productivity with increased wages. When the worker increases output so that the business makes more money then he/she should share in the increased profits up to the 300 baht. Of course if an employee is very valuable then the business owner is free to establish a higher compensation. The model could freeze the level of profits that the owner keeps until the employees reach the 300 threshold. When output increases with wage increases then inflation is controlled and everybody is happy. B)

    A model would be perfect except for one problem. ...... We are in Thailand :o

    What factors do you think are used to set a minimum wage?

    Yes when inflation is up so should the wage be because prices rise.

    Do you propose just to give people huge salary so they can afford to buy anything and everything?(i do not mean 300 baht but general)

    The model you are talking about is called bonus or commission or pay per job it certainly has nothing to do with minimum wages

  6. In my opinion its one of the best initiatives so far. However knowing my rights does not make me right nor does it help me in any way what so ever.

    As the saying goes" The one who is right is the one who has the rights to be right"

    I would love to see a seminar where some kind of panel or agency would be set up and foreigners living in Thailand can lodge complains that will actually be dealt with, but i am dreaming now

  7. and I actually thought someone had the sense to realise that sex tourism sells and is worth cultivating - after all if they legalised prostitution in Pattaya they could then tax it properly like any other profession and concentrate on dealing with real criminals.

    They do tax it. I know of at least four police agencies that collect the tax on a regular basis. Pattaya criminals? What criminals in Pattaya. They are the ones who .....

    Considering that there are only 3 police agency's i would really love to know what 4th you know? and what others would be? since you said you know at least 4rolleyes.gif

  8. if a man is paid 200 baht a day, and he then receives an increase of 50% I rest assured that his disposable income has risen 100 baht......where he chooses to spend his new found wealth is up to him and remember these are people with the ability to keep overheads to a minimum, they have had years of practice...

    when a man is paid 100 baht more, 50% rise, rest assured he will be paying 50% more on everything he buys the day after he gets his 100 baht.

    I am starting to see that you simply may not understand how economics works,

    Remember when fuel prices went up? so did the price of bread, milk and every other necessity. One thing though wit that, 1 truck can carry lots of milk and bread and prices still almost doubled. What do you think would happen to prices when main expense -wages- go up by 50%?

    So did the dairies, and bakeries all go out of business because the price doubled, due to a fuel increase.......because that is what we are told will happen if there is a minimum wage rise.....

    I understand economies of scale, a man that eats his own rice and chickens is not affected by a price rise of bread, he drinks water not milk, maybe a little home made rice wine now and then.....his trip into town on the baht bus once a week may go up 5 baht.......the only time he may be affected in the way you suggest is if he gets to a salary level where he considers luxury items are affordable......but you don't appear to want that to happen

    Yes the man will also peddle his OWN, HOMEMADE generator, bring his own water from the ocean, Oh but wait, the man who eats his own rice and chicken would be self employed farmer, so the wage increase would not applywhistling.gif

    Of course that man when he needs help on his farm, would pay his staff half in money and the other half in chickens and rice to cover the wage increase. Oh but wait, if he pays in rice and chickens then he does not have enough food for himselfwhistling.gif

  9. if a man is paid 200 baht a day, and he then receives an increase of 50% I rest assured that his disposable income has risen 100 baht......where he chooses to spend his new found wealth is up to him and remember these are people with the ability to keep overheads to a minimum, they have had years of practice...

    when a man is paid 100 baht more, 50% rise, rest assured he will be paying 50% more on everything he buys the day after he gets his 100 baht.

    I am starting to see that you simply may not understand how economics works,

    Remember when fuel prices went up? so did the price of bread, milk and every other necessity. One thing though wit that, 1 truck can carry lots of milk and bread and prices still almost doubled. What do you think would happen to prices when main expense -wages- go up by 50%?

  10. Major companies put out to SME's and that is one area where such business may suffer, the major corporates procurement sector is ruthless, they negotiate to leave limited margin for the producer in order to maintain their profit levels and competitive edge........any SME that has a say three year contract to supply product may well have failed to build into the module a major lift in the minimum wage, unfortunate, another part of the learning curve. While I agree this could well cause a loss of margin for the remaining duration of the contract, do we blame the government for putting up the minimum wage to a reasonable level, the major corporate purchaser for driving down the margin for the producer, or the SME management for being short sighted and not ensuring sufficient margin.

    "do we blame the government for putting up the minimum wage to a reasonable level" - Who else can you blame?

    And this isn't just about raising minimum wages. No one is saying don't raise minimum wages.

    It's about raising minimum wages by such a large percentage in such a short time. The tax offset will help some companies, but only those that are making enough profit after taking in all the extra costs.

    A rise in the minimum wage pushes more disposable income into the purchasing sector, so if the SME's have a good product the market will probably be able to absorb a price increase....

    Limited inflation can promote growth in the economy

    Tell me are you able to release the percentage and timing of the minimum wage rises you appear to be privy to.......I doubt it will be an immediate full on rise......but if it suits your political standing to hold the new government to this promise......then I feel you are not discussing the possible effect of a realistic minimum wage increase but rather angling to accuse the government of either causing hardship/unemployment/failed business........or not delivering on their promise........

    For me as I have stated previously I think the government will build the minimum wage as quickly as is reasonably possible.....people may get impatient but I think as long as the promise is delivered this term the government will be ok.

    Arise in minimum wage = a rise in prices, so rest assured there will be no more disposable income, if anything less disposable income. Then, there will also be more unemployment which again means less disposable income.

    Then there will be higher prices, meaning less spending, also meaning less exports, also meaning less jobs and again means less income.

    Wages usually rise along with the prices, not other way around.

  11. Finally a mayor with a sense for reality. Isn't his dad (Somchai Khuenpluem) still a fugitive from the law?

    To finally embrace Pattaya as place where most of businesses are directly or indirectly dependent on prostitution is as bold a move as it is smart. The truth shall set you free!

    Perhaps it would be good for the Tourism Authority of Thailand to also finally admit the fact and cease TV commercials like "Pattaya, Pearl of the East. Enjoy!" and instead replace them with plainly inaccurate messages like "Pattaya, Gem of the Eastern Seaboard, where the polluted sea is going to strip the skin off your body and land-based vixens of any type will soothe you in amazing ways.".

    But when have you ever encountered a government official who got it right in this country? Where are they holidaying anyway?

    do you know what satire means? Its that large word written in red and bald in the beginning of OProlleyes.gif

    Just in case you do not, Satire is A funny piece of writing that usually makes fun of foolish or evil behavior.

  12. $300-$350 for a house? where in the suburbs?2 hour drive from the city 2 bedroom apartment in Sydney is $600+, house is $800+Price to purchase 2 bedroom unit in the city $700 000+Price to purchase house in the city or decent area $1 000 000 Just sold 1 bedroom, no parking, in Paddington for $660 000, my 2 bedroom in Surry Hills was valued few months ago at $850 0001 bedroom was renting for $690 per week and 2 bed is currently paying $700 per week, but tenants been there for 5 year already so kept rent the same(others in the building paying $850 per week)PS. Both apartments, not houses<br />

    Melbourne suburbs, within an hour of the city. Everyone in Australia knows Sydney housing prices are ridiculous. Inner Melbourne you would be looking at min $500+ as well.

    Kuffki you must have sold at a very opportune time. Housing prices are dropping like stone now. I know Brisbane has dropped over 6% in the last few months. Houses have been very over valued lately over here.

    I would be interested in a private chat about business/property etc over a few ales wiith you when I get close to making the permanent move as you are obviously no dunce.

    But back on topic, this isn't really about pay rates etc, it is more about them having to work 20 hours or so on a shift and the staff, after those hours being able to do their work in a safe enviironment. I would think at around the 12 hour mark they may start to decline in their competence and may be unsafe.

    absolutely 20 hours of work is impossible, however you have to keep in mind that when they are resting ie say BKK to SYD is only 9 hour flight, but there is also a lay over in Sydney before flying back and i could be wrong but they lay over time is also counted into the working hours. So in earlier example in fact they only work about 9 hours, while the other 11 are resting. Not in their home, but still in a nice hotel.

    again i could be wrong, but i am pretty sure thats the case. I seriously doubt any airline makes their staff work for 20 hours as in being in flight and work for 20 hours straight

  13. <br />
    <br />
    Australia's minimum wage is Aus$590 per week
    <br /><br />This amounts to about 75000 Baht per month.Is there someone who can confirm this as I'm interested in a low paid job in Australia in that case.<br />
    <br /><br />$590 = 15.52 per hour on a 38 hour week pre tax. $2,360 per month pre tax a pitence and I wouldn't work for that in Aust .<br /><br />AUD = 32.82 baht 77,455 bht per month pre tax. after tax about 52,000 baht.<br /><br />You would struggle very hard to live on this in Aust as the average rent is approx 250 AUD per week. However knock yourself out and go for it.<br />
    <br /><br /><br />

    Don't know where you live in Australia, but in Melbourne there are not many rentals for around $250 per week anymore, especially if you're looking for a house. It's up around the 300-350 now. Housing is ridiculous in Australia at the moment. The average entry level house costs around 400-500k AUD. The cost of living is relatively high in Australia compared to say the US.

    $300-$350 for a house? where in the suburbs?2 hour drive from the cityrolleyes.gif

    2 bedroom apartment in Sydney is $600+, house is $800+

    Price to purchase 2 bedroom unit in the city $700 000+

    Price to purchase house in the city or decent area $1 000 000 +

    Just sold 1 bedroom, no parking, in Paddington for $660 000, my 2 bedroom in Surry Hills was valued few months ago at $850 000

    1 bedroom was renting for $690 per week and 2 bed is currently paying $700 per week, but tenants been there for 5 year already so kept rent the same(others in the building paying $850 per week)

    PS. Both apartments, not houses

  14. Isn't that the difference to being paid a 'salary' which is understood does not include overtime and a paid by the hour (in which case you need to pay overtime)? I was employed in your scenario above under a salary and in my contract it was outlined that additional work may be required from time to time (at no additional pay). Part of the contract.

    Didn't you have this in your contracts with your employees? If they were on an hourly rate then you need to pay them for the time they are there. They leave early, they get paid an hour less, the work an hour more, they get paid an hour more. This is the law and why many office, etc jobs are salary (as there is no need for overtime pay). Technical jobs are usually paid on number of hours worked.

    If you had staff that were lazy, then why didn't you get rid of them during the probation period. Australia employers are allowed to have a probation period and if the employee is not working as expected for their wage then you have the right not to offer them a permanent ongoing contract, which is not 'firing them'. Surely as a good business owner you would know this, be able to determine the persons potential attitude while working during the interview, from references etc. Thought this was normal practice?

    i was not aware that this topic was about me, nor was i ever i was posting about my situationblink.gif

  15. Kuffki, from the conditions you mention about your staff it seems you are a more than fair employer. Unfortunately there are many that aren't and they end up causing grief for the employers that do the right thing.

    Thats the whole point, i am sure if you ask some of them, they will tell you how badly they are treated.and usually the ones who are really worth the money-either get pay rises or look for another job and the lazy, useless ones are the ones always complain about being used or underpaid or exploited.

    And i am 99% certain its the same across the board

    Yes I see your point and agree that some, maybe most are like that. But some do have legitimate complaints regarding being paid under the minimum wage or being asked to work unreasonably long hours. It is because of those employees actions that cause problems with reputable employers having to jump through hoops to satisfy govt organisations.

    No doubt, however again in most cases, employee does not speak the truth of what actually takes place.

    Employee would never confirm that he/she gets to go home earlier every day, but in return sometimes asked to stay longer(without pay)

    Employee gets to pick holidays but sometimes asked to work on the weekends

    It is give and take, but with many employees, especially the ones who complain, it is never about them giving anything to employer, it is only about them taking.

    Jetstar is a budget airline, so staff are not expected to perform on the same level as full service airline, so they can not expect a salary of a full service airline.

  16. No i am not saying business should act illegally, however it is hardly ever as black &white as that.

    For example, if i have someone work night and pay him minimum wage, but he is at work 3 hours over time-legally i should pay him 3 hours over time. right?!

    But that night person sleeps for 8 hours of his/her shift/ so legally i should either fire them or cut the salary(providing i have evidence) right?!

    But to be a "nice" business, i do not fire him, but keep him on minimum wage. The reality is even though he/she is at work, he/she is asleep.

    If this person goes to union and files a complaint, he/she will win for being exploited and underpaid(he/she will never say in complain that he/she sleeps for 8 hours of the shift) but in reality the employee is the one exploiting the company and using company time for sleeping

    I would make him take it off his holiday entitlement, but that may not be so easy in Thailand. I don't disagree with what you say here, my points are more about the employers who pay under the minimum wage as a matter of course. There are quite a few of them here unfortunately.

    You misunderstood what i was trying to say. That was just an example. My point is that the ones who supposedly underpay usually have the reason for it, which is never published and employee never speaks the truth of what actually takes place. Because i can not think of a business where the owner would underpay to good employees.

  17. Actually, if employees were greatful and hard working then business would not need to "exploit" Show me one business where "usefull" staff are mistreated. and i do mean useful in the eyes of the business not in the eyes of employeerolleyes.gif

    I am sure every cleaner thinks he is the core of the company and of course is under paid in his opinion.

    How long have you live in Oz? you are a migrant from UK, is not that right?

    Here is one recently, first one on google. http://www.fairwork....ns-workers.aspx

    I can get many more if you like but don't think it is necessary. Main issue with many of them is being underpaid. Though there is a federal court decision handed down just a few days ago regarding a voluntary agreement made by x-strata mines with it's employees being illegal.

    Yes I am a migrant from the UK. I am 47 and have lived in oz since I was 4. Though I would say for all intents and purposes I'm from oz. even though I'm not a citizen. I chose not to be a citizen because an EU passport allows me to work in Europe a lot easier, if I wished.

    Sorry about the links, I have no idea of the issue with them, I think you mentioned this to me on another thread but I have no idea what is going wrong.

    And where does it say that those"underpaid" were valuable in the eyes of the business?

    Also how many businesses are out there?

    So now that employees got some extra money, company will close down and all will be unemployed! what a happy endingrolleyes.gif

    Lets see how helpful it would be for the employees of this company to get a job at another

    So you are saying that it is ok for a business to act illegally?

    The law states the minimum wage. If a business cannot operate on that basis then they should certainly be shut down. The employees aren't getting 'extra money' they are asking for their entitlement under the law but are being taken advantage of by an unscrupulous employer. The employer should not be running a business if he/she cannot abide even provide the minimum wage.

    Google is your friend to find there are many many employers that are doing this which is why there must be checks and balances in place.

    No i am not saying business should act illegally, however it is hardly ever as black &white as that.

    For example, if i have someone work night and pay him minimum wage, but he is at work 3 hours over time-legally i should pay him 3 hours over time. right?!

    But that night person sleeps for 8 hours of his/her shift/ so legally i should either fire them or cut the salary(providing i have evidence) right?!

    But to be a "nice" business, i do not fire him, but keep him on minimum wage. The reality is even though he/she is at work, he/she is asleep.

    If this person goes to union and files a complaint, he/she will win for being exploited and underpaid(he/she will never say in complain that he/she sleeps for 8 hours of the shift) but in reality the employee is the one exploiting the company and using company time for sleeping

  18. Kuffki, from the conditions you mention about your staff it seems you are a more than fair employer. Unfortunately there are many that aren't and they end up causing grief for the employers that do the right thing.

    Thats the whole point, i am sure if you ask some of them, they will tell you how badly they are treated.and usually the ones who are really worth the money-either get pay rises or look for another job and the lazy, useless ones are the ones always complain about being used or underpaid or exploited.

    And i am 99% certain its the same across the board

  19. Actually, if employees were greatful and hard working then business would not need to "exploit" Show me one business where "usefull" staff are mistreated. and i do mean useful in the eyes of the business not in the eyes of employeerolleyes.gif

    I am sure every cleaner thinks he is the core of the company and of course is under paid in his opinion.

    How long have you live in Oz? you are a migrant from UK, is not that right?

    Here is one recently, first one on google. http://www.fairwork....ns-workers.aspx

    I can get many more if you like but don't think it is necessary. Main issue with many of them is being underpaid. Though there is a federal court decision handed down just a few days ago regarding a voluntary agreement made by x-strata mines with it's employees being illegal.

    Yes I am a migrant from the UK. I am 47 and have lived in oz since I was 4. Though I would say for all intents and purposes I'm from oz. even though I'm not a citizen. I chose not to be a citizen because an EU passport allows me to work in Europe a lot easier, if I wished.

    Sorry about the links, I have no idea of the issue with them, I think you mentioned this to me on another thread but I have no idea what is going wrong.

    And where does it say that those"underpaid" were valuable in the eyes of the business?

    Also how many businesses are out there?

    So now that employees got some extra money, company will close down and all will be unemployed! what a happy endingrolleyes.gif

    Lets see how helpful it would be for the employees of this company to get a job at another

  20. Has anyone bothered to ask if employees had gun to their heads?:blink:

    They do not like it, simply resign and get a job with the airline who does not exploit.

    Just typical Thai mentality "give them a finger,, they want the whole hand" no comprehension what so ever.

    I gave my staff 20% off daily special prices(which are already half price), some had the nerve to question why its not 50%, mind you, its on top of their free meal allowance.

    i gave my staff leniency in regards to having a day off(and they get 1 day off per week), so some started shifting and changing every second day.

    Business should NOT have to explain it self, do not like it-off you go and find another job.

    Gotta agree you got a good point there.

    If all emplyers were fair and reasonable then businesses would not have to explain themselves. There are unscrupulous employers out there that take advantage. There are many cases here in oz where employees were underpaid. That is why employers need to be answerable.

    Actually, if employees were greatful and hard working then business would not need to "exploit" Show me one business where "usefull" staff are mistreated. and i do mean useful in the eyes of the business not in the eyes of employeerolleyes.gif

    I am sure every cleaner thinks he is the core of the company and of course is under paid in his opinion.

    How long have you live in Oz? you are a migrant from UK, is not that right?

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