A third of Thais believe road carnage is fate, conference told

[joeyg]

12 hours ago, FarangJon said:

A third of Thais believe road carnage is fate, conference told.

 

Yeah and Thai people belive in ghosts too. Fate of course

Are there any other cultures that believe in ghosts?  Thank you.

 

[joeyg]

17 hours ago, keithpa said:

Why are people wasting their time on this. Nothing any body says is going to make one iota of difference.

I respect your right to question why people are discussing this in an open forum about Thailand. And, Thank You.

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed. 

[joeyg]

I think extreme poverty + ignorance + alcohol abuse = the cause of many of the road fatalities here.

[MartinL]

17 hours ago, DavisH said:

... and force all riders to wear helmets. Let's just start there. Only only needs to fall off their bike at 10 km/h or less and suffer a brain injury or worse. 

 

I was waiting in line at 4am yesterday to go into the King's crematorium exhibition. 

 

A young, smallish rider on a Honda MSX was carrying a passenger of about 120 kg and attempted a wheelie, encouraged by his passenger. Neither was wearing a helmet.

 

Given that the bike's small, got a short wheelbase and the passenger was sitting behind the rear wheel axle, the low-speed wheelie attempt was successful (sort of). The wheel went up, fatty passenger fell off and smacked his head on the tarmac. Twenty minutes later he was still there unconscious with hordes attempting to revive him but no help from an ambulance. A police car drove past, slowly & without stopping,  while he was there in full view. There were all the soldiers & volunteers there due to the queueing people but ... nothing. Folks were on their phones but it seems they were calling a taxi because he was eventually put in a cab, when he'd come round, and taken to hospital(?).

 

This happened at less than the width of the road from me.

 

I've got the stage where there's almost no sympathy from me for these idiots. I just thought "Silly see-you-next-Tuesdays"

[joeyg]

17 hours ago, DavisH said:

Assuming 75-80% of deaths involve motorbikes, it's quite easy to see where education/training/law enforcement should be directing itself. Follow Vietnam's example and force all riders to wear helmets. Let's just start there. Only only needs to fall off their bike at 10 km/h or less and suffer a brain injury or worse. 

I had a colleague that was an ER Doc in the states.  We were both avid bikers and rode in the days when helmets were not mandatory. Hated them when we first started waring them.   His tongue in cheek joke was "helmets make great organ donors?"

[johnarth]

does the Government still say that people injured in a road accident, but do not die until after they are in the hospital is not a road death, if yes you can see why figures don't add up?

[TKDfella]

13 hours ago, Brunolem said:

The cycle of rebirth is not specific to Theravada, it is part of all schools of Buddhism.

Having said that, rebirth in Buddhism has little to do with Groundhog Day...one doesn't die and wake up the next day in a bed as if nothing had happened.

How one will be reborn depends on how one will die, not to mention how one has spent one's life.

Dying in car accident, while driving drunk, and killing and wounding a few others in the process, won't do one any good.

As a matter of fact, there will be hell to pay (way to speak) and the concerned individual will be reincarnated in a "lower" form of life, say, a worm...and will have to go through the whole cycle of birth and rebirth again.

 

Yes I'm quite aware of all that. I was quoting Theravada because Thailand Buddhism is mostly Theravada. I wasn't suggesting being reborn is a continuation or similar to one's former life but if you link such philosophy with fate, destiny, whatever and the fact that many Thais feel they 'free' to do anything then there is a recipe for a dangerous 'don't care' or 'doesn't matter' (Mai Pen Rai) attitude.Indeed it becomes easier to adopt the 'it's fate' attitude. Numerous times during conversations with locals about deaths etc. I been told something like 'When it's your turn, you can't avoid it'. Yes, I know that isn't specific to Thais either, but they do seem to have a more fatalistic attitude towards such ideas.

[joeyg]

8 minutes ago, MartinL said:

 

I was waiting in line at 4am yesterday to go into the King's crematorium exhibition. 

 

A young, smallish rider on a Honda MSX was carrying a passenger of about 120 kg and attempted a wheelie, encouraged by his passenger. Neither was wearing a helmet.

 

Given that the bike's small, got a short wheelbase and the passenger was sitting behind the rear wheel axle, the low-speed wheelie attempt was successful (sort of). The wheel went up, fatty passenger fell off and smacked his head on the tarmac. Twenty minutes later he was still there unconscious with hordes attempting to revive him but no help from an ambulance. A police car drove past, slowly & without stopping,  while he was there in full view. There were all the soldiers & volunteers there due to the queueing people but ... nothing. Folks were on their phones but it seems they were calling a taxi because he was eventually put in a cab, when he'd come round, and taken to hospital(?).

 

This happened at less than the width of the road from me.

 

I've got the stage where there's almost no sympathy from me for these idiots. I just thought "Silly see-you-next-Tuesdays"

I understand why you say that.  However, even from stupidity  I still disturbs me to see people suffering or in pain.

[joeyg]

2 minutes ago, TKDfella said:

Yes I'm quite aware of all that. I was quoting Theravada because Thailand Buddhism is mostly Theravada. I wasn't suggesting being reborn is a continuation or similar to one's former life but if you link such philosophy with fate, destiny, whatever and the fact that many Thais feel they 'free' to do anything then there is a recipe for a dangerous 'don't care' or 'doesn't matter' (Mai Pen Rai) attitude.Indeed it becomes easier to adopt the 'it's fate' attitude. Numerous times during conversations with locals about deaths etc. I been told something like 'When it's your turn, you can't avoid it'. Yes, I know that isn't specific to Thais either, but they do seem to have a more fatalistic attitude towards such ideas.

Agreed.  Even more so in India in my opinion.  However "Thais feel they 'free' to do anything then there is a recipe for a dangerous 'don't care' or 'doesn't matter' (Mai Pen Rai) attitude."  Is definitely not what Buddha taught.  On the contrary he taught mindfulness, or staying aware of everything as there are good and bad consequences for everything.

[the guest]

... and a 100% of foreigners believe that Thai standards and too low, that they have no respect for the law, or for other people on the road. Then again, who can blame them, if the police are totally inept at enforcing the law, you can't expect the people to follow it.

 

 

[NanLaew]

Now, if we can get them ALL to think outside the box and consider some vague notion that only a third of accidents are fate, then we can focus on the two-thirds that are obviously controllable.

[joeyg]

Another factor to consider, is that many Thais are only 2 or 3 generations removed from being rice farmers.  I have spent a fair amount of time in Issan.  It's not uncommon to see the Lao Khao and beer come out at 8 AM and go late into the night, followed by the same thing day after day.

 

I've never seen anything like it.  i have definitely drank more the first couple of years i retired to Thailand.  Taken steps to cut way back and grateful I did.  And I don't drive.

 

Interestingly, with all the motorcycle accidents and deaths here, I don't recall ever seeing a moto-taxi guy in a wreck.  Makes ya wonder.  Is it because they're "pros?"

[twizzian]

14 hours ago, mindfulness said:

... well this morning it must of been fate that saved me while riding the Honda Scoopy from an idiot cutting me up in overtaking, then immediately pulling over to park. While in the puzzling name he overtook then pulled over is baffeling in itself.

Come to the conclusion the place has just a high percentage of poor educated ignorant weird <deleted>, who seem to be constantly in a dream world. 

Nothing new, happens to us all everyday here.

Think ahead & think the unexpected.

In your case, it’s ‘always expected, this is what they do!

[NanLaew]

2 minutes ago, twizzian said:

...overtaking, then immediately pulling over to park. While in the puzzling name he overtook then pulled over is baffeling in itself. ...

It's that total lack of spatial awareness commonly mis-labeled as the uniquely "Thai me-first attitude" where in reality, it is an Asian trait.

[noahvail]

It’s an old adage here, when choosing a motocy-taxidriver, stay away from the ones with scars on their arms. Those scars are generally from accidents.

[chrisinth]

On 11/18/2017 at 9:53 AM, rooster59 said:

The survey polled 1196 people in 15 provinces. 

 

What a BS article about a third of the population citing road deaths/accidents are to do with fate.

 

The surveyors couldn't even reach 2,000 people to interview. That, IMO, is not a true representation of a country's population

[TKDfella]

2 hours ago, joeyg said:

Agreed.  Even more so in India in my opinion.  However "Thais feel they 'free' to do anything then there is a recipe for a dangerous 'don't care' or 'doesn't matter' (Mai Pen Rai) attitude."  Is definitely not what Buddha taught.  On the contrary he taught mindfulness, or staying aware of everything as there are good and bad consequences for everything.

Yes, too right! But when you look at this one topic it isn't Buddha's teaching to be so selfish (on the roads) so as to cause others suffering. When they get on the road it's full steam ahead, no courtesy or thought for other road users. No doubt you read about another accident reported on TV (Nation) about a (converted) pickup full of students speeding (according to witnesses) and crashing . 5 dead and 9 injured. The driver fled the scene, which that alone can't be part of Buddha's either. I wonder what Buddha would have to say about this.

[Cranky]

On 11/18/2017 at 11:44 AM, metisdead said:

Posts in violation of the following have been removed as well as the replies:

 

8) You will not post disruptive or inflammatory messages, vulgarities, obscenities or profanities.

11) You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand, specific locations, Thai institutions such as the judicial or law enforcement system, Thai culture, Thai people or any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.
 

I am genuinely confused by some of the rules in item 11 above.  How do you define 'overly' with regard to negative comments - if someone is unhappy with an event or topic, in this case road safety, how on earth can one say anything other than negative about this.  Locations, are we to praise them all.  Institutions, no politely voiced opinions on the RTP?  Corruption - off limits?  Smoking booths next to the beach actually a good idea?  Litter and pollution not an issue?

 

Respecting Thai culture, race, religion and gender is straightforward politeness but some of the events posted here beggar belief and initiate the lively debate expected.

[Airbagwill]

As ever, as totally inane piece of questionable stats are used by expats in a never-ending quest - however tenuous to bash Thai peple.

 

How about we apply the same question to Brits - who as we ALL know are SUPERB drivers ??

 

 

36 per cent of Britons said they believed in fate, and 30 per cent in the existence of alien life.

 

In Britain more people believe in Ghosts than a creator.

 

Christians are more likely to believe in aliens than the devil, and more likely to believe in fate than in heaven or an eternal soul.

a is more widely disbelieved in than ghosts or karma.

 

 Christians are more likely to believe in fate (46 per cent) than heaven (44 per cent) or an eternal soul (36 per cent). - [Yougov 2016]

 

[chopin2]

Does a Budda thing make you eligible for a car insurance discount?

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, Airbagwill said:

As ever, as totally inane piece of questionable stats are used by expats in a never-ending quest - however tenuous to bash Thai peple.

 

How about we apply the same question to Brits - who as we ALL know are SUPERB drivers ??

 

 

36 per cent of Britons said they believed in fate, and 30 per cent in the existence of alien life.

 

In Britain more people believe in Ghosts than a creator.

 

Christians are more likely to believe in aliens than the devil, and more likely to believe in fate than in heaven or an eternal soul.

a is more widely disbelieved in than ghosts or karma.

 

 Christians are more likely to believe in fate (46 per cent) than heaven (44 per cent) or an eternal soul (36 per cent). - [Yougov 2016]

 

Probably Brits are a little less liberal in their application, ie, they watch where they are going and drive with a sense of self preservation. 

[Brunolem]

You are right!

They have their "Buddhism" all wrong...not really surprising from people who basically don't know anything about Buddhism, starting with the name of the one (Buddha) that they are constantly praying in order to win the lottery!

They have adapted Buddhism in a way that fits them, that is, more or less by keeping the nice pictures and statues, and getting rid of everything else, because, you know, living like a true Buddhist is not much fun...too many don't, too many rules, too many constraints...

 

[Airbagwill]

1 hour ago, mommysboy said:

Probably Brits are a little less liberal in their application, ie, they watch where they are going and drive with a sense of self preservation. 

So ... Brit-fate OK and Thai-fate not OK?

 

I suppose you are now going to claim that isn't racist?

[Krataiboy]

The conference was organised by the government's Department of Disaster Prevention and Mitigation

 

I wonder. . . is fiddling the figures prevention of mitigation?

[The Teacher]

They only surveyed 1196 people in 15 Provinces and still, the figures don't add up. and what Government agency was in charge of the poll, Hehehehehe the same idiot who thinks that being number one is a good idea 

[mikiea]

On 11/18/2017 at 10:11 AM, lupin said:

A third of Thais believe road carnage is fate

.......... and the other 2 thirds lied about it so as not to appear silly

 

huh.....that 1/3 are the drunks on the road ....

[balo]

Don't worry , you can protect yourself against accidents, no ploblem. 

 

 

[TechnikaIII]

On 11/18/2017 at 3:26 PM, Megasin1 said:

Bribe collecting is a protected job 

They even bribe officials to get the job because it is so lucrative.

[joeyg]

On 11/19/2017 at 12:21 PM, TKDfella said:

Yes, too right! But when you look at this one topic it isn't Buddha's teaching to be so selfish (on the roads) so as to cause others suffering. When they get on the road it's full steam ahead, no courtesy or thought for other road users. No doubt you read about another accident reported on TV (Nation) about a (converted) pickup full of students speeding (according to witnesses) and crashing . 5 dead and 9 injured. The driver fled the scene, which that alone can't be part of Buddha's either. I wonder what Buddha would have to say about this.

The activities you describe are not condoned by Buddha or his teachins.  On the contrary.  pickups full of speeding unresponsible drivers are not the conduct Recommended by Buddha.  However all of it comes under the perview of karma.  Buddha would be very disturbed at the road behaviour and in fact most of the other "things" that go on in Thailand.  Actually Thais know very little about the teachings of Buddha.  Its aterrible situation that will only get worse Read this about kama.  Its short and clear... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma