smew Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 At 01:00 am, Russian was drunk for sure and speeding, heavy time in jail I hope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 18 minutes ago, ttrd said: 28 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: I think you've made a mistake: No one has mentioned that the Brit thew himself. As you can see in the quotes below, it is only you who in Post #23 suggested that the Brit has thrown himself 25 meters (spider man style). Post #17 Post #23 RE - Who's to know if the Brit was hammered and stumbled in to the path of the car? Based on this assertion (something my reply did) he would need to throw himself a considerable distance (25m) which is far above human capacity regardless of age - hence my ref to spiderman and his alike...;) Without wishing to get into a 'tete-a-tete' I'm still at a loss as to why you think the Briton would need to 'throw himself' a considerable distance (25m). IF the Briton was drunk and stumbled into the path of the car, it would take the car about 25m to stop if traveling at 50 kmh.... the Briton was perhaps thrust off the car from impact or carried the claimed 25 meters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunPer Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 13 minutes ago, Cranky said: If THE car stopped after impact exactly where it is in THE photo he was driving on THE wrong side of THE road. Always in Thailand look left, look right, look left and right again, look up and down, look left...... Well spotted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 7 minutes ago, Russell17au said: Sorry but that car was being driven at an excessive speed in this case. To do the amount of damage to the bonnet and the windscreen of that car means that there has been considerable force at the time of contact. That damage would not occur if the driver was driving at the signed speed limit of 30kph. The driver was speeding. Without being an expert it would appear that IF the speed limit was signed at 30 kmh the impact damage may imply that the speed limit was being exceeded. With that said - model vehicles are designed to 'cushion' upon impact with a pedestrian and the damage would appear far more severe and suggest a higher impact speed to laymen such as ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 minute ago, khunPer said: 16 minutes ago, Cranky said: If THE car stopped after impact exactly where it is in THE photo he was driving on THE wrong side of THE road. Always in Thailand look left, look right, look left and right again, look up and down, look left...... Well spotted. In which case its possible that the Briton stepped out into the road after looking to his right, but unfortunately not checking to his left for a car travelling on the wrong side of the road. A phase I've commonly heard in Thailand: "Always look both ways before crossing a one way street" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell17au Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said: Without being an expert it would appear that IF the speed limit was signed at 30 kmh the impact damage may imply that the speed limit was being exceeded. With that said - model vehicles are designed to 'cushion' upon impact with a pedestrian and the damage would appear far more severe and suggest a higher impact speed to laymen such as ourselves. Have a look at the windscreen, that is from the contact with the old mans head. To do that amount of damage it means that there was considerable force come in contact with the windscreen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran00001 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 54 minutes ago, toughlove said: No need to play the racist cards it's well known that Russians most are drunks. It's part of their culture to be drinking hard, I'm east Europe and I get it . But It's like saying it's unfair to call Indians cheap Charlie's. In jomtien where I am many can not even manage the baht bus trip to Pattaya without nursing a big Chang at midday. It is unfair to brand Russians as drunks and it is unfair to brand Indians as cheap Charlie's, to be honest it is staggering to learn that there is someone who can't grasp the very basic and glaringly obvious fact that it is unfair to make generalisations on an entire nationality based on the actions of some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Kieran00001 said: It is unfair to brand Russians as drunks and it is unfair to brand Indians as cheap Charlie's, to be honest it is staggering to learn that there is someone who can't grasp the very basic and glaringly obvious fact that it is unfair to make generalisations on an entire nationality based on the actions of some. In some cases it maybe a generalisation occasionally but as they say.... If the shoe fits... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunPer Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Without being an expert it would appear that IF the speed limit was signed at 30 kmh the impact damage may imply that the speed limit was being exceeded. With that said - model vehicles are designed to 'cushion' upon impact with a pedestrian and the damage would appear far more severe and suggest a higher impact speed to laymen such as ourselves. One thing is the speed limit signs, another thing is the actual speed of vehicles – especially at this spot at night many cars drives (very) fast, and way too fast for view and road condition; and I talk from experience as being very familiar with that spot. There are by the way no beer bars right there, but a soup street kitchen open late night on the opposite side of where the body lies on road, and on same side a small art gallery selling coffee and soft drinks, but I think they close early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttrd Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 12 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Without wishing to get into a 'tete-a-tete' I'm still at a loss as to why you think the Briton would need to 'throw himself' a considerable distance (25m). IF the Briton was drunk and stumbled into the path of the car, it would take the car about 25m to stop if traveling at 50 kmh.... the Briton was perhaps thrust off the car from impact or carried the claimed 25 meters. RE - the Briton was perhaps thrust off the car from impact or carried the claimed 25 meters. Perhaps may be the correct term since non of us know what actually happened hence all the different speculations - we may leave it here until more (accurate) information are available...;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, Russell17au said: 7 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Without being an expert it would appear that IF the speed limit was signed at 30 kmh the impact damage may imply that the speed limit was being exceeded. With that said - model vehicles are designed to 'cushion' upon impact with a pedestrian and the damage would appear far more severe and suggest a higher impact speed to laymen such as ourselves. Have a look at the windscreen, that is from the contact with the old mans head. To do that amount of damage it means that there was considerable force come in contact with the windscreen Agreed - but did this considerable force come at a speed of 30 kmh / 50 kmh or even faster? Us laymen are unable ascertain this - it would take an 'expert witness', someone educated in accident investigation to estimate at what speed it would take for someone of this weight and proportion to damage this specific vehicle in this manner. We (ThaiVisa members) can only wildly guess - it is not unconceivable that the vehicle was traveling at 30kmh, equally so it appears probable to my uneducated self that the vehicle may well have been traveling faster than 30 kmh. One earlier post pointed out that there was a 30kmh speed limit in this area - is that confirmed ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttrd Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 6 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said: It is unfair to brand Russians as drunks and it is unfair to brand Indians as cheap Charlie's, to be honest it is staggering to learn that there is someone who can't grasp the very basic and glaringly obvious fact that it is unfair to make generalisations on an entire nationality based on the actions of some. When it comes to the allegations about drunker russians and cheap Charlie indians the term "some" may be rather relatively as we actually talk in numbers above hundred of millions....;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackheart1916 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Cranky said: No evidence whatsoever to say the Boris was drunk or speeding. Cars are designed to dent easily. Who's to know if the Brit was hammered and stumbled in to the path of the car? "She said the impact hurled the man some 25 metres" That would indicate travelling pretty fast to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell17au Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said: Agreed - but did this considerable force come at a speed of 30 kmh / 50 kmh or even faster? Us laymen are unable ascertain this - it would take an 'expert witness', someone educated in accident investigation to estimate at what speed it would take for someone of this weight and proportion to damage this specific vehicle in this manner. We (ThaiVisa members) can only wildly guess - it is not unconceivable that the vehicle was traveling at 30kmh, equally so it appears probable to my uneducated self that the vehicle may well have been traveling faster than 30 kmh. One earlier post pointed out that there was a 30kmh speed limit in this area - is that confirmed ? That impact would be at a considerately faster speed than 30kph. It was fast enough that it did not knock the old man over but it took his legs out from under him causing hid body to fall onto the bonnet of the car and his head to hit the windscreen with considerable force. At 30kph you would knock the person over and there head would hit the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedtripler Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Agreed - but did this considerable force come at a speed of 30 kmh / 50 kmh or even faster? Us laymen are unable ascertain this - it would take an 'expert witness', someone educated in accident investigation to estimate at what speed it would take for someone of this weight and proportion to damage this specific vehicle in this manner. We (ThaiVisa members) can only wildly guess - it is not unconceivable that the vehicle was traveling at 30kmh, equally so it appears probable to my uneducated self that the vehicle may well have been traveling faster than 30 kmh. One earlier post pointed out that there was a 30kmh speed limit in this area - is that confirmed ? It's an easy calculation to make based on the weight of the victim, the distance of the body traveled after the impact, the points of impact on the vehicle to calculate what speed the vehicle was travelling when it hurled the pedestrian I'm not a forensic scientist but I'd bet that the vehicle was travelling considerably faster than 18.6mph (30km) Whether or not the old man was drunk stumbling around in the middle of a dark road is still up for debate but even that wouldn't excuse the Russian who war probably doing at least twice the speed limit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punchjudy Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 both nationalities are known to like a drink or six Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackheart1916 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 12 minutes ago, khunPer said: One thing is the speed limit signs, another thing is the actual speed of vehicles – especially at this spot at night many cars drives (very) fast, and way too fast for view and road condition; and I talk from experience as being very familiar with that spot. There are by the way no beer bars right there, but a soup street kitchen open late night on the opposite side of where the body lies on road, and on same side a small art gallery selling coffee and soft drinks, but I think they close early. In addition to this,the number and type of vehicles on the island has changed dramatically in the last 20 years,as has the pace of the island. Expect to see more of these stories in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttrd Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 25 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Agreed - but did this considerable force come at a speed of 30 kmh / 50 kmh or even faster? Us laymen are unable ascertain this - it would take an 'expert witness', someone educated in accident investigation to estimate at what speed it would take for someone of this weight and proportion to damage this specific vehicle in this manner. We (ThaiVisa members) can only wildly guess - it is not unconceivable that the vehicle was traveling at 30kmh, equally so it appears probable to my uneducated self that the vehicle may well have been traveling faster than 30 kmh. One earlier post pointed out that there was a 30kmh speed limit in this area - is that confirmed ? When we first speculate in the speed of the car - this may give a more Clear Picture at least of where the limit of the minimum speed may have been the moment the accident occured. Relationship between Speed and Risk of Fatal Injury: Pedestrians and Car Occupants https://nacto.org/docs/usdg/relationship_between_speed_risk_fatal_injury_pedestrians_and_car_occupants_richards.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinca tinca Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 3 hours ago, Cranky said: No evidence whatsoever to say the Boris was drunk or speeding. Cars are designed to dent easily. Who's to know if the Brit was hammered and stumbled in to the path of the car? go read the report again.....THERE IS A WITNESS.....a thai female Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 58 minutes ago, khunPer said: There are by the way no beer bars right there, but a soup street kitchen open late night on the opposite side of where the body lies on road, and on same side a small art gallery selling coffee and soft drinks, but I think they close early. Sorry KhunPer, you are wrong. The building on the left in the OP is in fact The Pink Mango bar. And where the car is stopped, it looks like it has come to a stop in the opposite lane to which it was going. RIP Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunPer Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 hour ago, khunPer said: One thing is the speed limit signs, another thing is the actual speed of vehicles – especially at this spot at night many cars drives (very) fast, and way too fast for view and road condition; and I talk from experience as being very familiar with that spot. There are by the way no beer bars right there, but a soup street kitchen open late night on the opposite side of where the body lies on road, and on same side a small art gallery selling coffee and soft drinks, but I think they close early. I need to stand corrected – not being a regular bar customer – that there actually is a bar there, in the house with lit windows in the background of the image. For info, here's the spot a Google Street View. There are numerous speed limit sign along the road through Maenam Bay and village (today same-same), with 40 km/hr.; and new ones with 45 km/hr. in the pedestrian crossing areas (yes confusing), and yellow signs reminding one of "City Limit, reduce speed", and fairly new yellow signs with pedestrians and 30 km/hr. as it's close to the markets (between morning market and evening market). However, cars often speed up at night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunPer Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 7 minutes ago, South said: Sorry KhunPer, you are wrong. The building on the left in the OP is in fact The Pink Mango bar. And where the car is stopped, it looks like it has come to a stop in the opposite lane to which it was going. RIP Pete. Yes, and sorry, I just realized and posted a correction... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKDfella Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 4 hours ago, Cranky said: No evidence whatsoever to say the Boris was drunk or speeding. Cars are designed to dent easily. Who's to know if the Brit was hammered and stumbled in to the path of the car? For what it's worth, the witness said 'speeding car'. My condolences to the dead man's family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvavin Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 I reckon the whole row of ribs of this British guy must have been smashed! Ummm......this Russian's car speed should have attained the bullet train speed to hurl the victim 25 meters away! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whaleboneman Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 3 hours ago, AnnaL said: So much Russophobia and national hatred here guys! Is it even considered normal in your countries in the moral perspective? I am Russian, but I drive carefully and am not constantly drunk after dark. So do many of other Russians on Samui, too. Maybe you don't recognize their nationality if they are polite and sober? How do you feel when you are regarded with racism (I.e. by Thais sometimes)? The man here stayed put and waited for the police to come. If he was drunk, the news would surely mention that. Excellent post. Thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starcandle Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 6 hours ago, Bob12345 said: Wow, guess the guy was driving somewhere around 600km/h to be able to accomplish that. I had a customer leave my bar stone cold sober, he was struck by a motorbike at about 60kph and was thrown 30 meters, it wasn't a nice sight and the damage was so horrific he was deceased by the time I got across the road. So your 600km/h comment is unwarranted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evadgib Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 33 minutes ago, khunPer said: I need to stand corrected – not being a regular bar customer – that there actually is a bar there, in the house with lit windows in the background of the image. For info, here's the spot a Google Street View. There are numerous speed limit sign along the road through Maenam Bay and village (today same-same), with 40 km/hr.; and new ones with 45 km/hr. in the pedestrian crossing areas (yes confusing), and yellow signs reminding one of "City Limit, reduce speed", and fairly new yellow signs with pedestrians and 30 km/hr. as it's close to the markets (between morning market and evening market). However, cars often speed up at night. My wife says 2 Thais have died on that same stretch this week.....& I heard another siren an hour ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran00001 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 hour ago, ttrd said: When it comes to the allegations about drunker russians and cheap Charlie indians the term "some" may be rather relatively as we actually talk in numbers above hundred of millions....;) 84% of adult Russians are not alcoholic, is that relative? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran00001 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 hour ago, ttrd said: When it comes to the allegations about drunker russians and cheap Charlie indians the term "some" may be rather relatively as we actually talk in numbers above hundred of millions....;) 84% of adult Russians are not alcoholic, is that relative? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran00001 Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 1 hour ago, speedtripler said: In some cases it maybe a generalisation occasionally but as they say.... If the shoe fits... If the shoe fits is an expression used to tell somebody that what was said about them by someone else was true, it doesn't make sense to say it someone else and it doesn't make sense unless what has been claimed is actually true. I am not the Russian so I am not going to wear the shoe and we don't know that he was drunk, in fact it can be assumed he wasn't, so neither is he going to wear the shoe that you infer should fit him due to him being Russian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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