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Hospital bills.


defib

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Hi, I am in a Bangkok Hospital and have spent five days in ICU. Now I am going to a ward, but the cost so far is staggering! I am self funding and could run out of money soon. What happens then? And if you are not made well, how can one get back to your home country ever? Thanks.

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I would suggest asking the hospital for a tally of the costs so far and a projection of future costs to see whether you are able to pay. If you can't inform Bangkok hospital of that fact, then you better either get yourself home or check into a government hospital. I don't think you will be allowed to leave the country until your bills are paid, so maybe your family can help.

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The common thing nowadays is to do a "go fund me" page. Just dont do what others have done and make up a story about being bashed, robbed or insurance wont pay up etc.

If you are honest and maybe someone can tell papers back home, "countryman stranded in Thailand" etc, lots will contribute.

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Staggering will be an understatement.    Get yourself out of there by any means,there was an organisation I heard about few years ago that organised a kidnap from these parasites

   Govt,hospitals are OK really,and in depth hospital care try India  excellent and damned cheap.

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If you can't pay they will probably kick you out (if you are not in a critical state)

As somebody suggested already, request a transfer to a government hospital, that's much cheaper.

If you are in a state that you can't travel home and also don't have money you are probably lost, Thailand is not a nanny state.

One more example for why health insurance is important.

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6 minutes ago, jackdd said:

If you can't pay they will probably kick you out (if you are not in a critical state)

As somebody suggested already, request a transfer to a government hospital, that's much cheaper.

If you are in a state that you can't travel home and also don't have money you are probably lost, Thailand is not a nanny state.

One more example for why health insurance is important.

 

 

Sounds harsh, but there is a lot of truth in there.

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You should have expected this when you entered that hospital,forward planning with/without insurance is essential,a few twists and turns    KL airport probably will get you an airline to get you wherever you want to go,BKK too strict.  Just get out of there any which way

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You should get yourself transferred at once to a government hospital. there are some excellent ones in Bangkok e.g. Chulalongkorn, Siriraj, Ramathibodhi, Rajavithi.

 

Do this immediately while you are still able to pay the accumulated bill, because they will not let you transfer elsewhere without first paying the bill.

 

And no, they won't throw you out when your money is exhausted, they will in fact hang on to your passport and clothing and refuse to discharge you while every day the bill mounts higher. This has happened to many, many people.

 

Be assertive with them re the transfer, tell them you  refuse further treatment at their hospital and insist on immediate transfer to a government hospital.  If necessary, sign yourself out against medical advise and take a cab to a government hospital (obviously, get all your records first).

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These people primarily are not interested in you getting better,but detaining you to get that bill higher and higher,ICU? you appear quite lucid,so why keep you there when a ward will do?

You fell into a trap,even with insurance it does not guarantee you will escape unscathed,they will drain that pot  for sure,but will tell you when the money has run out instead of leaving you there with ever mounting dept.   Play them at their own game,tell them you do not have the money,true they will ship you into a ward and lock you up,but they have to feed you and keep you,costing them money,they will give way,may keep passport,but can get new one easily

Medical jet skiing scum

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18 minutes ago, altcar bob said:

These people primarily are not interested in you getting better,but detaining you to get that bill higher and higher,ICU? you appear quite lucid,so why keep you there when a ward will do?

You fell into a trap,even with insurance it does not guarantee you will escape unscathed,they will drain that pot  for sure,but will tell you when the money has run out instead of leaving you there with ever mounting dept.   Play them at their own game,tell them you do not have the money,true they will ship you into a ward and lock you up,but they have to feed you and keep you,costing them money,they will give way,may keep passport,but can get new one easily

Medical jet skiing scum

If you believe that hospitals and the medical profession in Thailand are primarily interested in just money, you shouldn't be here.

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Just now, simoh1490 said:

If you believe that hospitals and the medical profession in Thailand are primarily interested in just money, you shouldn't be here.

Well I do and I am.    They (private hospitals) are born to lie and cheat,how do I know?  guess,but there are alternatives than putting oneself through the process and saving a heap of money that they undoubtedly will be after

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20 minutes ago, altcar bob said:

Well I do and I am.    They (private hospitals) are born to lie and cheat,how do I know?  guess,but there are alternatives than putting oneself through the process and saving a heap of money that they undoubtedly will be after

There's a lot of highly skilled and very capable medical staff here, people who want to heal and help others - I wouldn't confuse that fact with the system being what it is, private health care is after all a business.

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2 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

There's a lot of highly skilled and very capable medical staff here, people who want to heal and help others - I wouldn't confuse that fact with the system being what it is, private health care is after all a business.

I suppose that is why Sheryl points out consistently a few (a very few) that meets your estimation of"a lot of highly skilled and very capable medical staff"

 

This OPs tale is enough to frighten anyone to consider the way to go is medical insurance,not so,anyway get another few years under your belt see if you stay decided on that route,and IF it is affordable.  Big rises ahead for medical insurance next time around.

 

There are far too few Farangs around too,a lot have gone,,so the onus on these private hospitals will be to maximise any and all who enter their domain

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13 minutes ago, altcar bob said:

I suppose that is why Sheryl points out consistently a few (a very few) that meets your estimation of"a lot of highly skilled and very capable medical staff"

 

This OPs tale is enough to frighten anyone to consider the way to go is medical insurance,not so,anyway get another few years under your belt see if you stay decided on that route,and IF it is affordable.  Big rises ahead for medical insurance next time around.

 

There are far too few Farangs around too,a lot have gone,,so the onus on these private hospitals will be to maximise any and all who enter their domain

I didn't understand your point about Sheryl etc in your first para., I'm pretty sure that Sheryl will agree there are indeed lots of highly skilled medical staff here although finding them is not always easy - Sheryl and the pinned list of medical professionals in the Chiang Mai forum constantly point out those people to posters looking for a specific medical talent.

 

I've "self insured" for the past 16 years here and for me it's worked out well, I'm lucky that I have the funds to do be able to do that. Others however who don't have the funds or who come here on holiday thinking they don't need it are running a big risk, as the OP found out, sometimes the gamble doesn't pay off.

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Sometimes the private hospitals will keep someone in ICU instead of transferring to a ward room if all their "ward" rooms are private rooms and the patient doesn't have a friend or family member to stay with them.  The purpose of the friend/family member isn't to provide direct care, but rather to make sure the person asks for assistance when needing to use the toilet, has water when needed, etc.  Sometimes they'll let a patient stay in a private room alone, but usually they are reluctant to permit this.  

 

In a gov't hospital, a patient will probably be in a true ward room, with other patients.  Not only does this lower the cost, but it eliminates the need to have someone stay with the patient and it also makes the time go by more quickly.

 

Sheryl's advice is good -- the OP should get himself transferred out of the private hospital and into a gov't hospital pronto!  Some private hospitals will help with this if it's made very clear to them that the money is running out and there aren't any outside sources to help.

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As for the OP's second question -- "if you're not made well, how can one get back to your home country ever."  

 

You don't have to be 100% "well" in order to fly.  Some airlines do a very good job of accommodating people in wheelchairs, even those who need to be carried onto an aircraft.  They can provide oxygen if needed.  All this has to be arranged in advance and some airlines are better than others.  It would help to know your final destination.  

 

Some Embassies can help with arrangements, too.   Again, it would be helpful to know the OP's nationality.

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In a different (old) subject this was posted June 5, 2018 so if same incident it has been a long hospital stay for OP and indeed extremely expensive.

 

Quote

Posted June 5
I had three piece AMS penile implant fitted in the Blie Ribbon Clinic in India two weeks ago. The overall cost about 410,000 baht. Sadly as arrived back in Bangkok, it had got infected and am spending nearly double that having the device removed and fighting the bacterial infectionthat had taken hold! It has been a total disaster all round. If I could only turn the clock back.....

 

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This hospital ,and other ,should post a list of charges ie days stay in ICU,ward stay,whatever procedures may occur,oxygen use,so at least you have an idea of what you are heading into,but they don't,there lies the trap.  You have no idea of their reputation,or doctors skills,but as they do web crawling to enhance their reputation you have to dig down about 5 or 6 pages until the truth comes out. They stink

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In a different (old) subject this was posted June 5, 2018 so if same incident it has been a long hospital stay for OP and indeed extremely expensive.
 
Posted June 5
I had three piece AMS penile implant fitted in the Blie Ribbon Clinic in India two weeks ago. The overall cost about 410,000 baht. Sadly as arrived back in Bangkok, it had got infected and am spending nearly double that having the device removed and fighting the bacterial infectionthat had taken hold! It has been a total disaster all round. If I could only turn the clock back.....
 


Perhaps that person should have stayed in India longer or flown back earlier rather than later. Personally i would have sat it out in India for longer
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As an update, I did indeed have a bacterial infection earlier this month and ended up in Bumrangrad Hospital. This was cleared up with very good care and  the cost with no ICU, quite affordable. Sadly, with my trip home booked for last Saturday, I fell very ill the day before on the 15th. I had severe bleeding from a stomach ulcer and actually collapsed with low blood pressure and loss of blood. I was 50km from Bangkok but the local hospital rushed me back to Bumrangrad where there is no doubt they saved my life. They used 14 units of plasma and did surgery to stop the bleeding from at least two ulcers. This ill health was out of the blue, and I never dreamt that I would need hospital so much and it had a great impact on my saved money. I insisted on coming out of ICU to a ward and am now very much better. There is only a 5% chance of fresh bleeding, and my kidneys which stopped working are up to 50%, and I will be leaving soon. I have enough money to pay this bill, although it is very high. Medical bills have cost me nearly three million baht this month, and although twice saved from life threatening situations, it shows the money you need to put aside for emergencies if you have no, or are unable to get, medical insurance. I must say you have to seperate the excellent quality of care from the doctors and nurses at Bumrangrad to the cashier demanding the money! I just pray no more medical emergencies around the corner for me here in Thailand.

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Glad to hear you are alright.

 

For future reference you could have come to the ER of a top government hospital like Chulalongkorn or Siriraj, and they too would have saved your life. But the stay would have been far less comfortable, especially for someone without an attendant (friend or relative to help with bathing etc), And you would have been surrounded by nurses etc with little or no English which would have been scary.  But the total cost would have been bout 1/3 what it was at Bumrungrad.

 

Certain TV members believe that there is no need for medical insurance because one can count on flying to India for low cost care. I hope the read your account carefully since that was obviously impossible in your situation - which occurred out of the blue with no warning in someone who seemed quite well.

 

In the future please do not travel without medical insurance, travel policies are quite affordable and will not exclude past conditions if fully resolved before your trip starts. (In your case that would rule out anything to do with the ulcer or your kidney function until the former is documented fully healed and the latter completely back to normal).

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/29/2018 at 11:41 AM, chakatee said:

Just as a note: Bumrangrad is not a Bangkok Hospital but a hospital in Bangkok

It is a private hospital,    Practice is to take you to a private hospital firstly  unless requested than a  govt.hospital as private ones will give more money (was 600 baht) for carcass delivery, where they can get their claws into you,as govt. was 300 baht.  Probably far more now as desperation takes a hold wealthier  ex pats dried up(most have cleared off)

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On 6/20/2018 at 6:29 PM, scubascuba3 said:


 

 


Perhaps that person should have stayed in India longer or flown back earlier rather than later. Personally i would have sat it out in India for longer

Agree wholeheartedly with this,but as OP stated he was back in Thailand when he came down with infection,but he could have gone back and been treated.   If the OP had ulcers,he must have had some discomfort for some time,stating this to Indian doc would have investigated,probably finding the cause and treating it there and then.   So sorry for the OP,should be widely published the pitfalls of private hospitals in Thailand

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On 6/20/2018 at 9:57 AM, altcar bob said:

These people primarily are not interested in you getting better,but detaining you to get that bill higher and higher,ICU? you appear quite lucid,so why keep you there when a ward will do?

You fell into a trap,even with insurance it does not guarantee you will escape unscathed,they will drain that pot  for sure,but will tell you when the money has run out instead of leaving you there with ever mounting dept.   Play them at their own game,tell them you do not have the money,true they will ship you into a ward and lock you up,but they have to feed you and keep you,costing them money,they will give way,may keep passport,but can get new one easily

Medical jet skiing scum

From what this chap has stated after your reply with his update, it was life saving stuff.

 

I have been here retired for almost 3 years, and up until about a month ago, I would self insure because I found the polices available wouldn't cover me for a preexisting condition, that said, I was nervous without having health insurance, and certainly wasn't going to pay 100,000 baht per annum for worldwide coverage and not having my preexisting condition covered.

 

I had been to public hospitals for the drip after some food poisoning, and a day procedure to remove a mole on my face, both hospitals were quite good, and cheap to boot, but that wasn't why I used their services, one was local and the other was referred to me by Sheryl as I needed the services of a plastic surgoen.

 

My last experience (recent) in the local public hospital wasn't so good, my Dr referring me to the hospital after two separate courses of different antibiotics for a chest infection, after a chest x-ray, some oxygen, and a referral to do a lung test, I was then told by the doctor after doing the lung test (spirometre), no full lung test, that everything is fine, he said its normal to cough up phlegm and be short of breath after a flu, just rest and drink plenty of fluids, now I know these public hospitals handle big crowds, and its usually 2 hours before you get seen, and I am fine with that, but you know when you are not right, and when you cough and feel like your lungs are coming up through your mouth with every cough all night long, you have had enough and have to try an alternative hospital.

 

I went to AEK private at Udon Thani, never been before, I do have private health insurance now, but only for emergency or elective, so I would have to pay for an outpatient visit, which didn't bother me in the least, the place was like a 5 star hotel, and I saw a doctor within 10 minutes, gave him the background, wanted another chest x-ray, as he said the one previously at the public hospital a week earlier would be too old and he would need to see one anyway, and then referred me to a chest specialist two doors down, nurse came along and took me for the x-ray, sure I was thinking here we go, cha ching, the I saw the specialist, she did some checks on me, said chest was clear, requested sinus x-ray, yep, I said cha ching again, then on return, all clear, she gave me antibiotics, steroids, inhaler etc etc, which I took on the spot and felt much better within an hour, she requested I see her in two weeks to see how I am doing, cha ching, the bill came to 5,600 baht, the public hospital was 350 baht.

 

The sheer fact that I felt good for the whole week, meant that the money was well spent and my paranoia cha ching, was out of line. The specialist was thorough in her examination, was not in a rush to see other patience, she also advised me that if I didn't feel better before the next appointment, I should return, well guess what, last night I was short of breath again, so I went back today, she checked me again, and said there was still some wheezing and spasms, and recommended some more meds, however no antibiotics, or antihistamines this time, she gave me 3 days worth of more inflammatory tablets and an additional inhaler with some tablets for H.Pylori just in case.

 

My breathing has increased 10 fold, I feel heaps better, i.e. I'm not freaking out because I can't breath, I said I will see you next week, she said, no, cancel next weeks appointment, see you in two weeks,  unless your not feeling well, as we may need to give you more medicine for a few months, but we will see you in two weeks time and see how you are feeling.

 

The reason I am giving you a long spill is because she could have easy said, we should admit you for further observation, and kept me there for a few days, and collected, but I found her and the original doctor, both very professional, and her knocking my symptoms out pretty quick smart on both occasions to be just brilliant as opposed to being on antibiotics for two weeks that were doing nothing, although she did say she only gave me 3 days worth of anti inflammatory tablets the first time, which obviously wasn't long enough. Today's cost was 2,010 baht.

 

From my experience the level of care/service, results and follow up provided at AEK private at Udon Thani means that it is my preferred hospital now, and is worth the hour drive for me, vs the 15 minute drive to the local, so I cannot agree with your theory, although you have obviously had some run in with some hospital and their charges, suffice to say, if I had to stay I wouldn't be fussed, because paying 67,000 baht for health insurance which covers my preexisting gives me that calmness that I am covered, and am not going to get ripped.  

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Bangkok group saved my wife's life and up to one point they demanded payment everyday, after talking with the senior doctor and explaining that I had too send all the paper work and bills to my insurance company they were happy to wait and went beyond too make us comfortable. Sometimes it pays to explain the problems ,,,uncaring they are not...…………………..

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  • 1 month later...

Another update. My last post was 22nd June. On the 23rd, as the hospital tried to get me back on warfarin, the ulcer had another major bleed. I was in Bumrangrad until the 2nd July as they dealt with this ulcer again, and the whole stay cleared me out of virtually all my saved money. I had to insist on leaving the hospital as my money was on its last legs,  and returned to the UK on July 4th. Luckily I made it without furthur problems and am in the care of the NHS. The clinic here still hasn’t sorted out my warfarin dose proving how difficult it was for Bumrangrad Hospital. The NHS are going to deal with the ravages of my bacterial infection but that will take many operations and about a year. I hope to return to Thailand for two or three months per visit from the end of next year, but, with top quality travel insurance! My total hospital bill topped three million baht in the end, but at least I am alive to tell the tale. 

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I don't understand. I, too, had stomach ulcers. I had black, digested blood coming out of both ends.

An endoscopy revealed I had ulcers from my lower esophagus throughout my stomach to my upper duodenum. 

As it is now known that these ulcers are caused by a bacteria heliobacter pylori, I was given antibiotics and was completely clear by seven days.

So, why all this recurring treatment?

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