NanLaew Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, cyberfarang said: Let me put it to you this way; of course girls can dress somewhat sexy and look attractive when out and about, they are not expected to dress in burkas or like Victorian women when it was considered obscene to show an ankle. But those who dress provocatively to deliberately arouse sexual interest (remembering there are a lot of crazies out there) do so at their own risk and discretion. Being sensible and moderation is the key. Sorry, but can`t explain this in any other ways if this goes above your understanding. Your repeated, archaic, misogynist proselytizing doesn't need any sort of higher intellect to see it for what it truly is... repeated, archaic, misogynist proselytizing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, cyberfarang said: Let me put it to you this way; of course girls can dress somewhat sexy and look attractive when out and about, they are not expected to dress in burkas or like Victorian women when it was considered obscene to show an ankle. But those who dress provocatively to deliberately arouse sexual interest (remembering there are a lot of crazies out there) do so at their own risk and discretion. Being sensible and moderation is the key. Sorry, but can`t explain this in any other ways if this goes above your understanding. Who decides what's too sexy or provocative? You should know that most rapes are men exercising power over women, nothing to do with sex at all. I see plenty of sexy women who I'd love to bed, doesn't mean I drag them into the nearest bush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, giddyup said: ... You should know that most rapes are men exercising power over women, nothing to do with sex at all. ... Steady on there giddyup, you may be pushing the envelope on that concept based on cyber's earlier consideration that the problem solely lies with "those who dress provocatively to deliberately arouse sexual interest". He probably still thinks they're asking for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, NanLaew said: Steady on there giddyup, you may be pushing the envelope on that concept based on cyber's earlier consideration that the problem solely lies with "those who dress provocatively to deliberately arouse sexual interest". He probably still thinks they're asking for it. I want to know where he draws the line as to what is provocative and what is safe. Personally, I find girls wearing glasses particularly sexy. Contact lenses should be mandatory! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer90210 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Not politically correct and touchy issue for society to accept, but unfortunately studies and research in Criminology (by renowned western experts) do put a responsability on the victim and their part played on their own victimization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, observer90210 said: Not politically correct and touchy issue for society to accept, but unfortunately studies and research in Criminology do put a responsability on the victim and their part played on their own victimization. I wonder what excites rapists of 70 year old grandmothers then? Is it the surgical hose or the teeth in the glass by the bed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The manic Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 hours ago, impulse said: What's next? #donttellmenottowearmybling? Because I have every right to wear my Mr T wannabe kit anywhere I want, and anyone who would steal it from me is in the wrong, not me for wearing it out on the walking street drunk at 3:00 AM. Like it or not, certain behaviors put us at increased risk of being victimized. Like wearing bling on Walking Street at 03:00, leaving the car running while inside the 7/11, walking around with $100 bills hanging out of our pockets, and (sadly) dressing provocatively. In every case, the perpetrator is absolutely wrong. But if you want to reduce your risk of being a victim, avoid behaviors that increase those risks. She was 12 years old. You are a disgrace and a pedophile supporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, observer90210 said: Not politically correct and touchy issue for society to accept, but unfortunately studies and research in Criminology (by renowned western experts) do put a responsability on the victim and their part played on their own victimization. The only responsibility lays with the scum who rape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer90210 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Take the story of the guy walking late night, drunk, in a bad neighborhood with a brand new genuine Audemars Piguet on his wrist. He get's assaulted and robbed. Disgusting act from a thief and naturally the sole culprit by the law, is the thief. But.. no matter who is responsable, once the harm is done on the victim, its done and leaves scars. So instead of debating and arguing who is responsable, is it not better to plainly avoid becoming a victim ? ? ? Free for all to have their own opinion.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 6 minutes ago, observer90210 said: So instead of debating and arguing who is responsable, is it not better to plainly avoid becoming a victim ? ? ? And a woman avoids that how? By dressing neck to knee, showing no hint of cleavage, or perhaps just stay indoors to be really safe? Well, that's not really safe either is it? Guys crawl through windows to rape women in their own beds. That's the woman's fault too I guess for not making sure they had adequate security. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer90210 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 6 minutes ago, giddyup said: And a woman avoids that how? By dressing neck to knee, showing no hint of cleavage, or perhaps just stay indoors to be really safe? Well, that's not really safe either is it? Guys crawl through windows to rape women in their own beds. Common sense maybe ? avoiding certain areas at night ? avoiding getting drunk with a stranger in a club or leaving her drink unattended ? avoiding dating unknown people on the net ? perhaps dressing a bit differently ? .avoiding over display of jewelry ... etc. etc. etc. ...seems quite obvious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, observer90210 said: Common sense maybe ? avoiding certain areas at night ? avoiding getting drunk with a stranger in a club or leaving her drink unattended ? avoiding dating unknown people on the net ? perhaps dressing a bit differently ? ... seems quite obvious ? or maybe not ? What about guys that forcibly enter the house or flat and rape women at home, sometimes very elderly women, I guess they must have been asking for it as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer90210 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, giddyup said: What about guys that forcibly enter the house or flat and rape women at home, sometimes very elderly women, I guess they must have been asking for it as well? well you are suggesting that, not me....but I'm sure you will get my point once you read my previous posts above a few times. thanks for your bickering and welcome to my ignore list dear fellow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, observer90210 said: Take the story of the guy walking late night, drunk, in a bad neighborhood with a brand new genuine Audemars Piguet on his wrist. He get's assaulted and robbed. Disgusting act from a thief and naturally the sole culprit by the law, is the thief. But.. no matter who is responsable, once the harm is done on the victim, its done and leaves scars. So instead of debating and arguing who is responsable, is it not better to plainly avoid becoming a victim ? ? ? Free for all to have their own opinion.... Yet another trivialization of rape with another totally irrelevant and inappropriate 'for instance' from the staid and comfortably safe male viewpoint. The guy that wears "a brand new genuine Audemars Piguet" or leaves the key in the car while popping into the 7 eleven or wears his thick gold chain on the beach at 3 a.m. or (bizarrely) wears an away shirt at the home end at a football match isn't likely to get something forced inside their body now are they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer90210 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Just now, NanLaew said: Yet another trivialization of rape with another totally irrelevant and inappropriate 'for instance' from the staid and comfortably safe male viewpoint. The guy that wears "a brand new genuine Audemars Piguet" or leaves the key in the car while popping into the 7 eleven or wears his thick gold chain on the beach at 3 a.m. or (bizarrely) wears an away shirt at the home end at a football match isn't likely to get something forced inside their body now are they? well if he is stabbed..I guess something sharp may have a forced entrance, dear chap. My point is not about rape or not, it is about avoiding becomming a victim if you take some time to read my initial posts from the start. thanks for your reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 9 minutes ago, observer90210 said: Common sense maybe ? avoiding certain areas at night ? avoiding getting drunk with a stranger in a club or leaving her drink unattended ? avoiding dating unknown people on the net ? perhaps dressing a bit differently ? .avoiding over display of jewelry ... etc. etc. etc. ...seems quite obvious How Do I Love Thee Apologize for Rapists? Let me count the ways. ... (with apologies to Elizabeth Barrett Browning) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfarang Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 36 minutes ago, giddyup said: What about guys that forcibly enter the house or flat and rape women at home, sometimes very elderly women, I guess they must have been asking for it as well? You`re deviating from the subject and just to remind you: Don`t Tell Me How To Dress, Thai women say. This is about women dressing sensibly and maybe not bringing unwanted attentions upon them. Now I`m waiting for the question; well, what is dressing sensibly? I`ll answer before being asked; it`s using common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, cyberfarang said: You`re deviating from the subject and just to remind you: Don`t Tell Me How To Dress, Thai women say. This is about women dressing sensibly and maybe not bringing unwanted attentions upon them. Now I`m waiting for the question; well, what is dressing sensibly? I`ll answer before being asked; it`s using common sense. Women are free to dress as they will. The way women dress is not the cause of rape. The cause of rape is rapist scum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, cyberfarang said: You`re deviating from the subject and just to remind you: Don`t Tell Me How To Dress, Thai women say. This is about women dressing sensibly and maybe not bringing unwanted attentions upon them. Now I`m waiting for the question; well, what is dressing sensibly? I`ll answer before being asked; it`s using common sense. Who's common sense, yours? Who decides what manner of dress is not going to excite some predator into committing a rape? I guess you are suggesting that all women dress conservatively with below knee hemlines and definitely no cleavage, certainly no <deleted> me high heels. If you knew anything about the mind of a rapist you'd know that it's a power thing, sex is just a by product of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanemax Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 hours ago, NanLaew said: Thus elevating victim blaming to the somewhat odious level of rape apologist. I 100% agree that it is always the rapists fault , they are to blame . I am not an "apologist" for their behavior . Potential victims should take certain measures to stop it happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanemax Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Enoon said: How about the "authorities" suggesting that men should stop behaving like uncontrolled savage beasts and behave with the respect for women ("others") .... weaker, more vulnerable others....regardless of their "misguided" behaviour.......as decreed by the precious Buddha who they defend and proselytise on behalf of so vigorously? I never seem to hear that admonition. Silly me, the "authorities" are invariably men aren't they? And the message remains: "Women.........don't feed the animals" The "authorities" do not just suggest that rapists should not behave in that way , they jail them , society does not accept rapists , we prosecute them and punish them . Males should not behave like "uncontrolled savage beasts ", unfortunately, some do , in an ideal World , rapists would not exist , but in the real World they do . Victims should try to not to get themselves into that position , although , if they did , it would always be the rapists fault and he would solely be to blame . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seahorse Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Let's all just stick our heads in the sand and pretend that there are no bad people in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAtUbon Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 I have lived in several so-called “civilised” cities and towns in England. In none of them would my ex-wife (The Harridan Witch of Old England!) venture out at night after about 21.00 even to go to the Circle K convenience store (or Sperrings as was) (equates to 7/11). Even in the middle of winter with four inches of snow, dressed in a head to toe duffle coat – just about as unappealing as she could get was a No-No (she was bleddy unappealing at the best of times ?). Either I would go myself, walk with her, or drive her in the car. And as for allowing my daughters…. Forget it. It doesn’t matter where you are in the world, a lone woman is prey. And a lone child, probably a million times as much. My advice to ladies would be to dress provocatively at the party if you want to, have fun flirting (or whatever!), but get a taxi home. And don’t put yourself at risk. It is up to the individual to assess the danger they present to themselves, and for responsible adults to do that for minors. I’m just an old git, but I know that through time immemorial, women have never been safe on their tods. The lone girl working in fields, the woman trudging home from the market, or the office girl walking to the bus-stop after a long day. The attacker is a sick pervert, but the woman/girl/carer should take every precaution. My tuppence worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dexlowe Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 The cause of rape is rapist scum, says one poster. So, how do you eliminate the cause? How do you prevent deviates from raping? How do you stop an aspiring rapist from acting out his fantasies when an opportunity presents itself? How wonderful it would be if there was a magic answer, but until it is found can you blame people for advocating a discretionary approach? It's disappointing that some posters here are being unfairly labelled as misogynists and, wow! even apologists for rapists -- that must hurt. All of us are sickened by a rape, more so if it involves kiddies, so some of the more inflammatory responses here are just a tad too hysterical IMHO. The "apologist for rapists" comment was way out of line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graemeaylward Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Victims are NEVER to blame.! Full stop!Sent from my Lenovo A3000-H using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTuner Posted June 26, 2018 Share Posted June 26, 2018 Hey you, wear bikinis. I expect a full netizen outrage session before I've finished my coffee or I shall be very very disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted June 26, 2018 Share Posted June 26, 2018 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupatria Posted June 26, 2018 Share Posted June 26, 2018 11 hours ago, sanemax said: And they would act differently , if the possibilities were removed . Does it mean in countries where women in public are only allowed if clad in burkas, rape does not happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dap Posted June 26, 2018 Share Posted June 26, 2018 11 hours ago, sanemax said: And they would act differently , if the possibilities were removed . No, they would still be assh*les no matter how anyone is dressed. You should take the time to view the examples of clothes worn by rape victims, not to mention the old and infirm. Oh yeah, don't forget the numerous nuns who are attacked as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickTik Posted June 26, 2018 Share Posted June 26, 2018 There is no doubt that a woman, or anyone, has the right to wear whatever they want without being raped or sexually abused. However, remember that, biologically, when men see a lot of "skin" an attractive woman is exposing, their mind shift gears. Why? Because one of the root forces of human survival is reproduction. That "force" is elevated when an attractive and sexy woman exposes her body. Smart women are selective about when they expose their skin and female features. Ask yourself - do you want a bunch of "roosters" chasing you in a "sausage fest", or do you want to be attractive to only one person you are attracted to? Your internal answer to that question will tell you how to appropriately dress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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