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rooster59

Put your cards on the table, EU makes last Brexit call to Britain

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1 minute ago, RuamRudy said:

Why, even now, can the architects still not define what it means?

They can define it - Leave means Leave. The EU and remainers cannot understand this.

 

2 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

An alternative perspective could be that there are corrupt, tax avoiding billionaires across Europe, emulating the Vote Leave playbook. Why should it only be the UK's corrupt, tax avoiding billionaires who benefit from the chaos they funded?

Your opinion carries no weight - If you want to make a claim, back it up - Simples.

 

11 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

All these people, in all these Countries are not brainwashed, falling for fake news, racists, xenophobes or right wing lunatics.

 

3 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

I appreciate that you have a stong reason for pushing this line, but the picture from where many of us are sitting is that you are so very, very wrong.

I have no strong reason for pushing this line. It is a line that is pushed by left wingers, liberals and remainers.

 

It is beyond the realms of fantasy that all these people, in all these different Countries fall under these labels.

 

For sure, I understand that it is frightening for those squinting out from the safety of their safe spaces.

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2 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Do you understand that my comment

"Interesting to know it's only non-Brits who think that way"

was in response to this assertion from vogie?

 

"Why do non brits think they know better than than us?"

 

Apparently vogie believes it's only non-brits who are opposed to Brexit. Maybe it was illegal immigrant Mexicans who voted for remain?

I hope you are not misquoting me, where did I say 'Apparently vogie believes it's only non-brits who are opposed to Brexit.' I did not say that!

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10 minutes ago, vogie said:

I hope you are not misquoting me, where did I say 'Apparently vogie believes it's only non-brits who are opposed to Brexit.' I did not say that!

You said"Why do non brits think they know better than than us?"

Who would "us" be if not Brits?

So are all Brits in agreement with you? Are all non-brits not in agreeement with you?

Why exactly is nationality pertinent when it comes to knowledge? 

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28 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Without wishing to sound dismissive, it is clear that the majority of people in any democracy are not sufficiently politically engaged to be able to make a reasonable and informed decision about complex matters such as Brexit

Oh dear, remainers are more intelligent syndrome strikes again. One can only be sufficiently politically engaged if you voted to remain. What arrogant, unsubstantiated, self promotional tosh.

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15 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

The poster you are replying to said that Tusk was not elected by the electorate, which is true, I’m very surprised that you didn't know that.

 

The Tory party chose May into her position, in the same way the labour party chose James Callaghan in 1976, and Gordon Brown 2007; again I am surprised that you were unaware that this is common practice when a Prime Minister resigns

The poster I replied to said Tusk was not elected, which is a falsehood.

Yes, he was not elected by the general EU electorate but that is how things often work in a representative democracy. No PM (or similar position) gets directly elected by the electorate, usually parties or their representatives get elected and they chose who will lead them.

 

Brexiteers keep spreading lies about unelected EU officials (and a lot of others things as well). They deserve what they seem to wish for (the severe economic damage that Brexit will bring), but I feel sorry for those that voted remain and all others that could not vote but still have to face the consequences.

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1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

You said"Why do non brits think they know better than than us?"

Who would "us" be if not Brits?

So are all Brits in agreement with you? Are all non-brits not in agreeement with you?

Why exactly is nationality pertinent when it comes to knowledge? 

 

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

Apparently vogie believes it's only non-brits who are opposed to Brexit

Show me where I said this, "apparently" doesn't cut the mustard with me

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4 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

They can define it - Leave means Leave. The EU and remainers cannot understand this.

 

That's the best you can do? Even the Tories cannot even agree what that means. Why not try to answer my question:

 

12 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Care to offer an alternative perspective? Are you suggesting that the majority of Europeans understand the intricacies of their domestic and international political engagements?

 

6 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

Your opinion carries no weight - If you want to make a claim, back it up - Simples.

Of course, I am not an investigative journalist - but there are investigative journalists working on this very subject right now, uncovering some very dirty goings on, with Farage and Banks at the very heart of it. Whilst I don't hold my breath, I hope very much that criminal proceedings commence soon,

 

8 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

For sure, I understand that it is frightening for those squinting out from the safety of their safe spaces.

What is truly frightening is that you believe that the public understands the implications of their actions. No wonder we are being screwed by those in power if the willful myopia is so prevalent.

 

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Whatever the British government says,the EU is going to veto

it,they are shit scared,Britain is going to do very well outside

of the EU,as that will cause others to leave.

regards worgeordie

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11 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

That's the best you can do? Even the Tories cannot even agree what that means. Why not try to answer my question:

I did. Leave means Leave. That you cannot understand this is not my problem.

 

11 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

Of course, I am not an investigative journalist - but there are investigative journalists working on this very subject right now, uncovering some very dirty goings on, with Farage and Banks at the very heart of it. Whilst I don't hold my breath, I hope very much that criminal proceedings commence soon,

Instead of howling at speculation, come back when and if, anyone is taken to trial and found guilty.

 

11 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

What is truly frightening is that you believe that the public understands the implications of their actions.

How many times do I have to tell you ? Do not try and put words in my mouth.

 

This is what I said

 

35 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

And 1 in 4 EU Countries, and rising in the hands of '' Populist Governments '' suggests that the majority of voters are now very aware of what has been going on for the last 30 years and are now saying no more.

Take note of the word '' Suggests '' and what it means.

 

Of course being a remainer, you also get confused by the meaning of '' might '' and '' could '' which has lost all meaning for remainers and has now come to represent '' Fact ''

 

Your safe space awaits.

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59 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

Of course it must be saved at all costs. It represent cohesion and stability. Without wishing to sound dismissive, it is clear that the majority of people in any democracy are not sufficiently politically engaged to be able to make a reasonable and informed decision about complex matters such as Brexit. That is why we have corrupt, shadowy organisations willing to pump masses of dirty money into the generation of fake news via fake organisations to sway the gullible public with populist sentiment. Which is why we have Trump in the White House and Brexit on our table - the public has been seduced into believing that such unthinkables might actually present the the answers to our problems.

"Of course it must be saved at all costs. It represent cohesion and stability."

 

Not really.  At the moment the eu is far more concerned about the rise of nationalist parties in various eu countries than brexit.  Why are these nationalist parties on the rise?  Because of eu policies.

 

"Without wishing to sound dismissive, it is clear that the majority of people in any democracy are not sufficiently politically engaged to be able to make a reasonable and informed decision about complex matters such as Brexit."

 

Eloquent Pilgrim responded to this elitist comment perfectly.  I'd only add the point that politicians are no wiser than the electorate on political issues.  Hence the Iraq war, based on WMDs that was swallowed hook, line and sinker by politicians......

 

"That is why we have corrupt, shadowy organisations willing to pump masses of dirty money into the generation of fake news via fake organisations to sway the gullible public with populist sentiment."

 

More elitist nonsense.

 

Personally, I believe it is the remainers that are gullible enough to believe this type of nonsense - which is why they believed the immediate armageddon catastrophe forecast by most of the media, politicians and 'experts' - not to mention 'the russians' (somehow....) influenced those that voted leave!

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For those barking at the moon and still screaming about no-one knows what Brexit is

 

Quote

3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

http://www.lisbon-treaty.org/wcm/the-lisbon-treaty/treaty-on-European-union-and-comments/title-6-final-provisions/137-article-50.html

 

Paragraph 3 of Article 50 of the Lisbon treaty spells it out in 3 easy steps.

 

The treaties cease to apply

 

  • On triggering A50
  • After a 2 year time span
  • Or extended by mutual agreement.

Of course,  the real problem for the EU and remainers is

 

Quote

Varadkar added: “If that principle were to be conceded there would be Eurosceptics and right-wing populist parties in every second country of Europe who would say cannot we have the same deal. While we really regret that the UK has decided to leave the European Union, we are not going to let them destroy the European Union.”

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/29/eu-uk-divide-poses-serious-threat-to-brexit-talks-says-barnier

 

Apparently the UK leaving the EU will destroy the EU.

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46 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

Is that correct ?

 

And 1 in 4 EU Countries, and rising in the hands of '' Populist Governments '' suggests that the majority of voters are now very aware of what has been going on for the last 30 years and are now saying no more.

 

Without being dismissive ? ?It would seem that it is you, and people like you, that are insufficiently engaged with your brain matter to make assumptions about anyone.

 

All these people, in all these Countries are not brainwashed, falling for fake news, racists, xenophobes or right wing lunatics.

"And 1 in 4 EU Countries, and rising in the hands of '' Populist Governments '' suggests that the majority of voters are now very aware of what has been going on for the last 30 years and are now saying no more."

"All these people, in all these Countries are not brainwashed, falling for fake news, racists, xenophobes or right wing lunatics."

 

Agree 100%

 

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1 hour ago, vogie said:

 

Show me where I said this, "apparently" doesn't cut the mustard with me

Logically speaking, there doesn't seem to be other options unless you were being irrational. Oh wait...

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42 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

"And 1 in 4 EU Countries, and rising in the hands of '' Populist Governments '' suggests that the majority of voters are now very aware of what has been going on for the last 30 years and are now saying no more."

"All these people, in all these Countries are not brainwashed, falling for fake news, racists, xenophobes or right wing lunatics."

 

Agree 100%

 

Nationalism is not the only response to the problems the EU faces, but it is the only ‘solution’ being offered by the rightwing, curiously where nationalism is rising it is being funded and promoted by billionaires and multimillionaires and as in past history supported by the working class.

 

Nationalism, different continent, same dumb arguments.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Logically speaking, there doesn't seem to be other options unless you were being irrational. Oh wait...

I have read your posts, you don't really do logical do you. I did not say 'Apparently vogie believes it's only non-brits who are opposed to Brexit' so why put words in my mouth, you do know it's againgst forum rules or is "apparently" your get out of jail card.

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