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Major Change Eff 1 Apr 19 in Bangkok Bank ACH Transfers


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In a related thread people are now receiving a letter from Bangkok Bank regarding their non-IAT transfers....the letter says the bank will try to continue to allow non-IAT transfers until 30 Jun.

 

 

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Thanks too "smo".....he posted a copy of the letter some folks are now receiving from Bangkok Bank when their ACH transfer arrives in "non-IAT" format.   You can read more about it in above post/related thread...but below is the letter smo posted.

 

image.png.34cc37fbdc8465917dc57b4453242f12.png

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Pib said:

Thanks too "smo".....he posted a copy of the letter some folks are now receiving from Bangkok Bank when their ACH transfer arrives in "non-IAT" format.   You can read more about it in above post/related thread...but below is the letter smo posted.

 

image.png.34cc37fbdc8465917dc57b4453242f12.png

 

 

I just received this letter today, too.  I also received notification today that my last ACH transfer to Bangkok Bank NY Branch was received into my Thai bank account, so it looks like they are still offering this service past April 1, 2019, as others have found as well.  According to the letter, this indulgence may continue to June 30, 2019.  However, I think I will switch over to TransferWise since I mostly need to transfer 65,000+ baht per month to Thailand in order to qualify for the monthly deposit method of meeting the financial requirements for a retirement extension.  It's been really convenient to use this Bangkok Bank service, so thanks to them for doing so up until now, and I'll miss it when it goes away.  I imagine I will like TransferWise as well once I get that set up and I understand for the amounts that I will be sending it's quite competitive with BBK's old service.

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I'm going to check into the "Thai Baht Remittance Service" the letter mentions, but I expect it's going to be similar to transferring funds via the Bangkok Bank London or Tokyo branches where you first register and get some kind of account/reference number which needs to be in each transfer. 

 

If a person needs to include some kind of "reference" number then that means needing to do a Wire transfer to get the funds to the NY branch which most US banks charge a healthy fee.  And you can't include a reference number in an ACH transfer.  Or if it requires opening an account then that's like opening a US bank account.  Or maybe it's some kind of bill pay arrangement.  Who knows....no details in the letter about the Thai Baht Remittance Service.

 

Or maybe they have figured out an easy way like giving you some kind of registration number which "simulates" an account number (will be linked behind the scenes) and you can setup an ACH transfer to the NY branch who have your registration linked to your in-Thailand bank account.  

 

I also expect the NY branch would do the exchange which probably means a lower exchange rate than given by the in-Thailand bank.  

 

But hey, I'll going to ask the NY branch for more info.   And maybe there will be info on their website over the coming months like eventually appeared for transfers via their London and Japan branches when money transfers tightened up in those countries.

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I got the letter today also....had to sign for it as it came registered.   

 

And by chance I got to talk to one of the Bangkok Bank reps today (I happened to be in the HQ Bangkok Bank building today) on this IAT goatrope and the rep said that Bangkok Bank NY did get an extension.   I pretty much got the impression today from that discussion that 30 Jun would be the last day non-IAT transfers would be allowed whether from a bank or govt agency....come 1 Jul all non-IAT payments will be rejected.  Since Bangkok Bank originally made the IAT announcement in Apr 2018 that means people will have had 15 months to make necessary changes to get their payments/transfers switched to IAT format, SWIFT, or other method. 

 

And the fact they are now sending out registered letters with one final notification pretty much tells me 30 Jun will be the last day for non-IAT transfers/payments.

 

Yeap...I think 30 Jun will be the last day....no more extensions...but that's just my impression.   

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Got a response from Bangkok Bank "New York" regarding the "Thai Baht Remittance Service" they referred to in their above letter.    See below instructions and attached application (i.e., transfer form).  

 

A few key things to point out/stress: 

- You can actually send in Thai baht or US dollars although the service's name implies Thai baht.

 

- If selecting to send in Thai baht expect their NY branch exchange rate would probably be 1 to 3% below the mid market rate which is typical when allowing a US bank to accomplish the currency exchange.   This is basically an indirect/hidden fee.   

 

- If selecting to send in baht a sliding scale remittance fee based on amount sent applies which ranges from $3 to $20...amounts people typically send would get the $5 or $10 fee.  Yes, even after getting the lower NY branch exchange rate which is an indirect fee there will also be a $3 to $20 additional fee.   

 

- If choosing to send dollars there will be a $55 flat fee (for any amount sent) instead of the $3 to $20 sliding scale fee.  

 

- Also not identified in below instructions (but stated in the transfer form Terms and Conditions) there could be a receiving bank fee which means you will probably also be tagged with the standard "0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max)" Bangkok Bank international transfer receiving/exchange fee which applies whether funds are received in a foreign currency or baht.  

 

-  Additionally, you must fund the transfer with a "bank check" (personal check not accepted) which will take 3 days to clear before the NY branch will send the transfer.  

 

- When wanting to do another transfer repeat everything you did for the first transfer.  That is, fill out the application (i.e., transfer form), attach ID, provide bank check, select whether sending in dollars or baht, email/fax/mail to them, and then wait probably a week or so for the funds to arrive....a lot will depend on how fast you can get a bank check delivered to the NY branch to fund the transfer.   And don't forget after you "first/original transfer" to mail them the original for their records; otherwise, subsequent transfer requests will not be processed.

 

Summary of their Thai Baht Remittance Service: expensive, paper-based, and slow.

 

Instructions

image.png.b80af66dd15603b75e8b33557da27828.png

 

 

Application Referred to in Above Instructions

Bkk Bk 2 Remittance Application(fillable)_Apr2019.pdf

 

 

 

Edited by Pib
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33 minutes ago, Pib said:

Got a response from Bangkok Bank "New York" regarding the "Thai Baht Remittance Service" they referred to in their above letter.    See below instructions and attached application (i.e., transfer form).  

 

 

OK, doesn't sound desirable at all, but thanks for investigating this option which was new to me.

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I'm struggling to think of any likely scenario where using this baht remittance service would be a better/preferred option for any Thailand resident expat vs all the other post-ACH-cutoff options -- domestic wire to BKKB NY, international wire to BKKB TH, Transferwise or similar private money transfer.....  And it's hard to figure what that scenario might be.

 

It strikes me as pretty much a giant and likely expensive PITA.....  Something that has the appearance of having been created/established by BKKB decades ago, back in the days of typewriters and pre-internet, and never been updated, or probably much used, ever since.  The BKKB Japan system is streamlined by comparison!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by TallGuyJohninBKK
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I also struggle trying to image who would want to use the service. However the application form shows a revision date of Apr 2019....good to see they are keeping an expensive, slow, and paperbased process updated.

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Pib wrote:

Quote

Also not identified in below instructions (but stated in the transfer form Terms and Conditions) there could be a receiving bank fee which means you will probably also be tagged with the standard "0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max)" Bangkok Bank international transfer receiving/exchange fee which applies whether funds are received in a foreign currency or baht. 

I have been using Transferwise for a few months - the funds are transferred into my Bangkok Bank account in baht in the amount shown by Transferwise as the total baht being sent in the transfer.  Bangkok Bank has not charged any additional fees.  It is my understanding that the 0.25% fee is for the currency exchange.  

 

As to the requirements described, it appears to be a very cumbersome experience and for me not worth the trouble.  With Transferwise, barring weekend or holidays, the funds are usually in my bank the following day from initiating the transfer request.

 

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I am aware that Transferwise uses certain banks to receive funds destined for accounts at other banks and as reported by many, these transfers show up as domestic instead of foreign because they come from Transferwise via one of their receiving banks.

 

However, when I transfer funds by Transferwise, I receive an SMS message from Bangkok Bank of a foreign transfer into my account when the Transferwise funds are received, no fee is shown as being deducted (when I previously sent ACH transfer via NY Branch, I rec'd a similar SMS which showed the dollars received, baht amount converted into, and deduction of the 0.25% fee (usually the maximum of 500 baht in my case)).  Further, it is coded by Bangkok Bank as an FTT (foreign) transfer on my online bank statement and, as mentioned, the amount deposited is exactly the amount stated by Transferwise that they will send at the time I initiate the transfer. 

 

From that, I concluded that Bangkok Bank is not charging the 0.25% fee when they receive the funds.

Edited by soisanuk
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40 minutes ago, soisanuk said:

I am aware that Transferwise uses certain banks to receive funds destined for accounts at other banks and as reported by many, these transfers show up as domestic instead of foreign because they come from Transferwise via one of their receiving banks.

 

However, when I transfer funds by Transferwise, I receive an SMS message from Bangkok Bank of a foreign transfer into my account when the Transferwise funds are received, no fee is shown as being deducted (when I previously sent ACH transfer via NY Branch, I rec'd a similar SMS which showed the dollars received, baht amount converted into, and deduction of the 0.25% fee (usually the maximum of 500 baht in my case)).  Further, it is coded by Bangkok Bank as an FTT (foreign) transfer on my online bank statement and, as mentioned, the amount deposited is exactly the amount stated by Transferwise that they will send at the time I initiate the transfer. 

 

From that, I concluded that Bangkok Bank is not charging the 0.25% fee when they receive the funds.

Bangkok Bank is one of the 3 Thai banks that have transferwise local accounts so any payment within that bank is known to be international even though it is a local baht transfer and not subject to the normal receiving fee.  In most cases it will be a Bangkok Bank transfer but occasionally a deposit might be made from one of their other accounts and that will appear as a local bahtnet deposit.  Unsure if immigration will accept or not (you can get transfer paperwork from Transferwise).  There appear to be an option to advise Transferwise to use BBL for transfer during the transfer process but not confirmed if foolproof or not.  Our Embassies have made life very difficult for us at an age where this is most unwelcome.  

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1 hour ago, soisanuk said:

I am aware that Transferwise uses certain banks to receive funds destined for accounts at other banks and as reported by many, these transfers show up as domestic instead of foreign because they come from Transferwise via one of their receiving banks.

 

However, when I transfer funds by Transferwise, I receive an SMS message from Bangkok Bank of a foreign transfer into my account when the Transferwise funds are received, no fee is shown as being deducted (when I previously sent ACH transfer via NY Branch, I rec'd a similar SMS which showed the dollars received, baht amount converted into, and deduction of the 0.25% fee (usually the maximum of 500 baht in my case)).  Further, it is coded by Bangkok Bank as an FTT (foreign) transfer on my online bank statement and, as mentioned, the amount deposited is exactly the amount stated by Transferwise that they will send at the time I initiate the transfer. 

 

From that, I concluded that Bangkok Bank is not charging the 0.25% fee when they receive the funds.

That's happening because since you are sending to you Bangkok Bank account and Transferwise is also using Bangkok Bank as its partner bank for the transfer then Bangkok Bank treats it's as an "internal transfer" between Bangkok Bank accounts but still codes it as an international transfer without any international receiving fee--it's just  unique setup they have with Transferwise.

 

Now if Transferwise had used K-bank or TMB to accomplish the final leg of the transfer to your Bangkok Bank account then there would still have been no receiving fee but it would "not" have been coded as an international transfer....just as any ol' domestic transfer.    

 

 

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Just a heads up to those using Fidelity Investments Standing Wire Transfer Orders...

 

For the first time, (today, after having made similar transfers in Jan, Feb, Mar and April) they included a secondary security step of sending a six-digit verification code via SMS, so make sure you are prepared for this additional hurdle. Their SMS system is supported on Google Voice.

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1 hour ago, mtls2005 said:

Just a heads up to those using Fidelity Investments Standing Wire Transfer Orders...

 

For the first time, (today, after having made similar transfers in Jan, Feb, Mar and April) they included a secondary security step of sending a six-digit verification code via SMS, so make sure you are prepared for this additional hurdle. Their SMS system is supported on Google Voice.

That is confusing, since I was told that I had to call Fidelity in order to use the Standing Wire system for Overseas Transfers.  Which I did last summer to both SCB and Bangkok Bank as a test after I mailed them the forms with Medallion Guarantee   

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32 minutes ago, Langsuan Man said:

That is confusing, since I was told that I had to call Fidelity in order to use the Standing Wire system for Overseas Transfers.

 

Sorry for not being more clear.

 

Yes, I have to make a call to Fidelity to initiate a Wire Transfer each month. I have standing wire transfer orders on file, to Bangkok Bank and SCB, established in person at a Fidelity branch  - so no Medallion Guarantee needed as the office rep. served as that guarantor.

 

During today's call the rep. asked if I can receive an SMS - there may be other verification methods, like email? - I said yes. I have two numbers associated with my account, both receive SMSes from Fidelity, I asked the rep. to send it to my GV number (I didn't call it that, just said ends in nnnn) and got the SMS is less than 1 second. I was calling on my GV number as well, and I've been registered in their voice reco system.

 

This is the first time I have been asked to provide this secondary verification, after having made four (4) similar transfer requests previously, hence I thought that I'd mention it so folks using this provider/method can be prepared.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by mtls2005
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Has anyone successfully used the Bangkok Bank ACH Transfer from the US in the last few days? Just confirming that it still appears to be working in accordance with the recently received letter where they will "try its best to make such transfer until June 30, 2019."  Thanks.

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1 hour ago, yamadajr said:

Has anyone successfully used the Bangkok Bank ACH Transfer from the US in the last few days? Just confirming that it still appears to be working in accordance with the recently received letter where they will "try its best to make such transfer until June 30, 2019."  Thanks.

Yes, It's good (4/26, received 4/29-Weekend)

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This 38-page thread is too long to study, and I am confused.  Can someone please give me a simple answer?

 

Last week I'd never heard of ACH, IAT, or ABA routing numbers.  I'd been wiring myself money from U.S.A. using the regular Bangkok Bank Swift code.  No problem, for 2 or 3 transfers per year .... but with 12 extra transfers per year to keep Immigration happy, the fees will add up, and I looked for a better way.

 

Like others here, my U.S. broker offers free Domestic wires but charges $25 each for International wires.  I clicked Domestic, entered the 9-digit routing code for BKKBank New York; just now I confirmed the money is in my account with a total fee of about $10.  (I don't know what the BKKBank fee is the Swift way, but won't worry about $10.)

 

But then I see this thread: Bangkok Bank ACH Transfers will no longer be available.

Ouch!  My plan was to do these transfers monthly for the rest of my life.

 

But wait!  "IAT" transfers are still OK?  Just not ACH?  I've no idea what the difference is, but think mine was IAT.  How can I know for sure?

 

And did I read that an "International" wire will be billed as Domestic if I use the BKKBank New York Swift code instead of the regular BKKBank Swift code?  Is that correct?

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29 minutes ago, singburisam said:

This 38-page thread is too long to study, and I am confused.  Can someone please give me a simple answer?

 

Last week I'd never heard of ACH, IAT, or ABA routing numbers.  I'd been wiring myself money from U.S.A. using the regular Bangkok Bank Swift code.  No problem, for 2 or 3 transfers per year .... but with 12 extra transfers per year to keep Immigration happy, the fees will add up, and I looked for a better way.

 

Like others here, my U.S. broker offers free Domestic wires but charges $25 each for International wires.  I clicked Domestic, entered the 9-digit routing code for BKKBank New York; just now I confirmed the money is in my account with a total fee of about $10.  (I don't know what the BKKBank fee is the Swift way, but won't worry about $10.)

 

But then I see this thread: Bangkok Bank ACH Transfers will no longer be available.

Ouch!  My plan was to do these transfers monthly for the rest of my life.

 

But wait!  "IAT" transfers are still OK?  Just not ACH?  I've no idea what the difference is, but think mine was IAT.  How can I know for sure?

 

And did I read that an "International" wire will be billed as Domestic if I use the BKKBank New York Swift code instead of the regular BKKBank Swift code?  Is that correct?

The original cut off for the ACH transfers via Bangkok Bank New York was 1st of April this year.  Bangkok Bank sent out letters saying they'll "do their best" to extend that to 30 June 2019.

 

You should look into another option, such as Transferwise.  I was happy with my Schwab>BKK Bank ACH but with April 1st looming, needed a new Plan A.  Been using  TW for 3 months now, no problems.

Edited by 55Jay
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5 minutes ago, 55Jay said:

The original cut off for the ACH transfers via Bangkok Bank New York was 1st of April this year.  Bangkok Bank sent out letters saying they'll "do their best" to extend that to 30 June 2019.

 

You should look into another option, such as Transferwise.  I was happy with my Schwab>BKK Bank ACH but with April 1st looming, needed a new Plan A.  Been using  TW for 3 months now, no problems.

Unless something has changed very recently with TransferWise there's something additional you must do to ensure that your transfer will come from Bangkok Bank into your Bangkok Bank account (and therefore show up as a foreign transfer) rather than come from one of the of TW's other partner banks (TMB and Kasikorn).  If the transfer were to come from one of these partner banks it would end up in your Bangkok Bank fine, but might be marked as a domestic transfer which could cause a problem with immigration when you go to get your extension of stay.

Again, there is an additional step that you need to execute with TW (an email or phone call) to ask them to use Bangkok Bank as the intermediary bank in Thailand when transferring money to your Bangkok Bank account in Thailand.  You might think, "why wouldn't they," but their business model does not make that guarantee and it could work fine 10 straight times and then you could have one transfer that used say Kasikorn as the intermediary bank (for TW internal business reasons) and that one might be marked as a domestic transfer.  

Hopefully, someone will be able to provide you with the latest guidance from TW that you need to use with TW to guarantee that this doesn't happen to you.

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2 hours ago, singburisam said:

This 38-page thread is too long to study, and I am confused.  Can someone please give me a simple answer?

 

Last week I'd never heard of ACH, IAT, or ABA routing numbers.  I'd been wiring myself money from U.S.A. using the regular Bangkok Bank Swift code.  No problem, for 2 or 3 transfers per year .... but with 12 extra transfers per year to keep Immigration happy, the fees will add up, and I looked for a better way.

 

Like others here, my U.S. broker offers free Domestic wires but charges $25 each for International wires.  I clicked Domestic, entered the 9-digit routing code for BKKBank New York; just now I confirmed the money is in my account with a total fee of about $10.  (I don't know what the BKKBank fee is the Swift way, but won't worry about $10.)

 

But then I see this thread: Bangkok Bank ACH Transfers will no longer be available.

Ouch!  My plan was to do these transfers monthly for the rest of my life.

 

But wait!  "IAT" transfers are still OK?  Just not ACH?  I've no idea what the difference is, but think mine was IAT.  How can I know for sure?

 

And did I read that an "International" wire will be billed as Domestic if I use the BKKBank New York Swift code instead of the regular BKKBank Swift code?  Is that correct?

 A domestic wire and ACH are different animals. 

 

IAT stands for "International ACH Transaction"...basically it an ACH transfer that is formatted for leaving the US....going to another country like Thailand.  It is "not" a wire (a.k.a., SWIFT) transfer.   Wire/SWIFT and ACH are two different animals.  

 

Regarding ACH what is not OK is if it's in the ACH Domestic format as that format does not include the additional info found in an ACH IAT format transfer.  No known US bank/credit union for retail accounts sends in ACH "IAT" format...instead they use international wire (a.k.a., SWIFT).   An ACH Domestic format is like when you are transferring funds from one bank in the US to another bank in the US (and those funds are not leaving the US).

 

Since you have been using SWIFT you have not been using ACH (Domestic or IAT format) 

 

Depending on your US sending bank you may not be able to use the Bangkok Bank NY SWIFT code of    BKKBUS33 which would normally be used when you are in a foreign country and SWIFTing funds to your NY branch account....like you had an account with their NY branch which you do "not" as they don't issue "retail" accounts as the NY branch is for corporate accounts.   Instead you might be forced to using the NY branch routing number of 026008691 for a domestic wire.    But if your bank does allow use of the BKKBUS33 SWIFT code it might incur the domestic wire fee instead of a typically higher international wire fee.  Now Bangkok Bank NY will relay your funds to you in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch but they will still charge their intermediary bank fee of either $5 or $10 for typical amounts and you will also have the 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) receiving fee at your in-Thailand Bangkok Bank branch. 

 

If you use Bangkok Bank international SWIFT code of BKKBTHBK then you sending bank will route the funds...it probably will not even go thru their NY branch which means no intermediary bank fee...but you will still have the in-Thailand receiving fee mentioned above.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Pib said:

...

Since you have been using SWIFT you have not been using ACH (Domestic or IAT format) 

 

Depending on your US sending bank you may not be able to use the Bangkok Bank NY SWIFT code of    BKKBUS33 which would normally be used when you are in a foreign country and SWIFTing funds to your NY branch account....like you had an account with their NY branch which you do "not" as they don't issue "retail" accounts as the NY branch is for corporate accounts.   Instead you might be forced to using the NY branch routing number of 026008691 for a domestic wire.    But if your bank does allow use of the BKKBUS33 SWIFT code it might incur the domestic wire fee instead of a typically higher international wire fee. ..

 

 

My post must have been unclear.

 

The transfer I made two days ago did NOT use any Swift code -- it DID use {"domestic wire" 026008691}.  (Don't blame me if "wire" is the wrong word -- I think that's what Schwab's webpage called it.)

 

My question is:  Will this option disappear next month?

 

If it will disappear, I think I should try the BKKBUS33 SWIFT code (I don't have an account at BKKB NY but do have one in BKKB Thailand).  If that works at all, it should continue to work, right?

 

(I don't want to try this experiment until next month.  I'll need the June transfer anyway for Immigration, and only get three free "domestic wires" per quarter.)

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5 hours ago, singburisam said:

My post must have been unclear.

 

The transfer I made two days ago did NOT use any Swift code -- it DID use {"domestic wire" 026008691}.  (Don't blame me if "wire" is the wrong word -- I think that's what Schwab's webpage called it.)

 

My question is:  Will this option disappear next month?

 

If it will disappear, I think I should try the BKKBUS33 SWIFT code (I don't have an account at BKKB NY but do have one in BKKB Thailand).  If that works at all, it should continue to work, right?

 

(I don't want to try this experiment until next month.  I'll need the June transfer anyway for Immigration, and only get three free "domestic wires" per quarter.)

That number in the first paragraph is the routing number for Bangkok Bank's NY Branch.  If the "domestic wire" you sent used this number it was, in fact, an ACH transaction and yes, as far as anyone knows, that option will be gone by the end of June.  Up until June 30, it would most likely work.  Following that it would not, barring another extension (which is possible).

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