"Easy Ride" for pensioners in Thailand now over, says Pattaya Radio

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

That actually sounds fine to me. If Thai immigration still accepts those letters with a disclaimer and then demands evidence to support the claim. Most of us are making legit claims and are in a position to prove it. Especially easy with a government pension. 

For many, a government pension is insufficient to meet the 65,000 baht/month requirement - unless you were a government servant, of course. So it has to be supplemented with income earned on investments.

I use my annual income tax statements as proof of income.

[smedly]

1 hour ago, bbi1 said:

 

It was only a matter of time before a crackdown on the Retirement Visa. First it was the Ed Visa, then the Tourist Visa, now it's hitting the old dudes with their Retirement Visas. I remember the days when some old dudes on this forum liked taking glee in singling out young dudes who were here on those type of visas. Now it's them that's being cracked down upon.

what are you going on about ? what crackdown ?

 

If people don't meet the requirements then they shouldn't be here - simple 

 

I see no crackdown going on, there might be enforcement of existing laws

[bbi1]

51 minutes ago, tifino said:

 

strange what a pensioner's salary has to be reported via their Embassy?

 

 

feels like silly climbing an apple tree to pick oranges!

 

 

 

yeah I'm not from UK, being an aussie!

 - but, if I was an aussie pensioner, living in LOS, and required that letter; 

       I don't go to the Embassy... I logically contact CentreLink/DVA etc directly, via the GOV website back in Australia, and get the letter$$ from them

In the aussie sytem, one gets sStatement of Pension; regarding type of pension, and all the $$$ details of how much is paid...

 

 

Does the UK Embassy pay UK pensioners their pension??   that would be stranger!

lol....yeah it does seem strange when you think about it. Surely a government statement shows the pension being paid.  Or even a bank statement would definitely have all that info showing, plus the bank account statement would show the same amount of money coming in every week/fortnight/month.

[bbi1]

53 minutes ago, amse said:

Don't forget that even though there are thousands of law abiding foreigners living here who can't afford the extreme amount needed in a bank to get a retirement visa, and there are many lawyers helping them out, and understanding immigration officers giving honest foreign retired people a break, that it's a win-win situation for everyone, and the income the retiree's do get goes into Thailand by buying food, renting an apartment/house, buying/renting a vehicle, buying clothes & etc. It not only would be a sad state of affairs for not only the farangs, but also the Thai's providing the services if thousands, maybe even millions had to leave. If the Thai government would lower the amount needed in a bank to say half what it is for a retirement visa, Thailand would be much better off because of it!

"Extreme amount"??? lol <deleted>..... If an retired person can't save up a measly 800k in the bank by the time they're 50 yrs old then there's something wrong. Thailand doesn't want peeps without money as we all know. They was to keep the quality in and the poor out.

[bbi1]

51 minutes ago, Jeffrey346 said:

Quote from the BE website:

 

"This letter has previously served as a supporting document for obtaining a Thai retirement or marriage visa. The British Embassy Bangkok is stopping the certification of income letters because it is unable to fulfil the Thai authorities’ requirements to verify the income of British Nationals".

How come the US Embassy has no knowledge of this?

Has Thai Immigration singled out the British?

So it's only the British Embassy in Bangkok? Well, as far as I know there are 100's of other British embassies/consulates located in other countries outside of Thailand. Is that not the case? Take a flight or land crossing to another country with a British embassies/consulate and the problem is solved ????

[Jingthing]

11 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

For many, a government pension is insufficient to meet the 65,000 baht/month requirement - unless you were a government servant, of course. So it has to be supplemented with income earned on investments.

I use my annual income tax statements as proof of income.

No it doesn't. You can use the combination method that mixes income stated in a letter and money in a Thai bank totaling at least 800K. 

I agree people use different kinds of income and that's OK.

Just saying if your own embassy can't verify a pension from their own government, then how worthless is that? 

[dick dasterdly]

11 minutes ago, brommers said:

Surely the issue is not Thai Immigration! They have not introduced anything new with regards to visa application or extension. It is the British Embassy that is the source of the problem.

 

As a Brit I quickly realised decades ago that the British Embassies around the world have no interest in British citizens, nor giving them anything like good service. Back in Blighty the government has always seen expats and tourists as a pain the backside or as traitors for leaving the Sceptred Isle.

 

So now the British Embassy once again degrades the service to British passport holders, and yet most posts are nattering on about Thai Immigration.

 

Agree entirely about the British Embassy.  But presumably they are just showing the typical Brit. politician position of immediately accepting all and any rules issued by others, regardless of the consequences for 'their' citizens?

 

11 minutes ago, brommers said:

 

If you can't meet the clearly stated & long standing conditions then you cannot stay here. If you were trying to skate around regulations in the UK you would be swiftly turfed out of that country. So why is Thailand wrong?

I for one, can meet the "long standing conditions" re. proof of income.  The problem arises when the 
Brit. Embassy refuses to provide the REQUIRED proof of income letter.

[blackhorse]

"Extreme amount"??? lol ..... If an retired person can't save up a measly 800k in the bank by the time they're 50 yrs old then there's something wrong. Thailand doesn't want peeps without money as we all know. They was to keep the quality in and the poor out.

I'm not brit but have a 8 million baht condo but not the 800k in spare cash although meet requirements for income.

There are many reasons why people are asset rich but cash poor, or meet the income 65k but don't have the savings.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

26 minutes ago, brommers said:

So now the British Embassy once again degrades the service to British passport holders, and yet most posts are nattering on about Thai Immigration.

 

If you can't meet the clearly stated & long standing conditions then you cannot stay here. If you were trying to skate around regulations in the UK you would be swiftly turfed out of that country. So why is Thailand wrong?

 

You're missing the bigger picture.

 

Brits with 65,000 baht per month or better income ARE meeting the clearly stated and longstanding Thai Immigration financial requirements for retirement extensions.

 

And yet, once the British Embassy starts no longer issuing income affidavits, how are those Brits supposed to get the retirement extensions they're entitled to, if Immigration continues demanding consulate income letters that the British Embassy won't provide.

 

[notamember]

2 hours ago, wgdanson said:

Never had Immigration in either Jomtien or Phitsanulok 'shit' on my application. If you have the correct amount of money, and the correct documentation....no problems. This new rule is has been made because you could tell the Brit Consulate anything you wanted about your gross UK income, and they would issue the signed letter, no questions asked. Now the Thai lot have got wise to this scam and are closing the loophole.

you are wrong

Brits have always had to prove the income claimed, you are mixing them up with US embassy letters who write what you pay for

[granuaile]

18 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

That actually sounds fine to me. If Thai immigration still accepts those letters with a disclaimer and then demands evidence to support the claim. Most of us are making legit claims and are in a position to prove it. Especially easy with a government pension. 

I always take originals and copies of my Social Security statement and my state pension's deposit statement as backup anyway (but never been asked for them). It would be nice if Thai immigration would accept them in lieu of the affidavit but as long as the U.S. embassy issues the letter I'm fine with both....

[notamember]

2 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

There are a few things that have been missed here.

1.  If a Brit walked in and signed an oath saying that he was a millionaire they would stamp it.

2.  Last year when I renewed my retirement extension as with every year the Canadian Embassy has required proof that I was making the money I stated.  That is the first difference.

3.  Last year Thai immigration also asked me for supporting docs to the letter.

4.  There has always been and will always be those around us that want to abuse the system that is why it is best to stay up and up on it.

5 and this is the biggest point BIG JOKE IS RUNNING things and he is not a BIG JOKE.  Look at his previous actions if he says he is going to start closing visa mills I would not bet against him or his staff.

 

The bottom line is the Brit Embassy staff got lazy.  Brits took advantage of it.  They have been weighed measured and found wanting in their procedures.  They have 2 choices clean up their act or just stop signing.  Personally, if I was a Brit (thank god I am no longer one or part of a colony)  I would be pissed at those that screwed it up and the embassy.

 

OHH CANADA WE ARE PROUD OF THEE.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

about Brits is BS, they wanted evidence less than 2 weeks go

[tifino]

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

No it doesn't. You can use the combination method that mixes income stated in a letter and money in a Thai bank totaling at least 800K. 

I agree people use different kinds of income and that's OK.

Just saying if your own embassy can't verify a pension from their own government, then how worthless is that? 

 

so the test itself is looking for a particular amount of Income, and whatever funds in the bank account, are 'deemed as Income?

and if so, what formula do they use to convert A$$ets, into Deemed Income?

[dick dasterdly]

5 minutes ago, bbi1 said:

"Extreme amount"??? lol <deleted>..... If an retired person can't save up a measly 800k in the bank by the time they're 50 yrs old then there's something wrong. Thailand doesn't want peeps without money as we all know. They was to keep the quality in and the poor out.

A minimum of 65,000 bht income p.m. is not "peeps without money".

 

Feel free to look down your nose at those of us who had substantial cash sums when first coming to Thailand, but one way or another, lost it whilst here ????.

[bbi1]

2 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

I'm not brit but have a 8 million baht condo but not the 800k in spare cash although meet requirements for income.

There are many reasons why people are asset rich but cash poor, or meet the income 65k but don't have the savings.


 

Personally I would be expecting to have a lot more than AUD$32k saved upif I was going to be staying in a foreign country for emergencies, eg. medical for example, but that's just my thinking. What will you do when sh*t hits the fan with no money saved up?

[notamember]

2 hours ago, bluesea said:

Like everything else in Thailand, it will blow over!! sensationalised by the media.

many forget that Thaivisa is not a free information service and without subscribers there are no advertisers and no money

Headlines no matter how salacious or true make money

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, tifino said:

 

so the test itself is looking for a particular amount of Income, and whatever funds in the bank account, are 'deemed as Income?

and if so, what formula do they use to convert A$$ets, into Deemed Income?

Nope.

Combination applications are a combination of income and bank account funds.

For example, income annualized to 500K. So you'd need to show at least 300K baht in the bank properly seasoned. 

[Spidey]

11 minutes ago, bbi1 said:

So it's only the British Embassy in Bangkok? Well, as far as I know there are 100's of other British embassies/consulates located in other countries outside of Thailand. Is that not the case? Take a flight or land crossing to another country with a British embassies/consulate and the problem is solved ????

Immigration will only accept letters from British Embassy in Bangkok. Also I would imagine that this advice has gone out to all British Embassys.

[tifino]

1 minute ago, dick dasterdly said:

A minimum of 65,000 bht income p.m. is not "peeps without money".

 

Feel free to look down your nose at those of us who had substantial cash sums when first coming to Thailand, but one way or another, lost it whilst here ????.

ah! that was the past 'Fun Ride' ???? 

[notamember]

2 hours ago, petermik said:

I admire your optimism....the use of "agents" providing spurious bank accounts to obtain long term visas here has been on the agenda for some time 

by everyone but immigration.....

[Spidey]

Just now, notamember said:

many forget that Thaivisa is not a free information service and without subscribers there are no advertisers and no money

Headlines no matter how salacious or true make money

This information has come from a number of sources, not just Thai Visa. It's on the British Embassy website.

[tifino]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Nope.

Combination applications are a combination of income and bank account funds.

For example, income annualized to 500K. So you'd need to show at least 300K baht in the bank properly seasoned. 

so it is more a 'compilation' of ... 

needs both (added together) from the two separate bodies of substance

[Spidey]

Just now, notamember said:

by everyone but immigration.....

Now immigration. As reported Jontien Immigration has already turned away a number of visa agents.

[thequietman]

1 hour ago, Searat7 said:

Your posting makes a good case for having 2 baht accounts here; one attached to ATM card and the other holding most of your money. I made this change at BKK Bank a while back. No worries about skimmers.

Correct ........ one for general day to day money with ATM card (only keep what you need). Deposit for visa in another account with no ATM card asked for. If money goes missing, the bank took it.

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, tifino said:

so it is more a 'compilation' of ... 

needs both (added together) from the two separate bodies of substance

Whatever word you need to understand it. It's commonly referred to as a COMBINATION application. Seems straightforward to me. 

[Chongalulu]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I have no idea what you're talking about now. I have made no such statement. I am saying that I find it irresponsible of the British embassy to stop income letters and then suggest that their nationals use proof of bank deposits instead BEFORE Thai immigration has officially changed their policy on always requiring income letters for income based applications. 

 

The responsible thing would be to say, well we won't do the letters anymore, Thai immigration requires the letters, so be prepared to do 800K baht bank applications or if not, be prepared to leave Thailand. The British embassy does not make Thai immigration policies!

Yes,thanks for applying reason and logic instead of hysteria. 

If your visa extension falls due before 12 June next year apply for the income letter by the last application date (12 December) this year and it is valid for 6 months. Others due after that date can wait to see what alternatives will become available subsequently. So plenty of time. Don’t panic!

[aglae4]

No, it is not only the British Embassy. A friend of mine went to the Thai Embassy in Brussels last friday to get a retirement visa for his mother that wants to retire in Thailand. She has the 800 000 bahts in the bank but her pension was not enough for the 65000/month. The visa was refused because now in Brussels you need both (not one of the requirements, both!). My friend sent en email to the embassy to be sure this was not a mistake and he got a message back on his phone, saying ; yes, she need both proofs. The 800000 bahts is to be sure  she has money and the second of 65000bahts/month is to proove that she has a monthly income. The visa was refused! The Thai Embassy has always been very strict. And now this! 

[logres212]

1 hour ago, smedly said:

Because it is not their responsibility to prove that your declaration is true - that is down to Thai Immigration, The British embassy letter was different - they actually confirmed your income - which they are now saying they can no longer do

 

The two methods involving Embassies were fundamentally different

Yes that's correct, the Australian embassy has never supplied an income letter signed by them. They're only notarising a stat.Dec. which could be a declaration for anything, so the onus is on the person signing the Stat Dec to prove what it contains not them. So I can't think of any reason they would stop doing this. Surely the British embassy could do the same, they must still notarise Stat Dec's for other things.

[dick dasterdly]

2 minutes ago, notamember said:

many forget that Thaivisa is not a free information service and without subscribers there are no advertisers and no money

Headlines no matter how salacious or true make money

Actually, I was taken completely by suprise to learn (on this thread) that the Brit. embassy had announced that it was not going to issue proof of income letters after Dec 12 (?)!

 

So the thread is not a 'salacious headline', and is relevant to many of us living here.

[Teee]

This has just appeared on the gov.uk site.