With Trump sitting nearby, Macron calls nationalism a betrayal

[connda]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

With Trump sitting nearby, Macron calls nationalism a betrayal

Macron is a globalist, acts like a globalist, talks like a globalist - and now has the support of only 23 percent of the French. 

 

Nothing like calling the other 77 percent 'deplorables'.  See how well that worked in 2016 in the US.

[vogie]

7 minutes ago, Grouse said:

You really have a problem with believing that ANYONE can have feelings of philanthropy, altruism or want to do the best that they can for their people. Harping on about selfishness and gravy trains is all very well but I trust  this isn't motivated by something more fundamental?

Anybody that disagrees with you has a problem, we know that grouse. Show me where I mentioned gravy trains and selfishness, have you got the right poster. Incidentely Macron does not have to be popular with me, I don't vote for him, but the people of France do and it is no secret how unpleasant the man is and will certainly have to become more popular in the future to become electable again.

Did I read last week that Marie le Penn has passed Macron in the popularity stakes? Bonjour.

[canuckamuck]

42 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I think you confuse nationalism 

with patriotism

 

I view nationalism with disdain. I think it includes jingoism, xenophobia and exceptionalism. Waving a St. George's  flag is an example. I don't think racism is involved. That's a separate issue.

 

Ultimately, and coming back to Nash again, solutions that are best for all should be sought. It's the key issue of our time if you think about it.

 

Hungary is a good example. Interesting to compare their stance now with their stance as part of Austria Hungary, and one of the central powers, in the lead up to WW1.

 

We forget history at our peril.

Nationalism is the patriotism of the government.

The globalists abhor nationalism because it keeps them stealing power from sovereign states.

What globalists want is a one world government which serves the elites. Macron is 100% globalist

 

[Becker]

12 minutes ago, connda said:

Macron is a globalist, acts like a globalist, talks like a globalist - and now has the support of only 23 percent of the French. 

 

Nothing like calling the other 77 percent 'deplorables'.  See how well that worked in 2016 in the US.

Macron makes unpopular decisions because he believes in certain ideas. The man-child just panders to his base and organizes an endless string of pathetic love fests where his frail ego is stroked by the cheers of "excitable" people.

[Becker]

15 minutes ago, vogie said:

Incidentely Macron does not have to be popular with me, I don't vote for him, but the people of France do and it is no secret how unpleasant the man is and will certainly have to become more popular in the future to become electable again.

Did I read last week that Marie le Penn has passed Macron in the popularity stakes? Bonjour.

There is no connection between unpleasantness and electability. Case in point is the disgrace in the WH.

[Becker]

14 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

Nationalism is the patriotism of the government.

The globalists abhor nationalism because it keeps them stealing power from sovereign states.

What globalists want is a one world government which serves the elites. Macron is 100% globalist

 

"Nationalism is the patriotism of the government."

Huh?? If you say so.

 

"The globalists abhor nationalism because it keeps them stealing power from sovereign states."

Many globalists dislike nationalism because it has often led to atrocities.

 

"What globalists want is a one world government which serves the elites."

I'm a globalist but I don't want "a one world government"

[candide]

3 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Macron is a mere puppet for his former employer..Goldman Sachs I believe..he is a globalist and imo does not give a toss for the working man/woman..his god is money and power cos greed is good.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

He never worked for GS.....

[canuckamuck]

10 minutes ago, Becker said:

"The globalists abhor nationalism because it keeps them stealing power from sovereign states."

Many globalists dislike nationalism because it has often led to atrocities.

 

The worst atrocities in human history came from socialism. Globalism is socialism's big brother.

Quote

"What globalists want is a one world government which serves the elites."

I'm a globalist but I don't want "a one world government"

I have to tell you that just although you support the ideology, you aren't really a player.

[The Theory]

Macron 555 , he is clown who is not even funny. He is struggling badly.  

 

[FritsSikkink]

7 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

Very often nationalism is a defense of your moral values. 

When Genghis Khan is at your gate for example.

What moral values might that be?

• The ones of the native Americans
• The ones of the slave owners
• The ones of the KKK
• The ones of the bible bashers
• The ones of the Western European immigrants
• The ones of the Eastern European immigrants
• The ones of the Northern European immigrants
• The ones of the Southern European immigrants
• The ones of the Asian immigrants
• The ones of the Middle Eastern immigrants
• The ones of the Southern American immigrants
• The ones of the Eastern African immigrants
• The ones of the Northern African immigrants
• The ones of the Western African immigrants
• The ones of the Southern African immigrants
• etc.

[canuckamuck]

7 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

What moral values might that be?

• The ones of the native Americans
• The ones of the slave owners
• The ones of the KKK
• The ones of the bible bashers
• etc.

I don't know your moral values.

[attrayant]

As if there is only one set of "correct" moral values.  ????

 

[moontang]

and you all live in Thailand, because they aren't "nationalists,"like the Americans?  Or is it the free speech?

[sukhumvitneon]

Quote

"Patriotism is the exact opposite of nationalism: nationalism is a betrayal of patriotism," Macron said in a 20-minute address delivered from under the Arc de Triomphe to mark the 100th anniversary of the end of World War One.

 

"By pursuing our own interests first, with no regard to others', we erase the very thing that a nation holds most precious, that which gives it life and makes it great: its moral values."

What the <deleted> is this?  Fighting wars on behalf of the Brits and the Frenchies isn't in the US's interest.  The EU moaned when the US government mentioned that the US should close the bases.  Let the EU pay its own way defense wise,  but it won't of course because it needs the US milking cow on standby.

[FritsSikkink]

58 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

I don't know your moral values.

We are talking about US nationalism so I was wondering what morals do fit there.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, canuckamuck said:

The worst atrocities in human history came from socialism. Globalism is socialism's big brother.

I have to tell you that just although you support the ideology, you aren't really a player.

Utter hogwash.

 

 

 

[alocacoc]

Macron is an idiot who couldn't care less about France.

Sent from a so called Smartphone using an App.

[Pedrogaz]

He is right of course, nationalism breed war, and war is the ultimate evil on the planet for us humans.  But Macron might be a tad more believable if he didn't have his tongue up Trumps bottom on Syrian and Yemeni issues.  Being cuckolded in public by Trump was not a particularly good idea either from a PR point of view

[Pedrogaz]

1 hour ago, attrayant said:

 

I'd like you to show causative relationships between socialism and "humanities [sic] worst atrocities".  First, we'll need to come up with a list of events that we can all agree were the worst atrocities.  Are you up for the challenge?

He probably doesn't know about black 47 or the famine in Bengal....the free market's first claims to horror.

[Scottjouro]

Marcon is a bigger idiot/clown than Trump

[Jingthing]

Marcon is a bigger idiot/clown than Trump

You may not like him but that's no excuse to push such an absurdity. "trump" has got to be among the most clownish major leaders in world history. The winner at being a clown and orange to boot. A perfect clown color. Certainly the most media exposed clown leader in history.

 

OK there were others. Goering comes to mind.

 

Macron is extremely dignified. The opposite of a clown.

 

 

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[Jingthing]

He is right of course, nationalism breed war, and war is the ultimate evil on the planet for us humans.
But Macron might be a tad more believable if he didn't have his tongue up Trumps bottom on Syrian and Yemeni issues.
Being cuckolded in public by Trump was not a particularly good idea either from a PR point of view

Fair enough. He took a risk trying to court 45. Risks don't always work out.

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[mcambl61]

1 hour ago, Pedrogaz said:

He is right of course, nationalism breed war, and war is the ultimate evil on the planet for us humans.

But Macron might be a tad more believable if he didn't have his tongue up Trumps bottom on Syrian and Yemeni issues.

Being cuckolded in public by Trump was not a particularly good idea either from a PR point of view

leaders or lack thereof, breed war, it has little to do with "nationalism"

but money and power yes.

[mcambl61]

42 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Fair enough. He took a risk trying to court 45. Risks don't always work out.

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he wanted to protect his part of the billions of dollars of projects and industrial supply

contracts to Iran, as does germany. one of the main reasons the entire ridiculous agreement was sought after. especially giving Iran all the benefits upfront

[Jingthing]

"trump" looking like a BIG LOSER these days. In his perverted world of arrested development that's as bad as it gets.

Expect him to get even darker now.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/11/13/macrons-pyrrhic-victory-over-trump/?utm_term=.6c03a1d78e1b



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[FritsSikkink]

6 hours ago, sukhumvitneon said:

What the <deleted> is this?  Fighting wars on behalf of the Brits and the Frenchies isn't in the US's interest.  The EU moaned when the US government mentioned that the US should close the bases.  Let the EU pay its own way defense wise,  but it won't of course because it needs the US milking cow on standby.

The EU doesn't need you at all. You need to sell arms for you 200 + years of continuous wars as this is your best export item. In the mean time you nick resources from all over the world.

[Jingthing]

Hmm.

I thought the topic here was NATIONALISM and how it is the opposite of PATRIOTISM. 

Didn't see anything about socialism or communism in the O.P.

 

[Opl]

  https://thenib.com/nationalism-isn-t-patriotism

 

 

[Jingthing]

The recent "trump" visit to France was one of his lowest presidential moments and that's saying a lot in a presidency littered with historic level low moments.

 

Quote

 

A powerful reminder of the dangers of Trumpian nationalism

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/opinions/wp/2018/11/12/a-powerful-reminder-of-the-dangers-of-trumpian-nationalism/

[Morch]

4 hours ago, mcambl61 said:

leaders or lack thereof, breed war, it has little to do with "nationalism"

but money and power yes.

 

If it's supposedly just about leaders, how come you guys invest so much times bashing "the left", and what you imagine its agenda is? To follow the logic of the post above, it would be more to the point to focus on specific leader or leadership issues. But no....let's have another rant about the evils of socialism.