LOS alternative

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said:

must have improved a lot over the past 10-15 years then, good

 

More specific info here from 2016 --

 

Quote

 

Fowler said that the overall crime picture in Ecuador is better than in the other countries she is studying and that the trend is positive. “Compared with Spain, Panama and Costa Rica, expats in Ecuador suffer fewer crimes. Crime is increasing in Spain and Panama and is holding steady in Costa Rica, but it is dropping in Ecuador,” she says. She and Simmons credit the decline to government spending on crime prevention, including the hiring of more police, the installation of surveillance cameras in urban areas and a new nationwide 911 monitoring program.

 

https://cuencahighlife.com/study-shows-ecuador-expats-in-rural-areas-are-more-vulnerable-to-crime-conspicuousness-is-one-reason-why/

 

 

Quote

Ecuador will end the year with second lowest murder rate in Latin America

https://cuencahighlife.com/ecuador-end-year-second-lowest-murder-rate-latin-america/

 

 

Quote

While serious crime has dropped in Cuenca, ‘crimes of opportunity’ pose an on-going threat

https://cuencahighlife.com/while-cuencas-serious-crime-rate-is-low-petty-crime-is-a-problem-advice-to-travellers-hold-onto-your-stuff/

[melvinmelvin]

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

More specific info here from 2016 --

 

https://cuencahighlife.com/study-shows-ecuador-expats-in-rural-areas-are-more-vulnerable-to-crime-conspicuousness-is-one-reason-why/

 

 

https://cuencahighlife.com/ecuador-end-year-second-lowest-murder-rate-latin-america/

 

 

https://cuencahighlife.com/while-cuencas-serious-crime-rate-is-low-petty-crime-is-a-problem-advice-to-travellers-hold-onto-your-stuff/

have been to Ecuador many times, but not since early 2000s, international meetings in one of the two

main cities or in coastal resorts.

each delegate met by armed guards at airport just outside the plane,

followed through immigration and customs then driven to a Sheraton - Hilton or smth like that.

Armed guards in meeting rooms all day

 

when meetings were hosted in coastal resorts we were rounded up at a Hilton/Sheraton

in one of the two main cities,

then early Monday morning off to the resort in buses

armed guards inside each bus

armed vehicles in front of the first bus - between buses - behind the last bus

vehicles had hand weapons + mounted machine gun + bazookas

 

my colleagues from US (mostly FCC and DoS some DoD) and Canada, were scared shitless, really, every time

a meeting in Ecuador surfaced.

Absolutely no way of getting them to join me in going to the local for a beer, they were genuinely very afraid

and just couldn't wait for getting on a plane out of Ecuador.

 

no unexperienced travelers these guys, very very seasoned travelers, constantly crisscrossing the planet.

 

so I am kinda surprised when I do read (the last few years) that Americans list Ecuador as a retiree place.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

have been to Ecuador many times, but not since early 2000s, international meetings in one of the two

main cities or in coastal resorts.

each delegate met by armed guards at airport just outside the plane,

followed through immigration and customs then driven to a Sheraton - Hilton or smth like that.

Armed guards in meeting rooms all day

 

when meetings were hosted in coastal resorts we were rounded up at a Hilton/Sheraton

in one of the two main cities,

then early Monday morning off to the resort in buses

armed guards inside each bus

armed vehicles in front of the first bus - between buses - behind the last bus

vehicles had hand weapons + mounted machine gun + bazookas

 

my colleagues from US (mostly FCC and DoS some DoD) and Canada, were scared shitless, really, every time

a meeting in Ecuador surfaced.

Absolutely no way of getting them to join me in going to the local for a beer, they were genuinely very afraid

and just couldn't wait for getting on a plane out of Ecuador.

 

no unexperienced travelers these guys, very very seasoned travelers, constantly crisscrossing the planet.

 

so I am kinda surprised when I do read (the last few years) that Americans list Ecuador as a retiree place.

Cuenca in particular became very popular after International Living started promoting it many years ago as a top retirement place. It's looks quite attractive to me but haven't had the chance to visit. Particularly the visa offer, the spring like weather, the medical infrastructure, and now a world class mass transit system. 

[mokwit]

If you have never been to S. America I suggest you visit before making any plans to move there. S. America is what it is.

 

P.S. If you don't like being 'the farang' you will like being 'el gringo' even less.

[Jingthing]

6 minutes ago, mokwit said:

If you have never been to S. America I suggest you visit before making any plans to move there. S. America is what it is.

 

P.S. If you don't like being 'the farang' you will like being 'el gringo' even less.

I know exactly what you're saying but it's a mixed bag. In my case, I blend in really well in Latin America and people there are often visually freaked out when they find out I don't speak "much" Spanish (or Portuguese). So on a street stranger level that's kind of fun compared to sticking out. I also think there is a lot of diversity between different specific places in Latin America, just like anywhere. I wouldn't move to Rio even if I could get a visa there. On the other hand I spent about six weeks in Buenos Aires and never felt threatened at all, but of course I wasn't living in the slums.

[mokwit]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

never felt threatened at all, but of course I wasn't living in the slums.

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

 

You are right, S. America is a mixed bag, but in some big cities there is no need to go to the slums because as darkness falls the slums come looking for you.

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I know exactly what you're saying but it's a mixed bag. In my case, I blend in really well in Latin America and people there are often visually freaked out when they find out I don't speak "much" Spanish (or Portuguese). So on a street stranger level that's kind of fun compared to sticking out. I also think there is a lot of diversity between different specific places in Latin America, just like anywhere. I wouldn't move to Rio even if I could get a visa there. On the other hand I spent about six weeks in Buenos Aires and never felt threatened at all, but of course I wasn't living in the slums.

when it comes to Brazil, Argentina and Chile I think that the farther south you get

the more pleasant and foreigner friendly the social environment is.

 

kinda chilly far south in Argentina and Chile though, but the wine is brilliant

[JackThompson]

9 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

... my colleagues from US (mostly FCC and DoS some DoD) and Canada, were scared shitless, really, every time a meeting in Ecuador surfaced.

Those group-events may have been particularly dangerous because of the personnel you describe being present - "high value targets" to the bad-guys.  Mr Expat in flip-flops is less likely to be seen as part of "the political / economic enemy" by some local faction - though might still get held-up for his wallet, if in the wrong place at the wrong time.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Those group-events may have been particularly dangerous because of the personnel you describe being present - "high value targets" to the bad-guys.  Mr Expat in flip-flops is less likely to be seen as part of "the political / economic enemy" by some local faction - though might still get held-up for his wallet, if in the wrong place at the wrong time.

You quoted me but that was NOT my quote! 

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

have been to Ecuador many times, but not since early 2000s, international meetings in one of the two

main cities or in coastal resorts.

each delegate met by armed guards at airport just outside the plane,

followed through immigration and customs then driven to a Sheraton - Hilton or smth like that.

Armed guards in meeting rooms all day

 

when meetings were hosted in coastal resorts we were rounded up at a Hilton/Sheraton

in one of the two main cities,

then early Monday morning off to the resort in buses

armed guards inside each bus

armed vehicles in front of the first bus - between buses - behind the last bus

vehicles had hand weapons + mounted machine gun + bazookas

 

my colleagues from US (mostly FCC and DoS some DoD) and Canada, were scared shitless, really, every time

a meeting in Ecuador surfaced.

Absolutely no way of getting them to join me in going to the local for a beer, they were genuinely very afraid

and just couldn't wait for getting on a plane out of Ecuador.

 

no unexperienced travelers these guys, very very seasoned travelers, constantly crisscrossing the planet.

 

so I am kinda surprised when I do read (the last few years) that Americans list Ecuador as a retiree place.

I backpacked through Ecuador, coming from Peru on my way to Colombia in 1999. I spend there couple of weeks and while I didn't like the country as much as the neighbours, I wasn't feeling afraid. Perhaps because I didn't look like a rich gringo ????

 

Anyway base on my short experience, I wouldn't move there. I could however move to Peru and especially Colombia, which has the nicest people I know. 

[cleverman]

1 hour ago, merlen10002 said:

The Malasian MM2H is just a tad more expensive than Thailand, must have 78,701.95 Bath (10,000 MYR)income per month and put in 2,753,486.57 Bath (350,000 MYR) , Malaysian ladies are very different to Thai ladies very different mind set, Alcohol is frowned on it is a Muslim country.  and Malaysia have four classes of people, Malay 1, Chinese's 2 , Indian 3 and last of all old Farang unless you are a rich Farang, then why would you be in Thailand or Malaysia ???? Anyone that had a problem with getting Embassy letter for income would not have the money to live in Malaysia.     

"Anyone that had a etc".   You are wrong, money going into a Malasian Bank is acceptable, and, some of us have the cash anyway. I research . Regards, Cleverman. 

[melvinmelvin]

9 minutes ago, oilinki said:

I backpacked through Ecuador, coming from Peru on my way to Colombia in 1999. I spend there couple of weeks and while I didn't like the country as much as the neighbours, I wasn't feeling afraid. Perhaps because I didn't look like a rich gringo ????

 

Anyway base on my short experience, I wouldn't move there. I could however move to Peru and especially Colombia, which has the nicest people I know. 

Colombia? Probably one of the most dangerous countries in SA. (when it comes to kidnap/ransom/slaughter)

Been to Bogota umpteen times for talks with a couple ministries,

just can't believe the security measures I was met with from the second I walked off the plane.

 

having said that and having visited most countries in the world 2-3 times,

the only place where I think twice about what I am doing is Nigeria, West Africa

[Jingthing]

Just now, melvinmelvin said:

Colombia? Probably one of the most dangerous countries in SA. (when it comes to kidnap/ransom/slaughter)

Been to Bogota umpteen times for talks with a couple ministries,

just can't believe the security measures I was met with from the second I walked off the plane.

 

having said that and having visited most countries in the world 2-3 times,

the only place where I think twice about what I am doing is Nigeria, West Africa

Medellin has been gaining in popularity. Things change. I'm also interested in Arequipa, Peru. 

[JackThompson]

50 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

You quoted me but that was NOT my quote! 

My apologies.  I must have quoted from within your quote.  By the time I got the page to load, the system will not let me edit it now.

[Small Joke]

I recently spent several months out of LOS, ranging as far afield as South America, doing some boots on the ground research.

My nutshell conclusions are: no other SE Asian country comes close to LOS with all its faults. Caveat! Where you settle in LOS also matters, Pattaya, 'the islands' and Bangkok are really best avoided unless you like paying too much for everything, or you have a chronic need to road test a new 'wife' every three hours, forever.

India? You're having a laugh!

Malaysia, I could deal with it, BUT if you have issues with Islam just remember you'll be hearing amplified calls to prayer constantly. Its also much more expensive than LOS, just to visa qualify. Alcohol is sky high, even given the luxury tax on wine here.

Mexico or Colombia are OK as a lifestyle move, but crime is high, and statistically, you will get rolled at some point, which may or may not be terminal. The rest of it; yeah, nope!

 

There are two -and only two- rules to bear in mind when you go hunting for your own private Idaho:

1. Cheap countries are cheap for a reason, sure the PI is great if you like living behind razor wire, smelling burning trash as you sit down to dinner every single night, dirt roads, joke internet, hospitals where opioid pain relief is more or less illegal, and 'workmanship' far far below even Thai unregulated standards.

2. If you were suddenly forbidden by law to date the local talent, would you STILL want to live there?

And therein lies your answer, gents.

 

 

 

 

[rumak]

9 minutes ago, Small Joke said:

My nutshell conclusions are: no other SE Asian country comes close to LOS with all its faults. 

too long to quote the whole post, but i agree.  I do wish however that some of the posters here would

take their own advice and move....especially the "experts" with the cut and paste snippets who present them as facts for their (lack of) experience.

[Small Joke]

7 minutes ago, rumak said:

too long to quote the whole post, but i agree.  I do wish however that some of the posters here would

take their own advice and move....especially the "experts" with the cut and paste snippets who present them as facts for their (lack of) experience.

Thanks, these are my personal findings, everyone has their own level of risk/reward, and thats OK too.

I left LOS really fed up with the junta, and the rising prices, and I came back a bit humbler, counting my blessings, and on the politics, I wised up, the government don't really touch my little world anyway, other than the annual visa nonsense. Paradise is as much about being happy with yourself, as what is out there.

[Small Joke]

On 11/13/2018 at 9:38 PM, BritManToo said:

And as much cannabis as you can smoke.

You can get that in LOS (and while it may not be 'legal' it is going to be decriminalised very soon, which means a slap on the wrist, not 5 years of rice and fish heads) and its warmer than Canada, and... how many Canucks are in LOS again? ????

[Small Joke]

2 hours ago, mokwit said:

You are right, S. America is a mixed bag, but in some big cities there is no need to go to the slums because as darkness falls the slums come looking for you.

 

 

I was very scared more than a few times in Mexico, and I like to think I know how to make my way with minimal risk in the world.

[Small Joke]

9 hours ago, 1337markus said:

It is. If you could sell your house as quick as you bought it I would be gone to one of those countries. I was in Indonesia a few years ago, they also opened the door for expats to live and buy property.

I was under the impression Indonesia visas for long term not an easy trick.

Also, its too 'pious' and generally backward, compared to Malaysia, for my tastes.

I haven't forgotten how they beheaded ethic Indonesian Chinese (Christians and Taoists) in the street in the 1990s just because the usual suspects felt they had to 'defend gods honour' bloody nut-jobs, no thanks!

[BritManToo]

47 minutes ago, rumak said:

too long to quote the whole post, but i agree.  I do wish however that some of the posters here would

take their own advice and move....especially the "experts" with the cut and paste snippets who present them as facts for their (lack of) experience.

If I wasn't stuck with 2 kids and a house, I'd be off to join my pals in Vietnam (or the Philippines).

I enjoyed both places.

[whitemouse]

6 hours ago, KittenKong said:

 

 

I am not going to buy and furnish another condo, and move my stuff to it, unless I know that I can live in it for at least 10 years.

 

So for me places like Vietnam, attractive as they are, are limited to short-term holiday destinations when I want to get away

 

People on 1 year  retirement extention are happy in Thailand, no doubt. I would be, too.

Problem is Im under, and I think most here are under 50.

It is increasingly difficult to stay here for us, also, for people who do not have, or are not willing to put 800k in Thai bank, hence this thread.

Everyone I  regularly talk to in Pattaya,  single guys, first topic of conversation is where to move, if regime keeps squeezing, and most agree it seems Vietnam. I was just there for 3 weeks, Saigon and Vung Tau, both very livable, and far better than anything in Cambodia, especially now,  Sihanoukville gone.

[whitemouse]

5 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Nicaragua is out for several years from now. Political violence. Expats have fled.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

Also, Malaysia should not be anywhere near that list. 

[JimmyJ]

8 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Brazil was very dangerous for a long time - kidnappings followed by "credit checks" and demands for the entire net-worth of your family for your life - but all that may be changing, with the new administration coming in.  Definitely a place to keep an eye on - though perhaps best to visit after the likely transition-turbulence.

 

 

Brazil is more dangerous than it has been in decades.

Bolsonaro is not like Trump, which is a comparison some try to make to soften his behavior.

He is an outright no holds barred fascist. Glenn Greenwald lives there - read his articles about this subject if you'd like specifics.

[JimmyJ]

8 hours ago, DavidB4 said:

I'm in Cambodia right now and would not recommend it. The food is at least 50% more than it was in Thailand and far less selection, minimal street food. If you have money to eat in a restaurant every night then you'd be OK. Also its getting more and more difficult to get longer visas here. I met a British pensioner who has a Cambodian wife, don't know about the legalities of the marriage...didn't ask, and he has to go home (which he does not want to do) after over 12 years here. 

"The food is at least 50% more than it was in Thailand..."

What city is this?

How are rents in Cambodia and the general attitude towards foreigners? Safety/crime?

[whitemouse]

1 hour ago, Small Joke said:

 

I left LOS really fed up with the junta, and the rising prices, and I came back a bit humbler, counting my blessings, and on the politics, I wised up, the government don't really touch my little world anyway, other than the annual visa nonsense. 

 

Again, annual retirement visa!

 

Why, why, why are you even THINKING about leaving Thailand? You are all set, why even speculate?

[whitemouse]

18 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

Brazil is more dangerous than it has been in decades.

Bolsonaro is not like Trump, which is a comparison some try to make to soften his behavior.

He is an outright no holds barred fascist. Glenn Greenwald lives there - read his articles about this subject if

 

Glenn Greenwald is full blown Marxist now, he belongs to Democracy Now 'news' show, together with Chomsky, both rabid America haters. GGreenwald makes stuff up all the time, his Intercept_ is a bad joke. 

I have no opinion on Brazil, but GG is the last person who's advise to take.

[JimmyJ]

7 hours ago, soleddy said:

Malaysia is very secular, nothing like being in Saudi. It has to be because it is only 75% Moslem, with Chinese malays 20% and Indians the other 5% (very rough figures). I'm going for Xmas, my 15th holiday there, so I do know a fair bit. I can drink as much as I want to...but there is a separate part in the supermarket for Ham and Pork Pies.

Also was surprised to see many obvious gay male hustlers in one spot on main shopping street Bukit Bintang in Kuala Lumpur (and a few fairly obvious female hookers in another area).

[whitemouse]

23 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

"The food is at least 50% more than it was in Thailand..."

What city is this?

How are rents in Cambodia and the general attitude towards foreigners? Safety/crime?

 

Everywhere. 

 

Cambodia is very strange when it comes to food. Nowhere is food so bad, yet weirdly expensive. Street food is twice the cost of Thailand. I'm not foody, but Cambodia street food is close to not edible, unless you like strange greenish colour bowl of  cabbage,  something beteeen a soup and really bad salad. Good for losing weight tho.

[whitemouse]

4 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

Also was surprised to see many obvious gay male hustlers in one spot on main shopping street Bukit Bintang in Kuala Lumpur (and a few fairly obvious female hookers in another area).

Yes, there are even gay bars on KL. But hold hands on the street, and get publicly caned. Sort of like Europe, 15th century, no thanks.