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BANGKOK 18 March 2019 21:15

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After much patience and trouble I have finally managed to get a peppercorn plant to grow. The first young leaves are definitely showing signs of iron deficiency, something that I have not noticed in other plants in the garden. So I need either chelated iron or FeSO4, Ferrous sulphate. The only possibility that I found on Lazada was priced at an outrageous THB 3300.- per unit, probably enough for the whole village.

Annoying is the fact that I did find Osmocote containing Fe and Mg years ago, but 800Km from here.

Any sources please? Chicken/cattle blood was suggested but I'm not too sure if that will be taken up by the plant?

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You should be able to find a litre bottle of micronutrients including Fe at any agri shop.

 

Failing all else, if you've a machine shop close by, ask for some floor sweepings and add the powder filings to the soil, seriously. You'd have to clean the filings. You could also soak them in water and spray with it.

Edited by grollies
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Could also be that you have sufficient iron in the soil and something is preventing your peppercorn taking up iron? But only a soil test is going to tell you that.

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19 hours ago, grollies said:

Could also be that you have sufficient iron in the soil and something is preventing your peppercorn taking up iron? But only a soil test is going to tell you that.

It is a fact that the soil is calcareous, thanks for that idea. I actually took the soil for this plant from another part of the property and put it into a concrete ring,  so unlike the soil otherwise in the garden, I haven't been looking after it. That suggests ferrous sulphate, I'll go one one of my typical Thai Odysseys tomorrow which will doubtless end in either frustration or spending a lot of money.

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Hello again, I think pix's work better than words.

1. Fe-EDTA and Nic 1Kg box

2. Nic  % of trace elements

3. WESCO add & Pn#     Mon-Fri.

4. from WESCO past www.

5. my order from WESCO a few years back

I forgot that the Fe was Bt. 370 from WESCO, I buy it here in Korat for Bt.500.

and save the money transfer cost and EMS costs.

rice555

Fe Nic.jpg

Nic spray.png

WESCO Adds.png

post-37242-0-76923800-1445440658_thumb.png

post-37242-0-24460600-1445440689_thumb.png

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Interveinal chlorosis can also be due to Magnesium and/or Manganese deficiency.  

 

On 11/24/2018 at 1:18 PM, grollies said:

Could also be that you have sufficient iron in the soil and something is preventing your peppercorn taking up iron? But only a soil test is going to tell you that.

This is a right on suggestion!  Only a soil test can take the guess work out of it.  If the soil is calcareous it could very well have an alkaline pH of over 8, which will make iron unavailable no matter how much you add.  

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But of course it is not always practical/affordable to run soil analysis for a small planting.  A complete test for primary and secondary elements plus % soil organic matter, cation exchange capacity and pH runs 3500 baht, plus recommendations Rx for amendments. 

 

If mine and I confirmed high pH with litmus paper or pH test kit, or calcareous (free lime) with a vinegar fizz test . and could not confirm an iron deficiency (because the chlorosis pattern is not definitive that iron is lacking in the soil) and didn't think it was worth it to fork out for a soil report, I would start with a program to lower pH. This can help to make iron and other nutrients more available. 

 

Incorporating compost will begin to help in time. (I saw small bags of 'peat moss' in a Home Pro. peat is more acidic than some other forms of organic matter).  

 

Sulfur is the one fertilizer product that can help to lower pH. Plants need S and it's often neglected in cheap soil tests and fertilization programs.  Soil sulfur is available in Thailand but not commonly used.  I found it in Chiang Mai.  Another way to get S is with the sulfate form of other fertilizer products.  Ammonium sulfate is a good one, N and S, but be careful about over application with this hot form of N and burning. (I fried my malay grass once with a concentration that would have been good for burmuda.)

 

 https://ohioline.osu.edu/factsheet/agf-507

 

FIZZ TEST

https://growabundant.com/preparing-for-a-soil-test/

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17 hours ago, rice555 said:

Hello again, I think pix's work better than words.

1. Fe-EDTA and Nic 1Kg box

2. Nic  % of trace elements

3. WESCO add & Pn#     Mon-Fri.

4. from WESCO past www.

5. my order from WESCO a few years back

I forgot that the Fe was Bt. 370 from WESCO, I buy it here in Korat for Bt.500.

and save the money transfer cost and EMS costs.

rice555

Fe Nic.jpg

Nic spray.png

WESCO Adds.png

post-37242-0-76923800-1445440658_thumb.png

post-37242-0-24460600-1445440689_thumb.png

This is great information.  I was looking at over 10,000 to buy 25 kilo sacks of the 5 micros I want, but really only need small amounts.

 

For soil apps I prefer the sulfate form when available, it is more affordable and also gets you some Sulfur. 

The EDTA form is chelated and good for foliar, or soil-less water soluble fert apps. 

 

Look at the difference in price:  MnSO4 and ZnSO4 at 50 baht per kilo, vs the Cu and Fe EDTAs at 400.  

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20 hours ago, rice555 said:

Hello All, WESCO BKK sells 1Kg bags Fe sulphate(around Bt.150) and Fe EDTA and DPTA for

around Bt.250 a Kg. They have all the single sulphates and the chelated micro's and Nicspray

wich is a complete blend of micro's, for fertigation or folier<sp> spraying.

THE WESCO www. doesn't work, but you can get their phone # off google.

rice555  They will EMS to you!

Thanks.

So I found Fe EDDHA, which is more useful for adding to soils than a as spray, which I don't plan to do. No indication of price. I will ask at the local farmers' shops otherwise will take the potentially doom laden plunge of ordering by phone. 

 

 

Fe EDDHA (2).png

Edited by cooked
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Thanks guys.

I decided to ask my ex-wife to send me a product from Switzerland, the one I used with success on the most stubbornly calcareous soils for Rhododendrons and the like.

It seemed easier!

Gesal Pflanzen Tonik, Fer sous forme de chélates 2,0%, manganèse 3,0%, magnésium 6,0% 

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On 11/29/2018 at 11:20 AM, cooked said:

Thanks guys.

I decided to ask my ex-wife to send me a product from Switzerland, the one I used with success on the most stubbornly calcareous soils for Rhododendrons and the like.

It seemed easier!

Gesal Pflanzen Tonik, Fer sous forme de chélates 2,0%, manganèse 3,0%, magnésium 6,0% 

Well that died a death, the package didn't arrive.

I eventually found, on Lazada: https://www.lazada.co.th/-i227599906-s347985604.html?urlFlag=true&amp;mp=1 which seems to have more nutrients than suggested (Wesco) or the one I wanted from Switzerland. Also much better value.

Th same shop has some other micro-nutrients also. I drenched my pineapples at the same time as recommended, will start a regular spraying program in a week or two

Thanks guys.

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On 1/27/2019 at 11:44 AM, cooked said:

Well that died a death, the package didn't arrive.

I eventually found, on Lazada: https://www.lazada.co.th/-i227599906-s347985604.html?urlFlag=true&amp;mp=1 which seems to have more nutrients than suggested (Wesco) or the one I wanted from Switzerland. Also much better value.

Th same shop has some other micro-nutrients also. I drenched my pineapples at the same time as recommended, will start a regular spraying program in a week or two

Thanks guys.

Check your soil and water pH levels, as alkalininty can affect plant uptake and assimilation of some micronutrients. 

I was getting interveinal chlorosis with some plants in our small garden. I did a full soil analysis a couple of years ago and applied prescription amendments which helped.  But I found the municipal water supply to be at pH 8.0 so continually influencing alkalinity. I am now pumping from a holding tank to which I add some vinegar to neutralize the pH somewhat. i can also fertigate with EM that I am brewing from a commercial concentrate.  I'm mulching with compost which helps acidify, and my homemade fertilizer blend has natural sulfates (gypsum /CaSO4, epsom salts /MgSO4, and sulfate of potash/K2SO4), which provide Sulfur as well as the primary cations, and this helps balance the chemistry. My dry fert blend also contains Azomite for volcanic trace minerals and Agrolig humates (from Evolare's wife's bonemeal.net organic farming supplies.  Garden and house plants are coming around with better color, healthy growth, and good pest/disease resistance. 

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Unfortunately, I have not been visiting the forum lately, I just saw this.

In Thailand, most things are available but hard to find. 

My orange trees occasionally run into iron deficiency with yellowing leaves, the below one-liter bottle lasts quite a long time, its supposed to be sprayed, but works quite well just by adding one cap on the ground, before watering. B 280, I buy it in a shop in Pak Chong; I am sure it is available in other areas as well. If you need the phone number, please PM me.

 

 

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10 hours ago, soidog2 said:

Unfortunately, I have not been visiting the forum lately, I just saw this.

In Thailand, most things are available but hard to find. 

My orange trees occasionally run into iron deficiency with yellowing leaves, the below one-liter bottle lasts quite a long time, its supposed to be sprayed, but works quite well just by adding one cap on the ground, before watering. B 280, I buy it in a shop in Pak Chong; I am sure it is available in other areas as well. If you need the phone number, please PM me.

 

 

IMG_0966.JPG

IMG_0967.JPG

Yes that looks like a good one, thanks. I went to what I thought was a good farmers and horticultural shop and their eyes glazed over when I asked about iron nutrients. The stuff I bought from Lazada as mentioned above seems to be working already, I am just confused as to why iron is such an important nutrient (for plants AND humans) and so difficult to find in Thailand. I could buy off supermarket shelves back home.

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