No Letter and no Money

[giddyup]

 

I've half a mind to believe you

Play the cards you were dealt.

[overherebc]

 

I don't think anyone will have to bother about your'e last sentence.

There are too many influential people making plenty of money for it ever to get stomped on.

You may be right but at the moment no-one actually knows how things are going to pan out.

[NoshowJones]

 

If you believe my comments are condescending then your outlook between what are the harsh realities of life and seeing everything through rose tinting glasses are warped.

 

Over the last few months several of my expat acquaintances have asked me to help top up their savings in ways of loans to total 800000 baht to obtain their retirement extensions. I have flatly refused saying I am not going to leave myself vulnerable for people who have decided to settle in Thailand without proper planning and would advise anyone else to do the same. The odds are that these loans would not be paid back and even if they were, if helping these people for one time, it`s going to be the same for the following years when they come cap in hand asking for more assistance, a vicious circle.

 

I have a retired cousin in England who was considering retiring in Thailand, following in my footsteps. I know he only receives a basic UK State pension with not much in savings and advised him not to come here except for a holiday and why. Luckily he has common sense and took my advice as I would advise others in similar situations.

 

The world is becoming a tougher place and very much more money orientated. I am forever telling my children to start paying into pension funds now and start saving for their old age, as old age looms quicker then many young people think. Will they listen? I don`t know for sure.

 

I have pity for elderly people that suddenly find themselves in financial dire straights during the last stages of their lives when they should be living a lifestyle of ease and plenty, especially when the powers that be decide to move the goal posts. But sorry to say no one is going to pull them out and others should heed these warnings and not live their lives on chance alone. That the reality and thus is life. Take my comments anyway you like, nothings going to change.

 

 

Can you imagine the average state pensioner in the UK, with highly over the top electric bills to pay and a TV licence also to pay until he's 75, and probably council tax too etc.

If he is not a drinker or womaniser. he would be better off here. Oh! wait, he would also be better using an address in the UK for obvious reasons.????

[dotpoom]

 

 

This list includes some very nice countries that make it easy for a person wanting to immigrate.

 

Just use a little navigation.

 

http://www.immigrationdo.com/easiest-countries-for-immigration/

 

When I opened the link I thought...Great!...this will be interesting. I soon discovered though one would need the patients of Jove ..to stick with it (which I don't have unfortunately).

  Maybe will give another go later. Thanks though.

 

[pastprime]

Id say for UK farang it is easy to see the outcome,reducing pension in real terms,battered by low GBP,then health worries on top. I feel sorry for those who bought property here years ago,sank a ton of money in what they thought would be an investment,in essence a massive lead weight,not a hope in hell of getting anything back ,immigration making a noose that tightens.

    Cut the losses worries too,and head for Canaries is all I'm planning,but have another 12 months starting January,but not holding out any hope

[totally thaied up]

 

Play the cards you were dealt.

Never a truer word said ...

[JackThompson]

 

It was my understanding that a retiree that is unmarried needs to deposit, on a monthly basis, 65000 Baht into a Thai bank. If the retiree is married to a Thai, then the amount is 40000 Baht (or a combination of pension funds and income from spouse).

 

When it comes to renewing the extension of stay, the retiree will need to prove to the IO that the appropriate amount of funds have been deposited in a Thai bank. A bank statement covering 12 months of deposits will be sufficient to prove this.

Some statements by the Brit and US embassies have implied this, but no official word from the top that an extension-of-stay may be obtained based on income, without an embassy-letter. 

 

 

I do not see what the hoopla is all about.

Uncertainty, due to no official statement confirming what you outlined.  Even that hopeful-outcome is more difficult than was legally-required for the income-letters - which were based on the "total-income" of the visitor.  This scenario raises the bar to "net imported income" - but would still be better than nothing, reducing the number who could be forced out.

 

 

He plans ahead does not need my money.

  What i do not understand is if he plans ahead how did this come about?

Planning ahead does not always work out as planned.  In this context, when one's income-based means of obtaining a permitted stay, which was "A-OK" for years, vanishes with little warning - even though you still have the required gross-income.

 

19 hours ago, Ctkong said:

I think those foreigners are pushing the envelope until the shit hit the fan and then it is time to go home. It is good while it last though... a last fling .

Somewhere else, if need be - but unlikely, "home".  Like the OP asked, basically, "Where To Next?"  If he is like me, the "passport-country" is far down the list of "next options."

Edited December 3, 2018 by JackThompson

[JLCrab]

 

If you are old and seriously ill one should have the good manners to die as cheaply as possible,

The flip-side from NY Times:

IF YOU MAKE it to your 65th birthday in the U.S. today, you can expect about 20 more years and have a good chance at 30. The fastest-growing segment of the population, in fact, is between the ages of 85 and 94.

[soalbundy]

 

You may be right but at the moment no-one actually knows how things are going to pan out.

sounds like life to me

[Olmate]

 

Get hit by a bus in oz and your flown by chopper. Have a stoke or anything requiring icu your free and immediate

Try paying for your hospital bill here? Your looking at 2 million baht +++I doubt you have good insurance.. Simply impossible on your pension.

 

Who eats in a pub every night? Pub grub is the same price here.. Meat and Veges and wine are cheaper in oz . Rent is affordable in small towns

 

You can't pick and choose. So your talking utter rubbish

 

Guess we,ll have to give up ,the beef I guess you mean to say, your wrong about  veggies and who drinks wine! Patong I eat restraunt meal for 200 baht ,and please tell us one or two small towns you would recommend where rents are 10,000 baht per month with electric water n wifi. 

[NoshowJones]

 

You may be right but at the moment no-one actually knows how things are going to pan out.

I don't think it matters too much how things are going to pan out, certain people will not lose their income streams.

[soalbundy]

 

The flip-side from NY Times:

IF YOU MAKE it to your 65th birthday in the U.S. today, you can expect about 20 more years and have a good chance at 30. The fastest-growing segment of the population, in fact, is between the ages of 85 and 94.

Life expectancy in the US is going down, drug abuse and suicides. Once you start with serious illnesses at an advanced age it's better not to bother, it's about quality not longevity, but every one to his own. Overweight, diabetic with a weak heart and scared of dying, living off of the daily doses of medicine wouldn't be my thing, I would love to have a goodbye pill even though I am fit and healthy, just in case.

[Olmate]

 

Get hit by a bus in oz and your flown by chopper. Have a stoke or anything requiring icu your free and immediate

Try paying for your hospital bill here? Your looking at 2 million baht +++I doubt you have good insurance.. Simply impossible on your pension.

 

Who eats in a pub every night? Pub grub is the same price here.. Meat and Veges and wine are cheaper in oz . Rent is affordable in small towns

 

You can't pick and choose. So your talking utter rubbish

 

Guess we,ll have to give up ,the beef I guess you mean to say, your wrong about  veggies and who drinks wine! Patong I eat restraunt meal for 200 baht ,and please tell us one or two small towns you would recommend where rents are 10,000 baht per month with electric water n wifi. 

[JLCrab]

The NY Times said that IF you make it to 65 ...

[DogNo1]

I have a lot of sympathy for retirees who now can't meet the minimum income requirements.  Twenty years ago, Thailand was very appealing for its low cost of living.  I have enough retirement income to meet the requirements but that is because my Japanese health insurance paid for treatment of my throat cancer and my recovery from a serious motorcycle accident so I was able to save for retirement and to qualify for a Japanese pension.  There has been a lot of tragedy in my family. My mother, stepfather, eldest sister and her husband all died of cancer in near poverty.   My youngest sister has been psychiatrically disabled all of her life and recently had a stroke so she requires 24-hour care. Her two children and my middle sister must take turns staying with her because her nursing home is understaffed and doesn't provide adequate care.  Medicare in America has gaps in care.  My daughter's uncle-in-law recently died of cancer in a lot of pain because his elderly wife couldn't risk losing all of her savings for a co-payment on another course of chemotherapy.  So Medicare in America isn't adequate for those who can't afford the supplemental insurance.  The financial situation of many people depends on luck.

I have been hoping that Thai Immigration will realize that many people have been living on less than 65,000 per month and will grandfather them in somehow.  Lacking that, paying an agent would seem to be the solution for a while although fees will inevitably go up.

 

So far as other places for retirees to live, there are many retiree communities around the world including Mexico, Costa Rica, etc.  Moving would be a chore though.  It will require ingenuity for the retirees whose income is below the present Thai requirements to find a solution.  Good luck to all!

[DrJack54]

Think as usual the thread after x pages has little to do with the OP.

I posted "use an agent" about post #3. Prob about 20k, maybe less. As a side idea I thought..umm I might lend the op 800k for 3 months. I thought (if I knew him) I could accept 10%. Ha...it amounts to 20k cost to him. So plan A is the one, for op situation if the embassy letter pans out sadly. Personally I think its just a glitch. 

[soalbundy]

 

Think as usual the thread after x pages has little to do with the OP.

I posted "use an agent" about post #3. Prob about 20k, maybe less. As a side idea I thought..umm I might lend the op 800k for 3 months. I thought (if I knew him) I could accept 10%. Ha...it amounts to 20k cost to him. So plan A is the one, for op situation if the embassy letter pans out sadly. Personally I think its just a glitch. 

so do I, a blip on the radar screen of life, the technicians are already at work on it, if not at full speed. No need to worry yourself into the grave, that will come all by itself.

[madmen]

Guess we,ll have to give up ,the beef I guess you mean to say, your wrong about  veggies and who drinks wine! Patong I eat restraunt meal for 200 baht ,and please tell us one or two small towns you would recommend where rents are 10,000 baht per month with electric water n wifi. 

https://www.domain.com.au/rent/?ptype=apartment&price=0-150&ssubs=1&excludedeposittaken=1 Plenty and add rent assistance and your your not far off 10k

 

I never used a/c in oz. WiFi isn't free here either

 

Who drinks wine? Not many here that's for sure!

 

When Was the last time you you had lamb chops and a block of aged cheddar? Or Spanish salami. You better check the price of Veges in ALDI On line. High quality and cheaper

 

Food is cheap here because it's 80% boiled rice or noodles with slivers of meat. Processed crap

 

And the oz dollar continues its relentless slide south. Soon enough your 200 baht meal will be luxury

 

But your ignoring the elephant in the room.

 

ONE major operation that keeps you in icu for extended periods is 2 million baht!!

Go fund me only works with young tourists but not crusty old pensioners

 

Factor that in and get back to us on your budget. And what if it happens twice lol....

 

 

 

 

 

[roger101]

Well not a lot of advice about what country (or what area) but an awful lot about money. I probably should have a little bit more information. So here goes.

I have been on a retirement extension for 11 years. I am married but have never bothered to use that as I thought it was too much hassle. If I move anywhere I wont be taking the wife (there is no way she would leave her grandchildren) so I want somewhere near to travel back here quite often.  

With reference to Medical Problems I have a private policy which will cover me for any mayor (urgent) problems.

PS It costs me 147,000 Baht a year (one of the reasons I never be able to raise 400,000 Baht).

[ozmeldo]

 

Agree. Too many posters make assumptions on pensioners without knowing anything. Cannot speak for other countries pensioners, but many of the US retired military pensioners living month to month have fairly decent monthly incomes, especially, if also getting SS benefits. Retired military get very good medical Tricare benefits overseas. Others may have insurance plans as well. Its not the monthly income that is hard to live on, it's having a chunk of money sitting idle in the bank above what they need to live on. That's why the monthly income method is needed. Everyone should work together to solve the current situation.

Fair enough but if it's so damned great then why can't they salt away 50k a month? Year and a half they're done.

 

Oh bc old codgers stuck in their ways....oh well. What's their next step bc this shitz goin down. Truly no sympathy, we all have our crosses to bear.

[ubonjoe]

 

Well not a lot of advice about what country (or what area) but an awful lot about money. I probably should have a little bit more information. So here goes.

I have been on a retirement extension for 11 years. I am married but have never bothered to use that as I thought it was too much hassle. If I move anywhere I wont be taking the wife (there is no way she would leave her grandchildren) so I want somewhere near to travel back here quite often.  

With reference to Medical Problems I have a private policy which will cover me for any mayor (urgent) problems.

PS It costs me 147,000 Baht a year (one of the reasons I never be able to raise 400,000 Baht).

At this time you do still have the 40k baht income option for an extension based upon marriage.

Another option that was mentioned earlier is to get multiple entry non-o visa based upon marriage at the consulate in Savannakhet Laos. No financial proof is needed to get it. It means leaving the country every 90 day for a entry unless you apply for a 60 day extension to visit your wife.

No need to leave and stay in another country.

[Ulic]

Either the Philippines or Vietnam. Both are inexpensive and friendly. Whether developments in Thailand sort themselves out or not you should check out both these countries as possible alternatives. Like Thailand, both countries offer strengths and weaknesses so it is really up to you. 

Vietnam -cheap, retirement friendly, friendly population, cleaner than Thailand.

Thailand- Nightlife, infrastructure including hospitals and western level shopping, an abundance of western level accommodation, pain in the ass hoop jumping for legal immigration status.

The Philippines- Poor infrastructure, including roads, hospitals, availability accommodation, on the positive side English is more widely spoken, cheap, good nightlife, easy immigration extensions.

No one country is perfect, it just depends on how you personally weight the positives and negatives.   

[Lacessit]

 

https://www.domain.com.au/rent/?ptype=apartment&price=0-150&ssubs=1&excludedeposittaken=1 

Plenty and add rent assistance and your your not far off 10k

 

I never used a/c in oz. WiFi isn't free here either

 

Who drinks wine? Not many here that's for sure!

 

When Was the last time you you had lamb chops and a block of aged cheddar? Or Spanish salami. You better check the price of Veges in ALDI On line. High quality and cheaper

 

Food is cheap here because it's 80% boiled rice or noodles with slivers of meat. Processed crap

 

But your ignoring the elephant in the room.

 

ONE major operation that keeps you in icu for extended periods is 2 million baht!!

Go fund me only works with young tourists but not crusty old pensioners

 

Factor that in and get back to us on your budget. And what if it happens twice lol....

 

 

 

I can point you to the most delicious spaghetti marinara or pork tenderloin in Chiang Mai for a fraction of the cost in Australia. However, I won't, because it would be casting pearls before swine.

You seem to be obsessing about the risk of a serious ailment here. What if it never happens?

Wine? Who cares when good whisky here is about half the cost of the cheapest brands in Oz?

Who gives a shit about lamb chops or cheddar? My GF makes a sweet and sour that would knock your socks off.

Keep crapping on, you are very entertaining. You've obviously never heard of the advice when you are in a hole, it's a good idea to stop digging.

[thaibreaker]

 

If you have a wife here head to Malaysia, you can do visa runs their no problem and I think you get 3 months at a time. I did. No problems what so ever. Then you can hop into Thailand when you want for a visit. The bad thing is you will have problems with a Thai wife or GF there. Mine only got one month, and had to stay out for one week before she could return.

 

Penang is a lovely place to hang your hat. Great food, and public transportation is great. Much better than Thailand IMO.

Best of luck to you.

The visa situation is not correct. I do know, as I have just been there over a long time.

 

In Malaysia you will get 90 days visa free stay maybe a couple of times, then you need to stay out of the country for a few weeks, or go back to your home country, before they grant you one more. If one thinks of staying indefinitely, there is the option of "second home visa", a 10 year visa, but they have roughly the same requirement as Thailand, with money in the bank.

 

They have indeed tightened up lately, the last few years, and the IOs are now sending these messages out. I got that after just one 90 days stay, and even stayed in Vietnam for 5 days before returning to Malaysia. They don`t like visa- or borderruns anymore.

 

Yes, Malaysia is a nice place, and Penang as you say is an okey place to live (although Langkawi is better imo), but I will not recommend it for the OP.

 

The reason is this is mostly a muslim country, and very different from other countries in the region or in Asia generally. With all that means of pros and cons. Daily prayers from loud speakers around the country 6-8 times a day (starting at 5.30 in the morning..), and about 70% of all ladies wearing hijab, niqab or burka. 

 

I will never get used to that myself, honestly.

 

So I would probably choose the Philippines or Vietnam to live, if I was the OP.

[madmen]

I can point you to the most delicious spaghetti marinara or pork tenderloin in Chiang Mai for a fraction of the cost in Australia. However, I won't, because it would be casting pearls before swine.
You seem to be obsessing about the risk of a serious ailment here. What if it never happens?
Wine? Who cares when good whisky here is about half the cost of the cheapest brands in Oz?
Who gives a shit about lamb chops or cheddar? My GF makes a sweet and sour that would knock your socks off.
Keep crapping on, you are very entertaining. You've obviously never heard of the advice when you are in a hole, it's a good idea to stop digging.

https://www.theurbanlist.com/sydney/a-list/sydneys-best-cheap-eats-under-10

Plenty of cheap eats under 300 baht and that's in Sydney! Your not real big on research

"what if bad health never happens"?

You better look for Sheryls posts on the probability of it HAPPENING. Only a total moron would think it won't happen to them and have zero funds to pay it in a 3rd world country.

Good luck with your life because your going to need plenty of it... Perhaps a dozen amulets may help. [emoji23]

[marcusarelus]

 

https://www.domain.com.au/rent/?ptype=apartment&price=0-150&ssubs=1&excludedeposittaken=1 Plenty and add rent assistance and your your not far off 10k

 

I never used a/c in oz. WiFi isn't free here either

 

Who drinks wine? Not many here that's for sure!

 

When Was the last time you you had lamb chops and a block of aged cheddar? Or Spanish salami. You better check the price of Veges in ALDI On line. High quality and cheaper

 

Food is cheap here because it's 80% boiled rice or noodles with slivers of meat. Processed crap

 

And the oz dollar continues its relentless slide south. Soon enough your 200 baht meal will be luxury

 

But your ignoring the elephant in the room.

 

ONE major operation that keeps you in icu for extended periods is 2 million baht!!

Go fund me only works with young tourists but not crusty old pensioners

 

Factor that in and get back to us on your budget. And what if it happens twice lol....

I have insurance through USA military VA.  Thai Hospital will direct bill.  So major operation is not my elephant.  New house AC 14,000 per month.  Electricity and water and best 3bb Internet 4,000 baht.  I'm a crusty old pensioner eating brie cheese and Waygu beef, fresh mozzerala cheese and Italian salami on my home made pizze (yup I have pizza oven).   I use AC every day as I watch football on my 65 inch Sony sports sound TV.  No, I'm not an Aussie.  I have lots of money in a Thai bank.  "We are delighted to renew your Bauluang Exclusive Membership and have sent your new card.........????

[Olmate]

 

https://www.domain.com.au/rent/?ptype=apartment&price=0-150&ssubs=1&excludedeposittaken=1 Plenty and add rent assistance and your your not far off 10k

 

I never used a/c in oz. WiFi isn't free here either

 

Who drinks wine? Not many here that's for sure!

 

When Was the last time you you had lamb chops and a block of aged cheddar? Or Spanish salami. You better check the price of Veges in ALDI On line. High quality and cheaper

 

Food is cheap here because it's 80% boiled rice or noodles with slivers of meat. Processed crap

 

And the oz dollar continues its relentless slide south. Soon enough your 200 baht meal will be luxury

 

But your ignoring the elephant in the room.

 

ONE major operation that keeps you in icu for extended periods is 2 million baht!!

Go fund me only works with young tourists but not crusty old pensioners

 

Factor that in and get back to us on your budget. And what if it happens twice lol....

 

 

 

 

 

G! Not sure about your real estate suggestions I like.$100 a week for self contained apartment with power ,water and cable I.net, 5 min walk to beach...not possible at any stretch in back a beyond buggerup even. Your assessment of Thai food is pretty revealing too but each to his own. Dont see a lot of undernourished people here tho , maybe just where you live.Ozzie dollar don’t worry me,turn it into baht and it’s gold .Suggest you make a trip back and just check how far a pineapple will get you.Finally if you die ,pretty sure it won,t be twice , here or there don’t matter ,insurance is a big no at my age but I can pay my way thanks. ...Lucky coz I’m too crusty for ,go fund me,....Might just take a Bex!

[rosst]

 

I would give serious consideration to the Philippines - good English and easy/friendly people with costs for most things at or below Thailand (hotels/rent however may be a bit more).  Much like Thailand was a decade or two ago. Tourist visa can be extended one, 3, 6 months up to 3 years before a day outside country is required to start again and this does not seem likely to change.  If marry local and arrive together automatic 1 year stay.  They do have good medical facilities but would not be free as UK. 

 

Cambodia is also popular but almost no medical care available - but visas not a problem at this time (it has recently changed a bit however).  

I took the challenge of the Philippines and four years on, I am happy with the move, look to the provinces, Manila and Cebu are not too nice, places like Dumaguete are full of foreigners and all the things they like, I like the rural scene like Isaan so I am in Sipalay City Negros Occidental Philippines. 

[madmen]

G! Not sure about your real estate suggestions I like.$100 a week for self contained apartment with power ,water and cable I.net, 5 min walk to beach...not possible at any stretch in back a beyond buggerup even. Your assessment of Thai food is pretty revealing too but each to his own. Dont see a lot of undernourished people here tho , maybe just where you live.Ozzie dollar don’t worry me,turn it into baht and it’s gold .Suggest you make a trip back and just check how far a pineapple will get you.Finally if you die ,pretty sure it won,t be twice , here or there don’t matter ,insurance is a big no at my age but I can pay my way thanks. ...Lucky coz I’m too crusty for ,go fund me,....Might just take a Bex!

Who said anything about dying? It's them keeping you alive and milking you for millions of baht. I'm not sure if your getting it.

 

If your never going to be sick or involved in accidents then no need to reply to my posts.

 

 

And how is the converting a crashing oz dollar " gold" its not even bronze!

[watcharacters]

 

When I opened the link I thought...Great!...this will be interesting. I soon discovered though one would need the patients of Jove ..to stick with it (which I don't have unfortunately).

  Maybe will give another go later. Thanks though.

 

 

Yeah the link is similar to the OutBrain click through articles.

 

But I question if it comes anywhere near requiring  the patience you suggest.    Regardless, for a person seeking information about immigration possibilities I thing the link is very worthwhile