Grouse Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 Whether you agree with Heseltine's stance, there is no arguing that he is a statesman. We need more parliamentarians of his calibre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 The Economist is right as usual https://www.economist.com/britain/2018/11/15/the-case-for-another-vote-on-brexit-is-gaining-strength Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyf Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 14 hours ago, aright said: Cheap and nasty rubbish? China manufactures 1.1 billion mobile phones; You can bring in any distraction you want. My niece has been at uni in China for nearly 6 years and during that time has brought home a variety of gadgets and the like, none of which lasted any time, even a mobile phone for my wife, battery lasted about 6 months. All she ever brought that was any good was the food items. I have had potato crisps from the UK, caviar and cheese items from Russia and various fish/seafood items from Denmark. She can buy these products in China at a fraction of the price that they would be sold in the country of origin, wonderful tool Google. Maybe you can explain how companies selling their products at ridiculously low prices can be good business for anyone other than the Chinese. What many people do not understand is that companies are prepared to "buy" business in a large cheap economy to get the turnover and then try and recover profit from the domestic market with increased prices. It is not only the food sector, a company I worked for making capital equipment did it. It is fairly obvious that distance makes a product less competitive unless something gives. It is in the interests of UK consumers that exporters do business with Europe rather than in the Asian markets. These trade deals all around the world may benefit some but certainly not the man in the street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aright Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 11 hours ago, sandyf said: You can bring in any distraction you want. My niece has been at uni in China for nearly 6 years and during that time has brought home a variety of gadgets and the like, none of which lasted any time, even a mobile phone for my wife, battery lasted about 6 months. All she ever brought that was any good was the food items. I have had potato crisps from the UK, caviar and cheese items from Russia and various fish/seafood items from Denmark. She can buy these products in China at a fraction of the price that they would be sold in the country of origin, wonderful tool Google. Maybe you can explain how companies selling their products at ridiculously low prices can be good business for anyone other than the Chinese. What many people do not understand is that companies are prepared to "buy" business in a large cheap economy to get the turnover and then try and recover profit from the domestic market with increased prices. It is not only the food sector, a company I worked for making capital equipment did it. It is fairly obvious that distance makes a product less competitive unless something gives. It is in the interests of UK consumers that exporters do business with Europe rather than in the Asian markets. These trade deals all around the world may benefit some but certainly not the man in the street. What distraction are you referring to. I give you the manufacturing statistics and my opinion on a country which I visit on business and socially at least once a year to visit companies I deal with, and 2 opinionated British civil servant friends who live there and you counter with the product experience of yourself and a young girl and a bad battery. When did you last take a business trip to China ? The China you describe existed three or four decades ago. Explain how companies sell their products at ridiculously low prices. It’s called brand establishment and low prices are used to cajole the customer in to buying the product in the hope they will like and repeat purchase. When I made the decision to sell into Europe I did it on the basis of lower cost than existing alternatives......what other reasons would they have to purchase, their specifications and trade terms were established. Product was sold at a significantly lower margin than I was happy with but that was a cost I was prepared to pay to get into the market. It costs money to develop a brand and you can’t develop it until you have a foothold in the market. The point you miss is, once established in the market, and you have had a positive response to the value of your product the chances are you can over time give the product value plus and incrementally raise prices to give you your required margin, or if as you say distance is a problem, move production to effect savings. Many Companies Mercedes, Air Bus etc are already doing it. Sales volumes will soon tell you if your prices are too high. As for recovering these costs by increasing the costs to domestic customers that is ridiculous a...…your competitors would take advantage of your high charges and b UK industry is not cartelized. These costs are financed by a development budget in most companies. It is in my business interest and the interests of UK consumers that exporters do business with the rest of the world; EU, Asia, USA, RSA, SA, etc....that means Brexit. I run two businesses and neither one is run for the benefit of the man in the street I leave that to Oxfam, the Salvation Army etc. although it’s arguable they follow your policy; that’s a business concept I and all the businesses I know don’t embrace and I make no apology for it. If you want businesses to operate on the benefit to man principle, I can’t advise you where to move to; the USSR was defunct many years ago. China still has advantages that cheaper countries don't: tight and well-sourced supply chains, efficient transportation logistics, modern ports, and an enormous domestic market that, if all goes according to their plan, will start buying a lot more of the goods that China produces. Let's hope Chinese businesses and the man in the street develops a taste for UK products as well. They are by no means perfect but they are the future and we deny them at our peril. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandyf Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 10 hours ago, aright said: What distraction are you referring to. I give you the manufacturing statistics and my opinion on a country which I visit on business and socially at least once a year to visit companies I deal with, and 2 opinionated British civil servant friends who live there and you counter with the product experience of yourself and a young girl and a bad battery. When did you last take a business trip to China ? The China you describe existed three or four decades ago. Explain how companies sell their products at ridiculously low prices. It’s called brand establishment and low prices are used to cajole the customer in to buying the product in the hope they will like and repeat purchase. When I made the decision to sell into Europe I did it on the basis of lower cost than existing alternatives......what other reasons would they have to purchase, their specifications and trade terms were established. Product was sold at a significantly lower margin than I was happy with but that was a cost I was prepared to pay to get into the market. It costs money to develop a brand and you can’t develop it until you have a foothold in the market. The point you miss is, once established in the market, and you have had a positive response to the value of your product the chances are you can over time give the product value plus and incrementally raise prices to give you your required margin, or if as you say distance is a problem, move production to effect savings. Many Companies Mercedes, Air Bus etc are already doing it. Sales volumes will soon tell you if your prices are too high. As for recovering these costs by increasing the costs to domestic customers that is ridiculous a...…your competitors would take advantage of your high charges and b UK industry is not cartelized. These costs are financed by a development budget in most companies. It is in my business interest and the interests of UK consumers that exporters do business with the rest of the world; EU, Asia, USA, RSA, SA, etc....that means Brexit. I run two businesses and neither one is run for the benefit of the man in the street I leave that to Oxfam, the Salvation Army etc. although it’s arguable they follow your policy; that’s a business concept I and all the businesses I know don’t embrace and I make no apology for it. If you want businesses to operate on the benefit to man principle, I can’t advise you where to move to; the USSR was defunct many years ago. China still has advantages that cheaper countries don't: tight and well-sourced supply chains, efficient transportation logistics, modern ports, and an enormous domestic market that, if all goes according to their plan, will start buying a lot more of the goods that China produces. Let's hope Chinese businesses and the man in the street develops a taste for UK products as well. They are by no means perfect but they are the future and we deny them at our peril. I will bow to your superior knowledge, you are obviously quite right that the UK consumers will be more than happy to accept rising prices so that far flung nations can enjoy the same products at a much lower price. It is companies with that attitude that have caused this problem, pushing up prices and then blaming the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aright Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 5 hours ago, sandyf said: I will bow to your superior knowledge, you are obviously quite right that the UK consumers will be more than happy to accept rising prices so that far flung nations can enjoy the same products at a much lower price. It is companies with that attitude that have caused this problem, pushing up prices and then blaming the EU. You make it sound too simple. Cars and computers and wine in Thailand are far more expensive than their European counterparts...……...nothing to do with the manufacturers. Cigarettes in the UK are more expensive than most countries....nothing to do with the manufacturers. If you find price advantage an unacceptable way to develop overseas markets and products how would you propose it be done so as not to offend the man in the street in the UK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beautifulthailand99 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 On 1/3/2019 at 1:56 AM, evadgib said: Yet you'd all find him hilarious and informative if batting for the other side. No he's a You Tube bore either way....thank god they have demonetised most of the tiddler accounts gives them less reason to spout now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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