UK PM May's government loses contempt vote over Brexit legal advice

[Retiredandhappyhere]

14 hours ago, NanLaew said:

From the very start, the PM has been batting on a sticky wicket, I am surprised that May and her dwindling band of sycophants, including those shady buggers, horse-trading under a "confidence and supply" mandate have gotten this far.

 

We are all aware of the ramifications of this parliamentary wool-pulling exercise and I reckon May's remaining days in office are now seriously under threat. Then the snap election and the likelihood of replacing one Grinch with another, just in time for Christmas? No... I don't think ANYONE wants that but keep in mind that our politicians don't really give a fig about what ANYONE wants.

 

But beyond all this hair-on-fire rhetoric, what do we want to see as the ultimate goal here? A renegotiated Brexit agreement that holds the EU's feet to some hypothetical fire? Or a no-deal exit or "extreme Brexit" as the BoE's badly chosen leader chose to arbitrarily think out loud... again. Or a second 'I've changed my mind' referendum?

 

Keep in mind that the British voters, myself included, have been mostly sleep-walking through the last 2 and half years of rinse-and-repeat and were quite happy just to let the government bureaucrats, technocrats and associated hangers-on from Westminster and Brussels "just get on with it" with regard to leaving the EU. Now and only now do some see that there has been some pretty open duplicity and circular talking from No 10? The only parallels I can draw is a similar and as yet un-reported lack of care and attention being paid by the electorate of the EU member countries to the 'deal' that THEIR elected leaders are selling them.

 

Anyway, I reckon the DUP takes the biscuit for duplicity.

If the DUP do reject the deal on offer, surely the most likely outcome will be a "no deal" scenario, which will leave Northern Ireland in exactly the position which the DUP are fighting tooth and nail to avoid.  Those people hoping for a reversal of Section 50, based on the "non-binding" advice of the European Court of Justice, will be disappointed and so will the EU.

[7by7]

13 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

I ask you this...are these British children..are they with their parents??? or are they non British???
Imo..charity begins at home..you take care of your own first and foremost before anyone else.
Perhaps if Blair and Co had not opened the flood-gates re immigration and also had not got involved in an imo illegal war, things would be a lot better re housing..nhs..etc.??

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 Most are British and with at least one of their parents. Most are not living rough but are in temporary accommodation, hostels or B&Bs.

 

See 130,000 homeless children to be in temporary lodgings over Christmas

 

But what this has to do with Brexit is beyond me; unless people are blaming the EU for homelessness in the UK!

[baboon]

2 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Imo..a lot worse than that is the fact that over 5% of homeless/rough sleepers in the UK are former members of H.M.Armed Forces!!!

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Disgusting conduct, don't get me wrong. Let it be a lesson to all young (wo)men making the decision to serve - Your country actually doesn't give a crap about you. You will be chewed up and spat out while your masters are clinking their flutes of Champagne together and toasting world peace, sniggering all the while...

[baboon]

1 hour ago, malagateddy said:

I ask you this...are these British children..are they with their parents??? or are they non British???
Imo..charity begins at home..you take care of your own first and foremost before anyone else.
Perhaps if Blair and Co had not opened the flood-gates re immigration and also had not got involved in an imo illegal war, things would be a lot better re housing..nhs..etc.??

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Perfectly valid. But Blair is long gone. We remain in Afghanistan and the Middle East fighting ISIS, or the other guys who aren't ISIS but who are evil personified....Why? 

[Basil B]

21 hours ago, marko kok prong said:

Why the hell do they persist in calling MP's lawmakers.

  Simplified English for our American cousins. 

[tebee]

Brexit poll shows growing number believe Leave vote was a mistake

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e90472e2-f81b-11e8-a7ad-f292e75f50c3

 

It found that 49 per cent thought Britain was wrong to vote to leave, the highest figure to date, while 38 per cent believed that Britain was right to choose to leave, a new low. This 11-point gap is the largest YouGov has had for the wrong decision having been made.

[Basil B]

19 hours ago, vogie said:

It would seem the House of Commons disagrees with you. This is a paragraph from the petition that was signed againgst a second referendum, it came in my email today, if I can find a way to link it to TV I will. It does make interesting reading.

 

"Stop possible second referendum on E.U. membership. There is a growing band of people that want to reverse the result of the democratic vote of this country to leave the European Union and are calling for a second referendum. This is mainly by the people that lost the vote two years ago and cannot accept the democratic vote of the majority decision. Although not legally binding the referendum on whether we stay or leave the EU carried out on the 23rd June 2016 was the clearest indication of the will of the electorate. At that time our Prime Minister David Cameron assured us that the result of the referendum would be carried out. We must ensure the democracy rules”.

Brexiteers running scared...

 

The first referendum was based on misinformation, dodgy money, in a BBC investigation in to Arron Banks companies that bankrolled the Leave campaign to the tune of £8 million believed to be Russian money.  BBC finds big irregularities and stonewalling of documents that should be available for public inspection, and even goes on to imply links to Ural Properties that overlook the entrance to Portsmouth navel base may have been used by the Russians to spy on us.

Quote

 

Two nominee companies have owned Ural Properties and the first is linked to a known associate of Mr Banks, Alan Kentish. Last year Mr Kentish was arrested by the Gibraltar authorities for alleged non-disclosure of information. No charges followed.

The company owns two flats in Gunwharf, Portsmouth, overlooking the sea lane into the Royal Navy base.

 

  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46460194

[melvinmelvin]

22 hours ago, Enoon said:

 

Vote of No-Confidence followed by General Election.

 

EU will (at least) suspend departure process until the UK gets its house in order.

 

 

 

Might be quite a while then ....

 

[vogie]

19 minutes ago, Basil B said:

Brexiteers running scared...

 

The first referendum was based on misinformation, dodgy money, in a BBC investigation in to Arron Banks companies that bankrolled the Leave campaign to the tune of £8 million believed to be Russian money.  BBC finds big irregularities and stonewalling of documents that should be available for public inspection, and even goes on to imply links to Ural Properties that overlook the entrance to Portsmouth navel base may have been used by the Russians to spy on us.

  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46460194

Yes where Cameron was more open about it, he used tax payers money (£10,000,000) to lie to the nation.

[Grouse]

11 hours ago, malagateddy said:

I ask you this...are these British children..are they with their parents??? or are they non British???
Imo..charity begins at home..you take care of your own first and foremost before anyone else.
Perhaps if Blair and Co had not opened the flood-gates re immigration and also had not got involved in an imo illegal war, things would be a lot better re housing..nhs..etc.??

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Bah 'umbug

 

[Grouse]

11 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 Most are British and with at least one of their parents. Most are not living rough but are in temporary accommodation, hostels or B&Bs.

 

See 130,000 homeless children to be in temporary lodgings over Christmas

 

But what this has to do with Brexit is beyond me; unless people are blaming the EU for homelessness in the UK!

Everyone agrees that Brexit will be ruinously expensive and government income will plummet 

 

We can't afford it

 

To even consider doing this when we have massive poverty and huge inequality is obscene.

[evadgib]

I wonder if this'll work? ????

 

 

[rixalex]

 
Which will upset many of those who voted leave in 2016; especially those who voted leave to stop immigration from the EU.

What will upset many of those who voted leave in 2016 will be this continually repeated lie trotted out ad nauseam.

Listen to me very carefully now. "Controlled immigration". Give it a few seconds for those words to sink in. Now compare with your words: "stop immigration". Can you distinguish a difference? There IS one you know.

I appreciate though, if you want to paint people as being small-minded and bigoted, your phrase works much better. Who cares about accuracy?

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[Grouse]

12 hours ago, malagateddy said:

I ask you this...are these British children..are they with their parents??? or are they non British???
Imo..charity begins at home..you take care of your own first and foremost before anyone else.
Perhaps if Blair and Co had not opened the flood-gates re immigration and also had not got involved in an imo illegal war, things would be a lot better re housing..nhs..etc.??

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Sorry to say gents but this seems to be common Brexiter refrain. Not impressed

[sandyf]

17 hours ago, vogie said:

These were the rules we were given, if remain had won I'm sure you would have been happy to accept the result. But I'm sure bias has a lot to do with how we think.

 

It does not matter how you try and defend it, totally immoral.

You would have plenty to say if treatment for a medical condition was based on a single test.

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, sandyf said:

It does not matter how you try and defend it, totally immoral.

You would have plenty to say if treatment for a medical condition was based on a single test.

If "ifs" and "buts" where candy and nuts, wouldn't we have a merry Christmas.

[sandyf]

Nothing is over until it is all over.

 

An exhaustive analysis of the campaign’s digital strategy concludes it reached “tens of millions of people” in its last crucial days, after its spending limit had been breached – enough to change the outcome.

The evidence will be put to the High Court on Friday, in a landmark case that is poised to rule within weeks whether the referendum result should be declared void because the law was broken.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/vote-leave-referendum-overspending-high-court-brexit-legal-challenge-void-oxford-professor-a8668771.html

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, rixalex said:

 

What will upset many of those who voted leave in 2016 will be this continually repeated lie trotted out ad nauseam.

Listen to me very carefully now. "Controlled immigration". Give it a few seconds for those words to sink in. Now compare with your words: "stop immigration". Can you distinguish a difference? There IS one you know.

I appreciate though, if you want to paint people as being small-minded and bigoted, your phrase works much better. Who cares about accuracy?

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Correct. But what about our own rights?

 

All you are doing is reducing OUR rights in exchange for more non EU migrants. Not smart

[rixalex]

Correct. But what about our own rights?
 
All you are doing is reducing OUR rights in exchange for more non EU migrants. Not smart

You mean, what about the rights of tebee, grouse and adam, and the other 1 or 2% of Brits living in the EU.

So we're back again to the wants and needs of this tiny proportion of the population.

Not that your wants and needs aren't important. But what you are doing is putting those wants and needs, like your desire to live and work freely and easily in the EU, ahead of Britain's need to have a fair immigration system that treats all immigrants equally.

Your freedom throughout the EU comes at a cost. It's a cost to people living in the UK who have immigrants turning up in their neighbourhood who haven't been vetted or tested at all, to see what useful contribution they will bring to society if they are planning on staying long term; and there is a cost to non EU immigrants who are being discriminated against since they are not also afforded this laissez faire open door attitude as well.

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[billd766]

16 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Imo..a lot worse than that is the fact that over 5% of homeless/rough sleepers in the UK are former members of H.M.Armed Forces!!!

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You want more money for the people of the UK?

 

Cut foreign aid to zero and spend the money on the people of Britain.

[malagateddy]

Bah 'umbug
 

Grouse..I tell the TRUTH ... I am not a trendy eu loving socialist like some people eho post on this Forum.
Like it or lump it..Blair and co. have a heck of a lot to answer for..opening floodgates re uncontrolled immigration..Iraq ..illegal war.
Now Grouse..have a laugh..google the Blair Miranda..read about blair..mandelson etc!!!

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[Guest]

57 minutes ago, billd766 said:

You want more money for the people of the UK?

 

Cut foreign aid to zero and spend the money on the people of Britain.

Foreign aid is often used as a tool to develop the poorer countries so that their people don't have the desperate need to come to our countries. 

 

Another part of foreign aid is to get our, developed countries, businesses to the developing world. 

 

It's not all just a giving money out for no reason at all.

 

In EU, some less developed countries have got more money than they give out to the EU. Poland as an example. They have improved their own economy quite a lot and will suck their nationals who are living in UK back to Poland in droves. Someday they will also will be net contributors to the EU if they manage their growth in a good way. Isn't that what you want?

 

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

You want more money for the people of the UK?

 

Cut foreign aid to zero and spend the money on the people of Britain.

There is no disputing that Bill.

People complain bitterly about huge amounts going to the EU and being used to assist European countries, those payments equate 0.7% of public spending and there are those that want to put a stop to it.

Little gets said about the 1.1% that goes on foreign aid.

[billd766]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

There is no disputing that Bill.

People complain bitterly about huge amounts going to the EU and being used to assist European countries, those payments equate 0.7% of public spending and there are those that want to put a stop to it.

Little gets said about the 1.1% that goes on foreign aid.

Just think how much more would be available to the government to spend on the people if we could do both. 

 

As an extra bonus if the government pulled out of bombing Syria we could spend that money on currently serving and homeless veterans.

 

https://www.statista.com/chart/13043/the-cost-of-the-uks-air-war-in-syria-iraq/

 

 

[beautifulthailand99]

err the areas with the lowest level of immigration had the highest levels of Leave vote - Project Fear at it's finest. 

[Grouse]

6 hours ago, rixalex said:

You mean, what about the rights of tebee, grouse and adam, and the other 1 or 2% of Brits living in the EU.

So we're back again to the wants and needs of this tiny proportion of the population.

Not that your wants and needs aren't important. But what you are doing is putting those wants and needs, like your desire to live and work freely and easily in the EU, ahead of Britain's need to have a fair immigration system that treats all immigrants equally.

Your freedom throughout the EU comes at a cost. It's a cost to people living in the UK who have immigrants turning up in their neighbourhood who haven't been vetted or tested at all, to see what useful contribution they will bring to society if they are planning on staying long term; and there is a cost to non EU immigrants who are being discriminated against since they are not also afforded this laissez faire open door attitude as well.

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That's a very silly comment

 

Many would like to work, live and retire in the EU

 

Our very British monoglot embarrassment is a disincentive but not an insurmountable one.

 

Why give up opportunity ?

 

What you don't realise is that the control levers and throttles are already in place. We don't use them. Most of our immigration is non EU now.

 

Now call me a bigot (or a big 'ed if you prefer), but I am much more comfortable with having Europeans as neighbours because they come with built in similar social mores and customs.

 

Don't bother saying we can attract people from AUS, NZ, CAN and USA because it is a one way street. 10 x more Brits emigrate to Australia than come the other way. Those that do come gravitate to London.

 

No. The answer is use proper controls now. We can control immigration easily (just by continuing to be nasty). No point leaving just for that.

 

 

[Grouse]

5 hours ago, billd766 said:

You want more money for the people of the UK?

 

Cut foreign aid to zero and spend the money on the people of Britain.

The common factors for Brexiters are becoming more obvious and more worrying.

 

Not very British

[Grouse]

39 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Just think how much more would be available to the government to spend on the people if we could do both. 

 

As an extra bonus if the government pulled out of bombing Syria we could spend that money on currently serving and homeless veterans.

 

https://www.statista.com/chart/13043/the-cost-of-the-uks-air-war-in-syria-iraq/

 

 

2B is peanuts

 

What is the issue with retired service personnel? Educate me...

 

Is there a military pension on top of state pension? What is the retirement age?

[baboon]

9 hours ago, billd766 said:

You want more money for the people of the UK?

 

Cut foreign aid to zero and spend the money on the people of Britain.

But Bill, the UK government wouldn't spend any windfall on better public services anyway. They like people standing on their own two feet even if they are missing a leg, here and there.

The money would go straight to corporate tax cuts. If you think your pension would be bolstered, I fear you might be in for a nasty shock.

 

And by the way, you have lived here for a good while. If misfortune besets you and you need to return home, don't be banking on a compassionate state to provide you with dignity and the help you need. Times have changed and it isn't the EU which is at fault... 

[mommysboy]

8 hours ago, oilinki said:

Foreign aid is often used as a tool to develop the poorer countries so that their people don't have the desperate need to come to our countries. 

 

Another part of foreign aid is to get our, developed countries, businesses to the developing world. 

 

It's not all just a giving money out for no reason at all.

 

In EU, some less developed countries have got more money than they give out to the EU. Poland as an example. They have improved their own economy quite a lot and will suck their nationals who are living in UK back to Poland in droves. Someday they will also will be net contributors to the EU if they manage their growth in a good way. Isn't that what you want?

 

Theoretical.