DrJack54 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 (edited) This op isn't meant to be one group versus other using the above mentioned options. Presently many threads running regarding some embassies no longer providing affidavit letters. My question has anyone actually investigated the cost of various ways of living in los on non o extensions. I'm interested in monthly deposit method (hidden costs). Transfer costs from o/s and more significantly poor exchange rate, etc. The 3 month bank deposit has costs also. Many like me accept zero interest (yes I know term deposit possible). Cut to chase nothing is free. It all pans out costing to various degrees. On my calculations, monthly transfers from o/s is not a good option. Happy to stand correct (without the stone chucking). Some people even asking where should they move to for easier regulations. Few in various threads mention Vietnam as one example. I get 4 multiple tourist visas there every year. Geezus they don't even have a retirement visa. Edited December 12, 2018 by DrJack54 Error Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post JLCrab Posted December 12, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 12, 2018 9 hours ago, DrJack54 said: I'm interested in monthly deposit method (hidden costs). Transfer costs from o/s and more significantly poor exchange rate, etc. That's easy -- there are no costs hidden or otherwise as the method as of now does not exist. However, I don't think the monthly transfer cost via SWIFT or other means and FX cost, should that method become available, will be prohibitive compared to parking 800K baht in a Thai bank account. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJack54 Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 "Hidden costs" was a bad choice of words. What I meant was costs overlooked by a lot of us (including myself) in relation to transferring our money from home country to here. 1/Bank to bank (international). 2/Money transfer companies such as OFX (money transfered in your home country to their account then transferred to Thai bank in baht). 3/Physically bringing cash from overseas here (not suitable for most). 4/Other methods. The difference in all methods is not minor. One of the biggest differences is exchange rates for the various methods. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLCrab Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 For me, I bring in and spend at least 65K baht each month anyway so the only additional cost is the SWIFT or some other transfer method vs. my current preferred (reimbursed fee) ATM route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Bangkok Basha Posted December 13, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 13, 2018 I use TransferWise to wire monthly deposits equal to or greater than THB 65,000 to my Bangkok Bank savings account, and plan to do so until my next extension of stay request next summer. The fees are much lower than other means of transferring, and are a tax-deductible expense (I pay U.S. income taxes) as the cost of living here and maintaining my residence. I don't want to park THB 800,000 (currently around $25k) in a low interest, or no interest Thai saving account. 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 (edited) The equivalent of 77000 ThB ( monthly transfers ) from Belgium to my Thailand bank account with TransferWise cost me +/- 620 ThB. 7500 ThB yearly, 1700 ThB L.o.I., 1900 ThB year extension. So less than 1000 ThB a month. A fair price ( and legal ) to pay, in my opinion; as I don't have 800000 ThB. Edited December 13, 2018 by luckyluke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kron Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 1 hour ago, luckyluke said: The equivalent of 77000 ThB ( monthly transfers ) from Belgium to my Thailand bank account with TransferWise cost me +/- 620 ThB. 7500 ThB yearly, 1700 ThB L.o.I., 1900 ThB year extension. So less than 1000 ThB a month. A fair price ( and legal ) to pay, in my opinion; as I don't have 800000 ThB. You state that you do not have savings, therefore I assume the monthly transfers are sourced from a pension or salary. It is my understanding that foreign-sourced income if paid in or remitted to Thailand within the year it is earned is subject to Thai taxation. The old TM6 form (2 versions back) had the tax warning on it. You will be presenting proof to Immigration of transfers which might cost you +10,000 Baht a month in tax. I think we must see how this all plays out in the coming year. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post moe666 Posted December 13, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 13, 2018 4 minutes ago, Kron said: You state that you do not have savings, therefore I assume the monthly transfers are sourced from a pension or salary. It is my understanding that foreign-sourced income if paid in or remitted to Thailand within the year it is earned is subject to Thai taxation. The old TM6 form (2 versions back) had the tax warning on it. You will be presenting proof to Immigration of transfers which might cost you +10,000 Baht a month in tax. I think we must see how this all plays out in the coming year. At present I do not think anyone transfering money into thailand is paying tax on their retirement transfer 5 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AAArdvark Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I don't know about other countries, but in the US there is a Bangkok Bank branch in NYC. You open an account at Bangkok Bank in Thailand. You then use the routing number of the New York Branch and your Thai account number. The costs would be whatever your US bank charges for a standard ACH transfer (they won't even know that the money is going to Thailand) and a possibly exchange rate loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amexpat Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 3 minutes ago, Glenn Roe said: I don't know about other countries, but in the US there is a Bangkok Bank branch in NYC. You open an account at Bangkok Bank in Thailand. You then use the routing number of the New York Branch and your Thai account number. The costs would be whatever your US bank charges for a standard ACH transfer (they won't even know that the money is going to Thailand) and a possibly exchange rate loss. Bangkok Bank will discontinue that process April 1. So they say. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 3 minutes ago, amexpat said: Bangkok Bank will discontinue that process April 1. So they say. Only if the transfer is not in the international ACH transfer code called IAT. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoza Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I was led to believe that if my income was generated in the UK and I pay UK taxes on this money (which I do) then I have already paid any tax due on that income ….something to do with an agreement between Thailand and UK....or is that not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 U.K. and Thailand do indeed have a double taxation agreement whereby if you pay tax on your income in UK then you don't pay tax on it in Thailand. Also any income earned in UK is taxed in UK. it has also been reported on here that if your lump sum is in a Thai bank and you receive interest which is taxable you can reclaim the tax from the Thai Tax Office. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavideol Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 16 minutes ago, JohnC said: U.K. and Thailand do indeed have a double taxation agreement whereby if you pay tax on your income in UK then you don't pay tax on it in Thailand. Also any income earned in UK is taxed in UK. it has also been reported on here that if your lump sum is in a Thai bank and you receive interest which is taxable you can reclaim the tax from the Thai Tax Office. so to understand correctly... we work collect a salary, pay taxes on that salary while working....then we retire collect a misery of what we paid for and still have to pay taxes on that misery of a pension.... double taxation or maybe triple taxation if retired into a country taxing us for the moneys bringing in to such country.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jimn Posted December 13, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 13, 2018 Totally irrelevant question. What is this monthly deposit method you are asking about? To my knowledge at this time there is no such thing. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, jimn said: Totally irrelevant question. What is this monthly deposit method you are asking about? To my knowledge at this time there is no such thing. There isn't. It's something that the embassies that are cutting off vital services to their expat citizens are talking about. Crickets from Thai immigration. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sometimewoodworker Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 34 minutes ago, JohnC said: U.K. and Thailand do indeed have a double taxation agreement whereby if you pay tax on your income in UK then you don't pay tax on it in Thailand. Also any income earned in UK is taxed in UK. it has also been reported on here that if your lump sum is in a Thai bank and you receive interest which is taxable you can reclaim the tax from the Thai Tax Office. Not quite correct. Both countries assess your income and the tax payable, tax payed in one country is then offset against tax liability in the other. So if the UK tax payed is greater than the Thai tax due you pay nothing, but if the UK tax is less than the Thai Tax due you have to pay the difference to The Thai tax authority. Most foreign account holders have income that is under the Thai tax threshold, or is for tax purposes zero so can reclaim any tax payed on bank interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Kerryd Posted December 13, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 13, 2018 I put my cash in a Thai bank because I know that most of the excuses people use for not doing that are total BS. There is little chance that Thailand is going to go into a recession "in the near future" and that all the banks will "fail" like some claim. The BS over interest rates is just that, BS. I've looked at rates in different banks in Canada and NONE of the mainstream banks offer anything better than what I get on my Fixed Term deposit in Thailand. There are some small banks that have better rates - IF you meet/maintain the conditions noted in the fine print. Otherwise they drop your interest to the lowest rates they offer on they regular accounts (and making regular withdrawals and transfers to Thailand would probably result in you not meeting those conditions so not only would you end up with a lower interest rate, you'd also be losing money on the transfer fees and possibly on the exchange rates as well). Note that those small banks are just as likely to fold as any bank in Thailand. Maybe even more so. I've noticed that a lot of people (not all) when talking about how much more they are earning on their money "back home" usually trip themselves up by noting that their money isn't actually in a bank account, available to be spent, but instead is in an RRSP or 401k or some other long term investment that they can't really touch. They aren't keeping that money in "fixed term" savings accounts (if they have it at all) but tied up in long term investments Which means they do NOT have the money to meet the financial requirements as money held in long term investments can't be used to meet the requirements for Immigration. (Keep in mind that Immigration expects you to actually be spending that 400/800k to live on. They don't expect you to keep it in the bank indefinitely - except for the "medical Visa" which we won't bother discussing because if you can't afford to put 800k in a Thai bank for 3 months then I'm sure you can't afford to leave 1.5 million in one for 5(+) years either.) Money tied up in long-term investments is not considered "available" to be used to live on. So the reality is, a lot of people (but not all, so don't get your panties in a bunch because I know you are a special case) can not meet the requirement (of 400/800k in the bank) because they don't-have-that-much available. Period. (Unless they were to cash out their Investment plan(s) back home.) I have money tied up in accounts (bank and RRSP) back home as well as investments in Thailand. I can't use any of that to meet Immigration's requirements so I made sure, years ago, to put the required amount in a local bank. No fuss, no stress, no hassles. If an emergency crops up (medical or personal or whatever) I can get the money back within minutes (when the bank is open of course - let's not get anal with stuff like "what if it was 3 am on a Sunday morning huh ?"). All I'd lose is the interest for that period but if I needed the money that badly, I wouldn't be worried about the lost interest. And there is virtually no chance that you are going to put money into a Thai bank and have the bank (or an employee) immediately "steal" it, but there are some people out there who listen to old wive's tales (told no doubt by the guy on the next bar stool who heard it directly from a guy that knew someone who had a friend that read something on the internet about someone that claimed to have known someone who overheard someone say it happens all the time). If your money goes missing out of your account it is probably because you gave your teerak your ATM card and PIN because you were too lazy to go get money from the ATM yourself. Or you wrote your PIN on your card so you wouldn't forget it. Or you use "1234" as your PIN and leave your card laying around where every ladyboy and cleaning lady can find it. Or you give your card/PIN to the waitress at the bar so she can go get money from your account because you don't want to leave your stool in case someone else takes it. (Yes, people have actually done that. With their ATM cards. I've seen guys in beer bars and go-go bars hand a waitress their card and a slip of paper with their PIN on it and the girl comes back a few minutes later and gives them back the money, card and ATM slip.) But of course, when they do something stupid it's never their fault, it's always "the bank stole it" or some other BS. (Dear old dad had given his ATM card and PIN to his female companion as he'd gotten too sick to get out of bed most days. She made sure she cleaned his account out, at 20k a day, right up until he died (and I took his ATM card and other ID for safekeeping). She was somehow able to get a new bank book or ATM card and after I went back to work she was able to clean out the rest of dad's money - except for the money he had in a Fixed Term account. She couldn't touch that luckily.) Costs ? 800k in a Thai Fixed Term account (at Bangkok Bank for example) earns 1.5% per annum, so 12,000 baht in interest per year. Less 2,000 baht in tax leaves 10,000 clear. No exchange rate BS. No transfer or ATM fees. No crisis because "I forgot" to transfer money and now can't meet the 3 month seasoning requirement. (Note: some banks have special "promotional" Fixed Term rates that pay a slightly higher interest rate for a FIXED period of time, after which the interest is paid and the rate drops to the standard 1% - until you go to the bank and put the money into a NEW Fixed Term deposit. At Bangkok Bank they were offering terms of 7 and 11 months for their promotional rates but it was a royal pain in the butt because each time a term ended, I'd have to go to the bank, close the old Fixed Term account then open a new one and deposit the money into it for another 7 or 11 month term.) New Extension on Visa - 1,900 baht. New Multi Re-entry Permit - 3,800 baht. Bank letter, photos, photo copies, coffee, taxi - maybe 300 baht. Total = 6,000 baht (or less) leaving 4,000 baht left over from the 10,000 earned in interest for a night on the town or a couple months of utility bills or whatever. But of course, as we know, everyone supposedly has a "special" account at a "bank" back home that gives them super high interest rates and no bank fees or special conditions and free ATM withdrawals as often as they want (etc, etc, etc) so there is no reason for them to put money into a bank in Thailand that will either fail in the near future or will steal their money minutes after they deposit it. Uh huh. ps: Vietnam is ALWAYS mentioned as an alternative to Thailand. But as discussed in other threads, the grass is also ALWAYS greener somewhere else - until you get there and actually start experiencing life, and the difficulties of living, in that other place. If those countries were really so great - there'd barely be any expats living in Thailand at all. Strange how there hasn't been a mass exodus to Malaysia, Cambodia, Vietnam and the Philippines despite all the people who keep claiming that those places are better than Thailand. Strange........ 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacko45k Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, Kerryd said: what if it was 3 am on a Sunday morning huh An ATM can deliver a good bit perhaps, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJack54 Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 (edited) Kerryd, you make some good points. I also use the 800k in Thai bank. Only difference is, after the extension date I start using the money. Some people visit home country each year (I do), point is I physically bring with me cash 25k USD each time. The difference in me bringing in cash and converting here is often between 0.5-1.0 baht per aud. (I mentioned USD before because that's the maximum before need to declare). Then there's the savings on transfers etc. On that sort of money im often 30k baht better off. I'm au. No one can completely acurately forecast exchange rates. However domestic interest rates are going in opposite directions in USA and au. Also the au government wants a weaker aud. In feb when back in au upon return will bring in another 30k au because rates end of 2019 expected to possibly be 22baht+. Point is with money in bank method you can let your money accrue in home country from pensions/investments etc. Then bring/transfer when it seems best. The guys using the monthly income deposit into Thai bank might see better alternative if it suits their situation. Edited December 13, 2018 by DrJack54 Error 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve73 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 On the issue of Thai taxation of foreign sourced income... I'm making some rounding assumptions here as I'm unsure of the exact numbers, but you'll get the gist, and you can re-run with exact number if you have them. A UK citizen will need to bring in minimum of 65kBt per month (call that 800k per year), and lets assume just 40THB/GBP (I know it's just above this at the moment, although maybe not in the future, but it keeps the maths easy). So 20k GBP per year. Now the UK personal allowance is around 10k (so the first 10k of income is not taxed). Above this it's taxed at 20%. So to receive 20k GBP after tax (so that it can be transferred to Thailand) you'll need to earn (or receive in pensions) 22.5k GBP before tax... (2,500 being taken in UK tax). So Thai tax will be due on the money imported.. From the tables I've seen (not those presented earlier), 0% due on the first 150k, 5% due on the next 150k, 10% on the next 200k, 15% on the next t 250k (taking us up to 750k), and 25% upto 1MM. So 800k income imported will require a total of 75k of tax to be paid (or 1,875 GBP). But since there has already been 2500 GBP of UK tax deducted, then no further Thai tax is payable (or if it is, then it can be reclaimed under the DTA). Note: This is my understanding of the situation, and I could be totally wrong, in which case please point this out. Interestingly, for married UK's. The 400k required (or 10k GBP) is below the UK PA, so no UK tax will have been paid.... but, there will be a Thai tax due of 17.5k THB, which will not be reclaimable against UK tax, since none was paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJack54 Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 I'm not qualified to talk about Thai taxation. However think some are confusing taxation here. Personally I (like many) have an income stream from my superannuation, rentals etc. I PAY taxes on all my income in Australia. The taxes have been paid to au government. The money is earnt there, not in Thailand. I'm happy to stand corrected but I am just spending my after-tax monies in Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sumrit Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 (edited) 53 minutes ago, steve73 said: On the issue of Thai taxation of foreign sourced income... I'm making some rounding assumptions here as I'm unsure of the exact numbers, but you'll get the gist, and you can re-run with exact number if you have them. A UK citizen will need to bring in minimum of 65kBt per month (call that 800k per year), and lets assume just 40THB/GBP (I know it's just above this at the moment, although maybe not in the future, but it keeps the maths easy). So 20k GBP per year. Now the UK personal allowance is around 10k (so the first 10k of income is not taxed). Above this it's taxed at 20%. So to receive 20k GBP after tax (so that it can be transferred to Thailand) you'll need to earn (or receive in pensions) 22.5k GBP before tax... (2,500 being taken in UK tax). So Thai tax will be due on the money imported.. From the tables I've seen (not those presented earlier), 0% due on the first 150k, 5% due on the next 150k, 10% on the next 200k, 15% on the next t 250k (taking us up to 750k), and 25% upto 1MM. So 800k income imported will require a total of 75k of tax to be paid (or 1,875 GBP). But since there has already been 2500 GBP of UK tax deducted, then no further Thai tax is payable (or if it is, then it can be reclaimed under the DTA). Note: This is my understanding of the situation, and I could be totally wrong, in which case please point this out. Interestingly, for married UK's. The 400k required (or 10k GBP) is below the UK PA, so no UK tax will have been paid.... but, there will be a Thai tax due of 17.5k THB, which will not be reclaimable against UK tax, since none was paid. I understand where you're coming from with this but, the annual personal UK allowance is £11,850, not £10,000. For a marriage extension, the required income is 40,000 baht per month which equates to 480,000 baht per year, not 400,000 baht. Using your average rounding up/down, to allow for small exchange rate fluctuations, somebody would need to bring around £1,250 pm into Thailand. So, @ £15,000 pa you would pay around £650,00 pa in UK income tax and, @ the equivalent 500,000 baht pa, you would pay around 27000 baht pa in Thai taxation. Depending on the exchange rate of course, a very similar amount. Edited December 13, 2018 by sumrit 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daejung Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 3 hours ago, moe666 said: At present I do not think anyone transfering money into thailand is paying tax on their retirement transfer Depends upon which international tax treaty is applicable for your country. According to French-thai international tax treaty , french pensions are taxed in France and vice-versa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgdanson Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 6 hours ago, Bangkok Basha said: and plan to do so until my next extension of stay request next summer. And then what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 6 hours ago, Bangkok Basha said: I use TransferWise to wire monthly deposits equal to or greater than THB 65,000 to my Bangkok Bank savings account, and plan to do so until my next extension of stay request next summer. The fees are much lower than other means of transferring, and are a tax-deductible expense (I pay U.S. income taxes) as the cost of living here and maintaining my residence. I don't want to park THB 800,000 (currently around $25k) in a low interest, or no interest Thai saving account. Just be aware that TransferWise payments do not always appear to be foreign in origin as reflected in your Thai-bank's activity record. If Immigration will rely on the bank's printout of activity, this could fail their test. Some have suggested showing a PDF from transferwise to bridge the gap, but this would be subject to fraud - such that one could move around 65K from account to account, and then print a faked/modified Transferwise PDF. I am doubtful anything other than a Thai-bank's printout stamped/signed by a bank-officer will work as primary evidence in the future (for those w/o embassy-letters, assuming these remain valid from some/all other embassies). 2 hours ago, Jingthing said: There isn't. It's something that the embassies that are cutting off vital services to their expat citizens are talking about. Crickets from Thai immigration. Exactly. We don't know if that even foreign-xfers, shown as foreign in our Thai-bank's activity-record, will even/ever be an option in the future - or if it is just some made-up bit from our embassies to quiet us down. They won't even reveal a transcript of their conversations with Thai authorities which led to losing our embassy-letters, so why in the world would we believe any statements about what they were told (or may have just made-up)? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgdanson Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 6 hours ago, luckyluke said: The equivalent of 77000 ThB ( monthly transfers ) from Belgium to my Thailand bank account with TransferWise cost me +/- 620 ThB. 7500 ThB yearly, 1700 ThB L.o.I., 1900 ThB year extension. So less than 1000 ThB a month. A fair price ( and legal ) to pay, in my opinion; as I don't have 800000 ThB. But are the Belgian Embassy still issuing income letters like the Immigration want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgdanson Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said: Not quite correct. Both countries assess your income and the tax payable, tax payed in one country is then offset against tax liability in the other. So if the UK tax payed is greater than the Thai tax due you pay nothing, but if the UK tax is less than the Thai Tax due you have to pay the difference to The Thai tax authority. Most foreign account holders have income that is under the Thai tax threshold, or is for tax purposes zero so can reclaim any tax payed on bank interest. And if the money was éarned'in a previous tax year....no Thai taxes. So in whch year was your pension earned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgdanson Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 3 hours ago, Mavideol said: so to understand correctly... we work collect a salary, pay taxes on that salary while working....then we retire collect a misery of what we paid for and still have to pay taxes on that misery of a pension.... double taxation or maybe triple taxation if retired into a country taxing us for the moneys bringing in to such country.... Is the money you pay into a Pension scheme (in UK) not tax free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 hours ago, Kerryd said: There is little chance that Thailand is going to go into a recession "in the near future" and that all the banks will "fail" like some claim. It's not just a question of bank-failures, Cypress-style bail-ins, revelations that "official" AAA credit-ratings of nations / banks were total bs, or some other event si milar to those which have happened in recent-memory. It's also a matter of guaranteed-access. Whether a person is willing to put 800K here likely depends on what fraction of their total liquid assets it would compose. If 10% or less, sure. If a significant percentage, it would be idiotic to put that much of one's money anywhere other than their home-country - the only place where they have a guaranteed "right to be" at all times - especially as Thailand's immigration-division seems intent on thinning the number of expats by various incremental-means. 2 hours ago, Kerryd said: I've noticed that a lot of people (not all) when talking about how much more they are earning on their money "back home" usually trip themselves up by noting that their money isn't actually in a bank account, available to be spent, but instead is in an RRSP or 401k or some other long term investment that they can't really touch. They aren't keeping that money in "fixed term" savings accounts (if they have it at all) but tied up in long term investments Which means they do NOT have the money to meet the financial requirements as money held in long term investments can't be used to meet the requirements for Immigration. ... or in foreign businesses. Which is why the income-method works for many ... or did before, anyway. 2 hours ago, Kerryd said: ps: Vietnam is ALWAYS mentioned as an alternative to Thailand. But as discussed in other threads, the grass is also ALWAYS greener somewhere else - until you get there and actually start experiencing life, and the difficulties of living, in that other place. If those countries were really so great - there'd barely be any expats living in Thailand at all. Strange how there hasn't been a mass exodus to Malaysia, Cambodia, Vietnam and the Philippines despite all the people who keep claiming that those places are better than Thailand. Malaysia long-term - only with immigration if the My-2nd-Home option will work for them. But as to the rest - much, much, much better in terms of dealing with immigration. They are not reported to make up non-existent rules to ply huge extortion-payments out of people for valid extensions of stay, and/or deny entry to those who have valid visas based on more non-existent laws/rules (because are not playing in their extortion-racket target-area). In terms of the other aspects of those locales - it's up to each person to decide if they meet their needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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