Thai Embassy in Vientiane issues warning to visa runners

[JackThompson]

10 minutes ago, SammyT said:

Yes, how dare they stop people from living here semi-permanently and long term on tourist visas, just because that's what you did.

How dare they violate the laws they are sworn to uphold, throwing thousands of Thais out of work every month by doing so.

 

10 minutes ago, SammyT said:

I doubt it is doing any harm to the country at all. Regular tourists will still come, even those who want to stay for the duration of two tourist visas will still come.

Even snowbirds are now getting interrogated at the Bangkok airports - told a couple weeks should be enough.  This, even though a Tourist visa is good for about 8 weeks, even without the extension - though surely that dishonest clique wish it were only 15 days.

 

10 minutes ago, SammyT said:

It's just the long term residents who don't qualify for other things and are too cheap to stump up for an elite visa who won't come.

So 99% of those who stay here more than a few weeks/yr.

 

10 minutes ago, SammyT said:

And I'm pretty sure they're fine with that. The ex-bar girls will find someone else to marry.

Believe it or not, we didn't all marry "ex bar-girls."  You'd be surprised to find Thai women work in other professions, too - even in the Jomtien area - most of them, in fact.  My wife worked at a guesthouse when we met - and continued to work there until Immigration put the place out of business (along with 1/2 the street, at the time we left). 

 

The bar-girls / go-go bar clientelle are primarily those "genuine" short-term tourists, whom Immigration treats well.  It's when "good guys" do the "right thing" and stick with one gal - even get married (gasp!) that the hard-liners really get their knickers in a twist.

[BritTim]

23 minutes ago, SammyT said:

No one has quite pointed out exactly what an IO here gets out of refusing someone entry who is repetitively using tourist visas. No one has said they've been asked for a bribe etc. I suspect it's not because the IO hates white people, I'm sure it's literally because they don't believe the person is a legitimate tourist, which they clearly aren't in the situations described by many above

Those who carefully pay bribes to override immigration officials' decisions are almost always smart enough not to boast about it on this board. There was one recent post here where someone paid at Suvarnabhumi to get unlimited visa exempt entries. Also, if you speak to officials you know well, they will quietly admit that there is a lot of corruption going on behind the scenes. That aside, there are officials who just get pleasure out of denying people entry, or forcing them to do things like buying expensive air tickets before admitting them. The motives are not always monetary.

[SammyT]

21 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

41 minutes ago, SammyT said:

Yes, how dare they stop people from living here semi-permanently and long term on tourist visas, just because that's what you did.

How dare they violate the laws they are sworn to uphold, throwing thousands of Thais out of work every month by doing so.

You have zero evidence to back up the assertion that thousands of Thais are being put of work every month just by them cracking down on people having repeated tourist visas. You make it sound like they're shutting actual tourism down, which they aren't. 

 

21 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Quote

It's just the long term residents who don't qualify for other things and are too cheap to stump up for an elite visa who won't come.

So 99% of those who stay here more than a few weeks/yr.

Again, it's not the people who are staying here for more than a few weeks a year who are being interrogated. It's the ones who are coming on a tourist visa, doing a visa run out of the country for 24 hours then turning around and coming back in then doing that again that are being target. Like I've said before, but you've conveniently ignored - the ones who do it for 11 months of the year.

 

The people who are coming for a couple of week 4 times are year don't seem to be having any issues. If they were, you'd certainly hear about it on here. 

[SammyT]

12 minutes ago, BritTim said:

That aside, there are officials who just get pleasure out of denying people entry, or forcing them to do things like buying expensive air tickets before admitting them. The motives are not always monetary.

"Official goes out of his way just to be super difficult, thus potentially putting his job at risk in doing so"

Sounds an urban legend passed among angry old expats to me. I've never had any issues with immigration officials the dozens of times I've come through airports and land borders. Maybe I just got lucky...

[BritTim]

2 hours ago, SammyT said:

"Official goes out of his way just to be super difficult, thus potentially putting his job at risk in doing so"

Sounds an urban legend passed among angry old expats to me. I've never had any issues with immigration officials the dozens of times I've come through airports and land borders. Maybe I just got lucky...

Rogue officials are, fortunately, not the norm, but they exist and it takes a lot for a Thai official to get fired or demoted as long as deference is shown to superiors. Some of the stories that are told about denied entry are likely not genuine. However, there have been credible accounts (especially concerning people from the Indian subcontinent or some African countries) of officials being very unreasonable with no apparent motive other than personal antipathy.

[Essecola]

Nice one. Don't release any detail about the maximum time a person can stay in the country per year, but just throw up a notice that vaguely threatens to reject entry for some cases. Well done.

[aldriglikvid]

Do we have any examples of those being rejected at immigration, in the number of tourist visas they had used up in total? 

 

I'm doing my 4th on a 18 month rolling period in a week. 

 

1st was applied to from home country and had 5 months out-of-Thailand before I applied for the 2nd one (also from home countr). 3rd was applied for in Vietnam and only 3 days "abroad". The upcoming 4th will be as the same as the third (3 days abroad). 

 

-20k Baht Cash

-Condo Rental Contract

-In/Out Air-tickets

 

Should I be worried? 

[BritTim]

25 minutes ago, aldriglikvid said:

Do we have any examples of those being rejected at immigration, in the number of tourist visas they had used up in total? 

 

I'm doing my 4th on a 18 month rolling period in a week. 

 

1st was applied to from home country and had 5 months out-of-Thailand before I applied for the 2nd one (also from home countr). 3rd was applied for in Vietnam and only 3 days "abroad". The upcoming 4th will be as the same as the third (3 days abroad). 

 

-20k Baht Cash

-Condo Rental Contract

-In/Out Air-tickets

 

Should I be worried? 

Getting the visa in Vietnam should be OK.

 

You are beginning to get to the point where entering by air at Don Muang(?) with your tourist visas is getting a little risky. You will most likely be OK, but you seem to have spent the last six months in Thailand continuously (bar a short visa run). If you run into the wrong official, you might be singled out.

 

If you get in OK this time, I strongly recommend you try to use friendly land borders to enter Thailand in future unless you have spent a long period outside the country.

[Essecola]

I don't have a place to stay in my home country and I don't want to live in Cambodia or Vietnam. Where am I supposed to go? I am not working here illegally. This is frightening.

[SammyT]

4 hours ago, Essecola said:

I don't have a place to stay in my home country and I don't want to live in Cambodia or Vietnam. Where am I supposed to go? I am not working here illegally. This is frightening.

 

Aim for refugee status? Actually, scrub that, Thailand doesn't recognise refugees. 

 

Seriously though, I think "I don't want to live in Cambodia or Vietnam" isn't sufficient reason for you to be able to just remain here forever on a tourist visa.

[Essecola]

These other places like Cambodia, Vietnam, and the Philippines are not safe and don't have as reliable medical services as Bangkok. I have nowhere to go. 

[SammyT]

3 minutes ago, Essecola said:

These other places like Cambodia, Vietnam, and the Philippines are not safe and don't have as reliable medical services as Bangkok. I have nowhere to go. 

 

How long have you been here on a tourist visa? Not old enough to qualify for retirement etc?

[Loomis]

I was at the embassy in Vientiane yesterday and didn’t see this sign anywhere. A person on Facebook mentioned they saw it the 17th and on the 18th the signs had all been taken down. I’ll look again today when I pick up my visa.

[JackThompson]

15 hours ago, SammyT said:

You have zero evidence to back up the assertion that thousands of Thais are being put of work every month just by them cracking down on people having repeated tourist visas. You make it sound like they're shutting actual tourism down, which they aren't. 

That is what many business-owners say - that their longer-stay customers won't come/stay in Thailand anymore due to fear of immigration, so their clientelle is being literally blocked from patronizing them.  This is not just "year round" visitors, but also "winter only" visitors, who are now afraid to try to enter Thailand. 

 

This is the damage done when you let lawless types take over your immigration-system at your capital airports.  Whether out of lazy-oversight, corrupt-payoffs, or whatever reason - you destroy your nation's reputation as a friendly destination.

 

Other types of tourists - package-tour types who are taken to spend in designated shops, walking-street "solo traveler" types, and other short / occasional visitors are still welcomed by immigration, so businesses serving primarily those groups survive.

 

15 hours ago, SammyT said:

Again, it's not the people who are staying here for more than a few weeks a year who are being interrogated.

Snowbirds and others from wealthy European countries - gone for months at a time - have been targeted upon returning.  When you are dealing with lawbreaking officials, there is no known "safe" zone - a lack of oversight turns it into a "thug" system.  They can make up any limit or rule they desire, depending on how they feel at that moment - which is what is happening now.  The victims they publish their experiences to their friends on social-media and each one becomes countless visitors lost to Thailand's competitors. 

 

15 hours ago, SammyT said:

It's the ones who are coming on a tourist visa, doing a visa run out of the country for 24 hours then turning around and coming back in then doing that again that are being target. Like I've said before, but you've conveniently ignored - the ones who do it for 11 months of the year.

I am not ignoring them - they are the best customers - spending almost year-round. 
But we have several reports of people gone from Thailand for 6 months or longer, also being interrogated upon returning, because they had stayed for 2x Tourist Visas worth or so in a previous year. 

 

The goal seems to be blocking entry to anyone who might "stick around" and not pay tribute (illegal tea-money) to immigration to do so.

 

15 hours ago, SammyT said:

The people who are coming for a couple of week 4 times are year don't seem to be having any issues. If they were, you'd certainly hear about it on here. 

Two visits of 4 weeks each seems to be tolerated, for now.  Just don't try to spend money here throughout the winter-season, then come back next year to do it again.  The message is, "Spend your next winter helping locals in some other country, so we can keep our citizens poor."

[farangx]

3 hours ago, Essecola said:

These other places like Cambodia, Vietnam, and the Philippines are not safe and don't have as reliable medical services as Bangkok. I have nowhere to go. 

Try Malaysia, entry gives you 90 days, better for conditions above too.

 

[Essecola]

2 hours ago, farangx said:

Try Malaysia, entry gives you 90 days, better for conditions above too.

 

Malaysia won't let you keep coming. A couple visits is ok, but if you have something that needs long term attention it can't work. What a horrible christmas present that notice is if it really means people won't be able to get 2-3 visas in Vientiane.

 

And as far as corrupt officials needing paying or them trying to steer people to agents, then where are these agents? Zero mention anywhere of how to find such agents so whoever can get their "payments" can indeed get them.

 

But I am certainly not prepaying 8333 baht per month for 60 months to somewhere that lies and doesn't provide clear info about how their rules work.

Edited December 20, 2018 by Essecola

[sapson]

Maybe a new thread with latest info only or reports from Vientiane would help people.

 

Save wading through this ever growing 12 pages which can be kept for those who truly wish to debate the rights or wrongs.

Edited December 20, 2018 by sapson

[farangx]

44 minutes ago, Essecola said:

Malaysia won't let you keep coming. A couple visits is ok, but if you have something that needs long term attention it can't work. What a horrible christmas present that notice is if it really means people won't be able to get 2-3 visas in Vientiane.

 

And as far as corrupt officials needing paying or them trying to steer people to agents, then where are these agents? Zero mention anywhere of how to find such agents so whoever can get their "payments" can indeed get them.

 

But I am certainly not prepaying 8333 baht per month for 60 months to somewhere that lies and doesn't provide clear info about how their rules work.

I never use agents before and I don't know of any here and in Malaysia. 

 

But if you can afford and not interested in prepaying that 8333b, then Malaysia's MM2H may just be the thing for you.  The money will need to be in a fixed deposit account with a bank in Malaysia for the duration of that visa.  If you had enough, you end that visa and the money is for you to take out ....

 

[JackThompson]

4 hours ago, Essecola said:

And as far as corrupt officials needing paying or them trying to steer people to agents, then where are these agents? Zero mention anywhere of how to find such agents so whoever can get their "payments" can indeed get them.

ED Visa extension payoffs usually go through the schools, vs agents.  Retirement or Marriage -extension payoffs are paid through agents (ads all over), who can often also source ED extensions, and sometimes Non-O extensions based on volunteer-work. 

If things get desperate, I would go to agent after agent, explain your situation, and ask what they can offer.  But, at this time, we really do not know what the story is at Vientiane.  Unless the now-lawful land-borders start rejecting entry to those with Tourist Visas, worst case would be buying a new passport more frequently - and perhaps doing this while in KL or similar - so there is not a bit of Thai history in it (even a transferred-stamp), at the start.

 

9 hours ago, Essecola said:

These other places like Cambodia, Vietnam, and the Philippines are not safe and don't have as reliable medical services as Bangkok. I have nowhere to go.  

 

As far as Medical in the PI - they have good private health-care available.  In my experience, only Manila is generally "scary" in terms of crime - like another country from the rest (but I did not, and would not recommend, travel to Mindanao areas).  If you want a larger city with malls and full-service private hospitals, most of Cebu (Visayas) and Baguio (Luzon) are OK.

Edited December 20, 2018 by JackThompson

[dpspike]

On 12/17/2018 at 11:10 PM, JLCrab said:

Yes and there are some on here who seem to think that they have some preordained right to live in Thailand long-term whatever circumstances might be their particular case.

You are still missing the point sir. According to Thai law, there currently is no limit on tourist visas, and the financial requirements for a tourist visa are quite modest (bank account with 20,000 baht or equivalent). So that implies that whoever meets that modest requirement does indeed have the right to be in Thailand. I'm just stating the law as I understand it, and the apparent disregard that Thai Immigration in Vientiane seems to be displaying because that is the content in the OP. If you just want to lash out at someone because you don't think they have enough money to stay in Thailand, that's up to you. But I try to confine my comments to the actual content of the OP, or when possible, find humor in it.

[Hawkman]

Yeah it's tougher in Vientiane. I have just left a company in Thailand after around 4 years and been on a non-b; but because of past Tourist Visas from Vientiane from 4 years ago with a red stamp, my visa was rejected. I assumed because I have a non-b and work permit for four years, it wouldn't have been a problem, but past visas are taken into account.

[Essecola]

1 hour ago, Hawkman said:

Yeah it's tougher in Vientiane. I have just left a company in Thailand after around 4 years and been on a non-b; but because of past Tourist Visas from Vientiane from 4 years ago with a red stamp, my visa was rejected. I assumed because I have a non-b and work permit for four years, it wouldn't have been a problem, but past visas are taken into account.

Rejecting the tourist visa even tho last one, with attached warning, is 4 years old is tough for sure. But at least it is within their policy, as their way is to not issue SETVs to any passport that has a warning stamp from them regardless of time period.

 

The fine details can be tedious, as I don't recall what their policy is towards seeing a warning stamp from a different embassy or consulate. I would guess they would still say no. 

 

Do empathize with what happened though. Hope you could sort something out.

[freedomnow]

2 hours ago, Hawkman said:

Yeah it's tougher in Vientiane. I have just left a company in Thailand after around 4 years and been on a non-b; but because of past Tourist Visas from Vientiane from 4 years ago with a red stamp, my visa was rejected. I assumed because I have a non-b and work permit for four years, it wouldn't have been a problem, but past visas are taken into account.

At LAST. posts coming in relevant to the changes of the OP vs all this DB8 - which stuffs the entire thread to the gills...making it a headache to get to the essence of the matter vs all this expat jousting that goes on in thread-after-thread which changes NOTHING because no immigration officials are hanging on your wise 'this is how it should be' words....

[BigT73]

On 12/20/2018 at 2:33 AM, Essecola said:

Nice one. Don't release any detail about the maximum time a person can stay in the country per year, but just throw up a notice that vaguely threatens to reject entry for some cases. Well done.

Have you thought about a ED Visa?  One school I seen is 2 days a week course with 2hrs a session.

[StayinThailand2much]

On 12/20/2018 at 12:49 PM, JackThompson said:

Two visits of 4 weeks each seems to be tolerated, for now.  Just don't try to spend money here throughout the winter-season, then come back next year to do it again.  The message is, "Spend your next winter helping locals in some other country, so we can keep our citizens poor."

That was exactly my motivation when booking a 5-week holiday in Down Under: not worrying for that time about Thailand visas, while spending the money somewhere else... ????

[TGZ453]

I'm planning to travel to Vientiane to apply for a tourist visa in the next two days.

 

Is there anybody who already traveled to the Thai embassy in Vientiane after 17 December and got trouble with applying for a tourist visa there ? were you really asked to show up the air ticket and 20,000 Baht ?

[ubonjoe]

49 minutes ago, TGZ453 said:

Is there anybody who already traveled to the Thai embassy in Vientiane after 17 December and got trouble with applying for a tourist visa there ? were you really asked to show up the air ticket and 20,000 Baht ?

I have seen no reports of them asking for the ticket or the 20k baht.

Not sure where the visa requirements posted in the OP came from since it is not mentioned in the notice.

[TGZ453]

20 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I have seen no reports of them asking for the ticket or the 20k baht.

Not sure where the visa requirements posted in the OP came from since it is not mentioned in the notice.

Thank you for the response.

 

Wish somebody who just applied for a tourist visa in Vientiane would happen to find this thread and come here to verify this confusion.

[JackThompson]

40 minutes ago, TGZ453 said:

Thank you for the response.

 

Wish somebody who just applied for a tourist visa in Vientiane would happen to find this thread and come here to verify this confusion.

I think we would hear about it quickly if they started asking to see a bank-statement and/or air-ticket and/or proof of where one will stay.  I have tried to supply those at that embassy before, and had staff literally throw these in the trash-bin.

[sanook 1]

3 hours ago, TGZ453 said:

I'm planning to travel to Vientiane to apply for a tourist visa in the next two days.

Would be great If you could update and also check If the notice published here is still there? I was there on the 7 th dec and didnt see anything outside the gate or inside the counsulate.