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Brunolem

How about Vietnam?

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1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

China and Vietnam appeared perfectly open and free to me, compared quite well to the tyrannical gynocracy that is the UK for freedom IMHO. Just different things you aren't allowed to do, I prefer the restrictions in Thailand/China/Vietnam to the restrictions in the UK.

In these countries, freedom is curtailed openly, whereas in the West freedom is tolerated as long as long as it doesn't interfere with the grand scheme of things.

 

Come a Brexit or a Trump, and freedom becomes untolerable for the real powers, who are not the elected puppets.

 

There is talk of impeachment, of a new referendum, and of course of foreign interference because the sheep are not supposed to rebel.

 

It wouldn't be surprising to see Brexit postponed, or even cancelled, before March is upon us...there are limits to freedom after all...

 

 

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2 hours ago, Brunolem said:

Let me amend this statement: ...unlike many of the pretenders/posters on Thai Visa...

 

The general rule is that really wealthy people don't come spontaneously forward to mention their good fortune, but rather prefer to remain silent about it, for obvious reasons.

 

It is like the guys who are always talking about their success with women...the talking is necessary to compensate for the lack of real activity...

So very true mate.  just like the seals, SAS MI 5 or Mi 6 guys at the Bars one comes across in the bars  a bunch of <deleted>. those who have been at the sharp end say the least

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2 hours ago, possum1931 said:

That would have been in a childrens ward, right?

YES I was eight  Funny thing i went home same day and had Ice cream many years later I needed a repeat op and was pissed of when the gave me Dry toast 55 55

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One bright spot for Vietnam is the PISA scores of their students . Education is the key to a good future. Based on this Vietnam has a much brighter future than Thailand. Vietnam is in the top 10 in Science and Math. Thailand in the bottom half of all countries.

 

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I've been to Hanoi and Saigon a couple of times. 

I never get the feeling of being unsafe. And it was never a problem to cross a busy street in Hanoi. Because people respect each other in terms of traffic. Every biker with a helmet following traffic rules. And ability of speaking English and French is an advantage. Food was not cheap indeed. 

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2 hours ago, Brunolem said:

In these countries, freedom is curtailed openly, whereas in the West freedom is tolerated as long as long as it doesn't interfere with the grand scheme of things.

 

Come a Brexit or a Trump, and freedom becomes untolerable for the real powers, who are not the elected puppets.

 

There is talk of impeachment, of a new referendum, and of course of foreign interference because the sheep are not supposed to rebel.

 

It wouldn't be surprising to see Brexit postponed, or even cancelled, before March is upon us...there are limits to freedom after all...

 

 

Sorry I can't find the connection to Vietnam. So what is your point? 

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On 12/30/2018 at 8:07 PM, scorecard said:

Overall there is respect for the law, way ahead of Thailand.

Its Communist. Unless absolutely necessary, I wont step foot in a Communist country.

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On 12/30/2018 at 9:46 PM, marcusarelus said:

Per capita GDP is 300% greater in Thailand.  $2,303  vs $6,663.  Vietnam is not in the same league.  Vietnam has 23 vehicles per 1000 people Thailand has 225.  It is like comparing the stone age to modernity. 

 

https://countryeconomy.com/countries/compare/vietnam/thailand?sc=XE15

Vietnam , GDP is smaller because a vast majority  of the people still live in rural areas  and are rice farmers , howecver the dvelopment that is  continuing is staggering as is year on year growth . Cities like Danang have 211st Centuries Hospitals  example  Vinacom Hospital , state of the art ..  Beautiful beaches and hinterland  lively expat scene 

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I have lived for the last four years in Vietnam albeit Hanoi which is totally different from Saigon - no one calls it Ho chi minh in the south. But i know it well. Visas are easy but long term quite expensive. Food in the south is good, not so much in the north. Weather pretty much like Thailand but much more susceptible to cyclones. People are pretty much the same everywhere but as a farang you will definitely be more hassled in Vietnamese cities than in Thailand. Infrastructure is not nearly so advanced as Thailand nor is healthcare. Rents and food on a par. Plastic and rubbish pollution even worse although Thai's seem more cleanliness conscious . construction absolutely everywhere which brings dirt and noise and a complete disregard for the environment. I know Thailand from 30 years ago and if I had a choice would prefer to live there but horses for courses. Vietnamese is far more difficult to learn than Thai even though they write in Arabic script. Vietnamese coffee is to die for, scooters in Vietnam are a pain in the ass! Who knows, they have both added so much to my experience of Asia it's not an easy choice. On the whole I find Thai people more to my taste and the government in Vietnam might not be to everyone's taste although it doesn't bother me.

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21 minutes ago, William Miller said:

Vietnam , GDP is smaller because a vast majority  of the people still live in rural areas  and are rice farmers , howecver the dvelopment that is  continuing is staggering as is year on year growth . Cities like Danang have 211st Centuries Hospitals  example  Vinacom Hospital , state of the art ..  Beautiful beaches and hinterland  lively expat scene 

You are right, GDP is not a good indicator.

One could also argue that per capita GDP is higher in Thailand than in China, so obviously Thailand is more of a powerhouse than China...or maybe not...

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21 minutes ago, William Miller said:

Vietnam , GDP is smaller because a vast majority  of the people still live in rural areas  and are rice farmers , howecver the dvelopment that is  continuing is staggering as is year on year growth . Cities like Danang have 211st Centuries Hospitals  example  Vinacom Hospital , state of the art ..  Beautiful beaches and hinterland  lively expat scene 

Beautiful beaches? Not really unless you like rubbish and over development. I've been to Danang loads of times and the coast line has been completely destroyed. It's newer and cleaner than Hanoi or Saigon but gets hit regularly with terrible weather in the rainy season.

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On 12/31/2018 at 5:50 AM, Brunolem said:

GDP is very unreliable obsession, that doesn't reflect the health of a country's economy, but rather the mental health of its leaders. 

 

China is a good example of that, announcing a year in advance a GDP growth of 6.9%, then publishing every quarter a growth that exactly matches the predictions, more or less 0.1%...all that in a 1.4 billion people economy! 

 

And the hapless journalists gobble all that with their mouth wide open, before serving it back to the credulous crowds... 

 

One of the many problems with GDP is that it doesn't take debt into consideration... it is like looking at the assets side of a balance sheet, while ignoring the liabilities side! 

 

The US is very good at using this "loophole", claiming a wonderful GDP growth, while keeping silence on a debt growing at twice the GDP rate, or more... 

Not strictly true, because the USA, along with the rest of the world publishes its debt:gdp ratio, which is a more accurate barometer of a country's health.  At around 107, the USA is caught in a debt trap.  Anything over about 90 is simply not sustainable.  But America will simply print more dollars beyond the $21Tn that it has already printed, and the American people will simply become poorer, year on year.  Strike that last, USA debt is closer to $22Tn!

 

Take a look at debt clocks around the world: http://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

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5 minutes ago, leggo said:

I have lived for the last four years in Vietnam albeit Hanoi which is totally different from Saigon - no one calls it Ho chi minh in the south. But i know it well. Visas are easy but long term quite expensive. Food in the south is good, not so much in the north. Weather pretty much like Thailand but much more susceptible to cyclones. People are pretty much the same everywhere but as a farang you will definitely be more hassled in Vietnamese cities than in Thailand. Infrastructure is not nearly so advanced as Thailand nor is healthcare. Rents and food on a par. Plastic and rubbish pollution even worse although Thai's seem more cleanliness conscious . construction absolutely everywhere which brings dirt and noise and a complete disregard for the environment. I know Thailand from 30 years ago and if I had a choice would prefer to live there but horses for courses. Vietnamese is far more difficult to learn than Thai even though they write in Arabic script. Vietnamese coffee is to die for, scooters in Vietnam are a pain in the ass! Who knows, they have both added so much to my experience of Asia it's not an easy choice. On the whole I find Thai people more to my taste and the government in Vietnam might not be to everyone's taste although it doesn't bother me.

How much does it cost to rent a scooter on a monthly basis in Hanoi or Saigon? In CM TL the cost is 2000 Baht. 

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On 12/31/2018 at 2:05 PM, Brunolem said:

How does that compare with Cambodia, which also offers high rates, yet not that high these days? 

You can get 8% in Cambodia on USD term deposits. Even more on Riel deposits, if you're willing to take the currency risk (it's been pretty stable actually, but I still prefer to deposit in USD). Note that in Cambodia the interest gains are taxed at 6% (residents) or 14% (non-residents). In Vietnam they are tax exempt.

 

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10 minutes ago, leggo said:

I have lived for the last four years in Vietnam albeit Hanoi which is totally different from Saigon - no one calls it Ho chi minh in the south. But i know it well. Visas are easy but long term quite expensive. Food in the south is good, not so much in the north. Weather pretty much like Thailand but much more susceptible to cyclones. People are pretty much the same everywhere but as a farang you will definitely be more hassled in Vietnamese cities than in Thailand. Infrastructure is not nearly so advanced as Thailand nor is healthcare. Rents and food on a par. Plastic and rubbish pollution even worse although Thai's seem more cleanliness conscious . construction absolutely everywhere which brings dirt and noise and a complete disregard for the environment. I know Thailand from 30 years ago and if I had a choice would prefer to live there but horses for courses. Vietnamese is far more difficult to learn than Thai even though they write in Arabic script. Vietnamese coffee is to die for, scooters in Vietnam are a pain in the ass! Who knows, they have both added so much to my experience of Asia it's not an easy choice. On the whole I find Thai people more to my taste and the government in Vietnam might not be to everyone's taste although it doesn't bother me.

 

I've been living in Vung Tau for most of two years, plus some Mekong Delta time in 2011-2012. I pretty much agree with all of your statements. And I particularly like your balanced summation: "they have both added so much to my experience of Asia it's not an easy choice." 

 

I'm not going to rate Thailand over Vietnam or Vietnam over Thailand. They're rich in cultures and well, they each do stuff different. I've benefited from exposure to both. 

 

However, I am considering moving back to Thailand, as a base, with occasional one-month stays in VN. Lots of things I don't like in Thailand but I do like the access to a greater variety of food, local, foreigner-made and imported. I prefer the accommodations in Thailand. And, if I must, declare that Thai girls are overall prettier and more down to earth. Just about everyone I know here who has been to Thailand agrees with this. Yet, the Viet girls are better educated, friendly, outgoing and often have better English. But  . . . fill in your own preferences. 

 

It must be the many years spent in Thailand but every time I arrive at Bangkok airport, I feel at home.  

 

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