Update: New Thai immigration rules for income!

[KhaoYai]

Interesting, people on other threads complaining about it getting more and more difficult to live in Thailand and that the rules keep changing.  Then on this thread people are talking about juggling money between bank accounts so it appears the minimum income is received when in fact it is not.

 

I wonder why the rules keep changing?

Edited January 5, 2019 by KhaoYai

[onera1961]

20 minutes ago, elviajero said:

2. How do people send their monthly pension income to Thailand now?

It seems they take it from ATMs.

[Spidey]

12 minutes ago, elviajero said:

2. How do people send their monthly pension income to Thailand now?

I withdraw cash from my UK credit card (always in excess of 65k), I then immediately re-deposit that cash into my Thai bank account. I have been keeping my credit card receipts from Bangkok Bank in the hope that TI will accept them of proof of income from a foreign source. Somehow, I doubt it.

 

I'm hoping to set up a monthly direct debit from my UK bank to my Thai bank but not sure that this is possible. It would also be more expensive and far less flexible than my current method.

 

It's not possible to have my company pension paid into a Thai bank and I wouldn't want all of my pension coming over either.

[luckyluke]

14 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

Agents will always do using the 400/800K method. They will never use monthly method. 

Maybe or than maybe not.

 

I don't underestimate the inventivity/creativity of some to make money/find loopholes. 

[JLCrab]

1 minute ago, luckyluke said:

I don't underestimate the inventivity/creativity of some to make money/find loopholes.

From the (almost) last lines of Hitchcock's Strangers on a Train of the now dead Bruno:

#1: Who was he, bud?
#2: Bruno ... Bruno Antony. Very clever fellow.

 

[Old Croc]

I've always used the 800k route.

Also, I would've met the qualification of transferring an average of 65k per month. The reason I've never done it this way was the necessity (pain) of dealing with the Embassy/Consulate and paying their large fees just to certify a document.

If Immigration will now just accept evidence from the bank to prove transfers, always part of the 800k method anyway, it would free up the money now held in a dead account.  

For someone like me, in future, my bank book and statements should be sufficient for Immigration to grant the extension without me having to also hold the 800K in a dead account.

My home country income is paid into my bank there, and I transfer large  amounts to my Thai account periodically when exchange rates are favorable. Typically 4-5 times a year.

So my question is - with the proposed changes, do the transfers have to be monthly, or can it be averaged out over the year?

[amexpat]

7 hours ago, jackdd said:

I recommend you watch this video to understand how Transferwise works, then you will understand that you can't use Transferwise if it has to be a transfer from abroad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLKKzRvOsLQ&feature=youtu.be&t=45

 

 

I didn't watch the video because:

 

I used Transferwise last week. Money from the USA hit my BKK account the next day.

 

The Bangkok Bank account statement identifies it as "International Transfer".

 

[onera1961]

8 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

I wonder why the rules keep changing?

To accommodate desperate Americans and British who have fallen in love with this country and want to live here. ????

[onera1961]

3 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

So my question is - with the proposed changes, do the transfers have to be monthly, or can it be averaged out over the year?

No one knows. If it averages over the year, than seasoning has no meaning. They have to transfer only 65x12 (780k Baht)

[onera1961]

10 minutes ago, amexpat said:

The Bangkok Bank account statement identifies it as "International Transfer".

I transfer using Transferwise only. Last year all my transfers show "international transfer" except two. I transfer almost every week 15K. I am closely watching this year but it just started and made only one transfer that arrived yesterday and shows "international transfer". 

Edited January 5, 2019 by onera1961

[Fex Bluse]

It is almost certainly a push from the Thai banks so that they can use your money. If the money is in your account in some other country, they can't earn on it while it sits in your account. The next step will be to manipulate the fees such that you would rather hold larger sums in your Thai accounts rather than making more frequent, smaller transfers.

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, onera1961 said:

I only transfer using Transferwise. Last year all my transfers show "international transfer" except two. I am closely watching this year but it just started and made only one transfer that arrived yesterday and shows "international transfer". 

Well, if the scenario that unfolds required 12x65k transfers from outside Thailand into a Thai account, your extension based on income, just maybe got rejected! 

[SheungWan]

19 minutes ago, KhaoYai said:

Interesting, people on other threads complaining about it getting more and more difficult to live in Thailand and that the rules keep changing.  Then on this thread people are talking about juggling money between bank accounts so it appears the minimum income is received when in fact it is not.

 

I wonder why the rules keep changing?

 

8 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

To accommodate desperate Americans and British who have fallen in love with this country and want to live here. ????

Indeed.

[elviajero]

10 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

1. True. The question then becomes how many people are on the line, and how many people object to transferring more than necessary into Thailand.

2. I don't know about other countries. Centrelink in Australia will transfer pensions to a Thai bank. I don't know if fees are associated, because I have never used that route.

The maximum Australian pension is about 40K baht/month, so an Australian would have to top up to 65K/month with other funds. Fees there.

1. There are undoubtedly some that are going to lose out, but unless they have a massive shortfall there are options.

 

I suspect the biggest losers will be those that, under the current arrangements, have  inflated their income, quoted gross income to cross the line, made up a non existent income. Of which I believe there are a lot.

 

I wouldn’t have thought keeping 320K in the bank would be too much of a problem for most genuine retirees.

[madmen]

Good luck with the following years extension when TI see you playing the 65k Merry go round when they see your bank book. If people choose to play these silly games, you will have the Malaysian model bond system in place here faster than even you could of ever imagined.

You need 2 bank accounts. The one showing your pension and the other used to send money back out again and back to the official account
Can't see how TI could find out

[jacko45k]

27 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

To accommodate desperate Americans and British who have fallen in love with this country and want to live here. ????

Actually the rules were far more accommodating before there really were any!

(EG the restrictions now applied to issuance of Non-Imm O ME visas in UK consulates).

Edited January 5, 2019 by jacko45k

[Moonlover]

Here we go again! 6 pages and 30 posts. All based on hearsay.

 

Wait for the official announcement folks, please!

[SheungWan]

7 minutes ago, madmen said:

You need 2 bank accounts. The one showing your pension and the other used to send money back out again and back to the official account
Can't see how TI could find out

You mean other than having the same name on both accounts?

[jmd8800]

8 hours ago, elviajero said:

There doesn’t appear to be anything new in the OP. 

 

Last I heard, the main issue — coming from the meeting back in December — was how to deal with first time applicants that have only been in the country 3 months.

 

These threads are pointless. We need to wait for the official announcement.

I agree. This info is still rumor / speculation. While it may very well turn out to be true, we really don't know that it is true. Wait for official announcements.

 

This is a disservice to people who are living on the edge as it is. Some will read unsubstantiated info here and make decisions that in turn, turn out to be bad decisions. I know one person already who has regretted his choice he made that was prompted in large part by false information about income letters found on TVF.

[Spidey]

4 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

You mean other than having the same name on both accounts?

Easy. Put one in your wife/girlfriends name. ????

[elviajero]

10 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

It is almost certainly a push from the Thai banks so that they can use your money. If the money is in your account in some other country, they can't earn on it while it sits in your account. The next step will be to manipulate the fees such that you would rather hold larger sums in your Thai accounts rather than making more frequent, smaller transfers.

So the Thai banks went to the foreign embassies to ask that they stop issuing income letters, so that immigration would be forced into accepting monthly foreign transfers as proof of income, knowing the expats wouldn’t want to pay transfer fees and would lump 800K in the bank instead? It’s a theory! ????

[Thaidream]

51 minutes ago, elviajero said:

2. How do people send their monthly pension income to Thailand now?

Very Easy- I have 4 Bank Accounts in an American Bank and use online banking. Then I use  a Thai aTM to withdraw  more than 65K each month.  Only charge is 220 Baht at the Thai atm.

 

Now, I will be spending $40 per transfer and have to call my bank each month to get a security code- go online and fill out all the transfer data when I could simply show my  banking details to Thai Immigration which even shows the exact hour and day and ATM location here in Thailand.  Absolute proof. One sheet to look at plus the ATM cards if they ask plus the  account summary shows the income stream each month direct deposited. 

[madmen]

You mean other than having the same name on both accounts?

Your only showing TI one account. The account where the money is going in not out

[wgdanson]

11 hours ago, Spidey said:

I still wonder how you prove that the 65k baht is from your home country. Foreign transfers aren't always clear in some bank books.

 If you could show a withdrawal from your foreign bank, and a similar deposit in your Thai bank a few days later, would that not be sufficient evidence?   

[elviajero]

19 minutes ago, madmen said:

You need 2 bank accounts. The one showing your pension and the other used to send money back out again and back to the official account
Can't see how TI could find out

They couldn’t. But have you ever tried transferring money out of a Thai bank account that wasn’t earned in a Thailand, or originally received from abroad? 

[jacko45k]

3 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Then I use  a Thai aTM to withdraw  more than 65K each month.

Not many machines can issue this, more usual is a 20,000 or 25,000 max per transaction. Guess what, each one is 220 baht!

[SheungWan]

3 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

 If you could show a withdrawal from your foreign bank, and a similar deposit in your Thai bank a few days later, would that not be sufficient evidence?   

The Tommy Cooper method.

[Thaidream]

1 minute ago, jacko45k said:

Not many machines can issue this, more usual is a 20,000 or 25,000 max per transaction. Guess what, each one is 220 baht!

Thai military Bank 30K per transaction- 220 Baht fee.  No need for bank transfers- account statement shows exact  amount, date and location of transaction backed up by the Thai ATM slip. 

[robsamui]

It just keeps getting sloppier and more problematic every month! Making my head ache. After 22 years of full-time residence here I  just can't wait to get to Vietnam where there is NONE of these kind of hassles. I'm leaving in six weeks

[madmen]

They couldn’t. But have you ever tried transferring money out of a Thai bank account that wasn’t earned in a Thailand, or originally received from abroad? 

No but there appears to be some 3rd party accounts that have been mentioned on this thread like dee and transfer wise.

I'm sure people will find a way