Please Help || DHL Duty/Tax Fee || Package Valued 2X Actual Value

[Daephius]

Any assistance is appreciated.

 

Moved to Chiang Mai a couple months ago.

Ordered myself a Christmas gift online; first time online shopping living in Thailand.

 

Package arrived on Christmas, December 25th.

Received an email from DHL EXPRESS requesting I pay 8801.28THB in duty/tax fees; they would deliver the package upon payment.

• Being ignorant of how duty fees are actually calculated,
• Being excited to receive/open the gift on Christmas, as my first Christmas in Thailand away from home,
  • I promptly paid the fee without question, thinking this was the way things worked.
  • Gut told me the fee was too much to be correct, though Christmas and New Year spirits washed those doubts away.

 

After the holidays I was about to toss the shipment packaging until I noticed on the DHL EXPRESS duty/tax invoice:

• Package was valued as 2X, double, the amount I had paid for including shipping.
• Researched on how duty fees for men's garments are calculated.
  • Duty = +30% of value + FRT. + INS.
  • VAT = +7% of duty + total value.
    • Convinced an error was made after triple checking calculations.

 

Infos:

• Actual package value as stated on email invoice, Paypal invoice, physical paper invoice included in package, bank statement:
  • 10705THB (320.97USD/454.58CAD)
    • Physical paper invoice included in package is in USD.
    • Email, Paypal invoice in THB.
    • Bank statement in CAD.
• Value as stated on DHL duty/tax invoice:
  • 21398.38THB
    • 21398.38/2 = 10699.19
      • Essentially 2X actual amount (10705THB).
  • FRT. = 350THB
  • INS. = 213.98THB
  • Duty = 6588.71THB (30%)
  • VAT = 1998.57THB (7%)
    • Subtotal fee = 8587.28THB
      • DHL disbursement fee = 214THB
        • Total fee = 8801.28THB

 

Triple checking:

• Their calculations are correct based on the 2X, doubled, value of 21398.38THB.
  • 21398.38 (their value) + 350 (FRT.) + 213.98 (INS.) = 21962.36
  • Duty = 30% of 21962.36 = 6588.71
  • VAT = 7% of (21962.36 + 6588.71 = 28551.07) = 1998.57
  • Subtotal = 6588.71 (duty) + 1998.57 (VAT) = 8587.28
  • Total = 8587.28 (subtotal) + 214 (DHL disbursement) = 8787.28 + 14 (more VAT) = 8801.28

 

• Calculations based on the actual price I had paid, value of 10705THB.
  • 10705 (actual value) + 350 (FRT.) + 213.98 (INS.) = 11268.98
  • Duty = 30% of 11268.98 = 3380.70
  • VAT = 7% of (11268.98 + 3380.70 = 14649.68) = 1025.48
  • Subtotal = 3380.70 (duty) + 1025.48 (VAT) = 4406.18
  • Total = 4406.18 (subtotal) + 214 (DHL disbursement) = 4620.18 + 14 (more VAT) = 4634.18

 

• 8801.28 (fee based on their package value)/2 = 4400.64

 

Conclusion: I paid 2X, double, the duty/tax fee I should have because they valued my package as 2X, double, the actual value.

Note: If any one needs proof of the values I've provided, I can post screenshots of the order invoice and a photo of the DHL duty/tax invoice.

 

Apologies for making this so long winded with the calculations/explanations.

If anyone could assist me, it'd be much appreciated.

 

Where should I go, who shall I call or email to get this resolved and receive a refund for the proper duty/tax amount?

• I've already sent these calculations/explanations to DHL EXPRESS through this contact page: http://www.dhl.co.th/en/contact_center/contact_express.html
  • Unfortunately, it's the weekend and they won't respond until the next business day (Monday).
• I've also called DHL EXPRESS' 24 hour contact.
  • Unfortunately, the gentleman over the phone asked me to call back in the morning because there was no way to check this duty/tax discrepancy at this time (past midnight).
• Should I visit the nearest DHL facility in person?
  • I am prepared to provide proof of actual package value in the form of:
    • Email invoice.
    • Paypal invoice.
    • Physical paper invoice included in package.
    • Bank statement.
• Is there any other resource I should contact for support in the event DHL does not cooperate?

 

I understand I should wait and see what the response is from the email contact, as well as when I call again later today; I just feel so foolish for not double checking the duty/tax invoice and researching how duty/tax is calculated prior paying it. I've got this pit in my gut, feeling like I intentionally got conned. I'm a student, not working at the moment, sorting out some health issues before applying for a job. This Christmas gift to myself consisted of quality shirts and vests; to look crisp for future job interviews, professional at landed job, and an investment for the future. I'm budgeting well and was prepared to pay a premium for quality garments... though my budgeting didn't account for paying 2X, double, the amount I should have in duty/tax fees.

 

I've posted this in the hopes one of you could do the calculations to confirm my suspicions, as well as to garner any assistance or resources to resolve this and get my hard earned coin back.

 

 

Thanks, for any help.

Wil

[Crossy]

• What was the value stated on the customs declaration form? (looks like this may be the issue from your info above)
• What was the freight and insurance cost?

 

The sum of the above is this value DHL will use to calculate the duty (CIF - Cost, Insurance, Freight).

 

Was a customs tariff code stated anywhere? (there are quite a lot of tariff codes for "clothing")

 

http://igtf.customs.go.th/igtf/en/main_frame.jsp?lang=en&left_menu=menu_integrated_tariff_search

 

To be honest, now you've paid I think it's game-over ???? But it's worth checking where things went wrong for future knowledge.

 

Whilst I personally have had no issues with DHL (several shipments all correctly charged), it should be noted that all the couriers will charge the maximum they can get away with. If at all possible avoid and use the regular postal service.

 

By the way, you should be able to get decent tailored clothing made here.

 

[neilrob]

Good luck with getting the money back. In future, if at all possible, avoid having items sent here by an express service, such as UPS, DHL, Fedex. If you do, you will always be charged customs duty and a fee from the express service on top. Items sent via the post office by a tracked mail service almost always get in duty free.

[cmsally]

They include cost of freight in their calculation. DHL is bad news as cost of freight expensive, so even if goods are cheap you could still get charged a lot.

[LivinLOS]

12 minutes ago, cmsally said:

They include cost of freight in their calculation. DHL is bad news as cost of freight expensive, so even if goods are cheap you could still get charged a lot.

Hes already factored in CIF. 

 

They do this fairly routinely.. Customs will 'estimate' what an item should be worth. I send packages pretty often and am quite willing to go make a pain in the arse of myself for as long as I like.. I have, even with full proof, never been able to get customs to review an estimate via the post office or the customs dept at the airport (the 2 routes 'mail' customs seem to be operated). 

I have had success with reducing it, before I paid, from couriers like DHL. It was however simply a negotiation, and had no basis of fact or relating to the invoices provided. 

Couriers always max out the fees, I am sure they use it as a profit centre, postal fees tend to slip through much more. 

[cmsally]

Just as an example of how ridiculous it can get; a friend of mine sent a parcel from the post office just before she left. The parcel somehow never got delivered in France and got sent back to Thailand . So we have a parcel clearly originating in Thailand , never received in France and automatically returned as non delivered (of course still unopened with original packaging). The post office sent a note saying I could pick up the parcel after paying 5400 Bt in duty. They would not budge even after stating the obvious in that they were Thai items that had not reached their destination ! Totally bizarre.

[LivinLOS]

33 minutes ago, cmsally said:

Just as an example of how ridiculous it can get; a friend of mine sent a parcel from the post office just before she left. The parcel somehow never got delivered in France and got sent back to Thailand . So we have a parcel clearly originating in Thailand , never received in France and automatically returned as non delivered (of course still unopened with original packaging). The post office sent a note saying I could pick up the parcel after paying 5400 Bt in duty. They would not budge even after stating the obvious in that they were Thai items that had not reached their destination ! Totally bizarre.

Beware sending things overseas for warranty repair.. 

I sent a 10k USD projector for a free repair.. You can guess the rest.. 

[Daephius]

28 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

Hes already factored in CIF. 

 

They do this fairly routinely.. Customs will 'estimate' what an item should be worth. I send packages pretty often and am quite willing to go make a pain in the arse of myself for as long as I like.. I have, even with full proof, never been able to get customs to review an estimate via the post office or the customs dept at the airport (the 2 routes 'mail' customs seem to be operated). 

I have had success with reducing it, before I paid, from couriers like DHL. It was however simply a negotiation, and had no basis of fact or relating to the invoices provided. 

Couriers always max out the fees, I am sure they use it as a profit centre, postal fees tend to slip through much more. 

Not to be rude, I understand everyone here is just trying to help, which I'm grateful. Just seems as though some haven't actually read through what I've written; granted it's a lengthy post.

 

Thank you for taking note I've factored in the CIF, which should be clear from the calculations I've provided.

 

For clarification:

The calculations based on the 21000THB package value that was assigned my package are directly copied from the DHL duty/tax invoice. Which, does include the freight and insurance, abreviated in the calculations as FRT and INS respectively. I literally copied the calculations provided on the DHL duty/tax invoice. 

 

The calculations based on the 10705THB value is the true value and duty/tax of my package, incorporating the FRT and INS fees into the equation.

 

Through calculating the duty/tax of my package's true value (10705THB), I've illustrated the clear correlation between the doubled value DHL has assigned to my package, and, the subsequent doubling of duty/tax.

 

The base value of my package does not change. The price of duty/tax is calculated from this base value. It's rather clear to me that my package's true 10705THB value was doubled to 21400THB. Naturally, the true duty/tax I should have paid at 4400THB was also doubled to 8800THB.

 

I understand quite vividly how duty/tax works since I've started researching it. There are no special percentages in regard to the garments I ordered; they are just dress shirts and vests. It even says right on the DHL duty/tax invoice that the duty is 30% and VAT is 7% of package value; which is exactly as my research has found to be true.

 

Please, don't get me wrong. I appreciate the time anyone and everyone's taken to comment out of the goodness of your hearts. 

 

I just trying to clarify that I grasp the duty/tax calculations quite well and am not asking how to calculate. I've provided the calculations to prove I do understand their workings.

 

What I am asking is:

What can I do to dispute this for a refund of the 4400THB extra I was told to pay?

Is it best to visit DHL in person with my invoices as proof of the true value of my package?

Is there any resource I that can help me in disputing this?

Or, am I stuck with calling/emailing DHL?

 

 

Thanks, again.

[Daephius]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

• What was the value stated on the customs declaration form? (looks like this may be the issue from your info above)
• What was the freight and insurance cost?

 

The sum of the above is this value DHL will use to calculate the duty (CIF - Cost, Insurance, Freight).

 

Was a customs tariff code stated anywhere? (there are quite a lot of tariff codes for "clothing")

 

http://igtf.customs.go.th/igtf/en/main_frame.jsp?lang=en&left_menu=menu_integrated_tariff_search

 

To be honest, now you've paid I think it's game-over ???? But it's worth checking where things went wrong for future knowledge.

 

Whilst I personally have had no issues with DHL (several shipments all correctly charged), it should be noted that all the couriers will charge the maximum they can get away with. If at all possible avoid and use the regular postal service.

 

By the way, you should be able to get decent tailored clothing made here.

 

Here's the tariff #: 621290910006

 

Appreciate the help.

[LivinLOS]

5 minutes ago, Daephius said:

What I am asking is:

What can I do to dispute this for a refund of the 4400THB extra I was told to pay?

Is it best to visit DHL in person with my invoices as proof of the true value of my package?

Is there any resource I that can help me in disputing this?

Or, am I stuck with calling/emailing DHL?

They have your money.. Your chances of getting it reviewed down now range from slim to none.. 

 

If you had tried before paying you may have had a chance. Took me weeks to get one they 'estimated' high reviewed and I only got it 50% closer to the actual price I paid, and that was with it undelivered and unpaid for. 

 

Good luck and would be happy to be wrong.. But I have been in this situation before and they will stonewall. 

 

Same at customs at the airport.. I ordered a leather bike jacket used from ebay.. 65 bucks.. Item arrives estimated 200 bucks and the 30+7 on top.. Even with the reciepts, the ebay transaction, the proof of what I paid.. They wouldnt change it.. "well thats what it would cost here" was vaguely stated. Pay up of dont get it was the general message. 

 

I send everything normal post (registered) and with a 20 USD value.. Probably gets through 50 - 70% of the time.. If I get caught I fight and pay, its a numbers game. 

 

[Daephius]

9 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

They have your money.. Your chances of getting it reviewed down now range from slim to none.. 

 

If you had tried before paying you may have had a chance. Took me weeks to get one they 'estimated' high reviewed and I only got it 50% closer to the actual price I paid, and that was with it undelivered and unpaid for. 

 

Good luck and would be happy to be wrong.. But I have been in this situation before and they will stonewall. 

 

Same at customs at the airport.. I ordered a leather bike jacket used from ebay.. 65 bucks.. Item arrives estimated 200 bucks and the 30+7 on top.. Even with the reciepts, the ebay transaction, the proof of what I paid.. They wouldnt change it.. "well thats what it would cost here" was vaguely stated. Pay up of dont get it was the general message. 

 

I send everything normal post (registered) and with a 20 USD value.. Probably gets through 50 - 70% of the time.. If I get caught I fight and pay, its a numbers game. 

 

I see...

 

So, it matters not what the legitimate value is, they simply estimate?

 

I'd've disputed and refused payment had I known any of this before. Only after I paid did I see the doubled value assignsd to my package on the DHL duty/tax invoice, then did research on how it's all calculated. After going through their calculations, then using the same formula, but with the legitimate value instead of their doubled value, I understood; the duty/tax price was 8800THB for a 10705THB package because they assigned 2X the value to my 10705THB package, estimating it as 21400THB... when the 30/7% duty/tax (including FRT/INS) for a 10705THB package should've been 4400THB, exactly 1/2 of the price they had me pay.

 

How foolish and naive of me.

Was so worried I wouldn't have the package to open on Christmas that I paid without investigating.

 

How've you disputed your cases?

Did you go in person, call, email?

Is DHL the one I deal with, or, is there another entity I should contact?

 

 

Thanks.

[Crossy]

9 minutes ago, Daephius said:

Here's the tariff #: 621290910006

Appreciate the help.

OK, according to the site I linked to 6212.909100 is "Compression garment of a kind used for the treatment of scar tissue and skin grafts". The general 6212 is brassieres and the like. So unless you're not telling us something, someone guessed.

 

The good news is that you're right, the rate is 30% of CIF, so you got that right.

 

This is your issue methinks (my bold):-

 

Quote

 

Value as stated on DHL duty/tax invoice:

• 21398.38THB
  • 21398.38/2 = 10699.19
    • Essentially 2X actual amount (10705THB).

 

You need to check what value was quoted when the item was shipped (on the original customs declaration). If you don't have a copy you might try asking the seller.

 

To be honest, where do you draw the line when the time/hassle outweighs the (possible) reward?

 

 

[Daephius]

2 minutes ago, Crossy said:

OK, according to the site I linked to 6212.909100 is "Compression garment of a kind used for the treatment of scar tissue and skin grafts". The general 6212 is brassieres and the like. So unless you're not telling us something, someone guessed.

 

The good news is that you're right, the rate is 30% of CIF, so you got that right.

 

This is your issue methinks (my bold):-

 

You need to check what value was quoted when the item was shipped (on the original customs declaration). If you don't have a copy you might try asking the seller.

 

To be honest, where do you draw the line when the time/hassle outweighs the (possible) reward?

 

 

Thanks for helping me out.

 

I was confused when I looked up the tariff # on the link you provided. I don't understand how Indian style dress shirts and vests are considered compression skin graft what?

 

I ordered from Mirraw.com.

It's only an Indian tradition ethnic marketplace.

 

I only have invoices from Mirraw.com, Paypal, and bank statement. I'll contact Mirraw support and request thd original customs declaration.

 

I'm thoroughly perplexed now.

Just wanted some fancy Indian ethnic dress shirts (kurta) and vests (nehru jacket). I can't comprehend how that's considered a compression healing thing(?).

 

Feels as though I'm in uncanny valley.

So confused right now.

[Daephius]

16 minutes ago, Crossy said:

OK, according to the site I linked to 6212.909100 is "Compression garment of a kind used for the treatment of scar tissue and skin grafts". The general 6212 is brassieres and the like. So unless you're not telling us something, someone guessed.

 

The good news is that you're right, the rate is 30% of CIF, so you got that right.

 

This is your issue methinks (my bold):-

 

You need to check what value was quoted when the item was shipped (on the original customs declaration). If you don't have a copy you might try asking the seller.

 

To be honest, where do you draw the line when the time/hassle outweighs the (possible) reward?

 

 

Here's an example of what I ordered.

I got 3 vests, 9 shirts.

Special Christmas sale.

[LivinLOS]

18 minutes ago, Daephius said:

How've you disputed your cases?

Did you go in person, call, email?

Is DHL the one I deal with, or, is there another entity I should contact?

For courier.. I refused to pay. and then a long series of arguments, calls and back and forth email proofs etc started. 

 

For post I have argued at the post office (stonewalled.. pay or we send it back or destroy it. I get the feeling its not in thier control) and at the airport.. Airport is more arguable but it became a game in the end.. 

Eg I sent about 3rd an actual 650cc motorbike with a 20 usd value.. huge boxes of parts.. That came through !!! 

 

I also sent 3 TV streaming boxes with a 1 dollar value each.. As they were used I even paid someone 3 bucks via paypal and had invoice, transaction proof, everything. Screw them, if they want to screw me, I will screw them back.. That was a fun argument. 

[cmsally]

My assumption is that because DHL collects on Customs behalf they have some sort of deal going. You could start with DHL and show them the calculations and how you have been overcharged. I would predict that they send you to Customs in order to pursue the issue. As above , I suspect their answer will be that "estimated value" makes it correct in their eyes!

[Crossy]

Clothing in general does seem to be an issue with Thai customs, we've had all sorts of reports of silly amounts of duty being requested for (even used) garments. Invariably these have been sent via one of the couriers.

 

Treat it as a life-lesson and move on.

 

[Daephius]

7 minutes ago, cmsally said:

My assumption is that because DHL collects on Customs behalf they have some sort of deal going. You could start with DHL and show them the calculations and how you have been overcharged. I would predict that they send you to Customs in order to pursue the issue. As above , I suspect their answer will be that "estimated value" makes it correct in their eyes!

I paid for it with Mastercard, not cash.

 

If DHL won't cooperate, I suppose I could dispute through Mastercard. My father has done this with the airline that refused to reschedule my flight from Japan to Thailand due to typhoons (Trami and Kong Rey), also refused to provide a refund.

 

My father wasn't the least bit worried, just asked me for the email proofs of AirAsia wasting my time, not rescheduling the flight, and all that. Mastercard reimbursed him no fuss.

 

I hope that works.

[Daephius]

14 minutes ago, Crossy said:

Clothing in general does seem to be an issue with Thai customs, we've had all sorts of reports of silly amounts of duty being requested for (even used) garments. Invariably these have been sent via one of the couriers.

 

Treat it as a life-lesson and move on.

 

A life-lesson, indeed.

 

I know now to avoid courier if I've the option; if I don't, refuse/dispute the duty/tax if it's incorrect. This experience had me learn how to calculate duty/tax, to tripple check before paying.

 

Though I'm rather stubborn, I'll do all I can to find a resolution until I've exhausted all routes.

 

I was just on the phone with DHL. The gentleman was rather helpful, he looked up my 'waybill' # after I explain the situation. He confirmed the invoiced amount to be 320.97USD (about 10705THB), said they'll investigate the discrepancy, and call me back tomorrow.

 

Really am grateful for your info and assistance. The link you provided to check the tariff # provided me yet more evidence a ridiculous error was made; dress shirts and vests most definitely cannit be mistook for a 'compression garment used to treat scars and skin grafts'. Even the gentleman on the phone took pause when I explained what was found when looking up the tariff # in comparrison to the actual itemized invoice.

[NancyL]

Frank and Vanita at Fashion King here in Chiang Mai could make quality garments like the ones shown for you.  They are of Indian heritage and do quality tailoring work.