Teachers-to-be can graduate with poor English, Thai panel decides

[Maestro]

Removed three troll posts.

[HalfLight]

3 hours ago, scorecard said:

It can be better if there is a serious desire / will to achieve better. 

 

For a lot of reasons, most of them venal and disreputable, this will not happen, though I agree it should.

 

 

 

[dcnx]

This is the future of Thailand. How you do one thing is how you do everything.

 

I personally can’t wait to see all of Thailand’s neighbors blow past and develop, in turn hiring Thais to clean their toilets and build their low quality buildings.

 

Thais will always be peasants and laughed at on the world stage. The best part is, they are too ignorant to notice everyone looks down upon them.

[marcusarelus]

9 minutes ago, dcnx said:

This is the future of Thailand. How you do one thing is how you do everything.

 

I personally can’t wait to see all of Thailand’s neighbors blow past and develop, in turn hiring Thais to clean their toilets and build their low quality buildings.

 

Thais will always be peasants and laughed at on the world stage. The best part is, they are too ignorant to notice everyone looks down upon them.

I think if you add the GNP's of Vietnam, Laos, Burma and Cambodia together they might have a chance in the next 10 years. 

[fruitman]

9 hours ago, SoilSpoil said:

Good news for my kids, who are fluent in both languages. Their future job market value stays guaranteed.

I was at the furniture fair in impact muang thong BKK....there were several property developers selling condo's in Pattaya, they had names like Monaco and Cote dÁzur...

 

The sales all approached me but when they found out i spoke english to them they all backed off with their tail behind their legs....

 

What a joke! Bunch of wannabe's, like if Pattaya has ANYTHING in common with Monaco...????

[MaxYakov]

When "no have" is good enough!

[somtumwrong]

Some five years back I dated a 26 year old English teacher from Isaan for a mere week. She was nice and pretty but the problem was she could not communicate with me. I mean, she did not understand me, I did not understand her. Her skills were below any little kid in my home country who had learned English as a foreign language for more than one year.

 

I speak English daily with people from all parts of this planet, so the problem must be me.

 

TIA. Sorry, TIT.

[nong38]

Usual local standards apply then.

[fruitman]

6 hours ago, robsamui said:

Having said that - with online Google speech translate, perhaps today learning languages is no longer strictly necessary. But when was the last time you saw a Thai pull out their phone so that they could understand what you were saying in English?

They do that regularly to me but i don't like to wait for that...

 

Now i refuse to speak to ANY salesperson in Thailand...i'm done with it...i know the standard answers already, no hab, don know, cannot...if i don't see the product i want to buy i go elsewhere period.

 

They also don't need to run away for me anymore (like in Takashimaya Icon Siam) because then i tell them that i can speak thai, in thai. 

 

So tomorrow i'll go shopping for clothes in Singapore, have a whole shoppinglist already and i also will get big money out of their atm's because i can use it without the 220 baht surcharge like in Thailand.

 

We go eat a lot of Malay/Indo food, see the free lightshow at the Marina Bay (is awesome), wife needs a new purse again and shoes from there and thinks the staff in Gucci Thailand is rude to her so she buys it in Singapore.

 

Well done thailand, you'll miss another 5000 euro from us..

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

13 minutes ago, fruitman said:

Now i refuse to speak to ANY salesperson in Thailand...i'm done with it...i know the standard answers already, no hab, don know, cannot...if i don't see the product i want to buy i go elsewhere period.

 

That's the result of their ardent study in their English classes!!!  Not to mention training in providing excellent customer service....

[JGV]

The members of the ruling junta and a chunk of the population insist that Thainess be priority 1 meaning nationalism is to be promoted. They fear a rise in English use would erode nationalism and threaten their grip on power. So any method adopted to eliminate the need for English is to be applauded - that is why English is so poor and teachers are not taught to learn English and then subsequently teach English

[chainarong]

Typical lazy response to a major problem , I actually felt embarrassed with that cop at immigration and the Saudi girl going to Canada, having to have a interpreter when facing the Western media, top man and no education skills.

[onlycw]

Every one gets a passing score at my private school as well. Blank page? Who cares?! 

[ReMarKable]

10 hours ago, ZeVonderBearz said:

If they're not teaching English then they don't need it. Even if a higher grasp of English was required, all the teachers, even if they don't speak a lick of English, would all graduate with the certificate saying they are English proficient. No fails, none of the time.

No, can only fail a certain percentage based on ethnicity, age , family contributions to the school and a reduction in English skills in the school overall.

[observer90210]

Scary !!!...hope they do not apply similar rules for doctors just to enable them to pass the exam !!!

[scorecard]

 

1. "If they are not teaching English they don't need it".  IMHO a more worldly more pragmatic attitude is needed, ultimately there must be value in all teachers speaking English as part of English language development for the nation and able to use key English words and terms in lessons and more.

 

2. If your talking about universities this has changed a bit:

 

- At my uni attendance records are solid, even to the point where admin. sattf arrive unannounced take the sign-in sheets and count the number of students in the room and more... 

Less than 80% overall attendance eans an automatic F grade. If the professor sidesteps this and gives a passing grade the admin. will change it back to F.

 

Same if students miss 2 compulsory class room individual assignments - automatic F. Student get marks total of say 85 /100 but has missed 1 assignment the professor must explain and if no solid explanation the grade goes to F.

 

Also in recent years students dismissed for behavior, disrupting classes and more quite a few students have been totally dismissed, also meaning their marks, grades and credits are totally cancelled and they can't ask for a grades summary to take to another university and gain credits. Credits are gone, there is nothing to take to another uni. 

 

And all other above has pushed many students to be more serious about study, attendance, behaviors etc. and I've had many more cases where the serious students ask for the professor take some action with students who continuously chat etc.

 

 

[HalfLight]

6 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

1. "If they are not teaching English they don't need it".  IMHO a more worldly more pragmatic attitude is needed, Ultimately there must ve value in all teachers speaking English as part of English language development for the nation and able to use key English words and terms in lessons and more.

 

2. If your talking about universities this has changed a bit:

 

- At my uni attendance records are solid, less than 80% attendance 80% means an automatic F grade. If the professor sidesteps this and gives a passing grade the admin. will change it back to F.

 

Same if students miss 2 compulsory class room individual assignments - automatic F, students get marks total of say 85 /100 but has missed 1 assignment the professor must explain and if not solid explanation the garde goes to F.

 

Also in recent years students dismissed for behavior, disruption classes and more quite a few students have been totally dismissed, also meaning their marks, grades and credits are cancelled and they can't ask for a grades summary to try to take same to another university and gain credits. credits are gone, nothing to take to another uni. 

 

And all other above has pushed many students to be more serious about study, atendance, behaviors etc. 

Which Uni?

 

 

 

[trainman34014]

3 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

English will be an important language to learn unless these two industries switch to another language:

 

1.  Aviation:  Pilots, ATC, cabin attendants, mechanics and even gate agents use English.  So I guess Thai students do not want to be pilots, aircraft mechanics or even flight attendants.  

2.  Information Technology:  Computer programs are written in English.   My guess is the creators of the Line App wrote the program in English.  I believe the Line App is the most popular App in LOS? 

 

Who knows maybe in 25 years Mandarin will become the Universal Language?

Then are Thai students in a mad dash to learn Mandarin or Cantonese?  My guess is they are not.  Then exactly what are Thai students or even teachers eager to learn?   

They are eager to learn how to get rich in the fastest possible way, preferably by taking after their 'Leaders' and somehow get on the gravy train of scams, extortion, brown envelopes etc etc.

[pubboy]

But must be fluent in Mandarin????

[pubboy]

But must be fluent in Mandarin????

[vinegarbase]

Does anyone really care? The Thais don't care. They think they know it all already and don't need you to tell them anything. I learned a long time ago to not solicit your opinion or advice to Thai people it is the biggest waste of time and breathe there is. You could see them rubbing two sticks together to try to start a fire and try to hand them matches and they will not even look at the matches and keep rubbing those sticks together thinking their way is best because it works for them in the end. Leave them to their own devices and you will have a much happier life. 

[fruitman]

1 hour ago, HalfLight said:

Excellent. The only useful answer to the common Thai view that the customer is someone to be looked down upon.

 

Excellent.

Well i've been in those LV. Gucci, Prada shops several times with my wife because she always wants to visit them wherever we are on the world....But i agree that in Singapore MArina Bay mall everything is absolutely perfect....Perfect english, very good manners, kind, polite, no attitude, clean, organised all perfect....Except......When my wife said OK i want this one (100.000 baht purse from LV) the sales said: sorry but it's sold out, in 14 days we have new stock!! We spent a whole afternoon for that to hear that it's sold out!!

 

Anyway, my wife is also Thai and works hard for those things. She's also sales and i agree with her to avoid those shops in BKK, even if we pay extra in Singapore. It's all about the good vibes you get from buying something like that.

 

 

[HalfLight]

5 minutes ago, vinegarbase said:

Does anyone really care? The Thais don't care. They think they know it all already and don't need you to tell them anything. I learned a long time ago to not solicit your opinion or advice to Thai people it is the biggest waste of time and breathe there is. You could see them rubbing two sticks together to try to start a fire and try to hand them matches and they will not even look at the matches and keep rubbing those sticks together thinking their way is best because it works for them in the end. Leave them to their own devices and you will have a much happier life. 

 

Not sure who your post was aimed at but it does seem like a fair comment.

 

To be candid though, I neither know nor care what works for them in the end and what doesn't. I have (as I suspect you have) learned not to waste my breath on Thais, they will find their own way. Or not. Either way, it isn't my problem but it doesn't mean I cant speculate and discuss with people who (in general) seem to be brighter and more experienced. That way I can learn and they might learn, both of us without having to endure what is usually an unsatisfactory exchange with Thais.

[HalfLight]

10 minutes ago, fruitman said:

Well i've been in those LV. Gucci, Prada shops several times with my wife because she always wants to visit them wherever we are on the world....But i agree that in Singapore MArina Bay mall everything is absolutely perfect....Perfect english, very good manners, kind, polite, no attitude, clean, organised all perfect....Except......When my wife said OK i want this one (100.000 baht purse from LV) the sales said: sorry but it's sold out, in 14 days we have new stock!! We spent a whole afternoon for that to hear that it's sold out!!

 

Anyway, my wife is also Thai and works hard for those things. She's also sales and i agree with her to avoid those shops in BKK, even if we pay extra in Singapore. It's all about the good vibes you get from buying something like that.

 

 

My wife and I enjoy rather less elevated places, but the attitude of Thais seems to be the same; often condescending, nearly always discourteous and (with a farang) always replete with a fake courtesy and a preparedness to completely ignore.

 

I guess the national characteristic (which comes from the culture) is a high bar to jump over, wherever in Thailand you find yourself lobbing up in. Not that I really mind, I have learned not to. There are subtle ways of bringing one of our less intelligent brothers and sisters down a peg or two. I get better at it the more practice I get, but it's an option of last resort. The problem with burning down the house is that you often can't put it back together, even if that is the desrired outcome. Being a long-time student of behaviour helps.

 

Good luck to you.

[fruitman]

22 minutes ago, vinegarbase said:

Does anyone really care? The Thais don't care. They think they know it all already and don't need you to tell them anything. I learned a long time ago to not solicit your opinion or advice to Thai people it is the biggest waste of time and breathe there is. You could see them rubbing two sticks together to try to start a fire and try to hand them matches and they will not even look at the matches and keep rubbing those sticks together thinking their way is best because it works for them in the end. Leave them to their own devices and you will have a much happier life. 

Exactly....When we had our new kitchen built (expensive one) they had to cut the granito for my stove and sink...they came with cardboard templates which you put on the granito and cut within the template and that's it...

 

They were measuring and investigating how to cut so i put the template on the granito and took the cutter and told them in my best thai to cut within the template....so i left, came back later and they hadn't use the template and even cut the whole too large...

 

Lucky the stove still fitted but if not they would have to pay for it....they also broke the granito when cutting the sink...they asked me if i would accept 1000 baht and they would fix the crack...i denied and said i wanted a new piece of granito which i got but they were not kind anymore and didn't glue it to the cabinets...so i had to do that myself after they were gone. It was 10.000 baht only for putting the granito on the cabinets, no material costs....1 day work....i thought they would do it in their huge factory with a cnc machine but they were grinding granito all day under my carport making much noise and dust.

 

No matter how much you help or pay them, they will still be donkeys and never learn from their mistakes.

[fruitman]

23 minutes ago, HalfLight said:

My wife and I enjoy rather less elevated places, but the attitude of Thais seems to be the same; often condescending, nearly always discourteous and (with a farang) always replete with a fake courtesy and a preparedness to completely ignore.

 

I guess the national characteristic (which comes from the culture) is a high bar to jump over, wherever in Thailand you find yourself lobbing up in. Not that I really mind, I have learned not to. There are subtle ways of bringing one of our less intelligent brothers and sisters down a peg or two. I get better at it the more practice I get, but it's an option of last resort. The problem with burning down the house is that you often can't put it back together, even if that is the desrired outcome. Being a long-time student of behaviour helps.

 

Good luck to you.

It's not only about being able to speak english, Thai should also learn how to treat a customer with respect. No matter how rich they are themselves or how small the order is, just make sure the customer is happy and comes back next time....Don't waste his time, work efficient, don't play with the phone in the meantime or talk to collegues...Don't ask stupid questions or anything else....and sure don't dig your nose in front of a customer.....and not at all if you work in a bar/restaurant...(i 've seen it all).

 

In Singapore they do it all perfect, everywhere...nobody is annoying me there by standing in my way or pushing or following customers nonstop.....

 

Oh well, thai refusing to learn something...what else is new.

 

But even Icon Siam is far far away from the standards they have in Singapore...and the Thai will never ever reach that level...

 

[dcnx]

41 minutes ago, fruitman said:

Exactly....When we had our new kitchen built (expensive one) they had to cut the granito for my stove and sink...they came with cardboard templates which you put on the granito and cut within the template and that's it...

 

They were measuring and investigating how to cut so i put the template on the granito and took the cutter and told them in my best thai to cut within the template....so i left, came back later and they hadn't use the template and even cut the whole too large...

 

Lucky the stove still fitted but if not they would have to pay for it....they also broke the granito when cutting the sink...they asked me if i would accept 1000 baht and they would fix the crack...i denied and said i wanted a new piece of granito which i got but they were not kind anymore and didn't glue it to the cabinets...so i had to do that myself after they were gone. It was 10.000 baht only for putting the granito on the cabinets, no material costs....1 day work....i thought they would do it in their huge factory with a cnc machine but they were grinding granito all day under my carport making much noise and dust.

 

No matter how much you help or pay them, they will still be donkeys and never learn from their mistakes.

Farmers with hammers.

 

I am amazed structures still stand here. 

[marcusarelus]

3 hours ago, somtumwrong said:

Some five years back I dated a 26 year old English teacher from Isaan for a mere week. She was nice and pretty but the problem was she could not communicate with me. I mean, she did not understand me, I did not understand her. Her skills were below any little kid in my home country who had learned English as a foreign language for more than one year.

 

I speak English daily with people from all parts of this planet, so the problem must be me.

 

TIA. Sorry, TIT.

I have not had any problems with teachers from Issan.  I love them.  Of course this is Thailand and when I got here 20 years ago the first thing I did was enroll in a college for English classes.  You might want to look up Thai proverbs about When in the city of the slanted-eyed, do squint your eyes.  The sun set on your empire years ago. 

[fruitman]

10 minutes ago, HalfLight said:

Yes, and until they do learn, the slap-down is an effective way of walking away and leaving bewilderment and embarrassment nehnd you. I must be a truly awful person, but there's a certain delight in turning an arrogant nose-down-looker into something he or she will be embarrassed about for a long time.

 

Bad HalfLight...

 

 

 

I agree i do the same since a few years...before i would never look down or treat anybody bad buy thailand makes me do it as well....i even look who's behind me now when i open a door and just let it fall right in their face....(like they always do to me).

 

But it's also staff running around in shops and not waiting for me to pass first when we enter a corner at the same time...i don't stop anymore and i'm double their size and weight...It's fun for me now and i would have never thought of becoming so rude....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[marcusarelus]

8 minutes ago, dcnx said:

Farmers with hammers.

I am amazed structures still stand here. 

My first English teacher, an old lady, lived in a 200 year old home in Chiang mai.  Are you not interested in seeing old Thai culture?  Lots of examples of ancient buildings and culture and tradition.