Stay longterm on tourist visas and visa exceptions

[alfonsalfons1]

Hi all.

 

I am a citizen of a western country. I do not work in Thailand. I have the funds to support myself. I do not have enough for an elite visa and I am far from 50 years old. I am not married to a Thai and I do not have a Thai child, however I want a family in the future if I meet someone I love. I have already researched ED-visas for Muai Thai and found gyms I can go to which will provide me with visas. I am already doing Muai Thai a few times a week, however, my gym does not provide visas. I do not want to change gym for several reasons including the fact that my gym is better located (close to my place), cheaper and I have all my friends at my gym. If necessary I will do the ED-visa for Muai Thai. However, I want to put it off for as long as possible and stay on tourist visas and visa exceptions until I absolutely must do the ED-visa. 

 

Here is my history: 

September 2016 - May 2017: Student visa (university)

December 2017 - February 2017: Visa exception + extension (came from Japan) 

February 2017 - April 2017: Tourist visa + extension from Kuala Lumpur

April 2017 - June 2017: Visa exception + extension (arrived through the Nong Kai border)

*New passport*

September 2018 - November 2018: Tourist visa + extension from my home country. Only used two days of the extension though.

November 2018 - January 2018: Visa exception + extension (arrived from my home country)

Now I just applied for a tourist visa from KL witch will last until April if I extend it. 

 

Planned:

April 2019 - June 2019: Border bounce + extension (perhaps Kanjanaburi border?)

June 2019 - September 2019: Tourist visa + extension from my home country 

September 2019 - November 2019: 

Border bounce + extension (perhaps Kanjanaburi border?)

November 2019 - February 2020: Tourist visa from KL or Vientiane or Savannaket or HCMC?

February 2020 - onward: two more border bonces + extensions and more turist visas from neighboring countries for as long as possible.

 

How long can I keep up with the visa exceptions and tourist visas and how do I do it in the best possible way? From what I can understand, after today spending almost all day reading your discussions here, there are a few things that can happen.

 

1. I will be denied entry. However, I always have 20000 baht, flight out and my rental agreement with me. Therefore they should not have any grounds to deny my entry since I not work here. I can still enter and make the papers to go to apply for a ED-visa.

2. I will be denied a visa. Then I can still enter and make the papers to go to apply for a ED-visa.

3. I receive a warning stamp with my visa. I can still enter and make the papers to go to apply for a ED-visa.

 

I will primarily use land borders, Nong Kai and Mukdahan if I apply for a visa at Savannaket or Vientiane. If I fly in I will fly in only to Suvarnapum, not Don Muang. 

 

Any input on this plan would be highly appreciated. 

Kind regards

[FritsSikkink]

1) If denied entry, you won't come in.

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

1. I will be denied entry. However, I always have 20000 baht, flight out and my rental agreement with me. Therefore they should not have any grounds to deny my entry since I not work here. I can still enter and make the papers to go to apply for a ED-visa.

If you use Tourist Visas and carry the required 20K Baht in Cash or Travelers Checks, you will only be "denied entry" if you enter at an entry-point that makes up and illegally enforces non-existent rules.  These include several airports plus the Poipet/Aranyaprathet border-crossing. 

At all other land-borders you will be fine.  You might also be OK flying into Chiang Mai, but being denied-entry at an airport can be a major PITA.

 

1 hour ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

2. I will be denied a visa. Then I can still enter and make the papers to go to apply for a ED-visa.

This is why you should not use your 2x land-border Visa Exempt entries, except in this circumstance - so you can return Visa-Exempt.  Then try another consulate when that entry/extension expires.

 

1 hour ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

3. I receive a warning stamp with my visa. I can still enter and make the papers to go to apply for a ED-visa.

You could also use that visa "with remark stamp" to enter, and immediately apply for a new passport from your embassy.  You will get the Visa next time, because the Thai consulates only count what they see in your passport.  Consulate personnel will recommend this course of action.

 

See my post below for the strategy which works best to get the most Tourist Visas out of a passport:

 

[alfonsalfons1]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

If you use Tourist Visas and carry the required 20K Baht in Cash or Travelers Checks, you will only be "denied entry" if you enter at an entry-point that makes up and illegally enforces non-existent rules.  These include several airports plus the Poipet/Aranyaprathet border-crossing. 
 

 

Thanks a lot Jack for your answer! You seem to be up to date about this. 

 

You make many interesting points both in this post and in the one you made on November 6th. 

 

Good idea to save the visa exceptions in case one is denied entry. However, to use one of them and save the other would not be a problem, or would it? And the second remaining one could be used at the end of the year. 

 

As I understand it, most people will be sent back to the destination they came from if they are denied entry. It would therefore be a good idea to only apply for visa in neighboring countries: Malaysia, Cambodia and Laos. Vietnam and Hong Kong are two other countries that you mention. In my current plan I might do a border run, a visa from my home country, a visa from Penang and then one more border run. Then I would be good until January 2020 and from there go to Vientiane three times and then Savannaket. Would it be a bad idea to use the two border entrances like this?

 

The idea of getting a new passport is not thrilling to me. Then I rather do the ED-visa I wrote about in my first post. My country only allows three passport to be issued within three years and since I just got a new one last year and my previous one was only three months old I can only do one more now. If I do that and for some reason lose it I might not be able to receive a new passport until five years have past. Furthermore, I know they do not like to issue new passports without a reason. My last one was running out of empty pages so they accepted it, but I am not sure if they would issue a new one just for me to apply for more Thai visas. Of course I could damage in in some way, drop it in the swimming pool or something, but that might also cause more problems, especially since my then current entry stamp might not be visible. Perhaps some other countries are not as strict as mine regarding issuing of new passports. 

 

I have not followed the discussion in this forum before, but catched up on all relevant discussions that had post after beginning of December. It seems to me like Don Muang is the really troublesome airport and that Suvarnapum is less likely to cause problems? I am based in Bangkok so to fly into Chiang Mai does not seem like a good option, even though it might be a safe entry point. Same goes for the southern borders. The good thing with Vientiane and Savannaket is that I can fly up there but exit at a land border. 

 

I will try to follow relevant discussions here on Thaivisa. 

 

Thanks again for your valuable input.

 

Kind regards

[DrJack54]

"I am far from 50".... Good luck ducking and weaving for next whatever years. Buy lotto and hopefully you can obtain elite visa. 500k. Bargain.

[alfonsalfons1]

13 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

"I am far from 50".... Good luck ducking and weaving for next whatever years. Buy lotto and hopefully you can obtain elite visa. 500k. Bargain.

One can do ED-visa for Muai Thai up to five years, expensive though. I can also get married and/or have a child. 

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

Good idea to save the visa exceptions in case one is denied entry. However, to use one of them and save the other would not be a problem, or would it? And the second remaining one could be used at the end of the year. 

A total visa-exempt count can work against you if you fly in - but if not flying, you could use your 2x Visa-Exempts by land at the end of each year.

 

2 hours ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

As I understand it, most people will be sent back to the destination they came from if they are denied entry. It would therefore be a good idea to only apply for visa in neighboring countries: Malaysia, Cambodia and Laos. Vietnam and Hong Kong are two other countries that you mention.

If sent back to Vietnam, and you don't have a visa, you could end up having to buy another ticket somewhere else - maybe your home country.  Similar with Myanmar, though Yangoon is a decent consulate for an SETV.  Cambodia also gave someone trouble on a rejected-entry "send back," recently.   I don't recall any rejected-entries on send-backs to Laos, but they tend to work with Thailand, so it could happen. 

 

Malaysia, OTOH, has been reported to apologize for how Thailand treated a visitor - no problem if sent back there - but also an easy place to take a train-in from - good decent-speed train system there (electric) with frequent service.

 

2 hours ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

My country only allows three passport to be issued within three years and since I just got a new one last year and my previous one was only three months old I can only do one more now. If I do that and for some reason lose it I might not be able to receive a new passport until five years have past

This is why the order of using Thai Consulates for Tourist Visas is important - covered more in my linked-post.   I'd skip that 3rd Vientiane TR Visa, for example, as they might "remark stamp" your 3rd from them.

 

2 hours ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

It seems to me like Don Muang is the really troublesome airport and that Suvarnapum is less likely to cause problems?

That used to be the case, but recent rejected-entries indicate it is run by the same clique now.  Buying VIP service on-entry could help deter rejections (since this involves some palm-greasing by the VIP company).  Staying out a couple weeks each time could also help one's odds playing airport-immigration roulette.

 

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I am based in Bangkok so to fly into Chiang Mai does not seem like a good option,

even though it might be a safe entry point.

Can fly domestic after entry - domestic flights are inexpensive - often about the same as a bus, if purchased well in-advance.

 

Quote

Same goes for the southern borders.

Enter by train at Pedang Besar, then fly domestic out of Hat Yai airport.

 

Quote

The good thing with Vientiane and Savannaket is that I can fly up there but exit at a land border. 

Yes, and also fly-ride either direction - can save a some on cost vs an international flight, and not much more trouble - an hour or so on a bus/van to/from airport to border.

Edited January 17, 2019 by JackThompson

[DrJack54]

20 minutes ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

One can do ED-visa for Muai Thai up to five years, expensive though. I can also get married and/or have a child. 

Clearly your aware of all options, so why post? Yes get married or pot someone...brilliant. 

Or buy visa that does not require ulterior motives. 

[alfonsalfons1]

3 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Clearly your aware of all options, so why post? Yes get married or pot someone...brilliant. 

Or buy visa that does not require ulterior motives. 

I am not there yet. Now I want to be on tourist visas for as long as possible. Do you have anything to add to that discussion? The two posts you have made in this thread do not really contribute at all. 

[alfonsalfons1]

11 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

A total visa-exempt count can work against you if you fly in - but if not flying, you could use your 2x Visa-Exempts by land at the end of each year.

 

Thanks again Jack! As I think right now I will do two border bonces, one tourist visa from Europe and one from Penang (or maybe Vietnam or Yangon) this year. Next year I will go to Laos three times and then do two border bonces. When I go to Laos I will use land borders. This is a rough plan for two years forward from today. I will update in this thread how it goes. Wish me luck

 

Kind regards

[DrJack54]

18 minutes ago, alfonsalfons1 said:

I am not there yet. Now I want to be on tourist visas for as long as possible. Do you have anything to add to that discussion? The two posts you have made in this thread do not really contribute at all. 

Perhaps not that makes you comfy. Several setvs will exhaust that. Couple of METV back to back maybe exhaust that, and need fly home country. Couple VE each year all with extensions. Get married. Have a kid. Ed visas. 

A few others. I'm sure most are aware of this.

Another is elite visa, if your way short of 50.  But not short of 500k.