New retiree visa rules bewilder Thai immigration: Source

[mickymouse1]

I would rather live in BOGOTA or Tijuana ????

[lamyai3]

52 minutes ago, skatewash said:

It's the embassies, not BJ who unilaterally decided to stop issuing income letters.  So who're the ones making fools of themselves?  When this was apparently discussed between Thai Immigration and the embassies back in May 2018 I don't believe BJ was even in the immigration division.  Repeated FOIA requests from the British Embassy have been answered by saying that no one on the British side bothered to take notes of what was discussed in the meetings.  We can't be sure what was said, but we can now be sure that certainly the UK, US, Australia, and Danish embassies made a colossal mistake by deciding on their own to stop the income letter service to their citizens.  Other embassies that did not make the same mistake continue to offer their citizens income letters and those letters continue to be accepted by Thai Immigration.

BJ was not yet head of immigration last May, but as head of tourist police his role of regular crackdowns and shake-ups was very similar to what it is now. It's well known that he's long since been golden boy to the xenophobic DPM and that he's pretty much following the briefing given to him.

 

I agree these embassies have let down their citizens very badly, and the resulting two tier system is grossly unfair. But they didn't just suddenly decide to embark on this new tighter interpretation of the rules by themselves - income letters were a nice little earner for them, involving minimal administration. The UK embassy described the meeting in May vaguely, not due to slapdash record keeping but for diplomatic reasons, and their comments implied they had no choice in the matter. This was the same month the UK embarrassed Thailand by issuing a ten year visa to it's second most wanted fugitive while ignoring all extradition requests, so it's hard not to join the dots. 

[SheungWan]

41 minutes ago, mickymouse1 said:

I would rather live in BOGOTA or Tijuana ????

Herb Alpert will be happy to hear that.

[SheungWan]

2 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

And, to add insult to injury, the types of Thai accounts the money can be held in are crap, low interest accounts. 

They don't like us here, their logic is to squeeze and milk us or to drive us away. They don't care which one. 

FX will have made many of those who have transferred the last 2/3 years very happy irrespective of your interest rates. 

[JackThompson]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

And then there is the problem o that many people of retirement  have significant pre-existing conditions that would either make them uninsurable or result in significant exclusions (leaving them in essence still uninsured except for accidents).

 

there are things the government could set up and require that would actually make sense but that is nto likely to be what emerges fin any mandatory health insurance requirement.

1 hour ago, fulhamster said:

Hard to get decent insurance coverage aged 65 plus

 

Which is why any mandatory coverage should be only to treat accidents and acute-illnesses - requiring the repatriation of anyone unable to pay for (and/or pay to insure-for) ongoing care. 

 

4 hours ago, icare999 said:

Maybe 500,000 visa elite valid 5 years is a good alternative now you have to keep 400,000 anyway 

Want to bet someone involved in these rule-changes had that thought?

Edited February 1, 2019 by JackThompson

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, HuskerDo said:

You can also keep most of your money in your homeland and deposit/transfer funds 65,000 baht into a Thai account each month. What's the issue? Of course if you don't qualify for a retirement visa that's another story.

Many qualified up until a month ago - or won't in another month.  THAT is the issue.  Not even a 1-year warning for retirees - that's disgraceful. 

 

Then add the "extra month" added to marriage-based extension seasoning - without even a public-statement or One Day of warning - even more disgraceful, as it more directly harms their own citizens. 

 

2 hours ago, skatewash said:

It's the embassies, not BJ who unilaterally decided to stop issuing income letters. 

After they were told (before BJ took over) that they needed to "verify" income-streams - unless they are all (4) lying about what transpired last May.  I agree they should have ignored it and carried on unless/until they were no longer accepted, as the others have.

 

1 hour ago, simtemple said:

The Philippines requires an initial bank deposit of US $10,000 and it can be used as a deposit to purchase a property.  The added bonus is that there are no greedy Thais and the Filipinos generally speak good English.

The PI is much better - love foreigners.  Many Filipinos don't speak English well, though the educated do. 

It isn't "Thais" who are the problem - most Thais are great.  It's just some anti-foreigner clique within Thailand's deep-state, which gets worse and worse, regardless of which govt is in power.

[HuskerDo]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

Many qualified up until a month ago - or won't in another month.  THAT is the issue.  Not even a 1-year warning for retirees - that's disgraceful. 

 

Then add the "extra month" added to marriage-based extension seasoning - without even a public-statement or One Day of warning - even more disgraceful, as it more directly harms their own citizens. 

 

After they were told (before BJ took over) that they needed to "verify" income-streams - unless they are all (4) lying about what transpired last May.  I agree they should have ignored it and carried on unless/until they were no longer accepted, as the others have.

 

The PI is much better - love foreigners.  Many Filipinos don't speak English well, though the educated do. 

It isn't "Thais" who are the problem - most Thais are great.  It's just some anti-foreigner clique within Thailand's deep-state, which gets worse and worse, regardless of which govt is in power.

Don't you think the foreigners/farangs are getting worse as well with their disrespect of Thai people, Thai culture, Thai laws, etc?   

 

I don't think they are anti-foreigner but rather anti-trouble maker. Not all that are being affected are trouble-makers but they are paying the price for those who are.

 

[HuskerDo]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

Many qualified up until a month ago - or won't in another month.  THAT is the issue.  Not even a 1-year warning for retirees - that's disgraceful. 

 

Then add the "extra month" added to marriage-based extension seasoning - without even a public-statement or One Day of warning - even more disgraceful, as it more directly harms their own citizens. 

 

After they were told (before BJ took over) that they needed to "verify" income-streams - unless they are all (4) lying about what transpired last May.  I agree they should have ignored it and carried on unless/until they were no longer accepted, as the others have.

 

The PI is much better - love foreigners.  Many Filipinos don't speak English well, though the educated do. 

It isn't "Thais" who are the problem - most Thais are great.  It's just some anti-foreigner clique within Thailand's deep-state, which gets worse and worse, regardless of which govt is in power.

Do you really want to deal with their President? He might execute you for simply walking across the street on any given Thursday at 2:15 pm while whistling. 

[Khaeng Mak]

9 hours ago, trainman34014 said:

Will this lot end up in the file cabinet marked ''It's all been a terrible misunderstanding '' ?

With luck it will end up in the same draw as the police order banning people from riding in the back of pickup trucks.

[farangx]

6 hours ago, Mavideol said:

“My goal is to make visitors to our country, whether here for tourism or business, feel safe,” said Surachate,  ..here he said visitors thus tourist not retirees

Retirees on extensions are visitors.

 

[farangx]

3 hours ago, Lingba said:

so what exactly ware they going to do to monitor you having the money in 3 months after you were given the extension????….are we now going to have to bring in a bank statement when we do our 90 day?...as usual, a ton of gray areas that nobody will be able to figure out and no two immigration offices in this country will process all this in the same way....another mess

What has 90 day reporting got anything to do with the changed rules? ????

 

[Saddic]

Going to work real well for folks who leave the country under the 3 month time period after getting a renewal... 

 

So are they gonna have Immigration at the airport checking folks coming into the country???   LOL... cant wait for the international press articles... 

 

TIT... it will all be different next week/month/year...

 

[dcnx]

10 hours ago, evadgib said:

It isn't worth getting excited until after a new govt gets sworn in.

You honestly think the junta is going to allow anyone else to take control of the county?

 

This will be a sham election. Even if it’s not Prayut, it will be someone on their team.

[HuskerDo]

12 minutes ago, dcnx said:

You honestly think the junta is going to allow anyone else to take control of the county?

 

This will be a sham election. Even if it’s not Prayut, it will be someone on their team.

Then there is just one thing to do...… RUN Forrest RUN!!!!!   ????

Edited February 1, 2019 by HuskerDo

[HuskerDo]

5 hours ago, simtemple said:

The Philippines requires an initial bank deposit of US $10,000 and it can be used as a deposit to purchase a property.  The added bonus is that there are no greedy Thais and the Filipinos generally speak good English.

Hey Sim. The comment "They don't like us here, their logic is to squeeze and milk us or to drive us away. They don't care which one. " came from Fex Bluse and not me.

 

Please quit misrepresenting posts. Thank you. Apology accepted.   

[stanleycoin]

9 hours ago, smedly said:

The problem BJ has is he cannot trust his own staff or any official to check any of this, it could be a simple case of bringing the used bankbook to immigration upon request after the extension has been granted - but then who does BJ trust in the local office to do this, as it stands officials in the local Immigration office are complicit in the illegal activity so they will never investigate/expose themselves. BJ needs a team he trusts to randomly select immigration offices and do an internal audit and if required contact approved extension applicants and ask them to provide their bank statements, if they have been involved in bypassing the rules then their extension should be cancelled, the agent and IO involved should be prosecuted - simple

That could result in a massive staff shortage,

throughout immigration offices in Thailand. 

 

[pattayadgw]

Expats supporting the Thai banking system... as if we haven't spent enough over the years of living here and continue to spend.  Whoever signed off on this has been using too much yaaba!! 

[lamyai3]

10 hours ago, moonseeker said:

I am not defending the "mess" here, but 800 K is not a very high threshold in 2019 to live here  as an expat. 

What do you suggest is fair treatment in the case of a UK citizen who retired here 15 years ago with £1000 a month pension, and has lived comfortably since then supporting his Thai family, even in spite the steadily worsening rates of exchange? Is he to abandon his family and go back to work at age 75?

 

For the record, 15 years ago £1000 purchased 74000 baht, right now the same money will get you around 41000 on a good day. 

[HuskerDo]

5 minutes ago, lamyai3 said:

What do you suggest is fair treatment in the case of a UK citizen who retired here 15 years ago with £1000 a month pension, and has lived comfortably since then supporting his Thai family, even in spite the steadily worsening rates of exchange? Is he to abandon his family and go back to work at age 75?

 

For the record, 15 years ago £1000 purchased 74000 baht, right now the same money will get you around 41000 on a good day. 

How did you get an extension the last several years if a person needs 65,000 baht monthly? £1000 is approx. half that amount.

Edited February 1, 2019 by HuskerDo

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

Is that accurate? That the money needs to stay 3 months after the extension is granted? Because it used to be that the money needed to be in the account for 3 months before the extension is granted. This is going to catch many people off guard! 

There is a new amendment out which can be seen as the OP here. 

 

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, barefootbangkok said:

Obviously these new regulations will create a bigger workload for the Thai Immigration staff who process all the paperwork, it seems at times that they are worn out.  The staff processing the 90 day reports look especially tired which makes sense since they have to process all the long term expats 4 times a year. 

Or perhaps reduce the workload substantially as many will decide to use agents who, for some reason, have been able to get around seasoning and money in the bank requirements.

 

They will get a quick rubber stamp from a guy sitting lop-sided. 

Edited February 1, 2019 by jacko45k

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, pattayadgw said:

If BJ keeps going down this road he won't have too many foreigners left in LOS.  Just keep squeezing BJ and at the end of it all it will be just another case of som nom naaaa!!  you make ya bed... now sleep in it!!

People on retirement and marriage extensions are but a tiny fraction of all the foreigners in Thailand. And many of those few are committed, as they have property that is unsaleable, a partner, maybe children or step-children and are tied here. 

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, Sheryl said:

it is basically a 400K bond that has to be posted and maintained. But badly worded/designed.

A 12 month bond, 7 months at 400k, and 5 months at 800k. 

In reality I feel it forces a 12 month 800k requirement.

Edited February 1, 2019 by jacko45k

[NanLaew]

9 hours ago, ocddave said:

The world is run on computers, they should really get Immigration up to speed, thus ending the piles of papers every year, 90 days, etc. While doing so, they should also have a simple login for checking Thai bank records on foreign Visa holders, or better yet, have it automatically update a database at Immigration with the information. Then we just show up with our Passport in hand, they look it us up on a computer, and viola all the information is already present, then stamp our passport and move on.

Yes, let's just have the immigration wing of this banana republic's police farce have access to every foreigner's personal banking information. What could possibly go wrong eh?

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

Yes, let's just have the immigration wing of this banana republic's police farce have access to every foreigner's personal banking information. What could possibly go wrong eh?

Bloody bad enough they have copies of the bankbooks knowing all my business and a gazillion copies of passport.

[lamyai3]

10 hours ago, smedly said:

The problem BJ has is he cannot trust his own staff or any official to check any of this

I think the main problem is that although he's acquired the reputation as someone who gets things done, he's ruthlessly ambitious and overzealous, and addicted to the glare of publicity. You never see a week go by without his name in the headlines in relation to some new crackdown, round-up or overhaul. Putting him in charge of immigration is bound to result in upturning the system for the sake of it, in many ways without really understanding the implications of what he's doing.

 

Maybe soon they'll promote him and hand him the reins of something more important. My suggestion is to put him in charge of the air pollution crisis and solving Bangkok's traffic problems. Fix these and he'd be a real hero of the people. 

[marcusarelus]

9 hours ago, robsamui said:

So What - you are an investor or you are looking for domestic consistency? You LIVE where? I live in Thailand and who gives a shit about your ancient investments. Now I am going to live somewhere else  after building a life in Thailand and living here.

Complain about your lack of investment foresight to someone who cares. Nobody here does. But we DO care about the quality of life in Thailand. And that's why thousands like me are moving out.

Stuff that in your investment portfolio and weight the losses and chat to other bloodless investors about it.

I was responding to "invest in Vietnam."  I think that is a questionable thing to do and so do the credit rating agencies.

[Odysseus123]

The Mad Hatter's Tea Party...

 

"For the snark was a boojum,you see"

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, lamyai3 said:

What do you suggest is fair treatment in the case of a UK citizen who retired here 15 years ago with £1000 a month pension, and has lived comfortably since then supporting his Thai family, even in spite the steadily worsening rates of exchange? Is he to abandon his family and go back to work at age 75?

 

For the record, 15 years ago £1000 purchased 74000 baht, right now the same money will get you around 41000 on a good day. 

I knew the risks when I moved here 20 years ago.  My money was worth more then.  Now it's worth less.  You pays your money and takes your chances. 

[metisdead]

A post containing a disallowed reference to the PM has been removed. 

 

An off topic trolling post has been removed.