richard_smith237 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 35 minutes ago, phutoie2 said: Rarely will you hear an educated Thai use that dreadful word, in our golf club house which is full of senior retired Army Officers, Police, Judges, Doctors etc, I have never heard it said. However gobby lard arsed expats are more than likely to use it. The same types who cannot even pronounce Pattaya correctly. Quite... I find its use [the term Farang] most abundant amongst the crass... intentionally or not, its more generally used amongst the lower classes, especially when in the presence of said foreigner. When cohorting with the well versed the term is rarely heard.... Its frequent use by us foreigners propping up a barstool and / or sweating over their latest anthropomorphic acquisition is telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 11 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said: When you say "Isaan" please explain that you are referring to "Isaan Laos". There are a number of different dialects in Isaan. One of which pronouces the "r" very strongly. I've travelled all over Issan and never heard anyone pronounce the "R". In fact, the majority of Thais don't pronounce it either. Which province pronounces the "R"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Quite... I find its use [the term Farang] most abundant amongst the crass... intentionally or not, its more generally used amongst the lower classes, especially when in the presence of said foreigner. When cohorting with the well versed the term is rarely heard.... Its frequent use by us foreigners propping up a barstool and / or sweating over their latest anthropomorphic acquisition is telling. Also used by the vast majority of Thais unless they're inveterate snobs trying to impress a farang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenslegs Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 53 minutes ago, phutoie2 said: Rarely will you hear an educated Thai use that dreadful word, in our golf club house which is full of senior retired Army Officers, Police, Judges, Doctors etc, I have never heard it said. However gobby lard arsed expats are more than likely to use it. The same types who cannot even pronounce Pattaya correctly. OK, I think I understand your point ... It's very bad form to refer to people as "Farang", but it's quite alright to call people "Gobby lard arsed". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youreavinalaff Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, Spidey said: I've travelled all over Issan and never heard anyone pronounce the "R". In fact, the majority of Thais don't pronounce it either. Which province pronounces the "R"? Speak any one who speaks the Northern Khmer dialect. They will pronounce a rolling "R". You can find a plethora of Khmer speaking villages in south Buriram, Surin and Sissaket. Also some in SaKeaow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 13 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said: Speak any one who speaks the Northern Khmer dialect. They will pronounce a rolling "R". You can find a plethora of Khmer speaking villages in south Buriram, Surin and Sissaket. Also some in SaKeaow. Was up in Buriram recently. Honestly didn't hear it. The locals claim to speak "Khmen" so I tried a bit of my Khmer on them. Understood very little, appears to be quite different to the Khmer that Cambodians speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Pilotman said: I have not heard a Thai yet who calls us 'farangs', it's always 'falangs'. Make of that what you will. It's because we can pronounce the consonant "r", and they can't. Just try to get a Thai to say "refrigerator" and you'll see what I mean. We have difficulty with the 28 Thai vowels. They have difficulty with combined consonants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammieuk1 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 I pronounce it see you next Tuesday sure they do to???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 36 minutes ago, chickenslegs said: OK, I think I understand your point ... It's very bad form to refer to people as "Farang", but it's quite alright to call people "Gobby lard arsed". It depends if they are gobby and lard arsed or not.... its only a sweeping generalization of the 'gobby lard arsed guys' propping up bars... not the 'slim and gentlemanly' guys propping up bars !!..... If the shoe fits... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 20 minutes ago, Lacessit said: It's because we can pronounce the consonant "r", and they can't. Just try to get a Thai to say "refrigerator" and you'll see what I mean. We have difficulty with the 28 Thai vowels. They have difficulty with combined consonants. What I don't understand is why, when there's an "L" at the end of a word, they change it to an "N". Also the "R" rather than being changed to an "L" sometimes becomes silent. I know Pattaya well, better than my wife, but when we first moved to Pattaya, she would ask me to take her to "Sentan shopping". I eventually realised that she meant "Central shopping" as in Central Festival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger buttmore Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 While on the subject, for plural I still use 'farang'. No 's' on the end. Like sheep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkv Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Spidey said: Sounds like you mix with a real bunch of tossers. Here, for the uneducated, is de facto on the word farang. His logic is: "If I don't remember some white foreigner's name, I call him farang. It's perfectly normal. Just like in Thai, when I don't remember someone's name, I call them pee or nong." I'm not buying it, sorry. If he does not remember his Thai friend's names, is he going to call them pee or nong? Or is he going to call them: "Hello, yellow Asian guy"? Surely none of his Thai friends would take any offence, because A. He forgot their names, and B. He is calling them yellow. Right? If they don't remember my name, they can call me: "mister". Or Sir. Or Khun. Or not call me anything. But not "Khun farang". Rubbish. Sorry. I still find it a bad word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 1 minute ago, roger buttmore said: While on the subject, for plural I still use 'farang'. No 's' on the end. Like sheep. No plurals in Thai and no conjugating verbs. Much easier to learn than English! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 43 minutes ago, Spidey said: Also used by the vast majority of Thais unless they're inveterate snobs trying to impress a farang. The type of Thai who is actively trying to impress a 'Farang' is the sort who is more likely to use the word Farang in the first place... Those who have no need to impress a 'Farang', who work and walk alongside us as equal peers in business, industry and life are usually of sufficient socio-economic-educational backgrounds that they'd recognize the clumsiness in resorting to such a term. It is harmless, but its also clumsy however its spelt... I have never heard my Father in Law, Mother in Law or Brother in Law use the word, I have never heard others in my Wife's family, cousins, aunties, uncles etc. use the word... My Thai friends don't use the word when I'm around... (in my absence, I'm not sure), I hear it most commonly when with other Westerners who are talking about themselves in a Thai situation, or by girls in a bar.. or when a motorcycle taxi or Tuk Tuk is trying to get my attention... "Hey You, You... Falang"..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: The type of Thai who is actively trying to impress a 'Farang' is the sort who is more likely to use the word Farang in the first place... Those who have no need to impress a 'Farang', who work and walk alongside us as equal peers in business, industry and life are usually of sufficient socio-economic-educational backgrounds that they'd recognize the clumsiness in resorting to such a term. It is harmless, but its also clumsy however its spelt... I have never heard my Father in Law, Mother in Law or Brother in Law use the word, I have never heard others in my Wife's family, cousins, aunties, uncles etc. use the word... My Thai friends don't use the word when I'm around... (in my absence, I'm not sure), I hear it most commonly when with other Westerners who are talking about themselves in a Thai situation, or by girls in a bar.. or when a motorcycle taxi or Tuk Tuk is trying to get my attention... "Hey You, You... Falang"..... OK. Point taken. You stick to your HiSo snobs and I'll stick to baan noak, genuine people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airalee Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Farang = correct spelling Falang= an acceptable misunderstanding due to the mispronunciation of ร by some Thai people. Ferlung, Farlong etc. = usually used by Farang who never mastered the difference between there/their/they’re, your/you’re, lose/loose, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said: Very true... My Wife can order something in a restaurant, I understand perfectly what she has said.... The Waiter / Waitress is lost and my Wife has to repeat herself a couple of times... or the Waiter / Waitress get the order wrong.... When getting the 1000 yard stare or the wrong order I used to think it was my fault... before realizing its not and Thai' face the very same issue !!!... my Thai is fine, it the person listening who's ears are not yet tuned to Bangkok Thai (or they are just dumb and not paying attention !). I know what you mean. I'll ask for three food cards, 100 baht each, in a food court at Big C. Depending on how far removed the cashier is from a rice paddy, I'll get responses ranging from instant comprehension to a blank stare. My Thai GF sits back and enjoys the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpudlian Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spidey Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, Liverpudlian said: Idiot. Now then Scouse. Very succinct. Is that your last word on the subject and was it addressed to all posters on this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieH Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Pilotman said: I have not heard a Thai yet who calls us 'farangs', it's always 'falangs'. Make of that what you will. Quite simply they cant pronounce the "r" and it comes out as "L" just like "roi" becomes "loi" and so on. (Cant or just lazy, up to you) Farang audio becomes Falang ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkv Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 Just to add on my previous comment. I know that Wikipedia is not the mother of them all, but it classifies the word "farang" as an ethnic slur. An ethnic slur is a term designed to insult others on the basis of race, ethnicity, or nationality. Just like "nigger" for example. We scroll down to F, we find farang. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs But then again, I am confident the writer of this Wikipedia article does not really understand Thai culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
55Jay Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 5 hours ago, Psimbo said: If I were you I'd consult one of the many, many, many, many, many, many threads about this. At the end of the day NO ONE CARES- they know what you mean anyway! (Errrrrrr- in case I get in trouble have you posted this as a Mod or a mere mortal? ????) Shameless self promoter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aforek Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 14 minutes ago, CharlieH said: Quite simply they cant pronounce the "r" and it comes out as "L" just like "roi" becomes "loi" and so on. (Cant or just lazy, up to you) Farang audio becomes Falang ???? Because phonetics represent the sound, not the spelling, the only acceptable spelling is " falang " , not farang ( have you ever heard a Thai say " farang " ? ) they are unable to pronounce our " r " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artisi Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Spidey said: Sounds like you mix with a real bunch of tossers. Here, for the uneducated, is de facto on the word farang. Somewhat interesting video, however - I would add that I have found that some adults and especially kids (friends of my boy) will address me as por xxxx (my boys name) or even just por (father) or loong (uncle) - never farang when being addressed directly or referred to. One young boy who speaks reasonable English calls me Dad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skatewash Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, Spidey said: What I don't understand is why, when there's an "L" at the end of a word, they change it to an "N". Also the "R" rather than being changed to an "L" sometimes becomes silent. I know Pattaya well, better than my wife, but when we first moved to Pattaya, she would ask me to take her to "Sentan shopping". I eventually realised that she meant "Central shopping" as in Central Festival. Good explanation here: https://www.into-asia.com/thai_language/thaienglish.php Basically, the ending 'L' gets transformed into an 'N' like it would in a native Thai word. The consonant cluster "tr" does exist in Thai, but often it gets simplified to only the first consonant and the second is dropped from the cluster. So Central in Sentan. Interestingly, "shopping" is already a well-behaved English word according to Thai rules: "shop-ping" as 'P' is an OK way for a syllable to end and "ng" is also a good way for a syllable to end. So shopping under Thai pronunciation rules ends up sounding much like the English word, although you may notice that the 'sh' sounds a little closer to 'ch' and that the syllables are spoken with equal emphasis or stress, so "(sh/ch)op-ping" rather than SHOPping which stresses the first syllable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artisi Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 32 minutes ago, Airalee said: Farang = correct spelling Falang= an acceptable misunderstanding due to the mispronunciation of ร by some Thai people. Ferlung, Farlong etc. = usually used by Farang who never mastered the difference between there/their/they’re, your/you’re, lose/loose, etc. Bought / brought etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 38 minutes ago, Spidey said: OK. Point taken. You stick to your HiSo snobs and I'll stick to baan noak, genuine people. Why Snobs vs Genuine?... isn't that your social bias at play? That someone is sufficiently educated not to use language which maybe by some considered clumsy makes them considerate, not a snob. Equally so, because someone is 'baan-nok' (from the countryside) makes them no more or less genuine than anyone else... However, being a foreigner (seemingly more wealthy) in an area who's people you have considered "baan-nok" (i.e. poorer and underprivileged countryside people) is only likely to serve your confirmation bias that they are more-genuine as they look up to your financial status. Genuine treatment comes from those who would need nothing from you but choose to treat you with mutual respect.... Baan-nok or city rich... and if the poor use the term Farang (or falang) then its quite often used in a genuine manner because they know no better, the educated using the term farang in the presence of a Westerner seems uneducated and clumsy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damrongsak Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 I think the original (Persian) spelling was فرنگ "... Interestingly, "shopping" is already a well-behaved English word according to Thai rules: "shop-ping" as 'P' is an OK way for a syllable to end and "ng" is also a good way for a syllable to end. ..." I thought it was derived from Sho Ping, the Chinese merchant who invented malls and department stores as a way of disposing of shoddy goods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skatewash Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 6 minutes ago, Damrongsak said: I think the original (Persian) spelling was فرنگ "... Interestingly, "shopping" is already a well-behaved English word according to Thai rules: "shop-ping" as 'P' is an OK way for a syllable to end and "ng" is also a good way for a syllable to end. ..." I thought it was derived from Sho Ping, the Chinese merchant who invented malls and department stores as a way of disposing of shoddy goods. Lest anyone think you were joking, his great-grandson Tso-Ping Ma is a professor at Yale University. Here he is giving a talk on the Made in China 2025 economic initiative: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Spidey said: Also used by the vast majority of Thais unless they're inveterate snobs trying to impress a farang. If someone knows not to use the word Farang in the presence of a westerner it certainly does not imply they are a 'Snob'.... it implies they are considerate and aware of the differing social, cultural and linguistic mores of another nation or race. Perhaps in this case you consider anyone who is educated a snob... Anyone educated using the word snob with a Westerner is certainly not trying to impress them... Only the socially and culturally uneducated can get away with their naive ignorance on this one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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