Grouse Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 25 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said: so, maybe HoC should be just scrapped and foggy island left to be run by the Upper House May be expedient in the short term Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 8 minutes ago, vogie said: So you're saying that the EU does not want deal, of course they want a deal, Europe is collapsing around them, going into recession and they don't want a deal. Keep flying their flag grouse, you may need it to wipe the egg off your face. You misunderstand Leaving with no deal has ZERO credibility. As a threat it is useless If course the EU wants us to remain: Geography History Scale The money is peanuts. Look at EU GDP!!! Look at the trade deals they have Frankly, leverage is very weak Strongest lever is that Germany could do with a partner st the top level. EU will just walk away...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melvinmelvin Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, Grouse said: May be expedient in the short term there is no short/long term Grouse, if it is at all possible to change some of UKs political system. like fptp like number of constituencies like boosting parliaments sovereignty like streamlining the parliament-cabinet relationship it would probably be a one time only event not, do this and this in the short time and maybe so and so in the longer time UK is rather allergic to any changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil B Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 7 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said: If it is at all possible to change some of UKs political system. like fptp like number of constituencies like boosting parliaments sovereignty like streamlining the parliament-cabinet relationship They are changing the number of Constituencies down to 600 at the next scheduled GE in May 2022, not sure what will happen if we get a GE called sooner but that is highly unlikely to happen, It would be like turkeys voting for Christmas... given that 50 will be going anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 13 hours ago, Lungstib said: The Brexit fiasco is at least informing us on the dire situation British politics is facing. The chosen winners of the last election have shown themselves to be totally divided over this issue and the opposition is making little or no inroads into its fight to overtake. Perhaps the British have finally decided that politicians are just not to be trusted to do what the electorate want but the time appears to be ripe for new parties to make an appearance. The old ones look to be intent on just pulling themselves apart. The last thing needed would be an additional bunch of lunatic populists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 20 minutes ago, Grouse said: You misunderstand Leaving with no deal has ZERO credibility. As a threat it is useless If course the EU wants us to remain: Geography History Scale The money is peanuts. Look at EU GDP!!! Look at the trade deals they have Frankly, leverage is very weak Strongest lever is that Germany could do with a partner st the top level. EU will just walk away...... Leaving the EU according to grouse, is staying in. As JRM said last night on Question Time "we voted to leave the EU, we didn't vote for a deal" Its like Jeremy Corbyns wonder deal, lets call it a Norway - - -, I just wonder whose idea that was, certainly not Corbyns. Lets give the electorate what they voted for, It will be once in a lifetime. It will mean leaving the single market and the customs union. "When the British people speak, their voice will be respected, not ignored" How shallow does that sentence sound now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritManToo Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 10 minutes ago, vogie said: Leaving the EU according to grouse, is staying in. As JRM said last night on Question Time "we voted to leave the EU, we didn't vote for a deal" Gotta agree, leaving means no deals, no payoffs just goodbye. Just as well I'm not in charge because I would have already ordered naval exercises in the Channel and North sea, and recalled troops to the UK. Maybe already setting up a Thai system for 90 day reporting and foreign nationals required to report addresses. I would also nationalise all foreign assets in the UK and only allow British citizens to own land and shares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomacht8 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 8 minutes ago, BritManToo said: Gotta agree, leaving means no deals, no payoffs just goodbye. If they don't like it, they can start shooting. shooting no. This will be a decade-long trial. Meanwhile, the globe keeps turning. Europe is getting poorer overall. Emerging markets catch up. And the big three US, China and Russia share the cake. The disunity of Europe is the best that could happen to their economy. Think the UK will also lose respect as a solid investment location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melvinmelvin Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 28 minutes ago, Grouse said: You misunderstand Leaving with no deal has ZERO credibility. As a threat it is useless If course the EU wants us to remain: Geography History Scale The money is peanuts. Look at EU GDP!!! Look at the trade deals they have Frankly, leverage is very weak Strongest lever is that Germany could do with a partner st the top level. EU will just walk away...... dunno Grouse, this is somewhat difficult terrain to navigate in, although many on TVF seem to think there are very simple solutions to complex problems, (the problems are not complex at all, but parties disagree way too much) reality shows it ain't that easy. it was said above that leaving with no deal has no credibility, maybe so, maybe no-deal is no threat any longer, can agree with that the real threat, which would really take the piss out of EU is if UK decided to remain, and then trigger a new A50 and EU would enjoy couple of more years with so called negotiators from UK and not least circus Farage in EP. That would really piss EU off, big time. The importance of avoiding no-deal has diminished over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomacht8 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said: dunno Grouse, this is somewhat difficult terrain to navigate in, although many on TVF seem to think there are very simple solutions to complex problems, (the problems are not complex at all, but parties disagree way too much) reality shows it ain't that easy. it was said above that leaving with no deal has no credibility, maybe so, maybe no-deal is no threat any longer, can agree with that the real threat, which would really take the piss out of EU is if UK decided to remain, and then trigger a new A50 and EU would enjoy couple of more years with so called negotiators from UK and not least circus Farage in EP. That would really piss EU off, big time. The importance of avoiding no-deal has diminished over time. Many companies are already preparing for this. All seminars at the Chambers of Commerce in Germany are fully booked! How do I properly fill in the customs documents? What is a certificate of origin? What tariffs await me? What is the SAD A50? What is differential taxation on exports to non-EU countries. Product Sales Tax Identification Number. GBVAT Registration NumberVAT Reg No 11/14 GB x1x2x3x4x5x6x7x8x9x10x11x12 More bureaucracy, more costs, long handling times. This leads to lower corporate profits and higher prices for all Europeans. The main thing is that the Brexiters have their independence sausage. There are some sympathies gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tebee Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 hour ago, tomacht8 said: Many companies are already preparing for this. All seminars at the Chambers of Commerce in Germany are fully booked! How do I properly fill in the customs documents? What is a certificate of origin? What tariffs await me? What is the SAD A50? What is differential taxation on exports to non-EU countries. Product Sales Tax Identification Number. GBVAT Registration NumberVAT Reg No 11/14 GB x1x2x3x4x5x6x7x8x9x10x11x12 More bureaucracy, more costs, long handling times. This leads to lower corporate profits and higher prices for all Europeans. The main thing is that the Brexiters have their independence sausage. There are some sympathies gone. indeed, the whole of the EU is much better prepared for a possible no deal Brexit than the UK is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tebee Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said: dunno Grouse, this is somewhat difficult terrain to navigate in, although many on TVF seem to think there are very simple solutions to complex problems, (the problems are not complex at all, but parties disagree way too much) reality shows it ain't that easy. it was said above that leaving with no deal has no credibility, maybe so, maybe no-deal is no threat any longer, can agree with that the real threat, which would really take the piss out of EU is if UK decided to remain, and then trigger a new A50 and EU would enjoy couple of more years with so called negotiators from UK and not least circus Farage in EP. That would really piss EU off, big time. The importance of avoiding no-deal has diminished over time. The simple but wrong answers problem is at the heart of Brexit . People knew they were not happy Brexit provided simple and apparently coherent answers as to why they were not happy So they voted for it Now, even when those answers have been proven to be wrong they won't change their minds So we fall off the cliff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomacht8 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 22 minutes ago, tebee said: indeed, the whole of the EU is much better prepared for a possible no deal Brexit than the UK is. I can support it that way. The UK does not have the administrative infrastructure to handle all the tasks that have been carried out via the EU now. Subsidy allocation to British farmers. Allocation of research funds for UK projects. Implementation of the Erasmus program. Participation in the project Galileo. Carrying out investment financing. Joint work on safety databases. Sustainability, resource security, environmental protection. Allocation of structural development funds. And much more. But now the UK must first invest in border security and customs clearance capacity. 555 They can do that, certainly in 40+ days, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damascase Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 29 minutes ago, tomacht8 said: ................... But now the UK must first invest in border security and customs clearance capacity. 555 They can do that, certainly in 40+ days, right? About Customs: will the UK have any Customs legislation in place, or will they continue to base procedures etc. on the comprehensive EU Customs legislation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomacht8 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 52 minutes ago, damascase said: About Customs: will the UK have any Customs legislation in place, or will they continue to base procedures etc. on the comprehensive EU Customs legislation? Nobody know what they want. Nobody wants the result of the negotiations aka Mays / EU plan. Parliament does not want no deal Brexit. Empty space in the heads of the Leaders from a Country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monomial Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 The EU is taking a big risk as well here, although probably not as much as the UK. Still, their worst nightmare is that a no deal Brexit occurs, and it isn't as bad as they've made it out to be. In fact, this is probably going to be the case, as they have been screaming the world will collapse for months. My guess is the reality will be bad, but not exactly the catastrophe it is being represented as. Should this actually happen, then Brussels will have absolutely no bullets if another member chooses to leave. They won't be able to play this card again if their bluff is called this time and the world keeps going with just a hiccup or two. So I would be willing to bet that as the deadline gets closer, both sides are going to become more flexible in their positions. Neither can really afford to let a no deal exit go through, although I'm sure hard liners on both sides are going to be inflexible about it. It is like watching a game of chicken though. Both sides waiting for the other to blink. Much like a US court room, there is almost certain to be a last minute plea bargain right before the jury comes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 3 hours ago, BritManToo said: Gotta agree, leaving means no deals, no payoffs just goodbye. Just as well I'm not in charge because I would have already ordered naval exercises in the Channel and North sea, and recalled troops to the UK. Maybe already setting up a Thai system for 90 day reporting and foreign nationals required to report addresses. I would also nationalise all foreign assets in the UK and only allow British citizens to own land and shares. As predicted, the closer we get to the nominal day, the more the wheels will fly off the Hard Brexiteer wagon and the only thing called for will be the men in white coats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 18 minutes ago, Monomial said: The EU is taking a big risk as well here, although probably not as much as the UK. Still, their worst nightmare is that a no deal Brexit occurs, and it isn't as bad as they've made it out to be. In fact, this is probably going to be the case, as they have been screaming the world will collapse for months. My guess is the reality will be bad, but not exactly the catastrophe it is being represented as. Should this actually happen, then Brussels will have absolutely no bullets if another member chooses to leave. They won't be able to play this card again if their bluff is called this time and the world keeps going with just a hiccup or two. So I would be willing to bet that as the deadline gets closer, both sides are going to become more flexible in their positions. Neither can really afford to let a no deal exit go through, although I'm sure hard liners on both sides are going to be inflexible about it. It is like watching a game of chicken though. Both sides waiting for the other to blink. Much like a US court room, there is almost certain to be a last minute plea bargain right before the jury comes back. Some people living in their own imagined world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 4 hours ago, vogie said: Leaving the EU according to grouse, is staying in. As JRM said last night on Question Time "we voted to leave the EU, we didn't vote for a deal" Its like Jeremy Corbyns wonder deal, lets call it a Norway - - -, I just wonder whose idea that was, certainly not Corbyns. Lets give the electorate what they voted for, It will be once in a lifetime. It will mean leaving the single market and the customs union. "When the British people speak, their voice will be respected, not ignored" How shallow does that sentence sound now? The shallowness is in the dishonest presumption by the Hard Brexiteers of what was voted on in the referendum. Holding hands in the darkness and endless chanting. A sad show of the self-deluded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nontabury Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 20 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said: Indeed. It's astonishing that May is trying so hard to placate the extremists in her party, rather than seeking a cross-party consensus. She will have a lot to answer for if we crash out. Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk Perhaps she should be trying to placate the over 17,400,000 people who Democratically voted to leave this so called union. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticky Wicket Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 5 hours ago, SheungWan said: Some people living in their own imagined world. Don't you get bored of posting sneering, condescending, self opinionated responses ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanrchase Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Perhaps she should be trying to placate the over 17,400,000 people who Democratically voted to leave this so called union. But the BRexiteer thinks they should be able to take their coat without paying the cloakroom fee and come back and use the bathroom facilities whenever they want.Sent from my SM-A500F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Teavee Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 hour ago, nontabury said: Perhaps she should be trying to placate the over 17,400,000 people who Democratically voted to leave this so called union. Though I get what the analogy is trying to say it's pretty poor as following that logic the Bouncer would be the one who's asking to leave and the patron is (or more accurately SHOULD be) trying to make sure they don't leave though the 4th floor window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 2 hours ago, nontabury said: Perhaps she should be trying to placate the over 17,400,000 people who Democratically voted to leave this so called union. Honesty is always a good starting point. But yes, somebody does need to answer to (most*) of the over 17,400,000 people for the lies and misinformation they were fed. * There will always be some that are not bothered by the lies so long as they can continue going through life blaming other’s for what’s wrong in their world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superal Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 This one off Brexit has brought to the fore many weaknesses in the UK governance . Elected MPs , do they vote in parliament with their constituents preferences on Brexit ( in order to be re-elected ? ) or do they follow some personal beliefs ? or do they follow their parties whip ? The above scenario does not help in the final Brexit decision . There is belief from several EU countries that the EU common market has passed its sell by date and that a Brexit no deal will trigger France & Italy to follow . The EU negotiating bullies are demonstrating to others who may consider leaving the EU that its not worth it . TM has proved she should not have been at the helm from the start as she lost 2 Brexit secretaries due to her stubborn ways . In private industries a performance as of TM would not be tolerated and she would have been kicked out by the shareholders . This Brexit bull needs to be taken by the horns and brought to a conclusion but I fear alas that the UK politics will not permit it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, superal said: This one off Brexit has brought to the fore many weaknesses in the UK governance . Elected MPs , do they vote in parliament with their constituents preferences on Brexit ( in order to be re-elected ? ) or do they follow some personal beliefs ? or do they follow their parties whip ? The above scenario does not help in the final Brexit decision . There is belief from several EU countries that the EU common market has passed its sell by date and that a Brexit no deal will trigger France & Italy to follow . The EU negotiating bullies are demonstrating to others who may consider leaving the EU that its not worth it . TM has proved she should not have been at the helm from the start as she lost 2 Brexit secretaries due to her stubborn ways . In private industries a performance as of TM would not be tolerated and she would have been kicked out by the shareholders . This Brexit bull needs to be taken by the horns and brought to a conclusion but I fear alas that the UK politics will not permit it . Private industry think the Hard Brexiteers are away with the fairies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwasaki Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 23 hours ago, tomacht8 said: Yes. It is going down fast as a Lift. Bangkok Bank today: Cash: 39.12 TT: 39.667 By the end of February, if there are no good news, we could test the 38.XX The Brexit banana stucks full in the back end. 1000 squid at 40 = 40,000. 1000 squid at 38 = 38,000. 2000 baht lost will not be as bad as a being in a lift crashing to the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Kwasaki said: 1000 squid at 40 = 40,000. 1000 squid at 38 = 38,000. 2000 baht lost will not be as bad as a being in a lift crashing to the floor. Except that’s not the real ‘Brexit’ loss is it?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomacht8 Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 44 minutes ago, Kwasaki said: 1000 squid at 40 = 40,000. 1000 squid at 38 = 38,000. 2000 baht lost will not be as bad as a being in a lift crashing to the floor. 22.jun.2016 1000 squid at 51,36 TT = 51.360 15.feb.2019 1000 squid at 39,66 TT = 39.667 = - 11.693 = - 22,77 % Let us count this. A simple rough estimate with the value loss constant over the time axis. Let say your monthly income/Pension is 1000 squid jul 2016 - feb2019 = 32 month 32 * 11.693 = 374.176 Baht loss For that Money you could buy 7 new Honda Clicks. or (1 Singha beer small 35Baht) = 10690 bottles beer you have less. or (Barfine 500 Baht) = 748 Barfines you have less 555 Have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwasaki Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said: Except that’s not the real ‘Brexit’ loss is it?! The fact is Brexit or no Brexit that's the way it's and you just have to live with it, there's nothing you can do about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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