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BANGKOK 20 April 2019 06:10
chang50

uk ni contributions

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3 hours ago, steve187 said:

30 years should give you a 30/35 pension excluding any contracted out years adjustment.

 

I understood that "contracting out" was from SERPs (State Earnings Related Pension) or SSP (Second State Pension).

It was where higher earners would accumulate extra benefits either within the state scheme (contracted in) or you could add those benefits to an existing employee or private scheme (contracted out).  Either way the Basic State Pension was supposed to be unaffected.  It now appears that there have been no additional benefits from contracting IN to the gov't scheme. 

 

For a few years in my prime earning period, even when contracted OUT, I was contributing NI at 4-5x the minimum rate, yet I appear to have received no benefit from doing so.

 

The numerous changes, such as increasing the minimum age for drawing state pension, and changes to the number of years of contributions required, leads me to conclude it all seems a bit of a con..!  Combined with the reports of peoples additional contributions making no difference to their pension forecast, which is why I will not be making any top-ups, at least until the situation becomes much clearer. 

 

I do have some additional resources, both a small QROPS, and independent investments (ISA, etc) outside of any "pension" provisions, so I am not relying on the maximum (or indeed any) Basic State Pension, although of course, as they say every little helps.  

 

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12 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

If you have a full 35 years of full payments, that is the only way to get more.

Well yes that is how I understand it.

What I don't understand is someone with 40 years NI contributions having to pay 6 years more, maybe something to do with the contracting out thingy.

I contracted out on advice and contracted back in and was better of because of it.

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6 minutes ago, steve73 said:

For a few years in my prime earning period, even when contracted OUT, I was contributing NI at 4-5x the minimum rate, yet I appear to have received no benefit from doing so.

Well I did.

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13 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

 

They shouldn't allow people to make additional contributions if it's not going improving their pensions any, I'll be asking about this when I speak to them as well...

This part of your comment struck a chord with me.

I had been paying Class 3 by DD ever since I started working overseas back in 1979. When the qualifying years changed to 35 I checked my NI status and was advised I had paid 36 years at that time. So I cancelled the DD.

A few months later I received a letter from NI querying my DD cancellation and asking for the reason, warning that my pension could be affected by this non payment. I just ignored the letter as I knew my situation was clear.

I made no further NI payments and applied for my pension early last year and this came through at the full rate when I turned 65.

NI would have been quite happy for me to continue with the payments even though, at that point, there would have been no benefit to me. Just shows that all should ensure they are fully aware of their personal payment situation.

 

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1 hour ago, sometimewoodworker said:

You have completely misunderstood the 6 years AVCs paid between 2010/11 - 2015/16 count

 

You were almost certainly contracted out for quite a long time. during that time you will have been paying into a different pension, so made lower pension contributions to the state pension and payed a lower NI rate.

f you read the 2 articles that have been linked to above and the "Topping up your state pension" PDF it certainly looks to me like

  1. In April 2016 they set my Pension to a certain amount based on the years I'd contributed up to then
  2. In Jan 2018 I back-paid for the 10/11, 11/12, 12/13, 13/14, 14/15 & 15/16 Tax Years  (6 Years)
  3. This hasn't changed the amount they set for me in April 2016 so only contributions I make from 16/17 onwards will change it  - That to me = Doesn't count 😞 

But I'll find out for sure when I contact them next time I'm in the UK (Mid-March)

 

Edited by Mike Teavee

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This part of your comment struck a chord with me.
I had been paying Class 3 by DD ever since I started working overseas back in 1979. When the qualifying years changed to 35 I checked my NI status and was advised I had paid 36 years at that time. So I cancelled the DD.
A few months later I received a letter from NI querying my DD cancellation and asking for the reason, warning that my pension could be affected by this non payment. I just ignored the letter as I knew my situation was clear.
I made no further NI payments and applied for my pension early last year and this came through at the full rate when I turned 65.
NI would have been quite happy for me to continue with the payments even though, at that point, there would have been no benefit to me. Just shows that all should ensure they are fully aware of their personal payment situation.
 

Yup, I talked to them last year about paying 6 years additional contributions to achieve full state pension.
She clearly stated that after 6 years I will achieve FSP and if I continue to pay there would be no benefit for me ( I would be throwing money away ), I would not lose any additional services ( NHS etc ), that I should monitor my forecasts to see the figures rise and cancel DD on achieving FSP.

I have since checked my forecast and have seen a rise since paying one years contributions.
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18 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:
25 minutes ago, steve73 said:

For a few years in my prime earning period, even when contracted OUT, I was contributing NI at 4-5x the minimum rate, yet I appear to have received no benefit from doing so.

Well I did.

In what way did it benefit you for the state pension?  (Obviously any contracted out portion would have benefited you outwith the BSP). 

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3 minutes ago, steve73 said:

In what way did it benefit you for the state pension? 

(Obviously any contracted out portion would have benefited you outwith the BSP). 

It was one of 2 extra over amounts added to my UK gov pension.

The gov pension was the full amount that was given weekly at the time.

I have know idea what BSP is googled it comes up something about airlines. 

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12 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

It was one of 2 extra over amounts added to my UK gov pension.

The gov pension was the full amount that was given weekly at the time.

I have know idea what BSP is googled it comes up something about airlines. 

Sorry... Basic State Pension.  

I understand that you have a UK Gov Pension (i.e. as a former gov't employee) which is different to the BSP (that all old age pensioners receive).

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On 2/20/2019 at 12:48 PM, evadgib said:

Appreciated. I have accessed my NI record online. I'm in no hurry to top up the 5 years incase they move the goalposts again but will look at it carefully.

Me  too as theyve  moved the goalposts at least twice now, 1st 45  years then 32,now  35? and yeah........will they really pay expats anything, I paid 32  years and then 1  year later they moved the  bloody  goal posts after Id  stopped  paying.

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15 minutes ago, steve73 said:

Sorry... Basic State Pension.  

I understand that you have a UK Gov Pension (i.e. as a former gov't employee) which is different to the BSP (that all old age pensioners receive).

Apologies I was not a former gov't employee.

I was in many full-time employment jobs, also self-employed for many years and then went back into full-time employment, eventually becoming one of the Directors of a company.

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Just Checked Wikipedia for UK State Pensions... It has certainly clarified a few things for me.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Pension_(United_Kingdom

 

For me - born after 5th April 1951 - I will receive the "New State Pension" (or at least a proportion of it), rather than the "basic state pension".

35 qualifying years are required for NSP. (Not clear whether anything less than 52 weeks payment of NI means the whole year is discounted, or if this is just from 2016 onwards.) 

 

I'm still trying to digest it all....   

 

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2 hours ago, steve73 said:

Just Checked Wikipedia for UK State Pensions... It has certainly clarified a few things for me.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Pension_(United_Kingdom

 

For me - born after 5th April 1951 - I will receive the "New State Pension" 

 

I'm still trying to digest it all....   

 

Well their ya go l'm an old git born in the golden years apparently, you're a baby that the UK government are clobbering now because they don't want to pay for pensions anymore.  😂

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4 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

f you read the 2 articles that have been linked to above and the "Topping up your state pension" PDF it certainly looks to me like

  1. In April 2016 they set my Pension to a certain amount based on the years I'd contributed up to then
  2. In Jan 2018 I back-paid for the 10/11, 11/12, 12/13, 13/14, 14/15 & 15/16 Tax Years  (6 Years)
  3. This hasn't changed the amount they set for me in April 2016 so only contributions I make from 16/17 onwards will change it  - That to me = Doesn't count 😞 

But I'll find out for sure when I contact them next time I'm in the UK (Mid-March)

 

If you made payments after the amount set in April 2016 assuming that in April 2016 you did not have enough years for a full pension and that any other state pension (serps) did not add up to £159.66 and that those payments have not affected the the amount you are due to receive you have a strong case for those payments to be returned.

 

However there is nothing that I can see in the regulations for the basic full state pension that has the effect of disallowing any years to be counted as qualifying years.

 

If it is true that after those payments you are still not entitled to at least 164.35 then the ability to add qualifying years 2006~2016 is totally pointless 

Quote

Voluntary National Insurance contributions can help you to protect your National Insurance record if you are not building your National Insurance record through working or receiving credits. HMRC have extended the usual deadlines for making voluntary National Insurance contributions for the tax years from 2006-7 to 2015-16. You will have until 5 April 2023 to make the contributions.

 

 

So if your pension was set in April 2016 at anything less than £132,22 your payments made in Jan 2018 should have made it  about £27.5 higher 

 

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5 hours ago, steve73 said:

Just Checked Wikipedia for UK State Pensions... It has certainly clarified a few things for me.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Pension_(United_Kingdom

 

For me - born after 5th April 1951 - I will receive the "New State Pension" (or at least a proportion of it), rather than the "basic state pension".

35 qualifying years are required for NSP. (Not clear whether anything less than 52 weeks payment of NI means the whole year is discounted, or if this is just from 2016 onwards.) 

 

I'm still trying to digest it all....   

 

Anything less than a full year of payments = 0

 

You should get a pension forecast from DWP soon as you will have an opportunity to make up qualifying years.

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