mercman24 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 ok i/we have probably read hundreds of post about the new ruling. i have not seen one reply from immigration what this 400,000 is being used for, is it an emergency fund one can, use, for hospital treatment, then it will be * sorry you have under 400,00 on yer bike* it cost 55,00 to get cremated here, (close i can walk it he he) stil i suppose i wont care as i will be cinders.just i have not seen one official, directive coming from IO (or maybe i have missed something ?? ) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I have seen nothing stating it is meant to be an emergency fund. I think that was an opinion voiced by some people. I think they may be flexible about the 400k baht if you can prove a valid reason for it dropping below 400k. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post onera1961 Posted February 21, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ubonjoe said: I have seen nothing stating it is meant to be an emergency fund. I think that was an opinion voiced by some people. I think they may be flexible about the 400k baht if you can prove a valid reason for it dropping below 400k. eternal optimist. ???? I don't know why Thai bank needs more foreign currency to make Baht even stronger when they have tons of it coming from FDI and tourists. Trump will soon declare Thailand as a currency manipulator. ???? Edited February 21, 2019 by onera1961 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elviajero Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) It’s a minimum balance; as simple as that. Currently if you drop below 800K during the 60day/3mth ‘seasoning’ period you won’t get the extension. The same will almost certainly apply for the new minimum balances. If you do drop below the minimums you could in theory — as now — leave/re-enter and start the extension process from scratch. You need more than 800K to retire. You need at least 800K plus your annual expenditure, and easy access to other funds for emergencies. The new rules don’t change that. Edited February 21, 2019 by elviajero 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post worgeordie Posted February 21, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 21, 2019 Keeping the 400 K THB in the bank ,is to prevent agents circumventing immigration rules,by putting up the cash for those that did not have enough to do themselves,as used to happen in the past,before the agents just had to "Loan" their client the money until they got their extension,now with having to have 400k THB in all the time ,means they cannot do it anymore. regards worgeordie 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJack54 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) I just don't get all these complaints about the new requirements. Note, like many I think it was introduced with little warning etc. Fact is if the the original requirement was to live in Thailand based on retirement or whatever was 800k in Thai bank for 12 months of every year. Fine. Good deal. I need to put 25usd in Thai bank ....OK. Hells bells its not sheep stations. If you can't afford that find a cheaper deal elsewhere. Edited February 21, 2019 by DrJack54 Error 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellowtail Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 As I understand it, the 400K in the bank is used to satisfy immigration requirements. Am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post JackThompson Posted February 21, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 21, 2019 48 minutes ago, worgeordie said: Keeping the 400 K THB in the bank ,is to prevent agents circumventing immigration rules,by putting up the cash for those that did not have enough to do themselves,as used to happen in the past,before the agents just had to "Loan" their client the money until they got their extension,now with having to have 400k THB in all the time ,means they cannot do it anymore. regards worgeordie All the 400K in the bank rule does, is make 12-mo seasoning on that much money. Likewise with the 800K for 5 mo now (or 6, according to some). Seasoning is waived for agent-applications. The "money in the bank" used by agents is only there for a few hours. That is why the changes only affected seasoning, so immigration's agent-partner-racket would not be affected. Imagine the guys at the top getting a cut of all the action below - you think they will give that up? The only losers are honest applicants and maybe some loan-sharks who were competing with immigration's partner-agents, while not providing immigration with a cut of their profits. 49 minutes ago, Yellowtail said: As I understand it, the 400K in the bank is used to satisfy immigration requirements. Am I missing something? You are correct. The 400K cannot be used in an emergency, or you could either lose your permit to stay for violation of terms, or be unable to renew the following year (we don't know how it will be enforced). That money serves no purpose that I can see, other than to protect immigration's agent-partners' businesses from competition. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mngmn Posted February 21, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 hour ago, DrJack54 said: I just don't get all these complaints about the new requirements. Note, like many I think it was introduced with little warning etc. Fact is if the the original requirement was to live in Thailand based on retirement or whatever was 800k in Thai bank for 12 months of every year. Fine. Good deal. I need to put 25usd in Thai bank ....OK. Hells bells its not sheep stations. If you can't afford that find a cheaper deal elsewhere. Have already. Called Australia. 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJack54 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 19 minutes ago, JackThompson said: All the 400K in the bank rule does, is make 12-mo seasoning on that much money. Likewise with the 800K for 5 mo now (or 6, according to some). Seasoning is waived for agent-applications. The "money in the bank" used by agents is only there for a few hours. That is why the changes only affected seasoning, so immigration's agent-partner-racket would not be affected. Imagine the guys at the top getting a cut of all the action below - you think they will give that up? The only losers are honest applicants and maybe some loan-sharks who were competing with immigration's partner-agents, while not providing immigration with a cut of their profits. You are correct. The 400K cannot be used in an emergency, or you could either lose your permit to stay for violation of terms, or be unable to renew the following year (we don't know how it will be enforced). That money serves no purpose that I can see, other than to protect immigration's agent-partners' businesses from competition. Why would/should it need to be used in "an emergency"... All this reference to 800k or 400k ongoing. What the? Convert it to USD ... Its sweet nothing for heavens sake. Why would Thailand even want someone scraping along on not being able to meet minimal requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post elviajero Posted February 21, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 21, 2019 21 minutes ago, JackThompson said: Seasoning is waived for agent-applications. No it is not. The is no rule/regulation or directive from the TIB waiving “seasoning for agent-applications.” 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumbastheycome Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 hour ago, worgeordie said: Keeping the 400 K THB in the bank ,is to prevent agents circumventing immigration rules,by putting up the cash for those that did not have enough to do themselves,as used to happen in the past,before the agents just had to "Loan" their client the money until they got their extension,now with having to have 400k THB in all the time ,means they cannot do it anymore. regards worgeordie There is some rationale/logic in that view. That being as a way to put a stop to the circumvention WITH the cooperation of IM officers ? But for those expats caught in the situation where with limited choice they agree to extortionist "loans" as a way to satisfy the new enforcement of financial requirements could be only to the satisfaction of the Agents and Thai Imm. In real terms it only opens the book on a new and more lucrative continuation of pseudo/legit/legit compliance. In situations where that becomes a reality the winner will be the Agents although with possible co-funding with select IO. One person I know who has queried his nominal agent about the situation has had confirmation that it will not be a problem due to being "well connected". What he failed to ask is the COST ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Dumbastheycome Posted February 21, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 21, 2019 12 minutes ago, DrJack54 said: Why would/should it need to be used in "an emergency"... All this reference to 800k or 400k ongoing. What the? Convert it to USD ... Its sweet nothing for heavens sake. Why would Thailand even want someone scraping along on not being able to meet minimal requirements. And in real terms that is the basis of it. As it has been Agents provide the means but not the intended security of the requirements. I can understand the impact on those who for various reasons have habitually circumnavigated the rules but .....times up. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAWNEESE Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) 23 minutes ago, elviajero said: No it is not. The is no rule/regulation or directive from the TIB waiving “seasoning for agent-applications.” Seasoning is waived for agent applications. A well known fact. They themselves advertise this. They dont even bother to hide it. Or am I missing the context of what you were saying. Its called bribery / corruption. I think that was the point being made. The same agents are advertising the new regs wont effect their business. Edited February 21, 2019 by PAWNEESE 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mogandave Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Seasoning is waived for agent applications. A well known fact. They themselves advertise this. They dont even bother to hide it. Or am I missing the context of what you were saying. Its called bribery / corruption. I think that was the point being made. The same agents are advertising the new regs wont effect their business. Do you have a link to the advertisements claiming there will be no effect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elviajero Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, PAWNEESE said: Seasoning is waived for agent applications. A well known fact. They themselves advertise this. They dont even bother to hide it. Or am I missing the context of what you were saying. Its called bribery / corruption. I think that was the point being made. The same agents are advertising the new regs wont effect their business. Seasoning is not waived. What is being described is — as you say — “bribery/corruption”. My point was to clarify that agents do not have an official waiver. The only way any requirement can be waived is by getting it signed off by a senior IO. What most ‘crooked’ agents, in colaberation with a corrupt IO, do is fake the required paperwork required for an application to be approved. An original bank letter is the only original document expected to be found on a file, which is why the agent deposits cash in an account long enough to get a bank letter. A bank letter just needs to confirm the balance on the date it’s produced, not that a minimum balance has been maintained for x months. All other documents are copies that are easily faked. Edited February 21, 2019 by elviajero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAWNEESE Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 No link. But others have posted links .. way tooooooo many threads for me to find the link(s). And there were discussions about it, Research if you not believe me. I believe me ???????????????? An agent did a talk at an Expats meeting recently in Pattaya. Reports on here were he said new regs not a problem. The meeting was only 300 yards from my condo ... so maybe I should have gone but I read the reports. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poohy Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 hour ago, elviajero said: Seasoning is not waived. What is being described is — as you say — “bribery/corruption”. My point was to clarify that agents do not have an official waiver. The only way any requirement can be waived is by getting it signed off by a senior IO. What most ‘crooked’ agents, in colaberation with a corrupt IO, do is fake the required paperwork required for an application to be approved. An original bank letter is the only original document expected to be found on a file, which is why the agent deposits cash in an account long enough to get a bank letter. A bank letter just needs to confirm the balance on the date it’s produced, not that a minimum balance has been maintained for x months. All other documents are copies that are easily faked. and you think that will change?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onera1961 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, elviajero said: You need more than 800K to retire. You need at least 800K plus your annual expenditure, and easy access to other funds for emergencies. The new rules don’t change that. How much more I need to retire if I would be drawing 75K/month from my SS at current exchange rate? Want to keep my finances planned Edited February 21, 2019 by onera1961 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onera1961 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Dumbastheycome said: In situations where that becomes a reality the winner will be the Agents although with possible co-funding with select IO. Agents and IOs also have hope and aspirations to drive a nicer car or bigger house just like everybody on earth. An agent fee is only 25K which amounts to 2K/mont or $75/month. This is a paltry sum to buy the privilege of staying in Thailand. Your home country banks may be charging you that much money for two transfers of your money from your home country banks to Thailand using SWIFT and the CEO of the bank is vacationing in French Revieria. . It is not asking too much if they could smooth out the process. Edited February 21, 2019 by onera1961 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mogandave Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 No link. But others have posted links .. way tooooooo many threads for me to find the link(s). And there were discussions about it, Research if you not believe me. I believe me [emoji32][emoji32][emoji32][emoji32] An agent did a talk at an Expats meeting recently in Pattaya. Reports on here were he said new regs not a problem. The meeting was only 300 yards from my condo ... so maybe I should have gone but I read the reports. So you are just regurgitating what someone else posted here and presenting it as fact.Nice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elviajero Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 3 hours ago, poohy said: and you think that will change?? Only if they go after the IO's granting the extensions, which I think is highly likely. Watch this space for 30 day under consideration periods for retirement extensions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 9 hours ago, elviajero said: No it is not. The is no rule/regulation or directive from the TIB waiving “seasoning for agent-applications.” I am not claiming what they are doing is legal - immigration violates the laws all over the place - offices, entry-points, etc. The primary-function of their operation is to maximize coerced/extorted bribes, while pretending to be a legitimate governmental org. This is what happens when there is no top-down oversight and firm-adherence to published laws - the rotten types take over. Therefore, in practice, seasoning is "not checked" / "waived" or whatever you want to call it when an agent submits an application. The new rules are written in such a way as to allow immigration's partner-agents to continue their racket together, with less competition from alternate-lenders. 4 hours ago, elviajero said: Only if they go after the IO's granting the extensions, which I think is highly likely. Watch this space for 30 day under consideration periods for retirement extensions. I would not be surprised. That would drive up the agent-fees by about 10K, as is the case with marriage-based extensions. I did some calling-around recently with agents, to see what my options were; the "base price" varied by a few K-Baht, but was 10K more if you needed the extension based on marriage (for the next guy up's sign-off?). I decided to stick with the Non-O-ME Visa (while that lasts), and avoid the completely-corrupt immigration system for now. Who knows what agent might get pawn-sacrificed this year to make it look like they are "doing something" about the "problem." The alternative would be post-extension bank-book checking, so immigration would make their agent-money from those - similar to how they re-worked the ED Visa corruption-money by shortening the extensions. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacko45k Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, JackThompson said: The alternative would be post-extension bank-book checking, so immigration would make their agent-money from those - similar to how they re-worked the ED Visa corruption-money by shortening the extensions The important thing seems to be the bank letter, agents make a short term deposit to obtain that. The requirement should be for the banks to only issue a letter for accounts where the deposit truly has seasoned. This might well be problematic for those converting their entry to Non-Imm-O though. Heck what is the point, Thais are very creative and would find a way around any new requirements. They obviously do not want to solve the issue at the source. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAWNEESE Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, mogandave said: So you are just regurgitating what someone else posted here and presenting it as fact. Nice I was refering to links or cut and pastes of agents sites statements ... that SPELT OUT that the new regs wont effect / be a problem regarding the corrupt way of renewing your visa. The links are on this site. As stated tooooo many posts .. thousands to search through. I.e Its what the AGENTS are saying. Not me. You not reading my post before presenting it as regurgitating what someone else said. Its what the AGENTS are saying. Durrrrrrrr Nice. Edited February 22, 2019 by PAWNEESE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellowtail Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 15 minutes ago, PAWNEESE said: I was refering to links or cut and pastes of agents sites statements ... that SPELT OUT that the new regs wont effect / be a problem regarding the corrupt way of renewing your visa. The links are on this site. As stated tooooo many posts .. thousands to search through. I.e Its what the AGENTS are saying. Not me. Not reading my post before presenting it as regurgitating. Nice. Right. Two posts up someone commented that the price was going up 10K so apparently, there's at least one agent that did not get the message. Oh what a wicked web we weave.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 20 hours ago, Yellowtail said: Right. Two posts up someone commented that the price was going up 10K so apparently, there's at least one agent that did not get the message. Oh what a wicked web we weave.... If referring to my post - I don't know if "awaiting approval" periods will be put in place for retirement-based extensions. This was a possibility suggested by someone else, which I agree could happen. My figure was based on: If retirement-extensions require division-approval at some point in the future, as do marriage-based extensions now, 10K would correspond to the additional agent-charge for marriage-based extensions, currently (in the Pattaya area). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellowtail Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 3 hours ago, JackThompson said: If referring to my post - I don't know if "awaiting approval" periods will be put in place for retirement-based extensions. This was a possibility suggested by someone else, which I agree could happen. My figure was based on: If retirement-extensions require division-approval at some point in the future, as do marriage-based extensions now, 10K would correspond to the additional agent-charge for marriage-based extensions, currently (in the Pattaya area). In any event, if the demand goes up, which is almost certain, the cost will go up. If the agent's cost goes up, which is very likely, the cost will go up. When customers shift from using an agent for convenience, to using an agent out of necessity, the cost will go up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onera1961 Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 (edited) On 2/21/2019 at 10:13 AM, PAWNEESE said: An agent did a talk at an Expats meeting recently in Pattaya. Reports on here were he said new regs not a problem. The meeting was only 300 yards from my condo ... so maybe I should have gone but I read the reports. So expats meetings are now inviting agents to talk on what subject? To clarify the requirements? Should not they invite a senior IO for that? Or they are inviting agents to discuss if it is possible to get extension without money? Edited February 23, 2019 by onera1961 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scubascuba3 Posted February 23, 2019 Share Posted February 23, 2019 I just don't get all these complaints about the new requirements. I've not heard one report saying an agency can no longer do the usual. So the new regs just seem to have impacted the expats who follow the rules. TiT. We should do a thread examples of TiT 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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