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New Juristic @ The Base Pattaya


PascalB

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Keep us posted just curious.

I moved out late last year after renting there for over 2 years.  It was great for the first 6 months.  Can't beat the location everything was new and nice, fiber internet, great roof top pool, etc.

 

I could not stand it when I left it is the busiest "hotel" in town.

Hoards of people hundreds everyday short term renters disrespectful destroying the place.

The management always gave the "we cannot control" answer.

They also probably need to get a new security company in there as they were facilitating the madness.

 

 

 

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17 hours ago, PascalB said:

The last owner general assembly kicked out Plus! as juristic from The Base Condominium @ Pattaya.

I wonder what the reason was? The obvious reason would be resident co-owners who are fed up with the place being used as a Chinese hotel, but of course many other co-owners will be the ones doing the renting out and they also have a voice and a vote.

 

And I wonder how the new management company (whoever they are) will look at short-term rentals?

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Is Plus the name of a specific person / human being or the name of a management company?

 

Unless it's recently changed juristic means juristic person and has to be a specific person, not a company or business name.

 

 

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Hi everybody!


Thank you new native for the fast feedback!

 

@storecard: Sansiri is the promotor, Plus! its management company in charge of the juristic office, Rentalfortheholidays the rental company.

I received the following cryptic message from Plus!: "Unfortunately, the Company needs to change services structure; consequently the services provided in Pattaya area shall be terminated. ".

And I have been told that the co-owner general assembly decided to change the management company.

 

I am going there on Friday to check what is going on.

 

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3 hours ago, scorecard said:

Is Plus the name of a specific person / human being or the name of a management company?

 

Unless it's recently changed juristic means juristic person and has to be a specific person, not a company or business name.

Plus! is a management company but it is quite common for some employee of a management company to be named as Juristic Person Manager, and this is generally included in the monthly management fee.

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1 hour ago, KittenKong said:

I wonder what the reason was? The obvious reason would be resident co-owners who are fed up with the place being used as a Chinese hotel, but of course many other co-owners will be the ones doing the renting out and they also have a voice and a vote.

 

And I wonder how the new management company (whoever they are) will look at short-term rentals?

     And, just as important, how does The Base Condo Committee look at short-term rentals.  The management company should be taking its direction on this, and most other matters, from the Condo Committee.  In a well-run condo, the management company is just the chauffeur.  The condo committee owns the car and tells the chauffeur where it wants to go--and then judges the chauffeur's performance in getting there.   It's up to The Base Condo Committee to work with the management company and instruct it on what it wants done on short-term renters, just as they would instruct on what they want done on delinquent owners who have not paid their condo fees.  

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5 hours ago, Henryford said:

I pity anyone who bought there as a "home".

Initial buyers did quite nicely with the price rise on their condos.  I wish I had bought more than one.  But, you're right, I wouldn't want to live there.

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9 hours ago, Henryford said:

I pity anyone who bought there as a "home".

Most of the owners couldn't care less as long as they make a profit on their investments. 

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4 minutes ago, balo said:

Most of the owners couldn't care less as long as they make a profit on their investments. 

     I disagree.  I think many owners do care; I certainly did when I owned at The Base, and also Centric Sea.  But, quite often things are stacked against them and it's difficult to get change.  Some foreign owners are afraid to get involved.  Some owners, foreign and Thai,  are reluctant to speak out against fellow owners, even when they are breaking condo rules.  Some are not clear on what's legal and illegal and are in the dark on condo rules and procedures. 

    I think many condo projects follow a strategy of keeping the owners as uninformed as possible--I don't know of any that have a website to keep owners up to date on what's going on in the condo project, post Condo Board  upcoming meetings, Condo Board Minutes, rules, etc.  The last condo I owned in America had a website and that was over 9 years ago.  Thailand condos seem in no hurry to use technology.  No Thailand condo project I have owned in has ever invited the owners to attend a condo meeting, other than the annual meeting.  We were encouraged to attend the monthly meetings in condos I owned in the US.

     I recently attended the annual meeting of a large Pattaya condo project.  The owners in attendance were very upset about the large number of daily renters and wanted something done about the problem.  I have attended many annual meetings and this was the most vocal in disapproval I can remember.

      Normally, the Condo Committee is where you would look to get action on a problem.  This condo, however, has condo committee members who were elected with the support of the developer, and in some cases work for the developer.  Some of the committee members are doing daily rentals, themselves, and don't want any crackdown.  There was much discussion, management promising to do more, blah, blah, blah.  Nothing concrete like putting in place fingerprint technology.  Just glittering generalities.

    During the meeting, one Chinese owner stood up and said he pays over a million baht in condo fees each year.  Doing the math, this man owns at least 50 condos in the building.  That many units is really a boutique hotel--which is exactly what he is illegally running within the confines of a condo residential building.  His argument was he has invested so much money so he should be able to continue to do his illegal business.   

     Personally, I blame the developer who sold 50 units to one buyer. Did they ask, "Hey fella, what are you planning to do with all those condos?  You do realize that short-term rentals are illegal in Thailand, don't you?"  Short answer, no--they just wanted to unload 50 condos, no questions asked.   Other owners also own multiple units for illegal daily rentals--you need multiple units to make any money with daily rentals.  No hotels of 1 room that I know of.

     In the case of this condo, the Condo Committee is in place until next year.  At that time the owners will have an opportunity to elect new members.  However, unless the owners opposed to illegal short-term rentals are organized, it's likely that owners will be elected who will oppose any sort of crackdown; it's unfortunate but those doing the illegal rentals will probably be more organized.  

      With The Base, only the implementation of fingerprint technology will solve the  illegal daily rental problem, with strict enforcement on changing the prints only once a month.  Really, nothing else will work long term.  It was almost put into place several years ago but was ultimately rejected.  Now, with all those doing the illegal rentals firmly entrenched, likely difficult to get approval.

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On 3/4/2019 at 11:11 AM, bkk6060 said:

Keep us posted just curious.

I moved out late last year after renting there for over 2 years.  It was great for the first 6 months.  Can't beat the location everything was new and nice, fiber internet, great roof top pool, etc.

 

I could not stand it when I left it is the busiest "hotel" in town.

Hoards of people hundreds everyday short term renters disrespectful destroying the place.

The management always gave the "we cannot control" answer.

They also probably need to get a new security company in there as they were facilitating the madness.

 

 

1

There is a really easy way to control though. Just install fingerprint scans instead of keycards for building entry.

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1 hour ago, Metapod said:

There is a really easy way to control though. Just install fingerprint scans instead of keycards for building entry.

     Absolutely.  And, as you say, so easy.  Everywhere you currently use a keycard, you use your fingerprint instead. Simple.  It's just using different, better technology.  I would love not having to remember to carry my keycard all the time.  If you have family members who occasionally use your condo, just put them in the system once and you're done--no having to juggle key cards for them. 

     It's obvious that most condo owners want to get rid of short-term renters.  But, nobody really wants to deal with the illegal short-term renter issue.  Management doesn't want to deal with it.  The Condo Committees don't want to deal with it, and residents don't want to personally deal with it, either.  Fingerprint technology takes dealing with it out of everyone's hands.   You just put in a policy that prohibits changing the prints more than once a month.  If someone is doing legal, monthly rentals, there's no problem.  New monthly tenant, change the prints.  Someone doing illegal daily rentals is stopped, with nobody actually having to do anything or confront anyone about their illegal activity.

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1 hour ago, Metapod said:

There is a really easy way to control though. Just install fingerprint scans instead of keycards for building entry.

There are 1000 rooms there.  Many guests, friends, relatives could be legit I think your idea won't work and would need constant maintenance/updating.

 

Probably would work at Trump Towers.

 

The guards could easily stop it all at the gate but like I said they assist/facilitate it.

My opinion is there is some extra payment going on because at least 3 guards are being paid basically full-time to do nothing else.

 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

There are 1000 rooms there.  Many guests, friends, relatives could be legit I think your idea won't work and would need constant maintenance/updating.

 

Probably would work at Trump Towers.

 

The guards could easily stop it all at the gate but like I said they assist/facilitate it.

My opinion is there is some extra payment going on because at least 3 guards are being paid basically full-time to do nothing else.

 

 

 

 

     I think you made my point.  "The guards could easily stop it..."   But, they aren't.  Just another group to add to my list of those not doing anything:  Management, Condo Board, Residents.  And, Security Guards.  Nobody wants to step up and personally get involved and tackle the problem.  And, as you said, some want to facilitate the illegal activity.  Fingerprint technology will do it for them.  Nobody needs to step up, it's a done deal.

     Will there be some work involved? Yes, especially initially when the residents are put in the system.  Once they are in, however, the work should be easily manageable.  And, it's likely to be a lot less work in the long run than attempting to deal with the illegal daily renters and all the work and problems they cause.  

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The trouble with finger prints is that some time the reader, the system or even the thumb print goes wrong or otherwise malfunctions. There is therefore need of a backup procedure and this is typically a PIN. Once you have a PIN the fingerprints aspect can be circumvented.

 

My wife and I sometime swap i Phones which can be opened with a thumb print.  We can get into each others phones with the PIN.

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Security guards.

We have a new firm at my condo complex from March 1st and one took me by surprise. He jumped out from behind a bush, clicked his boots, stood to attention and saluted me. I nearly soiled me keks. It won't last; in two weeks they will be ignoring everyone, just like the lot they replaced.

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News from The Base.

 

Savills is in the place, but looks like business as usual from an external point of view (security/guards).

For internals, Savills needs another couple of weeks to take over and put in place the computer stuff.

 

Works for the Edge (Sansiri) started next door and Mike's mall keeps growing (wondering what happent with the legend of max 8 floors before 2nd road).

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2 hours ago, PascalB said:

put in place the computer stuff.

Do you know what software is being used.

Custom excel vbasic? 

 

Are accounts being followed and posted to make sure there is a balance between reporting and actual bank balance.

 

Also are overdue accounts named and shamed?

My condo protects non payers who don't live there.

 

Thanks, just curious.

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There has been successful prosecution in Huahin for short term rentals, but that looks like the whole condo acted against sole owner who's renting out dailies that also countersues against the juristic person for enacting bylaw that prevented him from 'lawful use' of his property (renting out)

 

Chinese money seem to have been bought a large chunk of the rooms and must means quite a lot of voting rights, there hasn't been court case in this side of the bay so far. 

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On 3/12/2019 at 7:07 AM, stud858 said:

Do you know what software is being used.

Custom excel vbasic? 

 

Are accounts being followed and posted to make sure there is a balance between reporting and actual bank balance.

 

Also are overdue accounts named and shamed?

My condo protects non payers who don't live there.

 

Thanks, just curious.

Only clue I have is that Savills is an international corp and some apps are available through Android appstore.

Anybody having its condo managed by them and experience in this matter?

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  • 4 weeks later...

I had a condo at Jomtien Beach Condominium, (JBC), as far as I know the Juristic Person was not working for a management company, we had an active committee and the staff were directly employed by the Condominium with the exception of the security company, I recall twice a change of security companies due to poor performance.

 

Why pay for a management company who are really after seeing how much they can screw for themselves, by employing the JP and staff directly and keeping a close eye on the accounts you basically have a "Not For Profit" management company saving co-owners the proffit an outside company would have made if not more. 

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On 3/4/2019 at 1:20 PM, newnative said:

     I disagree.  I think many owners do care; I certainly did when I owned at The Base, and also Centric Sea.  But, quite often things are stacked against them and it's difficult to get change.  Some foreign owners are afraid to get involved.  Some owners, foreign and Thai,  are reluctant to speak out against fellow owners, even when they are breaking condo rules.  Some are not clear on what's legal and illegal and are in the dark on condo rules and procedures. 

    I think many condo projects follow a strategy of keeping the owners as uninformed as possible--I don't know of any that have a website to keep owners up to date on what's going on in the condo project, post Condo Board  upcoming meetings, Condo Board Minutes, rules, etc.  The last condo I owned in America had a website and that was over 9 years ago.  Thailand condos seem in no hurry to use technology.  No Thailand condo project I have owned in has ever invited the owners to attend a condo meeting, other than the annual meeting.  We were encouraged to attend the monthly meetings in condos I owned in the US.

     I recently attended the annual meeting of a large Pattaya condo project.  The owners in attendance were very upset about the large number of daily renters and wanted something done about the problem.  I have attended many annual meetings and this was the most vocal in disapproval I can remember.

      Normally, the Condo Committee is where you would look to get action on a problem.  This condo, however, has condo committee members who were elected with the support of the developer, and in some cases work for the developer.  Some of the committee members are doing daily rentals, themselves, and don't want any crackdown.  There was much discussion, management promising to do more, blah, blah, blah.  Nothing concrete like putting in place fingerprint technology.  Just glittering generalities.

    During the meeting, one Chinese owner stood up and said he pays over a million baht in condo fees each year.  Doing the math, this man owns at least 50 condos in the building.  That many units is really a boutique hotel--which is exactly what he is illegally running within the confines of a condo residential building.  His argument was he has invested so much money so he should be able to continue to do his illegal business.   

     Personally, I blame the developer who sold 50 units to one buyer. Did they ask, "Hey fella, what are you planning to do with all those condos?  You do realize that short-term rentals are illegal in Thailand, don't you?"  Short answer, no--they just wanted to unload 50 condos, no questions asked.   Other owners also own multiple units for illegal daily rentals--you need multiple units to make any money with daily rentals.  No hotels of 1 room that I know of.

     In the case of this condo, the Condo Committee is in place until next year.  At that time the owners will have an opportunity to elect new members.  However, unless the owners opposed to illegal short-term rentals are organized, it's likely that owners will be elected who will oppose any sort of crackdown; it's unfortunate but those doing the illegal rentals will probably be more organized.  

      With The Base, only the implementation of fingerprint technology will solve the  illegal daily rental problem, with strict enforcement on changing the prints only once a month.  Really, nothing else will work long term.  It was almost put into place several years ago but was ultimately rejected.  Now, with all those doing the illegal rentals firmly entrenched, likely difficult to get approval.

To be honest 10-15 years ago I did not know that short term was illegal, and wanted to know why the person managing it for me was always getting long term renters.

 

The developer selling 50 units to one person, this person may have been a backer who put money up front to kick start the development, difficult because until after a Co-owners committee can get up and running and kick out the blood sucking leeches who will be depleting the sink funds and prevent the developers friends using a unfair share of resources it is going to be going downhill.

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54 minutes ago, Basil B said:

I had a condo at Jomtien Beach Condominium, (JBC), as far as I know the Juristic Person was not working for a management company, we had an active committee and the staff were directly employed by the Condominium with the exception of the security company, I recall twice a change of security companies due to poor performance.

 

Why pay for a management company who are really after seeing how much they can screw for themselves, by employing the JP and staff directly and keeping a close eye on the accounts you basically have a "Not For Profit" management company saving co-owners the proffitT an outside company would have made if not more. 

      Too right.  I know of one condo project that just raised condo fees from 35 baht a sqm to 50 baht--a huge increase.  Especially when it is a large project and should have economies of scale.  12 of that 15 baht increase went directly to management.  When we lived at Lumpini Park Beach, also a large project, the condo fee was 20 baht a sqm and the project was maintained quite well.

      Having lived in at least 8 different projects, I have not noticed much of a difference in management whether I am paying 20 baht a sqm or double that.  In the case of some of these big, new projects, the high fees seem to be going to run the condos like hotels--with lots of extra staff to take care of all the illegal 'hotel' guests checking in and out every day and needing all the extra help and 'hotel' services.

 

 

 

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