sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Hi Guys, I've been reading this forum for a little while and the time has come for me to actually ask for some advice. I know the story seems long, and I apologize for that. I'll try to keep it organized and frank. I'll also mention that I'm 35 and she's 41. We're probably equally attractive - so it's not as obvious as many situations I've read here. Background I was recently in Ko Samui for a few weeks. I have a policy against dating bar girls for obvious reasons. I did however, meet a woman who owns 3 bars in Ko Samui (yes she definitely is the owner, not the bar girl). She didn't pressure me to come into her bar, I only met her because I went to her bar and no one there pressured me. Because no one there pressured me, I liked simply talking to her, and the bar's proximity to my hotel, I returned a few times. Aside from being very attractive, she's actually quite interesting - she's the quiet, shy type. So I persuaded her to meet with me one night after she closed the bar. She didn't agree right away at all. Eventually she gave in and we met after work. Fast forward, we're chatting in my room, I try to kiss her and she pushes me away. Because it was very late and she lived kind of far, I offered & she reluctantly agreed to stay in my room with me after I promised her I wouldn't try anything else - only sleeping. Next morning (also the day I was leaving Thailand), she gave in to my advance which surprisingly, escalated into us having sex. After that she was quite affectionate and seemed very sad that I was leaving. She never asked for anything and seemed genuinely interested in me. At the airport, my flight back to Germany got cancelled with no replacement for a few days. So she invited me to come back and stay with her for a few days while I wait. I returned to Ko Samui and stayed with her for a further 5 days. During which, she treated me like a boyfriend, gave me the keys to her place, and the keys to her motorbike to use while she was at work (she also has a truck she drives to her bars). The whole time she was very sweet and even paid for lunch & dinner almost every time. She never asked me for anything - not even to pay for lunch. Now I come home, we've kept contact through whatsapp, writing every day. She still hasn't asked for anything. The Problem: We had a conversation about me visiting again in 2 months - during which, she mentioned that she would only want me to do that if I could afford it & it wouldn't hurt me financially. She also said that she would be busy working a lot while I'm there, running the bars, because she hadn't earned enough to cover all of the bar's last month of expenses due to some improvements she made. (RED FLAG!?) In my home country, had I been dating a girl in the same situation, I would offer to help. So that's what I did. She didn't ask though - and seemed reluctant to accept my help, like I guess any normal person would. She hasn't yet asked for anything since. In the last week or so though, she doesn't respond to any deep type of conversation, and doesn't engage it/initiate it herself either. She also doesn't respond much, like other women do, when I'm being sweet or romantic. I don't know if this is due to 1. culture 2. her lack of English 3. Her shy personality (she claims it's this) or 4. This is how Thai women are or can be?? I'm starting to think that she's REALLY good at what she's doing, and is giving me just enough attention to keep me interested, just so that some other "situation" where I can "help" can happen again. Or maybe I'm overanalyzing and she actually is interested??? I've never dated a Thai woman before. Thoughts?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 I really would appreciate your input, guys. Also, she does tell me all the time that I "look so hansuuum" and that I could get so many younger, better looking girls if I want. .... To me this is somewhat normal behavior, but maybe she's doing that on purpose??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faraday Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Can you dance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, faraday said: Can you dance? Interesting question. Actually, yes I can. I've taken break dancing and ballroom dancing courses in the past.... I will even do the fandango... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brokenbone Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 nothing strange about it, you are not yet in full decay, no loose skin and so on, you are not yet repulsive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 I'm starting to think she's just REALLY good at this. Either that or I'm insecure...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totally thaied up Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 24 minutes ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: I'm starting to think she's just REALLY good at this. Either that or I'm insecure...... She owns three bars. She is very good at this... You will be are another notch on her bedroom post - next... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brokenbone Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 37 minutes ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: I'm starting to think she's just REALLY good at this. Either that or I'm insecure...... i'm 50 and still got hit on recently by one of the most beautiful gals i've seen in thailand, and she is far far wealthier then i am, and she knows it. and i'm still 15 years closer to the grave then you are. thai woman have lust, just not for old people, they are like everyone else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 8 minutes ago, totally thaied up said: She owns three bars. She is very good at this... You will be are another notch on her bedroom post - next... I'm not saying you're wrong - you might very well be right. But, how does her being a bar owner make her a good manipulator? As far as I know she was never a bar girl, and the girls in her bars only work as bartenders/attention getters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 I'll also mention, I talked about selling my house in Germany in a few years to buy one in Thailand and start a business (not with her, just in general). She told me she didn't think I should sell my house..... if she wanted to use me for money, wouldn't she have been ALLL OVER THAT shit?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brokenbone Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: I'll also mention, I talked about selling my house in Germany in a few years to buy one in Thailand and start a business (not with her, just in general). She told me she didn't think I should sell my house..... if she wanted to use me for money, wouldn't she have been ALLL OVER THAT shit?? its not a trap, enjoy your time with her Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavideol Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 1 hour ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: Interesting question. Actually, yes I can. I've taken break dancing and ballroom dancing courses in the past.... I will even do the fandango... right now I think she's making you dance the tango..... followed buy the paso doble Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grollies Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMartinHandyman Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Boiled down your issue is she’s not engaging in deep conversation, doesn’t swoon or respond the way you expect to you’re affectionate talk, advised you to come only if you can afford it and warned you she’s got three bars to run so she’ll be business as usual when you return I think you’re saying. Sounds normal to me especially from a bar keep who has likely had and or seen a lot of bar girl/ foreigner relationships. I’m guessing she needs to be in love with someone for marriage that moves to Thailand, can give her a better financial life than she’s already got going for herself and not jealous that she’s in a business that’s about relationships with men and hustling their money into her pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavideol Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 14 minutes ago, brokenbone said: i'm 50 and still got hit on recently by one of the most beautiful gals i've seen in thailand, and she is far far wealthier then i am, and she knows it. and i'm still 15 years closer to the grave then you are. thai woman have lust, just not for old people, they are like everyone else are you calling the guy old, he's 35 full of energy (maybe) and the lady 41 full of lust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavideol Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 13 minutes ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: I'm not saying you're wrong - you might very well be right. But, how does her being a bar owner make her a good manipulator? As far as I know she was never a bar girl, and the girls in her bars only work as bartenders/attention getters. and if my pig was an eagle it could fly.... owning 3 bars means she has been working in bars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 1 minute ago, KMartinHandyman said: Boiled down your issue is she’s not engaging in deep conversation, doesn’t swoon or respond the way you expect to you’re affectionate talk, advised you to come only if you can afford it and warned you she’s got three bars to run so she’ll be business as usual when you return I think you’re saying. Sounds normal to me especially from a bar keep who has likely had and or seen a lot of bar girl/ foreigner relationships. I’m guessing she needs to be in love with someone for marriage that moves to Thailand, can give her a better financial life than she’s already got going for herself and not jealous that she’s in a business that’s about relationships with men and hustling their money into her pocket. My thoughts as well. I'm just trying to figure out where do I fit into this, in her mind. Also, she knows I don't care that "she’s in a business that’s about relationships with men and hustling their money into her pocket.". I know what she's doing and she knows it, and you gotta do what you gotta do. My hypothesis is one of the following, in this order: 1. She liked the sex and it's worth it to keep me for that 2. She's REALLY good at being dishonest, and will ask me for money in another indirect way later. 3. She actually likes me I'm keeping a very close eye out for "my mom is sick all my money is tied in the bar" situations. But so far she hasn't seemed like a gold digger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, Mavideol said: and if my pig was an eagle it could fly.... owning 3 bars means she has been working in bars I get what you're saying but she also has a bachelor's in marketing and I don't think bar girls really end up buying the bar in most cases.... but I could be wrong. That's why I'm here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavideol Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 1 minute ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: My thoughts as well. I'm just trying to figure out where do I fit into this, in her mind. Also, she knows I don't care that "she’s in a business that’s about relationships with men and hustling their money into her pocket.". I know what she's doing and she knows it, and you gotta do what you gotta do. My hypothesis is one of the following, in this order: 1. She liked the sex and it's worth it to keep me for that 2. She's REALLY good at being dishonest, and will ask me for money in another indirect way later. 3. She actually likes me I'm keeping a very close eye out for "my mom is sick all my money is tied in the bar" situations. But so far she hasn't seemed like a gold digger. give it time, it will happen, sooner or later it always happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enki Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Many Thai say: age is just a number. No worries, if nothing goes wrong she will look with 70 like 55 ... and you are 49 then. For the rest: as long as she is not begging for money, what is your problem? Keep the house in Germany and rent it out. Get a "Hausverwaltung" if you are to lazy/busy to manage it. Your problems will be completely different: paperwork for marriage (a nightmare for a Thai/German couple, regardless weather you marry here or there [consider Denmark or Australia instead] ) Visa and work permit etc. If she is cool with it, I would try a slow approach, stay with her about 3 month a year for 1 or 2 years and see how it evolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 1 minute ago, Enki said: Many Thai say: age is just a number. No worries, if nothing goes wrong she will look with 70 like 55 ... and you are 49 then. For the rest: as long as she is not begging for money, what is your problem? Keep the house in Germany and rent it out. Get a "Hausverwaltung" if you are to lazy/busy to manage it. Your problems will be completely different: paperwork for marriage (a nightmare for a Thai/German couple, regardless weather you marry here or there [consider Denmark or Australia instead] ) Visa and work permit etc. If she is cool with it, I would try a slow approach, stay with her about 3 month a year for 1 or 2 years and see how it evolves. Forgot to mention, I'm American.... just been in Germany for the last 5-6 years. And I agree with you. But I just don't think I'm going to invest giving her my heart or fully trusting her for a very long time, after finding so many horror stories as well as my own intuition/life experience. Just wanted to know other's opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavideol Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Just now, sofreshnsocleanclean said: I get what you're saying but she also has a bachelor's in marketing and I don't think bar girls really end up buying the bar in most cases.... but I could be wrong. That's why I'm here. bachelor's degrees don't make as much cash as the bar does, easy to hide cash....I do know a couple girls that worked in bard and became owners, bar is in her name but the mafia are the ones pulling the strings, this is Thailand my friend, it's safer to always have one hand covering the ass.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyezhov Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 I dont care how much money they have I want them under 25, tight and skinny, and gone in an hour. Stir the soup on the stove before you go baby, have a wonderful life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 13 minutes ago, KMartinHandyman said: Boiled down your issue is she’s not engaging in deep conversation, doesn’t swoon or respond the way you expect to you’re affectionate talk, This is my primary issue!! This is where I'm confused. Do Thai women normally act this way??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 11 minutes ago, Mavideol said: give it time, it will happen, sooner or later it always happen As long as I'm aware of that possibility and not convincing myself otherwise then I guess it's a non issue. As soon as it happens I'll see it from a mile off. I'm not naive. But thanks for confirming my suspicions aren't just paranoia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerkinsCuthbert Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Enjoy your time with her, so what if she eventually asks for your help in some way, you're a big boy now, you can always refuse. You tink too mutt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 Just now, PerkinsCuthbert said: You tink too mutt! That's exactly what she's said to me!! ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Who Sold the World Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Quite simple really. Enter slowly and carefully with both eyes open. You've heard the horror stories, you know the "score". Enter the relationship with open eyes, tread softly and carefully. Take things one step at a time and at face value - trust yet verify. And do be careful. You could be seriously hurt on an emotional level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sofreshnsocleanclean Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, The Man Who Sold the World said: Quite simple really. Enter slowly and carefully with both eyes open. You've heard the horror stories, you know the "score". Enter the relationship with open eyes, tread softly and carefully. Take things one step at a time and at face value - trust yet verify. And do be careful. You could be seriously hurt on an emotional level. Quite good advice. My main issue/red flag currently is the lack of swooning & romantic responses that I would normally expect to get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olmate Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, sofreshnsocleanclean said: Quite good advice. My main issue/red flag currently is the lack of swooning & romantic responses that I would normally expect to get. Maybe your not swoon Worthy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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