Looking at going back to the UK with the family in 2021

[Essex Reject]

Not quite sure what the point of this thread is as have no specific concerns or questions (well not yet anyway) but would be interested on any thoughts or tips, good or bad.

 

To keep it short and sweet...I'm 51 been here 15 years, married to a Thai, we have 2 sons aged 10 and 7, who go to private school here, for many reasons (but mainly for a better future for the kids, in school and out of school) I want to call it a day and go back. My wife and kids have been back to the UK twice before on visits, boys have British passports.. What this big move would involve is...

 

Schools for the kids -  The big problems I'm going o encounter here is for one getting them into a good school, and two I am not there so have no reg address in the UK which you need before you start to apply in a catchment area, which is approx 10 months before he school year is due to start, so this could be a real headache.

 

Visa for wife - Shouldn't be a problem, although a real headache of course. We have a good case and hope as for as finances are concerned can show the savings amount required of 62,500  I would want us all to go together, not me first for 6 months etc.

 

Somewhere to live - Would look for rented accom, not cheap, but may be able to stay with my Dad briefly when we get there, but me going back alone could be an option a few mts before to sort something.

 

Get a job - Even though I won't desperately need to work initially I will need to get a job and i want to work, I have no trade so have no idea what I would do. Wife would be open minded to getting a job.

 

So a big old task and plenty to think about, any tips or help, or just tell me I must be mad, will be glad to hear it.

 

ER

 

 

 

[watcharacters]

Best of luck and success to you.

 

This could be the start of a memorable and exciting adventure for both you and your family.

 

 

[Essex Reject]

1 minute ago, watcharacters said:

Best of luck and success to you.

 

This could be the start of a memorable and exciting adventure for both you and your family.

 

 

Thanks mate. It really does feel like now (ish) or never. I want my kids to have what I had growing up (and yes I know it's different now) and to get to know my extended family,  my cousins, aunts, uncles etc they don't even know about. Just a Western, civilised (ish) lifestyle. They also have 2 cousins about their age there which is nice

[sanemax]

What job do you intend doing ?

A 51 year old with no previous work may find it difficult to get a job 

[Essex Reject]

3 minutes ago, sanemax said:

15 years in Thailand would mean that you have no recent UK work history and that would be a hindrance in finding a job

Yes agree. One can only do ones best though.

[GinBoy2]

Education for kids is a biggie for me.

 

Our son was born and went through elementary, and part of middle school in Singapore, which was excellent. 

 

Even though we paid for a private  High School in Thailand, it was total garbage, and in no way prepared him for when he ultimately went to college in the US

Best gift you are going to give your sons is getting them out of the Thai educational system

[Pilotman]

You have a very big job on your hands mate and you need to do a lot of research.  Finding a good school is like finding a Unicorn.  Do a lot of checking on the area  where you want to live and on school performance tables.  It's not easy to get a school out of the catchment area where you are living, so where you rent is going to be a big factor. Renting is a nightmare.  You need good references, a UK bank account history and a big deposit.  In addition, any town in the UK has good places and very bad ones, that will reflect in the  quality of the local schools and the quality of life for you and your family.  Again research is the key.  Inevitably, cheap or cheaper in the UK housing market means crap. I don't know your qualifications, but at your age you need to be experienced, qualified and attractive to potential employers.  Some companies, B & Q being a good example, encourage applications from older people, but it is inevitably part time and just a few hours a week. The UK is a part time, zero hours culture now.   Family support is going to be vital.  Don't underestimate the difficulty of getting a visa for your wife.  It's not as easy as it looks and is expensive. A good agent here in Thailand can help a lot. 

 

I hope this doesn't sound too negative. it's meant to be helpful. I do wish you and your family all the very best of luck in the move. 

[Essex Reject]

1 minute ago, GinBoy2 said:

Education for kids is a biggie for me.

 

Our son was born and went through elementary, and part of middle school in Singapore, which was excellent. 

 

Even though we paid for a private  High School in Thailand, it was total garbage, and in no way prepared him for when he ultimately went to college in the US

Best gift you are going to give your sons is getting them out of the Thai educational system

Yes. To be honest the school they are at now seems to be very good, but it's not a Western education, but we're not in the West so hardly the schools fault.

[Essex Reject]

2 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

You have a very big job on your hands mate and you need to do a lot of research.  Finding a good school is like finding a Unicorn.  Do a lot of checking on the area  where you want to live and on school performance tables.  It's not easy to get a school out of the catchment area where you are living, so where you rent is going to be a big factor. Renting is a nightmare.  You need good references and a big deposit.  In addition, any town in the UK has good places and very bad ones, that will reflect in the  quality of the local schools and the quality of life for you and your family.  Again research is the key.  Inevitably, cheap or cheaper in the UK housing market means crap. I don't know your qualifications, but at your age you need to be experienced, qualified and attractive to potential employers.  Some companies, B & Q being a good example, encourage applications from older people, but it is inevitably part time and just a few hours a week. The UK is a part time, zero hours culture now.   Family support is going to be vital.  Don't underestimate the difficulty of getting a visa for your wife.  It's not as easy as it looks and is expensive. A good agent here in Thailand can help a lot. 

 

I hope this doesn't sound too negative. it's meant to be helpful. I do wish you and your family all the very best of luck in the move. 

No problem mate and thanks. I wouldn't want a school out of the catchment area. I can pay big deposit for rent.

 

Yes, the visa is a nightmare, but she would be a very good candidate and would be confident she would be fine and yes may well go to a visa co here.

 

As I said it is a big job yes, but the bottom line is many do it.

[Pilotman]

6 minutes ago, Essex Reject said:

No problem mate and thanks. I wouldn't want a school out of the catchment area. I can pay big deposit for rent.

 

Yes, the visa is a nightmare, but she would be a very good candidate and would be confident she would be fine and yes may well go to a visa co here.

 

As I said it is a big job yes, but the bottom line is many do it.

sounds like you have it covered, good luck and especially good luck coping with the God awful weather after so long here. 

[Essex Reject]

1 minute ago, Pilotman said:

sounds like you have it covered, good luck and especially good luck coping with the God awful weather after so long here. 

Yes, but at the same time I'm very very tired of this heat as are my wife and kids, then you have the pollution problem.  At least the UK actually has weather. Sometimes 4 lots in a day, lol. Will be nice waking up and wondering what the day will be like instead of KNOWING what the day will be like..every day for 365 days a year.

[sanemax]

6 minutes ago, Essex Reject said:

Yes, but at the same time I'm very very tired of this heat as are my wife and kids, then you have the pollution problem.  At least the UK actually has weather. Sometimes 4 lots in a day, lol. Will be nice waking up and wondering what the day will be like instead of KNOWING what the day will be like..every day for 365 days a year.

Would they cope with 3 months of cold , dark ,  rain or drizzle , when its dark by 5 PM?

[blackcab]

20 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

Don't underestimate the difficulty of getting a visa for your wife.  It's not as easy as it looks and is expensive. A good agent here in Thailand can help a lot.

 

To be fair we have some excellent, free advice in the Visas and Migration to Other Countries forum. @theoldgit is a legend, and I speak from experience.

 

@Essex Reject I know where you are coming from. It could be a genius move or an absolute disaster. I think the difference is the effort you are prepared to put in, and it is really nice to see you are prepared to kick some ideas around and ask for opinions and contributions from others before you make any moves.

 

With your positive attitude and sensible approach I am sure you and your family will do very well for yourselves.

 

Best of luck, and please keep us updated with your progress. You transition will help others so much when they read it in the future.

[Elad]

Hi

You will probably have to go to the UK first and start renting a house. Part of the evidence needed for a settlement visa is a rental agreement and photos of the property. Also, the 62,500 savings is fine for bringing your wife but i think (not sure) it will be slightly more when bringing the kids as well. 

[Essex Reject]

2 minutes ago, Elad said:

Hi

You will probably have to go to the UK first and start renting a house. Part of the evidence needed for a settlement visa is a rental agreement and photos of the property. Also, the 62,500 savings is fine for bringing your wife but i think (not sure) it will be slightly more when bringing the kids as well. 

No, I don't believe that is true at all ref housing. You only need to show you have suitable accomodation initially, could be a family member who has room etc.

 

Yes, maybe a little more for each child.

[CharlieH]

inflammatory comments removed.

[madmen]

Everything else is doable but getting a job is a problem. Its going to have to be non office (age and experience, references)

 

Something like taxi driver or security guard perhaps

[Essex Reject]

3 minutes ago, madmen said:

Everything else is doable but getting a job is a problem. Its going to have to be non office (age and experience, references)

 

Something like taxi driver or security guard perhaps

I couldn't be a taxi driver, too many annoying herberts around and I have a terrible sense of direction (even with sat nav_

[GinBoy2]

So I can't really comment on moving to the UK since I'm American.

 

But an interesting case study is from an old TVF member Mobi who moved his family back to the UK.

 

His blog is a pretty interesting read on his experiences of taking wife and step daughter back to England, and might give you some insights

 

https://mobithailand.com/

[Skallywag]

Just curious - How did you survive in Thailand for 15 years with a wife and 2 kids and no job?  Stock market investing? 

I have only recently retired here and had to work for 42 years to do that.  Amazes me how someone at 36 can move to Thailand, stay for 15 years, and start a family -  you have obviously done that -

 

Cheers

[7by7]

@Essex Reject, a lot of responses here; some with useful information, others with none.

 

Firstly, as your children are both British citizens they do not need visas to enter nor live in the UK, and they will not be included in the financial requirement.

 

Neither do they need to pass the English test and obtain a TB certificate.

 

The procedure for your wife is quite simple; and I see no need in the circumstances you describe to waste money on employing a visa agent.

 

You should start by reading the relevant to you parts of Family visas: apply, extend or switch.

 

The key points are:-

 

1) Genuine relationship and intend to live together in the UK.

Provide evidence of your living together in Thailand as well as your marriage. Though as they have accepted your relationship when they issued her visit visas, they can't really question it now.

 

See Immigration Directorate Instructions Annex FM Section FM 2.0 Genuine and Subsisting Relationship

 

2) You will have suitable accommodation for you and your family once in the UK.

 

It is possible to contact estate agents in the area where you intend to live from Thailand and arrange to rent somewhere; even a short term let would be acceptable. 

 

Alternatively, you could, as you say, stay with you dad  for a while? Staying with family or friends is acceptable, provided there is at least one room for the exclusive use of you and your wife and another for the two boys. Your dad should write a letter inviting you to stay with him in which he briefly describes the property, i.e. number of rooms, as well as who else lives there, if anyone, to show there is room for you. If he owns, he should say so. If he rents he should say so and a letter from his landlord giving their consent to the arrangement helps, but isn't essential.

 

I have even heard of a successful applicant whose partner provided an open ended hotel booking, saying that they would stay here until they found somewhere more permanent!

 

Whatever your solution; if it's temporary accommodation of some sort then explain this in your sponsor's letter.

 

See Guidance Maintenance and accommodation (MAA)

 

3) You must meet the financial requirement; see Immigration Directorate Instruction Family Migration: Appendix FM Section 1.7 Appendix Armed Forces;Financial Requirement.

 

You say that you have sufficient cash savings to do this; but make sure you have the required evidence of this.

 

4) School for the boys. 

 

I think this will be difficult to arrange until you are here. Certainly, when I was trying to arrange a place for my step daughter,  schools in my area all told me to come back after she had arrived.

 

But that was 19 years ago; things may very well have changed. If you know where you will be living then I'd suggest contacting schools in that area to see what help they can offer; failing that the Local Education Authority.

 

That assumes you will be looking for state schools. If private schools, then I doubt you'll have any problems; just contact the school.

 

5) Work.

 

As you are meeting the financial requirement through savings, you don't need to have a job lined up for when you return. but assume that you would want one asap

 

I assume you have been working during the last 15 years, otherwise I have to wonder what have you lived on and how have you managed to build up at least £62,500 in savings! You may very well finds that experience helps you find work here; even if not in the same line of employment. Employers don't like to see too large a gap between jobs on a CV!

 

Work is available for the more mature, and i don't mean just shelf stacking in a supermarket! I changed jobs a little over 2 years ago from a dead end job (customer service manager in a bookies) into a more challenging and exciting one (noise survey engineer) and I'm 63.

 

Remember, too, that as she is entering with a settlement visa, your wife can also work, if she wishes.

 

Best of luck with this, and if you have any more questions don't hesitate to ask.

 

 

[theoldgit]

Also, the 62,500 savings is fine for bringing your wife but i think (not sure) it will be slightly more when bringing the kids as well. 

The children are British Nationals, so are not included in the financial requirement calculations.

[BritManToo]

17 hours ago, Essex Reject said:

Somewhere to live - Would look for rented accom, not cheap, but may be able to stay with my Dad briefly when we get there, but me going back alone could be an option a few mts before to sort something.

You should go back with the kids, right from the start.

Social services will give you help with schools and accommodation if you're classed as a 'single parent family'.

Easier to get your wife a VISA to join you and your kids too, again SS will support your VISA claims.

If you go back alone, you'll find lots more obstacles to overcome.

[Skallywag]

7 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Firstly, as your children are both British citizens they do not need visas to enter nor live in the UK, and they will not be included in the financial requirement.

OP said, "I'm 51 been here 15 years, married to a Thai, we have 2 sons aged 10 and 7"   

 

How could the 2 sons be British citizens ?  Because the father is British?  I am not sure about this.

 

Wish the OP smooth sailing, yet a lot of preparation and work to be done before the big move. 

[BritManToo]

20 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

Understood - am from the USA, below some of the rules and proof needed:

This is a thread about UK children, only proof required is a Birth Cert with your name on it.

I had my kid's UK passport by the time he was 2 months old, and a UK consular Birth Cert as well as the Thai one.

[Saltire]

Brave decision. I can't comment on the schools or kids as I never had any, but 14 years ago I lived in China with my Chinese girlfriend for 2 years. I was also 51 then and had no plans ever to return to the UK (Scotland). I made a mistake and took her to Scotland for Christmas and New Year, next thing I was going home!

 

The job market was the problem for me. As a maths honours graduate with 30 years of unbroken senior IT/Programme management experience in the UK, I was deemed 'too old' although no one was allowed to say that. My g/f was on a spousal visa which allowed her to stay for 6 months in which time if we did not marry we would have to return to China. Fortunately I got a good IT Management job 5 months in which allowed me to get a better one after a few years. It was very hard work and a lot of rejection to deal with. 

 

Another aspect for you to sort out is registration for you all with the NHS, which I am told is not cheap. Possibly only applies to your wife but you and the kids are unlikely to get anything free for 6 months as non-residents. Not 100% sure about your kids sorry.

 

I have no idea what the job market is like right now as I left the UK (never going back this time!!) about 7 years ago after an amicable finish to the marriage. Visa issues excluded, I plan to see out my retirement in Thailand.

 

I wish you good luck, I am sure it can be done, just don't think of yourself as 'old' just yet. And anyway you can always return to Thailand.

 

[7by7]

7 hours ago, Skallywag said:

OP said, "I'm 51 been here 15 years, married to a Thai, we have 2 sons aged 10 and 7"   

 

How could the 2 sons be British citizens ?  Because the father is British?  I am not sure about this.

You should have read a bit further!

 

From the OP:

On ‎3‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 8:20 AM, Essex Reject said:

I'm 51 been here 15 years, married to a Thai, we have 2 sons aged 10 and 7, who go to private school here, for many reasons (but mainly for a better future for the kids, in school and out of school) I want to call it a day and go back. My wife and kids have been back to the UK twice before on visits, boys have British passports..

(7by7 emphasis)

If they weren't British citizens, then they wouldn't have British passports!

 

As others have said, if Essex Reject is British not by descent his children are automatically British wherever they are born. Although there would be a slight complication if they were born before 1st July 2006 outside the UK or a qualifying territory* and he wasn't married to their mother at the time and hasn't married her since. But that is irrelevant here as they were born after that date.

 

British not by descent means that one was born in the UK or a qualifying territory and at least one parent was British at the time of the birth.

 

Assuming his sons were not born in the UK or a qualifying territory then they are British by descent. This means they have inherited their British citizenship from him. British citizenship can only descend one generation, so their children will not be British unless those children are born in the UK or a qualifying territory or if born elsewhere their mother is British not by descent so they inherit British citizenship from her.

 

Even if Essex Reject is British by descent and his sons were born in Thailand so therefore were not automatically British, he could easily have registered them as British.

 

*The qualifying territories are all the British overseas territories, except the sovereign base areas of Akrotiri and Dhekelia in Cyprus.

 

[stuandjulie]

We moved back 6 months ago after 15 years, no Thai wife or kids but hopefully some of this will be of help.

1. If you have cash any benefits are means tested so if you have cash not a lot of joy there.

2. There are plenty of jobs around even for oldies as they can't discriminate anymore.

3. Housing to buy or rent, plenty around, there are huge differences in price, we moved to just outside Durham up North and you can get nice places in beautiful countryside for 450 - 500£ rent, an up to date cozy house for less than 100,000£. Down South is very expensive.

4. Food is relatively cheap with huge choices.

5. Cigarettes are very expensive, booze from Supermarkets cheapish, pubs again depends where you are.

6. Setting up the day to day stuff for normal living, doctors, dealing with the council, utilities etc. is very easy.

7. Everything is on-line, it is getting harder all the time to do things the old way.

8. No-one at all knows what is going to happen with Brexit, it is a shit show.

[7by7]

10 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

Thank you. Am USA citizen and the rules of "decent" require a paternity test to prove your child's citizenship.

All the UK requires is the child's local birth certificate naming the British father (or mother) and the parent's long form British birth certificate* to verify that the parent is British not by descent.

 

*Or naturalisation papers if British nationality was acquired that way. Naturalised British citizens are British not by descent.

[Essex Reject]

On 3/17/2019 at 1:58 AM, 7by7 said:

@Essex Reject, a lot of responses here; some with useful information, others with none.

 

Firstly, as your children are both British citizens they do not need visas to enter nor live in the UK, and they will not be included in the financial requirement.

 

Neither do they need to pass the English test and obtain a TB certificate.

 

The procedure for your wife is quite simple; and I see no need in the circumstances you describe to waste money on employing a visa agent.

 

You should start by reading the relevant to you parts of Family visas: apply, extend or switch.

 

The key points are:-

 

1) Genuine relationship and intend to live together in the UK.

Provide evidence of your living together in Thailand as well as your marriage. Though as they have accepted your relationship when they issued her visit visas, they can't really question it now.

 

See Immigration Directorate Instructions Annex FM Section FM 2.0 Genuine and Subsisting Relationship

 

2) You will have suitable accommodation for you and your family once in the UK.

 

It is possible to contact estate agents in the area where you intend to live from Thailand and arrange to rent somewhere; even a short term let would be acceptable. 

 

Alternatively, you could, as you say, stay with you dad  for a while? Staying with family or friends is acceptable, provided there is at least one room for the exclusive use of you and your wife and another for the two boys. Your dad should write a letter inviting you to stay with him in which he briefly describes the property, i.e. number of rooms, as well as who else lives there, if anyone, to show there is room for you. If he owns, he should say so. If he rents he should say so and a letter from his landlord giving their consent to the arrangement helps, but isn't essential.

 

I have even heard of a successful applicant whose partner provided an open ended hotel booking, saying that they would stay here until they found somewhere more permanent!

 

Whatever your solution; if it's temporary accommodation of some sort then explain this in your sponsor's letter.

 

See Guidance Maintenance and accommodation (MAA)

 

3) You must meet the financial requirement; see Immigration Directorate Instruction Family Migration: Appendix FM Section 1.7 Appendix Armed Forces;Financial Requirement.

 

You say that you have sufficient cash savings to do this; but make sure you have the required evidence of this.

 

4) School for the boys. 

 

I think this will be difficult to arrange until you are here. Certainly, when I was trying to arrange a place for my step daughter,  schools in my area all told me to come back after she had arrived.

 

But that was 19 years ago; things may very well have changed. If you know where you will be living then I'd suggest contacting schools in that area to see what help they can offer; failing that the Local Education Authority.

 

That assumes you will be looking for state schools. If private schools, then I doubt you'll have any problems; just contact the school.

 

5) Work.

 

As you are meeting the financial requirement through savings, you don't need to have a job lined up for when you return. but assume that you would want one asap

 

I assume you have been working during the last 15 years, otherwise I have to wonder what have you lived on and how have you managed to build up at least £62,500 in savings! You may very well finds that experience helps you find work here; even if not in the same line of employment. Employers don't like to see too large a gap between jobs on a CV!

 

Work is available for the more mature, and i don't mean just shelf stacking in a supermarket! I changed jobs a little over 2 years ago from a dead end job (customer service manager in a bookies) into a more challenging and exciting one (noise survey engineer) and I'm 63.

 

Remember, too, that as she is entering with a settlement visa, your wife can also work, if she wishes.

 

Best of luck with this, and if you have any more questions don't hesitate to ask.

 

 

Sorry for late reply,

 

Appreciate your input and ideas. Are you saying it's possible to arrange somewhere to rent from over here by phone/email? Never heard that before, must be a lot to arrange etc, and obviously can't few property?

 

As for schooling, not being there and what with being able to apply for schools 10 months before makes it a huge problem. One idea I have thought of, albeit a very expensive one, is I  could place the boys in a private school for 1 year then once settled in a catchment area then apply for schools. Just an idea mind.

 

As for working, the more I think about it I really don't think I will get anything, unless I get lucky (someone I know for example) or charm the pants off of someone, lol.