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I worry daughter is to generous to Mom and family.


Elkski

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44 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I would like to know how you can divine the innermost thoughts of another person. You should be a multi-millionaire if you have that faculty.

My GF and I treat one another with mutual respect. A good foundation for a relationship.

I suppose your opinion will be put to the test when a serious family crisis occurs. Report back after that.

 

I'm sorry but I don't understand. I quoted what you said. No need for me to try to ascertain someone's innermost thoughts when they write them on a forum.

 

If you care to read my first post you will see that I have been with my wife for 19 years. Plenty of family crisis have occurred and we have survived.

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55 minutes ago, Rc2702 said:

We give 5k a quarter and send 1250 baht of nourishment foods a month.

 

In the future we will provide care and accommodation to them but not on there terms. I doubt they would want to leave there village and there is zero chance of us moving there.

 

My concern is the sister and her BF. Been together 7 years started to ask questions about pregnancy tests recently. Gotta feeling we would have to take care of the child as both work. Im not against it but the terms of such an arrangement would be interesting to hear.

We are talking about  9-15k a quarter .   But that means I'm thinking 9 and she is thinking 15. 

What supplement food items are you sending?   

 

I do worry about the family emergency. Sure gets mad because I talk bad about her family when I ask and try to plan for something that hasn't happened. 

 

I guess the fact that I'm having these conversations with this women is a big red flag. She has admitted to feeling the need to send mom money and has a long history of this on her own. 

 

I guess this is revealing my selfishness to her and you guys. So be it.   I have thought I should tell her whatever we send your mother we will send mine.  So we will have to eat out 8 times a month less of course I don't like to eat out two times a month so you will be cooking every night.   There are two daughters and supposedly they would inherit the farm.  I want to tell her if she donates more to Mom than her sister she should get more land then her sister. Maybe I should tell her we can make arrangements for the money we send Mom that is more than your sister sendwe buy more land each month. 

This is how my stingy logical mind works.  I guess currently they don't discuss how much each sibling gives mom.   

and I should add it does not appear the amount of money she has given is based on Mom's asking or needs.  It's more a face generosity thing. and when I asked why doesn't the farm make enough money she says it loses money but it provides rice for all the family to eat.  so I will be paying for how many people's bags of rice in the village and family?  But this type of logic doesn't work I'm pretty sure.

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29 minutes ago, Elkski said:

We are talking about  9-15k a quarter .   But that means I'm thinking 9 and she is thinking 15. 

What supplement food items are you sending?   

 

I do worry about the family emergency. Sure gets mad because I talk bad about her family when I ask and try to plan for something that hasn't happened. 

 

I guess the fact that I'm having these conversations with this women is a big red flag. She has admitted to feeling the need to send mom money and has a long history of this on her own. 

 

I guess this is revealing my selfishness to her and you guys. So be it.   I have thought I should tell her whatever we send your mother we will send mine.  So we will have to eat out 8 times a month less of course I don't like to eat out two times a month so you will be cooking every night.   There are two daughters and supposedly they would inherit the farm.  I want to tell her if she donates more to Mom than her sister she should get more land then her sister. Maybe I should tell her we can make arrangements for the money we send Mom that is more than your sister sendwe buy more land each month. 

This is how my stingy logical mind works.  I guess currently they don't discuss how much each sibling gives mom.   

and I should add it does not appear the amount of money she has given is based on Mom's asking or needs.  It's more a face generosity thing. and when I asked why doesn't the farm make enough money she says it loses money but it provides rice for all the family to eat.  so I will be paying for how many people's bags of rice in the village and family?  But this type of logic doesn't work I'm pretty sure.

Her family lack sugar  and milk so we send snacks and milk powder every month. Have been doing this for nearly 2 years. They seem to be doing really well (touch wood) 

 

They were really weak and thin but both have a bit of roundness to there faces now and have a lot more life in them. 

 

Besides money you should tell the family to keep there mouths shut on whatever you send them. 

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9 hours ago, Elkski said:

If we do a prenup she might know my assets.  I think it would be hard for a woman like this to understand I will need to keep on a rigid  track to my retirement plans.  I have said I will budget some support for mom like 3000 baht/mo.  In USA she may get a job.

From previous posts I thought you were retired, you have not mention that you worked in Thailand or in the USA that I can recall.  just an observation as you mention here "rigid track to my retirement plans"

 

Pretty basic is the fact that in the USA you will have to support yourself and your wife first with medical coverage, housing, utilities, food, transportation, etc..  

 

I would think about that before considering what your wife's family may want or expect  - as am sure you have to a great extent.  

 

Interesting read - and good questions as always Elski

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Overall, despite how lovely and beautiful she is, I would say don't marry into a poor family.  Especially one already demonstrating social dysfunction, drinking, gambling, and it would appear your g/f is the dutiful daughter being taken advantage of.   I wouldn't expect that dynamic to change if you pull her into your world full-time.   She'll still feel pressure to provide and they may pressure her to give more because of her relationship with you.  And if she doesn't, that'll be a constant stress on her.

 

Sounds like you have self-discipline and if you proceed, set the bar low at first and adjust from there if you need to.  Don't go in high, get them used to it, then try to reduce later.  Well, you can do that but the former path is better.  Don't be afraid to say "No", even if it makes you feel like a tight wad.  If saying no changes or ends the relationship, then you saved yourself years of headaches - move on and be happy.

 

I did that early on with my wife and her family, although didn't have to contend with the social dysfunction aspect.  With her Dad gone now (died 2 years ago), wife visits her 85 y/o Mom once a week out in the village, and usually leaves 1,000 Baht for the coming week's market runs.  About once a month she'll go to BigC/Tesco/Makro (whatever) and buy staple items, less than 2,000 Baht.  2 older sisters live there full-time now, taking care of things.  2 older brothers in BKK send money up for electric and other bills, and visit as often as they can.

 

So Mom costs me about $200/mo.   As long as I see all the siblings, nephews and nieces are engaged, donating their time and money to the effort, then I'm good with pitching in.

 

Good luck.

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Let me just put it this way, and you make of it what you will.

 

I have never observed a sibbling supporting able bodied adult sibblings to the extent that your girlfriend claims she is under obligation to do. Maybe if they were handicapped. But a sibbling supporting alcoholic or ne'er-do-well sibblings to the extent you describe? Never in my experience. Even evidence of unusually generous financial support for parents is scarce -- except, except -- when a farang is bankrolling the largesse.

 

I've lived in my area long enough to know which families have children living or working in urban areas or abroad. Some maybe work in entertainment venues, but many work in factories in Samut Prakan or Chonburi, etc. In many cases their children are being raised in the village because that is what is expedient. Typically, the woman sends a small amount of money each month to cover food and clothing expenses for the child and a little for the caregiver. For example, I know one woman who sends her mother 8K/month out of her salary of 20K to pay for her mother to look after her daughter. Half is for the child, half for the caregiver.

 

But, in general, it is difficult to discern any appreciable betterment of the family's standard of living from stipends sent from children working abroad or in urban areas. I see scarce evidence that those with children working abroad or in urban areas eat, dress, live in nicer houses, or drive nicer motorcycles or cars than families without children working abroad or in urban areas.  As I said earlier, sibblings shouldering the support for ne'er-do-well sibblings with alcohol or drug problems is just something I've never ever observed in my time here.

 

To be candid, the amount of money and the number of mouths your girlfriend claims are dependent on her makes me wonder if you aren't being fed stories which exaggerate the extent of filial and sibbling obligations in Thai culture.

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Skally and Jay thanks very much.  

I am putting my engineering training and frugal nature into this.  I know many say just follow your heart.  

I am retired although working like a dog as that goes.  Living in Utah of all places to put down roots.  

I am considering racking a few more years of work if I do bring a woman to USA.  I do see myself moving to the woman's home country after more confidence exist in a relationship.  

Some additional facts I've learned just now. Mom has a very big family like 13 brothers and sisters only a few are alive now. My girlfriend's mom has no grandchildren but lots of her siblings have grandchildren.  The village helps harvest mom's rice and gets 40% take.  Mom doesn't sell any of her 60 bags of rice because she gives it away to family. From my prior research into rice farming and talking to other women about their harvests and prices I know rice was about 10 baht a kilogram and rice bags 60 kg. You're probably seeing where I'm going with this logic.  yes my rough calculations are mom is giving away 25 to 35 thousand baht of rice each year. these calculations may be off but the point is my girlfriend is paying for everybody's rice as well as all the drinks for her brother and sister who do not contribute much to Mom.   I actually think the 40-60 split is too favorable for the village people. I don't think the village would be too happy to hear we are hiring outside company to harvest the rice and Mom will be selling her rice this year and in the future.  I don't think my thought process and Thailand will be a very good match.  As painful as I feel right now I think I'm going to have to cut this woman. 

Additionally I observed many of the village cows grazing on Mom's land last songkran.  When I asked about this and inquired if people pay to graze on Mom's land she said no everyone kind of shares things in the village.  I personally saw her give out about 20,000 baht during songkran to various people and her mom. I spent 1500 baht to modernize mom sink with a sprayer and high faucet that other villagers wanted to copy. I love to go to market and we bought seafood and helped cook  dinner for about 15 people. I spent most of two days of my time learning how to harvest bamboo to make repairs to bamboo chairs her late father made 15 years ago. I supposedly was the first farang in that village much less her bedroom.   I met this woman over a year ago. and we have been conversing for that much time and I have visited her four different trips since.  I have no doubt she has sent some number between 3000 and 10000 bought a month 4 more than 10 years. This represents from 30 to 50% of her salary. She lives a very austere life as I mentioned earlier. She shares a fan room with no kitchen in BKK. 

I have been inspired by her generosity.  I'm trying to convince her our future , my future must come first.  I just don't think her mind works this way. 

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I like the common litmus test here on ThaiVisa.  

 

"Would you get involved in a situation like this for a g/f in your country?".

 

Different culture and economies of scale but it's a fair question, and can help you refocus if you're down the Thai fever rabbit hole.  Then try to view yourself from her perspective.  What would you be thinking if the roles were reversed.

 

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Jay,. As you may be able to tell I have spent to much time reading TV and  know all the TV sayings.  Using the "would you do this at home" litmus test on a prostitute is easy to answer but this is hard to fault her generosity, but the outcome could be just as much a risk to my heart, mind, and purse.   

Her drunken brother probably doesn't drink much more than most. He is a heavy equipment operator when he has work. Supposedly he is not drinking anymore after last summers month long hospital stay and a month at moms recovering, but you know how that goes. Sister has a food catering business of some type.  Maybe I should add that she is the youngest sibling evidently she was very smart in school enter Dad read lots of books to her and tried to teach her English. She was his favorite child. I think he  told her she would be his best child,  not go to bars , not drink, excetera excetera I don't know all for sure.  He passed about 12 years ago.  She doesn't go to bars and has rarely drank.  Her generosity is inspirational but painful and I don't even think she understands. 

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Just don't do it, she will be happier doing her own thing, and possibly encounter other guys available out there who are not so rigid in their thinking regarding how she chooses to take care of her family.

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, JAFO said:

OP, I think its clear that with this post (and many others you have posted) that you continue to look at relationships and women like a mathematical algorithm and that you can quantify all her intentions now and later. Just doesn't work that way.

 

Relationships are always a "work in progress" from the day you meet.  If you and her are happy the rest usually always works out. If you are trying to dial it all in and not remain flexible, then its destined to fail. simple as that.

 

I suggest you stay single and date. This way when the math doesn't work out, you can just move on. 😉  

Best advice yet. The OP has too many concerns, better just to stay single, with money to jingle.

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Jafo, I missed your post.  Very good advice and knowledge of me.  I think of your prior advice often.  In fact I did not use a dating site to find this woman.  I saw her in front of emporium taking pictures with her friends of the Christmas display and the magic clicked and I uncharacteristically braved going up to her to talk to her.    Yes she maybe better off to find a man with an extra digit in his net worth column.   

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Not always about money, for sure a Thai lady is not looking for somebody who will complicate her life and bring conflicts. Thus a potential suitor must display a reasonable line of at least generous thought and understanding.

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Yes Geo,. Thai women don't like change or someone rocking the boat. 

 

Someone said you need to start off firm because it's hard to go backwards. 

 

I had a saying in my youth " a relationship with a woman is like a slippery slope, you can never climb uphill!  it's just a matter of digging in and sliding down as slow as possible" 

 

 

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Elkski, I don't know how old are you and you don't really have to say, but my mom is still alive, alone and lives of very small pension. I would feel very odd helping other people's family while neglecting my own.

 

Now, everyone deserves help, especially if they live in a poor Thai village and are malnourished, but I never saw a point helping a dysfunctional family - gamblers, drunkards and drug users. This help almost never works out and the worst thing is you are going to make yourself feel worse by "helping" these people, so in reality there will be even more miserable people around. I have never seen one single example where helping a basket case financially was productive. Ever.

 

From what you wrote so far, I would avoid.

 

 

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