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BANGKOK 19 August 2019 07:22
Elkski

I worry daughter is to generous to Mom and family.

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The relationship as I read through more of his posts seem completely centered around money and what he might have to "Give" based on conversations of what she currently gives.

 

I think one of the challenges here is balancing a western upbringing with a Thai upbringing and those differences.  In the states this is never really an item. We meet, we date and if the right person we marry and then the rest is worked out. Here it seems to be driven by financial support and what can the foreigner supply. If I had an extended family here with drinkers, druggies, sickly's etc I would not pay at all. Not my responsibility. My responsibility is to provide and take care of my wife, just like I would do in the states. But that would not change the relationship with my wife. I do not want to come across insensitive. I have bought my FIL some tools and my niece some college supplies but that is on my terms. There are no expectations just because I am a foreigner. My FIL lives with us on his own side of the house and does his thing. I never give him money. My wife shops for food for all of us but he eats like a bird. He gets a small govt pension and that's his. He lives a very very simple life. My other extended family members live near BKK and both her sister and her husband work and support their daughter. They never asked us for anything and do not think they ever would.

 

My point is that while I understand the OP is being cautious and rightly so. If my now wife had started on about giving money to family or sending money home when she came with me to the states I might have reconsidered because the relationship would have come across as more a financial arrangement versus a relationship. 

 

I find many of these type of deals seem to come from men using internet dating sites. Clearly the woman has a specific set of needs and requirements and is searching for it. Not sure all are upfront but she knows what she wants.

 

Good Luck

 

 

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3 hours ago, puchooay said:

I'm sorry but I don't understand. I quoted what you said. No need for me to try to ascertain someone's innermost thoughts when they write them on a forum.

 

If you care to read my first post you will see that I have been with my wife for 19 years. Plenty of family crisis have occurred and we have survived.

I said family comes first for a Thai. You truly have a jewel if you are put before your wife's family. I would describe you as a statistical outlier, assuming your post is valid.

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, Elkski said:

Yes Geo,. Thai women don't like change or someone rocking the boat. 

 

Someone said you need to start off firm because it's hard to go backwards. 

 

I had a saying in my youth " a relationship with a woman is like a slippery slope, you can never climb uphill!  it's just a matter of digging in and sliding down as slow as possible" 

 

 

Unfortunately what many westerners might see as 'rocking the boat' the Thai lady may well look on as liable to sink it!

I think starting off firm is better left until one is at least out of the blocks. No harm in trying to control expectation, just don't start out by pointing out family failings as a future lever to curb funding!

 

Take for instance eating out, yes for westerner good reward for a hard weeks work. The lady would probably gain more satisfaction rustling up a snack than an extravagant meal out, and sending an extra 100 baht that her family may eat chicken with their rice.

Thus a meal out will not necessarily impress a Thai daughter.

Edited by 473geo
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14 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I said family comes first for a Thai. You truly have a jewel if you are put before your wife's family. I would describe you as a statistical outlier, assuming your post is valid.

All four of my posts on this thread are valid. Yes, you are correct. I have a jewel.

 

I don't recall saying that my wife puts me first. Rather that she sees me as part of the family and therefore treats me as such.

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Posted (edited)

The topic and intent of this thread was to learn more about this  Thai thing if siblings sending money home to mom.    I haven't said it is a disfunctional family.   Although it surely is notable for me. But I've only met two families. 

Since beginning to travel to Thailand 3 years ago I have begun to realize how lucky my upbringing and life has been. In fact just the other day possibly due to this thread I called my mom up and told her how thankful I was for how well she raised me, always food ,and a nice home.  But we never had aircon or even a swamp cooler in Denver.  How did I survive.  

I have a rather big family of relatives since my mom had six sisters. but in America you may get support in the help of helping out some chores or construction or something but I don't know of any financial assistance of one relative to the other outside of individual families.  This is all such a strange concept to me.  I like to think I have developed a very open mind and I try to listen and not rigid in my thinking.  I know to many of you the fact that I am thinking in these terms is very unromantic and almost evil.  but let me tell you none of my engineering projects ever failed they were always one hundred percent successful and I had the lowest scrap rate of any engineer. I learned to Do it right the first time called dirtfoot.

 

DiRTfTS 

One of my bosses added the S for stupid

 

I'm 58.  many people have given me advice.  that I should just move to Thailand find a place enjoy hobbies relax and see what happens. 

other advice was to enjoy my butterfly years and then not worry about  picking one till I'm 65.  

One more thing this woman has never been on a dating site but I think modern social media let's these women see many instances of foreigner(she never say farang) Thai relationships.  She has a few friends who are married to foreigners and living in different countries.  I think through social media these relationships look amazing. We all know our women post their worst pictures and worst days on Facebook and Instagram.   Not.  

Plus a few careless or rich men have really ruined it for the rest of us.  So now many villagers and family think a Foreigner in the family is a gold mine.  

I know many of you are thinking if I'm thinking like this and willing to cut a woman over this reason it must not be real love. I don't know.  when I was 20 you fell in love and got married because we both had the exact same assets and education. It's different now when I'm older than the woman and the asset difference is vast.   I've read all the horror stories on TV of the men in pain and stuck in relationships usually via a child or destitute. I just think I need to make a smart decision and it's easier to decide now.   This is what I see as the weak link in our relationship.  even before I met this woman I had learned enough about Thai culture that I had budgeted three to five thousand bought a month for family.  It's not like a financial plan for 35 years doesn't have some risk of failure so I would like to have extra padding and anyone who knows financial calculations knows you don't want to deplete your principal early on. Do you think I could teach a Thai woman time value of money?

Edited by Elkski
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Well as far as women go I had a great time, enjoyed just about all my experiences, no plan no get it right first time pressure, just go with the flow, it appears either I learnt along the way, or finally got lucky. Maybe a bit of both. 🙂

 

I have a brother similar to you - engineer the world over - chose his wife in a similar fashion to your method, he planned to have a house paid for, marry at 30, he did, must have been happily married 30+ years now so worked for him. He and his wife, took really good care of our parents too. Now as the parents of his wife are aged and infirm he is helping to take care of them also. This in the UK. So for me not an unknown scenario.

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37 minutes ago, Elkski said:

Do you think I could teach a Thai woman time value of money?

Yes this can be done, for example my mother in law gave us land to build a house, I told my wife for now a house is dead money, a truck is dead money, first we buy a little land have cows and rice try to make little bit money. My wife took this on board, to her credit she weathered the continuous question of 'when make house' for 5 years!! Must have been very trying for her. However we bought a little land because we had money when it became available, subsequently built a modest home on the mother in laws land, and just now 13 years later I have told her if she is willing to learn to drive we can think about getting a car 🙂

Steady progress.....I smile when people use the phrase 'oh yeah your one is different' because if she isn't there are millions incredible women in Thailand 🙂

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Never a mention of private hospital.  She never says I think to mut.  But I have heard that before.  She wonders why I think about things that have not happened.  She is offended that I think that her family may someday have an emergency and  expect my money. 

 

I choose the first wife of 26 years with much thought.   It was a success in so many measures. It was painful to have failed at something. But then I had the thought to look the glass as 26 years full when the average is much shorter.  A chance scuba trip on a sudden work delay has now given me these refreshing wonderful SEAsia women to consider.   I just plan fir this relationship to last longer than 30 years to best my last wife. 

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11 hours ago, Pravda said:

Relocating to China would not be an issue. At least air quality seems to be better.

Oh yeah you will love the air in China.

And no queues! Shove your way to personal happiness.

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Posted (edited)

My Thai is almost zero.  It should be better.  But I've focused on other areas.  

I find Thai sounds better on my ears than Mandarin or Vietnamese. .  But on my spreadsheet, that line item only has a class 4 rating with a point  load factor of 0.2 calculated into it.  555

 

besides bringing a Thai woman to the USA and the pitfalls associated with that even though it's her dream I think the money issues to family is the only thing that can break us up. And the mental picture I imagine of something like that is not good. 

This woman like most Thai women was very concerned about my drinking and  gambling habits. 

before I knew it for drinking concern I did have three drinks at the beach in 7 hours. I learned this distressed her so I have pretty much limited myself to one beer every few days which is made much easier by all the shity beer in Thailand. Actually you can buy some nice microbrews from the USA but 250 baht , 10% discount for takeout. . I'm an IPA addict .  Besides my Homebrew recipe of ssos I think this is the best IPA I've ever had.  Oregon brewery.  as for the gambling her lottery addiction is more expensive than my bar poker Texas hold em nights. 

IMG_20190303_181346377.jpg

Edited by Elkski

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I’ve seen people that got the good flip of the coin. A guy down the street wife and young sone 5 yrs? He was retired with a pension.

Can’t say that his wife family members were given money they earned it. Her sister cooked all meals everyday of the year as needed,cleaned two houses on one lot washed clothes and was paid 3,000 baht a month. He and wife bought a full size tractor for the 26 rai. The brother worked the farm and I’d guess Tractor work 

for others for money. He maintains the tractor properly.Her Mother ans Father already reached Retirement age. Father goes out and helps at the farm most days driving the two wheel tractor pulling a tailor and he gets 700 baht a month from social security for lack of knowing the actual name of Thailand system. The mother is blind so really can’t work. They the 5 year old boy together and she has a teenage girl from another relationship. The daughter goes to proper school in Udon I don’t think it’s private but known for giving students a proper education. Other than that normal daily needs they pay for. There are 3 houses on 2 lots side by side looking at the set-up looms like one lot. One that was built prior to their relationship that Mama,Papa,Brother live in. One that they paid for for the two of them ans two children. The third house paid 

for by her sisters husband a foreigner that works in his country and out quarterly to visit his wife and 1 hear old son so they support themselves. Retired friend have been together over 8 years and on,y the last 5 years since they moved to the country. His wife takes care of the children, works at the farm of needed, takes care of buying groceries etc. so a non paying job. He liked Thai food but loved to cook so many times he made his own and I’ve ate some he’s good at it. 

 

He loved it here in the country never said a bad thing about his family ever! They all supported themselves as a family with no greed that I could see. I bought my land from them

 

So to say All relationship here are a set up for a rip off really not true there’s good and bad relationships in every country . I’m American if it matters.

 

Now there’s some that got the losing side of the coin toss. 

 

I’m one and beemthtough most of the things talked about. You have to look at it and remember how did you let your hands off the

wheel And either let little head do the thinking , being trusting or? 

 

If you figure out things are going sideways before you run out 

of rope and hang yourself (not actually hanf yourself ) you got into.

Figure out a way to control the mess of if you choose get out. 

I thought about packing it in and moving somewhere else in the region because Tyne you’d be much much smarter right,..uh huh.

 

I stayed figured out what I could and could not live wirh. The parents who live in a small house in back of main house. They

really didn’t try to greedy with me or did the two sisters. There is 

A Brother but he in his wife live and work in Bangkok. 

 

Once I was within ears reach and heard the older sister talking 

to my wife. I can understand a little Thai nit much but the sister 

was really giving it to the wife and trying to get her to help her on

her gambling losses. I felt for the wife because I understood it

was other sibling that was bewildering the youngest sister my wife

foe money.

 

Wife knows now little head no longer has a say if it’s something I want to do and not pushed into to do I will help out. But the sister 

got into the mess she can get out of it, ended up here and here 

husband who where basically doing their personal farm work. Which will, keep them from starving and put food on the plate 

 jt no real money is made other than to get by, so they went and

worked construction in Bangkok got out of the jam . I’ve only seen

Gambling be a problem with the sister once in three years, 

 

So....

 

Mama 5,000 baht a month works in the vegetable gardens and sells to local market and works the sugar cane and potatoes and rice we 15 rai. 

 

Papa - 0 baht and he knows when he asks usually for 200 baht he’s got to mow the yard around the house and it’s decent size and he knows he needs to do a good job. Wash cars and moto. I’d estimate

between 1500-2000 baht a month. It’s funny to see he quabbbling with pay for 20-40 baht she make sure he’s not pulling something.

 

oldest sister Ex gambler and husband- 5,000 baht plus house electric at the cow stables for lack of a better word. Takes care of 12 cows everyday the birth the calf’s everything. Daily they work their own potatoes, sugsr cane,rice fields and when the sell they get money. We have more than enough rice for all of them. 

They have 2 children teen daughter good student, 19 year old son

wa lazy do nothing but ask them for 20-40 baht a day. He had a little trouble wa seen smoking no possession and got locked up.

i was told about it and said not anything to do with me. I think it

was 16,000 baht ans he spent one or two nights locked up. I didn’t give any money. I think Mama borrowed against her gold 

 

So not much longer he had a job working construction in BKK 

7 months now he co so back every 1-1/2 months for 3 day break

and back to work. There are 5 or 6 guys same area same schedule. 

Ivw noticed he kinda I likes having his own money which is good 

some people need a push. 

 

Suster 5 years older than wife - 5,000 baht a month 4-5 hours everyday cleaning the house windows everything and she knows 

how to clean. She was doing mine and the wife wash but she really sucked at it. 

 

All in All their a good family and do anything I ask and really 

respectful their lives are a little better nit. Ugh but plenty 

of food  let are happy everyday. 

 

 

The oldest sister and her family live in a two bedroom house with the minimal we had built for them to live, they lived slept in a thatched 1 room whatever you want to call it until house was finished. All in we laid 90,000 for the house, All labor was done by his father , old sister and husband at no charge to us, electric runs around 800-900 baht a month. 

 

The wife is the greedy one and that’s be sorted out as far of money 

from me... 

 

You just need to figure out what BS if any you are willing to deal

with and go from there. I’ve got everything paid for so why leave.

if someone is unhappy the exit is that way, 

 

althiugh i basically retired I have a company unlated to thailamd 

have some revenue coming in. Not filed for social security but

Will be 65 in a couple of months Incase everything dries up,

 

Thailand for me is a good place to live / retire if so be, My body

can deal with heat much more than cold. I’ve met a lot of good 

people and not one ever asked for anything...  maybe we have 

a few drinks and If we can speak each other’s language we get 

by.

 

Once was told in China I was holding chopsticks incorrectly 

i said well does it look like I’ve starved.. no.

 

I lived in China in a small city and you think some changes that make you want to run,,,  try China for awhile. I lived there a little 

over 12 years. It took awhile to adjust I lived in a brand new apartment on the 12 floor and everyday the power went off everyday in the summer and climb 12 floors ... I’d go down to 

the place that took care of the electric same bs every day and

They didn’t speak English very well and I didn’t speak Chinese.

 

Later I learned to have patience but in the early years, the electric there office was a 4 minute walk from my unit and oartbif the complex. A few times I noticed where the breakers were so that 

day went in a shut their power off. They said yuh can’t do that..but I did and I’m not turning them on until an expedited effort to fix our buildings power, they sat in the heat and I sat there for a couple hours until the were off work, power was on the next day no further problems .

 

 

Transferred money from US to China needed to open business, 

it never got there not returned to the US bank. Went to the main office of bank what’s the problem. Well you’ve spelled your name incorrectly... I’ve spelled my name the same since 1954 I got loud

so they took me up to the VIP area. A guy sitting in a room looked

like he had a bit of money. There was a sign no smoking. (I’m a smoker) and angry can’t spell my name right, they said he’s a very important customer I walked over went inside the room he had 

all for himself.  You see that sign? No smoking put your fing cigarette out, he did. They moved me again, the problem this is a major Chinese bank they’re computer system didn’t have enough room for my name. I had to use only middle inrial 

 

so chnages have have some,patience and try to work through them 

Thai is a good with good people just keep your eyes open..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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10 hours ago, Elkski said:

Skally and Jay thanks very much.  

I am putting my engineering training and frugal nature into this.  I know many say just follow your heart.  

I am retired although working like a dog as that goes.  Living in Utah of all places to put down roots.  

I am considering racking a few more years of work if I do bring a woman to USA.  I do see myself moving to the woman's home country after more confidence exist in a relationship.  

Some additional facts I've learned just now. Mom has a very big family like 13 brothers and sisters only a few are alive now. My girlfriend's mom has no grandchildren but lots of her siblings have grandchildren.  The village helps harvest mom's rice and gets 40% take.  Mom doesn't sell any of her 60 bags of rice because she gives it away to family. From my prior research into rice farming and talking to other women about their harvests and prices I know rice was about 10 baht a kilogram and rice bags 60 kg. You're probably seeing where I'm going with this logic.  yes my rough calculations are mom is giving away 25 to 35 thousand baht of rice each year. these calculations may be off but the point is my girlfriend is paying for everybody's rice as well as all the drinks for her brother and sister who do not contribute much to Mom.   I actually think the 40-60 split is too favorable for the village people. I don't think the village would be too happy to hear we are hiring outside company to harvest the rice and Mom will be selling her rice this year and in the future.  I don't think my thought process and Thailand will be a very good match.  As painful as I feel right now I think I'm going to have to cut this woman. 

Additionally I observed many of the village cows grazing on Mom's land last songkran.  When I asked about this and inquired if people pay to graze on Mom's land she said no everyone kind of shares things in the village.  I personally saw her give out about 20,000 baht during songkran to various people and her mom. I spent 1500 baht to modernize mom sink with a sprayer and high faucet that other villagers wanted to copy. I love to go to market and we bought seafood and helped cook  dinner for about 15 people. I spent most of two days of my time learning how to harvest bamboo to make repairs to bamboo chairs her late father made 15 years ago. I supposedly was the first farang in that village much less her bedroom.   I met this woman over a year ago. and we have been conversing for that much time and I have visited her four different trips since.  I have no doubt she has sent some number between 3000 and 10000 bought a month 4 more than 10 years. This represents from 30 to 50% of her salary. She lives a very austere life as I mentioned earlier. She shares a fan room with no kitchen in BKK. 

I have been inspired by her generosity.  I'm trying to convince her our future , my future must come first.  I just don't think her mind works this way. 

 

You've answered most of your own questions I think.  At least she is straight with you on this, she spends all her money on the family.  If your money (or any of it) also becomes her money then you can see what will happen.  It sounds like the family are all quite happy to scrounge off her and she is quite happy to keep giving.  You should only expect that the financial pressures from the family will increase as she will have access to more money in their eyes.  I think with all Thai people you just have to take them as they are, getting involved in how much rice is given away or how the land is used would be churlish in their eyes and perhaps without sounding rude you're not understanding the village way of life or the family dynamics.  

 

I would also be wary of any Thai woman who suddenly has a "dream" to move to the US

 

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Posted (edited)

Dj54

 

I think your Thai family hit super lottery.   

 

I'm not sure how my life could ever compare.    You sound like you retired with an extra 0 on the finance line. 

Just remember to be worth more alive than dead. 

Edited by Elkski

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