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Foreign Retired Couple: Husband dies, How long can dependent wife stay?


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I cannot find an answer using search.  But if a foreign couple (both foreigners) are retired with the husband as the primary retiree (800,000 in the bank) and the wife as his dependent (free), and he dies, what are her options to stay, and how long does she have to make a new option?

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The wife’s extension would end if immigration are informed of the husbands death. She would immediately need to leave the country unless she qualifies to apply for an extension in her own right.

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6 hours ago, elviajero said:

The wife’s extension would end if immigration are informed of the husbands death. She would immediately need to leave the country unless she qualifies to apply for an extension in her own right.

She's over 50 and if she had 800,000 already in her own name in a Thai bank for 3 months could she immediately get retirement extension without needing to leave Thailand?

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1 minute ago, mojaco said:

She's over 50 and if she had 800,000 already in her own name in a Thai bank for 3 months could she immediately get retirement extension without needing to leave Thailand?

Yes she could.

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26 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Immigrants would not be going out and looking for somebody whose family member had died. A person could probably get away with staying until their extension ended.

Wouldn't they technically be on overstay if immigration is informed too late and that is discovered later?

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The police have to be informed is a foreigner dies,they would inform the embassy, but doubtful if immigration would link that to a dependant spouse. Tend to agree with UJ whereby in effect the extension of stay is cancelled the surviving spouse would have time to seek alternative, but yes, in reality on overstay.

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Thank all of you for your replies and advice.  But right now my 800,000 is in a Fixed Deposit and that wouldn't be instantly accessible via ATM card.  So I guess it would be best to get her on her own "retirement extension" ahead of time to avoid any probably-illegal overstay problems.  Or if she would prefer my having the 800,000 in my normal single-owner savings account with her as the death beneficiary registered on that account, maybe that would work timely enough for her to access my 800,000 to use for herself.

 

But that last option wouldn't meet the pre-extension two month criteria would it?

 

Edited by mojaco
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11 hours ago, elviajero said:

The wife’s extension would end if immigration are informed of the husbands death. She would immediately need to leave the country unless she qualifies to apply for an extension in her own right.

That's compassionate.  Throw her out!  She's obviously undesirable!

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1 hour ago, mojaco said:

Thank all of you for your replies and advice.  But right now my 800,000 is in a Fixed Deposit and that wouldn't be instantly accessible via ATM card.  So I guess it would be best to get her on her own "retirement extension" ahead of time to avoid any probably-illegal overstay problems.  Or if she would prefer my having the 800,000 in my normal single-owner savings account with her as the death beneficiary registered on that account, maybe that would work timely enough for her to access my 800,000 to use for herself.

 

But that last option wouldn't meet the pre-extension two month criteria would it?

 

 

AFAIK Thai banks do not list beneficiaries.  Either it is a joint account (which won't work for immigration) or one has to go through the courts for the survivor to get access.

 

I have asked. And ended up making out a Thai will solely for my Thai bank accounts because there was no other way.

 

While a foreign will can be used it will take longer so advisable to make a Thai one. Can be done at your Ampur for little or no cost. Your wife will still have to go through the courts but notarized translations and the like won't be needed so faster/less hassle.

 

This is actually one of my biggest grievances with the new requirements for not spending the  800K. If it was set up instead as a bond one posted that one could indicate a beneficiary for, then at least it would cover your cremation/funeral costs etc.

 

 

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I would say  go to try get the 7 days to leave , go neighboring country to get any available visa , or in last resort depending nationality a visa exempt by entry by air , to win time to arrange further steps..

 

Regrettable that with present changes about the ret.ext , it is not possible any more to make with the 800K on bank and shifting applicant's number 2 her dates make 2 ret. extensions with one 800K available 

Edited by david555
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This is a big problem and the reason I urge couples to each have their own retirement visa extensions if possible.  Or if they must piggy-back with one having a dependent visa, then the holder of the 800,000 baht bank account should be the younger, healthier person -- usually the wife, which, of course, runs counter to most people's thinking of who should be the primary person of a couple to "hold the money".

 

There have been several situations where I've been asked to assist a couple where the man is clearly in his final stages of life and wants to get the 800,000 baht transferred to his wife.  I've found bank officers very willing to visit the hospital room to execute the necessary documents.  They'd much rather do this than have family members try to play tricks like raiding a bank account once someone has passed.  Amazingly, many wives, especially Asian wives, don't want to cooperate because they think that transferring the money before someone is dead is a bad omen, an admission that they wish their husband to be dead.

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On 3/20/2019 at 11:21 AM, Sheryl said:

 

AFAIK Thai banks do not list beneficiaries.  Either it is a joint account (which won't work for immigration) or one has to go through the courts for the survivor to get access.

 

I have asked. And ended up making out a Thai will solely for my Thai bank accounts because there was no other way.

<SNIP>

 

My close Thai friend of 25 years asked yesterday and the local Bangkok Bank in our town said he could become like a "beneficiary" กรรมสิทธิ์ Kammasit (ownership in Thai), which would give him rights to the account upon the death of the owner without his name being on the account as a joint owner.  Maybe this is something only available to a Thai, or perhaps it depends on the particular branch decision?  It sounds "iffy" though to me since you were told "no" in your area.  I will avoid this possibility.

Edited by mojaco
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37 minutes ago, NancyL said:

an admission that they wish their husband to be dead.

Or knew they soon would be, damning in itself. Surely it is easy to move the 800k using internet banking? Actually a plus for using a savings or chequeing account rather than FD!

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29 minutes ago, mojaco said:

My close Thai friend of 25 years asked yesterday and the local Bangkok Bank in our town said he could become like a "beneficiary" กรรมสิทธิ์ Kammasit (ownership in Thai), which would give him rights to the account upon the death of the owner without his name being on the account as a joint owner.  Maybe this is something only available to a Thai, or perhaps it depends on the particular branch decision?  It sounds "iffy" though to me since you were told "no" in your area.  I will avoid this possibility.

 

May be Bank specific, mine is Kasikorn.

 

i will try asking again using the term Kammasit .

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4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

AFAIK Thai banks do not list beneficiaries.  Either it is a joint account (which won't work for immigration) or one has to go through the courts for the survivor to get access.

 

I have asked. And ended up making out a Thai will solely for my Thai bank accounts because there was no other way.

 

While a foreign will can be used it will take longer so advisable to make a Thai one. Can be done at your Ampur for little or no cost. Your wife will still have to go through the courts but notarized translations and the like won't be needed so faster/less hassle.

 

This is actually one of my biggest grievances with the new requirements for not spending the  800K. If it was set up instead as a bond one posted that one could indicate a beneficiary for, then at least it would cover your cremation/funeral costs etc.

 

 

Actually I have a retirement visa and have been using a joint bank account as proof of funds since the get ho for both marriage and later retirement extensions. I swapped from marriage to retirement visa 5 years ago due to the hassles with info needed for the marriage visa.

 

I do hear many people advocate that a joint account doesnt suffice, but have never had an issue with mine (yet).

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Is it possible to have online banking with a fixed account?  If so, could the online banking be able to transfer funds to other Thai accounts?  If this is true, the spouse without the 800K could login to the online account of deceased and transfer the funds into their own small account.  It might be tricky to show immigration the trail of the funds to meet their time requirements.

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I asked that very question in 2008, when my wife and I first received the retirement extension--she piggy-backing on my extension. We did the income letter, so it may be different than the B800k in the bank method. She is eligible to receive my retirement income upon my death. So, according to Songkhla immigration at the time; she had to get a non-O and income letter in her own name and reapply for a retirement extension. Which meant she would have had to go out of Thailand for the non-O and have the pension transferred to her name and then get the income statement during the validity of the non-O and apply for a retirement extension. 

 

Obviously, we never had to try it to see.

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No matter what is said here you MUST get legal advice. If your visa is cancelled immediately and bank accounts FROZEN, even joint accounts (that's how it happens in some other countries, I don't know about here) I believe she must have her own funds to apply for her own visa, it could involve leaving the country briefly and applying on her new visit visa. I don't know that she can 'take over' your visa, I kind of doubt it. If the worst happened and she didn't, she might need the help of a 'visa conpany' in the short term. Please don't rely on info given here. Pay a little money to an attorney and check. Cheers. 

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9 minutes ago, Speedhump said:

No matter what is said here you MUST get legal advice. If your visa is cancelled immediately and bank accounts FROZEN, even joint accounts (that's how it happens in some other countries, I don't know about here) I believe she must have her own funds to apply for her own visa, it could involve leaving the country briefly and applying on her new visit visa. I don't know that she can 'take over' your visa, I kind of doubt it. If the worst happened and she didn't, she might need the help of a 'visa conpany' in the short term. Please don't rely on info given here. Pay a little money to an attorney and check. Cheers. 

Good advice.

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7 hours ago, mojaco said:

Thank all of you for your replies and advice.  But right now my 800,000 is in a Fixed Deposit and that wouldn't be instantly accessible via ATM card.  So I guess it would be best to get her on her own "retirement extension" ahead of time to avoid any probably-illegal overstay problems.  Or if she would prefer my having the 800,000 in my normal single-owner savings account with her as the death beneficiary registered on that account, maybe that would work timely enough for her to access my 800,000 to use for herself.

 

But that last option wouldn't meet the pre-extension two month criteria would it?

 

Maybe it's been posted before, but in a situation as this, is it possible to have the account setup as joint?  Does immigration require the verified funds account (seasoned 800k), associated to only the visa holder/applicant?

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6 minutes ago, CanuckThai said:

Maybe it's been posted before, but in a situation as this, is it possible to have the account setup as joint?  Does immigration require the verified funds account (seasoned 800k), associated to only the visa holder/applicant?

Yes, a joint account is not accepted for an extension.

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3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Or knew they soon would be, damning in itself. Surely it is easy to move the 800k using internet banking? Actually a plus for using a savings or chequeing account rather than FD!

Usually the 800k is in a fixed account not accessible via internet bank or ATM machine because the interest rate is much better.  And it's surprising how many people, esp elderly people don't use internet banking.

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Just now, NancyL said:

Usually the 800k is in a fixed account not accessible via internet bank or ATM machine because the interest rate is much better.  And it's surprising how many people, esp elderly people don't use internet banking.

I actually keep my 800k in a savings account. The small extra interest I could earn in an FD doesn't worry me. It is a hangover from some past comments that Immigration wanted to see the 800k being used to live off. 

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