Need advice on how to change to a marriage visa from a retirement visa

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

13 minutes ago, bronzedude said:

I will be using the 400K income option. What do you mean by "be sure your financial proof does not meet the requirements for retirement?" Thanks

 

He means, if you happen to show Immigration bank deposit proof with a balance of 800K or more when applying for a marriage extension, Immigration has been known to strongly push people into doing retirement based extensions instead, because at least in the past, those have been easier for them.

 

If you have well over 400K but well under 800K, then basically, Immigration shouldn't be trying to push you into doing a retirement extension instead. Which would matter, for example, if you were planning to work in Thailand and needed to be eligible for a work permit, which you couldn't get under a retirement extension.

 

[Gashead]

Did application for an extension based on marriage at Korat Immigration last week.  Was previously on a Retirement but decided to change due to the new rules.   This is what i needed:

1.  ONE completed TM7 - 2 pictures.

2.  Proof of funds.  400K for 2 months.  Bank Letter + Bank Book. The bank letter must be dated the SAME DAY AS THE APPLICATION.

3.  Photos of me and Wife around the house.  They only kept 3.  One with us outside clearly showing the House Number and 2 inside the house.  If possible try to include a chiwawa in the pictures - it make them smile.

4.  Marriage certificate and updated Kor Ror 2

5.  Wifes ID and House Book

6  My Drivers Licence

7.  Map to my residence.  They replaced my hand drawn masterpiece with a google maps version and gave me a copy to use next time.

8. My passport and departure card

9. 2 witnesses.  Only required for fist application so won't (shouldn't) need next year

 

General impressions.  Very straightforward.  Officer I had was younger, had a checklist and stuck to it.  The requirement to have the bank letter dated that day is new and a pain as it means I can't get to the office until 10.30, basically the busiest time.  I was also told that I couldn't take my balance below 400K while the application was under consideration.  I asked if I would need another bank letter and was told that it was not necessary?  Was charged an extra 50 or 60 baht for photocopying.  I think they just copy the whole package and attach the extra picture.

[Suradit69]

23 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

I find this 40k for married extension and 65k for retirement confusing. Do they thInk two live cheaper than a single retired?

in their words of Hanson P>>>>> please explain

The amount required for a retirement extension was not established based on what would give you a comfy life. It's more to do with how much they'd like you to have available to contribute to the economy to make it worth having you here at all.

 

Surprisingly, Thailand and other countries want some minimal economic benefit from having you stay with them. They don't consider immigration laws or policy based solely on what will maximize the personal comfort of random foreigners.

 

The reduced requirements for marriage extensions is a concession to foreigners supporting a Thai wife and possibly children.

 

It makes sense if you don't start out by assuming everything ism about you.

[hansnl]

On 3/23/2019 at 11:36 AM, ubonjoe said:

Will you be using the 400k baht or the 40k baht income option?

Be sure your financial proof does not meet the requirements for retirement.

You can do it at any time during the last 30 days of your current extension of stay. Just apply for an extension based upon marriage instead of retirement.

My general list is here. Marriage Extension Requirements 2.pdf

Also, inform yourself in your local immigration office for the local pecularities........

[Tony45]

Ubonjoe,

Have downloaded your list for marriage visa.

Can you post a scanned copy of a Kor Roy 22 document for me?

Thank you for your list.

I can supply my email address if you like.

Edited March 24, 2019 by Tony45

[jesimps]

47 minutes ago, Suradit69 said:

The amount required for a retirement extension was not established based on what would give you a comfy life. It's more to do with how much they'd like you to have available to contribute to the economy to make it worth having you here at all.

 

Surprisingly, Thailand and other countries want some minimal economic benefit from having you stay with them. They don't consider immigration laws or policy based solely on what will maximize the personal comfort of random foreigners.

 

The reduced requirements for marriage extensions is a concession to foreigners supporting a Thai wife and possibly children.

 

It makes sense if you don't start out by assuming everything ism about you.

True to form answer from the C in C of the rosey specs brigade.

 

[DuiDui48]

On 3/23/2019 at 12:32 PM, ubonjoe said:

The reason for the difference is that extensions based upon marriage are done for humanitarian reasons not convenience.

And it is possible for a Thai wife to work, have a business and etc to help support the family.

Not all retirees are single. Many are married and have a family as well. Their family members do not have to show financial proof to get extensions.

So that's the reason...well,why the heck can't we combine funds if nessesary,wife husband IF the wife has a work?

[Spike1938]

Can someone please list an accurate list of the documents required to change from a retirement visa to a marriage visa?

I have no problem meeting the financial requirements so we can check that one off.

 

[PFV]

On 3/23/2019 at 11:36 AM, ubonjoe said:

.....

Be sure your financial proof does not meet the requirements for retirement.

....

Using the money-in-bank method, does it mean that the balance upon requesting a marriage extension should be less than 800K?

I was planning on having substantially more than 800K and just explaining that, due to school tuitions, etc., I will not be able to maintain it for the extra 3 months.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

24 minutes ago, Spike1938 said:

Can someone please list an accurate list of the documents required to change from a retirement visa to a marriage visa?

I have no problem meeting the financial requirements so we can check that one off.

 

 

Read posts #2 and #9 in this thread for the answers to your question.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 minutes ago, PFV said:

Using the money-in-bank method, does it mean that the balance upon requesting a marriage extension should be less than 800K?

I was planning on having substantially more than 800K and just explaining that, due to school tuitions, etc., I will not be able to maintain it for the extra 3 months.

 

Are you talking about applying for a marriage or retirement extension?

 

The point Joe was making above is that a marriage extension only requires at least 400K of a bank deposit. If you go into Immigration showing an account with 800K or more, in some places, they may not want to do a marriage extension and instead push you to a retirement extension, because it's an easier process for them.

 

If you really want a marriage extension, go to Immigration with a bank balance exceeding 400K, but under 800K, and then Immigration won't have any clear excuse to not want to do a marriage extension for you based on your finances.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

40 minutes ago, DuiDui48 said:

So that's the reason...well,why the heck can't we combine funds if nessesary,wife husband IF the wife has a work?

 

Because the current rules don't count the Thai spouse's income, just the foreigner applicant's income. It is what it is.

 

[PFV]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Are you talking about applying for a marriage or retirement extension?

 

The point Joe was making above is that a marriage extension only requires at least 400K of a bank deposit. If you go into Immigration showing an account with 800K or more, in some places, they may not want to do a marriage extension and instead push you to a retirement extension, because it's an easier process for them.

 

If you really want a marriage extension, go to Immigration with a bank balance exceeding 400K, but under 800K, and then Immigration won't have any clear excuse to not want to do a marriage extension for you based on your finances.

 

 

Previously, I have always done retirement extensions with an embassy letter, but due to the new requiremens in Chiang Mai (if I understand correctly, they want income to be from a pension) and the extra post-application seasoning, I was thinking of switching to a marriage extension. I could also do a retirement extension, but then what happens when I can't maintain the minimum balance. Would they allow me to do a new extension (marriage) right then and there, having failed to meet the retirement requirements, or would I have to leave the country and get a new non-O? I don't see how they could refuse a marriage extension with more than 800K if I explain that I cannot possibly keep it there for 3 extra months.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

9 minutes ago, PFV said:

Previously, I have always done retirement extensions with an embassy letter, but due to the new requiremens in Chiang Mai (if I understand correctly, they want income to be from a pension) and the extra post-application seasoning, I was thinking of switching to a marriage extension. I could also do a retirement extension, but then what happens when I can't maintain the minimum balance. Would they allow me to do a new extension (marriage) right then and there, having failed to meet the retirement requirements, or would I have to leave the country and get a new non-O? I don't see how they could refuse a marriage extension with more than 800K if I explain that I cannot possibly keep it there for 3 extra months.

 

You're not understanding... Retirement extensions can be processed locally by the local Immigration office, and approved the same day. Marriage extensions have to be approved at a higher level, and that's part of the reason for the 30-day under review period. That's why SOME Immigration offices, if the applicant can qualify for either type of extension, will strongly push them to do a retirement extension.

 

If you go in with more than 800K, you meet the financial qualifications for either a marriage or retirement extension.

 

If you go in with more than 400K but less than 800K, you only qualify for a marriage extension, assuming you meet all the other non financial requirements. Thus that avoids any possibility for Immigration to push you toward a retirement extension instead.

 

Re your other question, each type of extension is valid for one year. When you go to apply in the next year, if you don't meet the quals for one type, you could always apply for the other type, if you met the requirements, AND if you're applying before your current extension has expired.

 

Just switching from one valid type of extension to another type -- as long as the first one hasn't already expired -- doesn't require a trip out of the country.

 

Edited March 24, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[PFV]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

You're not understanding... Retirement extensions can be processed locally by the local Immigration office, and approved the same day. Marriage extensions have to be approved at a higher level, and that's part of the reason for the 30-day under review period. That's why SOME Immigration offices, if the applicant can qualify for either type of extension, will strongly push them to do a retirement extension.

 

If you go in with more than 800K, you meet the financial qualifications for either a marriage or retirement extension.

 

If you go in with more than 400K but less than 800K, you only qualify for a marriage extension, assuming you meet all the other non financial requirements. Thus that avoids any possibility for Immigration to push you toward a retirement extension instead.

 

Re your other question, each type of extension is valid for one year. When you go to apply in the next year, if you don't meet the quals for one type, you could always apply for the other type, if you met the requirements, AND if you're applying before your current extension has expired.

 

Just switching from one valid type of extension to another type -- as long as the first one hasn't already expired -- doesn't require a trip out of the country.

 

Thank you.

If I understood correctly, If I am pushed into a retirement extension, I could ignore the extra seasoning requirement and just reapply the following year?

[bronzedude]

3 hours ago, Gashead said:

Did application for an extension based on marriage at Korat Immigration last week.  Was previously on a Retirement but decided to change due to the new rules.   This is what i needed:

1.  ONE completed TM7 - 2 pictures.

2.  Proof of funds.  400K for 2 months.  Bank Letter + Bank Book. The bank letter must be dated the SAME DAY AS THE APPLICATION.

3.  Photos of me and Wife around the house.  They only kept 3.  One with us outside clearly showing the House Number and 2 inside the house.  If possible try to include a chiwawa in the pictures - it make them smile.

4.  Marriage certificate and updated Kor Ror 2

5.  Wifes ID and House Book

6  My Drivers Licence

7.  Map to my residence.  They replaced my hand drawn masterpiece with a google maps version and gave me a copy to use next time.

8. My passport and departure card

9. 2 witnesses.  Only required for fist application so won't (shouldn't) need next year

 

General impressions.  Very straightforward.  Officer I had was younger, had a checklist and stuck to it.  The requirement to have the bank letter dated that day is new and a pain as it means I can't get to the office until 10.30, basically the busiest time.  I was also told that I couldn't take my balance below 400K while the application was under consideration.  I asked if I would need another bank letter and was told that it was not necessary?  Was charged an extra 50 or 60 baht for photocopying.  I think they just copy the whole package and attach the extra picture.

Thank you. Very good explanations. Can the 400K be in 2 different accounts? Like 200K+ in a regular savings and 200K in a fixed account? What is considered an updated Kor Ror 2? 1 week? 2 weeks? 6 months? My wife is from Nakorn Sawan, Does the house book need to be the one from Nakorn Sawan? I own a condo in Jomtien and have a blue house book. Who do the witness need to be? Anybody that knows us both or just anybody?

[Number 6]

16 hours ago, bronzedude said:

I will be using the 400K income option. What do you mean by "be sure your financial proof does not meet the requirements for retirement?" Thanks

It's really no big deal at CW. I've done it for about five years now. Just get the paper work and the photos. Keep money in the bank until you get your stamp. Lots of paper, but easy enough.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

8 minutes ago, PFV said:

Thank you.

If I understood correctly, If I am pushed into a retirement extension, I could ignore the extra seasoning requirement and just reapply the following year?

 Not sure what you mean...

 

The new retirement extensions being issued now carry with them the added seasoning requirements (keeping the 800K balance for months after, and then going no lower than 400K for the rest of the year).

 

The marriage extensions being issued now don't carry those same onerous requirements. Usually, just that you have to keep the balance a few months beforehand and then a month or so after until you receive final approval of the extension at the end of the month under review period.

 

In that regard, the marriage extension these days is much more applicant friendly, whereas the retirement extension is much more restrictive in terms of your finances.  The other difference, of course, is that marriage extensions allow employment in Thailand with a work permit, whereas retirement extensions do not.

 

For all of the above reasons, I think, you'll see lately on TVF a lot of folks who are married and have long been on retirement extensions using the bank deposit method, who are now looking at switching to marriage extensions. Because they don't want Thai Immigration mandating what goes on with their bank accounts yearround.

 

Edited March 24, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[PFV]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 Not sure what you mean...

 

The new retirement extensions being issued now carry with them the added seasoning requirements (keeping the 800K balance for months after, and then going no lower than 400K for the rest of the year).

 

The marriage extensions being issued now don't carry those same onerous requirements. Usually, just that you have to keep the balance a few months beforehand and then a month or so after until you receive final approval of the extension at the end of the month under review period.

 

In that regard, the marriage extension these days is much more applicant friendly, whereas the retirement extension is much more restrictive in terms of your finances.  The other difference, of course, is that marriage extensions allow employment in Thailand with a work permit, whereas retirement extensions do not.

 

For all of the above reasons, I think, you'll see lately on TVF a lot of folks who are married and have long been on retirement extensions using the bank deposit method, who are now looking at switching to marriage extensions. Because they don't want Thai Immigration mandating what goes on with their bank accounts yearround.

 

Exactly, which is why I am planning on requesting a marriage extension, although I will have more than 800K in the bank due to school tuitions to pay in May-July.

If they give me a hard time, I will explain my situation. If they still puch me into a retirement extension, I will just ignore the extra 3-month seasoning requirement and see what happens. You indicated that there should be no consequences until the next extension, but if necessary, I can leave the country for a new non-O.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

12 minutes ago, PFV said:

Exactly, which is why I am planning on requesting a marriage extension, although I will have more than 800K in the bank due to school tuitions to pay in May-July.

If they give me a hard time, I will explain my situation. If they still puch me into a retirement extension, I will just ignore the extra 3-month seasoning requirement and see what happens. You indicated that there should be no consequences until the next extension, but if necessary, I can leave the country for a new non-O.

 

You do understand, we're only talking about whatever account you're going to show to Immigration. You can keep the extra money in any other account you want, and use as you wish.

 

Re the followup for retirement extensions, for people who  don't keep the 800K in their account for the required time after approval, some offices are said to be checking the balance at the next 90-day report (probably in the minority). Others, when you go to apply in the following year, if they find you didn't follow the minimum balance/seasoning requirements during the past year, probably would not approve you for the next year.

 

Again, this was just some advice Joe passed along to try to help people avoid any potential problems with obtaining their marriage extension. It doesn't mean having 800K is automatically going to cause the applicant some problem. It's just a precautionary approach the marriage applicant can take to AVOID any potential problems, especially if their local IO is known to be troublesome on that issue.

 

 

Edited March 24, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[PFV]

2 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

You do understand, we're only talking about whatever account you're going to show to Immigration. You can keep the extra money in any other account you want, and use as you wish.

 

Re the followup for retirement extensions, for people who  don't keep the 800K in their account for the required time after approval, some offices are said to be checking the balance at the next 90-day report (probably in the minority). Others, when you go to apply in the following year, if they find you didn't follow the minimum balance/seasoning requirements during the past year, probably would not approve you for the next year.

 

Again, this was just some advice Joe passed along to try to help people avoid any potential problems with obtaining their marriage extension. It doesn't mean having 800K is automatically going to cause the applicant some problem. It's just a precautionary approach the marriage applicant can take to AVOID any potential problems, especially if their local IO is known to be troublesome on that issue.

 

 

Thank you! Excellent advice. I will shift part of the funds to my wife's account to avoid any possible issue.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, PFV said:

Thank you! Excellent advice. I will shift part of the funds to my wife's account to avoid any possible issue.

 Once you're done with Immigration, if you want, you can then move those funds back into your own account for the rest of the year...  The rules only say you can't go under the 400K or 800K balances for various periods of time, and make sure you don't!

 

The rules in no way restrict your ability to ADD extra funds at any point in time after you've completed your extension application/approval process.

 

[connda]

48 minutes ago, PFV said:

I don't see how they could refuse a marriage extension with more than 800K if I explain that I cannot possibly keep it there for 3 extra months.

Honestly, I'm not being factious, but a some point in time you need to take off the rose-colored glasses and replace them with reality goggles.  There have been a bunch of threads on this topic.  I distinctly remember one OP stating that he applied for the marriage extension but was given a retirement extension stamp in his passport instead because he had in excess of 800k.  Perhaps we need more stories of expats applying for marriage extensions while having 800k in the bank, but I can't personally say that I've heard success stories using that scenario.  If they are out there, well, personally I'd like to hear about them.  Plus you are dealing with bureaucrats.  These people get paid to push paper and adhere to policy - they don't get paid to be compassionate if compassion for foreigners is even an emotion in their personal emotional makeup.  Reality is that you are not wanted here but are simply tolerated if you meet certain criteria that vary from immigration office to immigration office.

[bronzedude]

23 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

You do understand, we're only talking about whatever account you're going to show to Immigration. You can keep the extra money in any other account you want, and use as you wish.

 

Re the followup for retirement extensions, for people who  don't keep the 800K in their account for the required time after approval, some offices are said to be checking the balance at the next 90-day report (probably in the minority). Others, when you go to apply in the following year, if they find you didn't follow the minimum balance/seasoning requirements during the past year, probably would not approve you for the next year.

 

Again, this was just some advice Joe passed along to try to help people avoid any potential problems with obtaining their marriage extension. It doesn't mean having 800K is automatically going to cause the applicant some problem. It's just a precautionary approach the marriage applicant can take to AVOID any potential problems, especially if their local IO is known to be troublesome on that issue.

 

 

What would the exact seasoning date the 400k for marriage visa be if the last date of my extension was August 5? June 5? June 6?

[gunderhill]

On 3/23/2019 at 11:52 AM, ubonjoe said:

No skills are needed from my experience of applying for 11 extensions of stay based upon marriage.

Just have the correct documents and etc and it will not be a problem.

 

Which would be fine if they had a  list that actually included "everything" ( which it  does'nt) and they stopped  changing/  adding   things yearly..

[connda]

36 minutes ago, PFV said:

Exactly, which is why I am planning on requesting a marriage extension, although I will have more than 800K in the bank due to school tuitions to pay in May-July.

If they give me a hard time, I will explain my situation. If they still puch me into a retirement extension, I will just ignore the extra 3-month seasoning requirement and see what happens. You indicated that there should be no consequences until the next extension, but if necessary, I can leave the country for a new non-O.

Why don't you have one bank account that is strictly for immigration and never is touched and another with money you use for regular living expenses including tuition.  The whole concept of "I'll explain my situation" is going to fall on deaf ears.  Once more...these are bureaucrats who dot the 'i's and cross the 't's and don't act outside of the regulations that are given to follow, with the exception of possibly adding additional requirements that are not explicitly in the Immigration Police Orders.

[gunderhill]

18 minutes ago, connda said:

Perhaps we need more stories of expats applying for marriage extensions while having 800k in the bank

Just did  mine with over  2  million in the account, no problems.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, bronzedude said:

What would the exact seasoning date the 400k for marriage visa be if the last date of my extension was August 5? June 5? June 6?

 

I believe, the pre seasoning date is linked to the day you're applying for your NEW marriage extension, not anything relating to your prior one. So in other words, it would be X months before the day you apply for your new extension.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

Just did  mine with over  2  million in the account, no problems.

 

As I mentioned above, it isn't automatically a problem. But it has been a problem in SOME offices... So the advice given was just a general recommendation as a way to avoid potential problems.

 

[bronzedude]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I believe, the pre seasoning date is linked to the day you're applying for your NEW marriage extension, not anything relating to your prior one. So in other words, it would be X months before the day you apply for your new extension.

 

If I can apply for an extension in the 30 period prior to August 5 and I chose July 8 (Monday) to apply, then the 400k seasoning would have to be dated prior to May 8. On that Monday do I need to have my wife, photos, map, witnesses, housebook, bank letter etc. in addition to the application? By the way, I'll be going to Jomtien IO.