Explainer: Here’s what is required by Chonburi immigration for TM30 and retirement extensions

[pontious]

2 hours ago, digger70 said:

 I don't take Any notice of what they post on TV .I ask my Local Immigration Office what is required. than I Know for sure what I have to do and what to get. No Probs , works for me .

They did ask - and that is what Khun Puchai the IO who does all retirement extensions in Jomtien said he will accept. Who do you propose we ask next.

[Mac98]

9 hours ago, Lemonltr said:

The stipulation that incoming funds must arrive at about (within 4/5 days) the same time each month is new and very problematic for British retirees. The state pension is not paid monthly but every 4 weeks. 13 payments yearly. So 2/3 days earlier every month. Immigration should be made aware of this. Showing it has already been taxed is also new. 

My U.S. SS arrives on 4th Erfnesday of the month, which this May will be on the 22nd, and in June on the 28th. "Sorry sir, we must throw you out." 

[patsfangr]

I just made application for extension of my retirement visa on Friday. I had to make 2 trips, because I was told that I needed proof of the specific source of my foreign income, in addition to the record of deposits and letter from my Thai bank. So the information in the OP is definitely incorrect; or the rules have not been explained to the people checking the submitted application package! 

 

I have to go back on Monday, after 2 PM, to pick up my stamped passport - assuming that my application is approved. 

[pontious]

23 minutes ago, patsfangr said:

I just made application for extension of my retirement visa on Friday. I had to make 2 trips, because I was told that I needed proof of the specific source of my foreign income, in addition to the record of deposits and letter from my Thai bank. So the information in the OP is definitely incorrect; or the rules have not been explained to the people checking the submitted application package! 

 

I have to go back on Monday, after 2 PM, to pick up my stamped passport - assuming that my application is approved. 

Was that using the income method? If yes how many months deposit did you have?

[ttrd]

51 minutes ago, patsfangr said:

I just made application for extension of my retirement visa on Friday. I had to make 2 trips, because I was told that I needed proof of the specific source of my foreign income, in addition to the record of deposits and letter from my Thai bank. So the information in the OP is definitely incorrect; or the rules have not been explained to the people checking the submitted application package! 

 

I have to go back on Monday, after 2 PM, to pick up my stamped passport - assuming that my application is approved. 

13th of March I applied an extension of my retirement visa based on money in the bank and 14th of March it was approved. This was at immigration in Hua-hin. We may assume that It will not be the same process all over Thailand (as before) so different experiences may occur.

[DJ54]

2 hours ago, Mac98 said:

My U.S. SS arrives on 4th Erfnesday of the month, which this May will be on the 22nd, and in June on the 28th. "Sorry sir, we must throw you out." 

I think if they see the 12 months of monthly payments they shouldn’t give you the boot. I don’t know the SS system I’m 

guessing all get paid the same day as others. You get on various

dates and 1000 others the same.

 

Go in in a positive mood be nice, hopefully you’ve never pissed

them off should be ok. I’ve been renewing and see guys giving 

them a ration of shit then they scrutinized everything. 

 

If they remember you coming in every 90 days and renew 

no yap yap with them the rules may be explained to and a

make sure to bring it next time, 

 

 

 

[55Jay]

9 hours ago, Pasadena said:

So when you back Thailand and you have non O visa you need to report to immigration you back or not? Only if you change adress?

The attitude of my Immi Office was no, you don't have to report if you are returning to your normal "home" address.  Appears to be the continuing opinion for Jomtien as well.

 

I left Thailand with the Mrs. January 2018, returned March 2018. Drove home from Swampy as usual.

 

The entire staff at my Immi Office was replaced late 2018, among all the other Immigration drama around that time, and since then. 

 

Went for my annual extension last week and got pulled up by the new Immi staff because I didn't report my return w/in 24 hours a year ago, March 2018.  Wife filled out a belated TM 30.  Which means she was also at fault for not reporting a farang was staying at her house.  Me.  Her husband.  I didn't fill any form or sign anything.  It was all my wife and them, but he did make copies of some pages in my passport.   

------------

Immi really needs to carve out a new niche for Non-O long stayers, something along the lines of permanent residence, but short of that legal status.  Say you retire/married Non-O for 5 or 10 years with the same address and/or married to the same byrd, consistent, traceable compliance with financial requirements.......  Boring,  Predictable.  Plain vanilla.

 

Come on, Thailand, this is low-hanging fruit, grow a brain cell.

[Voltaren]

TIT

[sunnyboy2018]

9

15 hours ago, MadMac said:

Selfmade rules again. For an address change a TM30? TM30 is if you arrive from abroad only. For address change a TM28 is required.

 

Move to another province and you are screwed.

I travel abroad every year ...retirement Visa...never have to report until 90 days after my arrival just in case I did try to report to jomtien I 24 hour arrived but was sent away told to come back in 99 day...which I did. It took me 90 seconds brilliant service

[a977]

Just who the hell is RUNNING the Immigration Department Big Joke or some peanut from Jomtien, as far as I'm concerned if the ImmIgration department makes the rules then there the rules to follow not some peanut going on a whatever radio station spruking about his rules. If Khun (and I use that word loosely) Pickai can't follow his bosses orders then he belongs back in the barracks along with the rest of his mob. Go back to your desk and read the police order dated January 2019 and if you can't interpret it then you do not deserve your job.

[ttrd]

7 minutes ago, a977 said:

Just who the hell is RUNNING the Immigration Department Big Joke or some peanut from Jomtien, as far as I'm concerned if the ImmIgration department makes the rules then there the rules to follow not some peanut going on a whatever radio station spruking about his rules. If Khun (and I use that word loosely) Pickai can't follow his bosses orders then he belongs back in the barracks along with the rest of his mob. Go back to your desk and read the police order dated January 2019 and if you can't interpret it then you do not deserve your job.

If you expect this to happen then you have lost your way to the wrong location ...

[bipper]

12 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Irrelevant.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Calling Thai immigration stupid when it's near impossible to get a Thai wife into UK for a holiday is what's irrelevant.

 

What's also irrelevant is bitching all over a thread about the rules and regulations of Thailand that don't suit YOU.

 

It's crystal clear if you can't make the monthlys then 800k two months before and 400k all year after, simple. If that's too much then try Cambodia.

[sumrit]

14 hours ago, dave moir said:

Rubbish the uk state pension is paid every month on the same date i.e. 12/03/2019 - 12/04/2019

No, it's not, at least not for everyone. Mine's paid every four weeks.

[Humpy]

How about electronic tagging for all expats ?!!

[taxin]

20 hours ago, Jingthing said:

People NEED to know what are the legal consequences of --

 

Going under the 800K during the 90 day POST seasoning period

 

Going under the 400K after the 90 day POST seasoning period and before the PRE seasoning 800K period for the next extension

 

I've been posting about this for months now.

Immigration has never announced one thing about that.

It's fair to assume that if you go under the 800K during the initial POST seasoning period, that your current extension is CANCELLED, but then what? Prison? Deportation? Order to leave? Overstay fines? Blacklisting (if so how long)? WHAT!?! People NEED to know.

 

On the 400K period, it's not even easy to make any assumptions at this point. 
We NEED to know.

 

Some people have guessed it would only mean that your next year's extension would not be possible. That would be mild. But they don't know. Guessing things are better than they actually are has proven to be a very DANGEROUS game in this current extremely onerous environment. 

I once was declined for an extension of stay (applied for based on marriage and having children) due to falling under the 400K requirement, despite falling under for only one day of the previous few months.

 

Instead of showing me the door the immigration officer granted me a 60 day extension of stay. When I questioned this stating I was not aware there was such a thing as a 60 day extension, he said this has always been the case and they can can grant as they please.

 

Another similar experience was a few years prior to this, when applying for an extension of stay based on having a work permit I also fell foul (although I cannot remember what is was). Again instead of being shown the door he gave me 30 days, then another 30 days, at 3rd attempt I was then granted 1 year.

 

So IMO (as well as first hand experience) if you do happen to fall under the 400/800K rule you will not be fined or declined next time round, you will simply be given a shorter extension period. It will be a good money spinner for them as they will still charge the 1,900 baht each time.

[Henryford]

22 hours ago, hargri said:

What is acceptable evidence of funds coming from abroad? I have made 5 transfers since the new rules commenced and 3 show as foreign transactions. I have plenty of documents to prove the overseas source of funds as long as immigration are prepared to take the trouble to look at them. If it's Thai bank book/statement only then I'm 60% compliant. 

My problem as well. I fully comply with the 65k a month transfer (but not on the same day each month). But how do i prove it?

[Henryford]

2 hours ago, sumrit said:

No, it's not, at least not for everyone. Mine's paid every four weeks.

Yes it's paid either every 4 or 13 weeks. Either way you are not going to get a standard amount received every month (on the same day).

[MadMac]

7 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

9

I travel abroad every year ...retirement Visa...never have to report until 90 days after my arrival just in case I did try to report to jomtien I 24 hour arrived but was sent away told to come back in 99 day...which I did. It took me 90 seconds brilliant service

 

Well, in Chiang Mai they would have charged you 1600B regardless, and in the future 10000B if this new plan goes through.

 

The same is going to happen should you move from Chonburi to Chiang Mai. They will probably laugh at you when you tell them about that radio show and that you were told "no need, come back later". Go figure.

 

[luckyluke]

17 hours ago, Johnnylaserdick said:

So Chonburi only looking at your bank transfers now and not accepting income letters from the 100 plus countries that still issue them.  Great!!

I have done 15 extensions at Pattaya/Jomtien based on a L.o.I., last one was end January 2019.

 

Of course it may be not accepted next time, or rules have changed already in the meantime. 

 

However I haven't read anything as such on a Belgian, neither a Dutch & French forum/blog. 

[digger70]

14 hours ago, pontious said:

They did ask - and that is what Khun Puchai the IO who does all retirement extensions in Jomtien said he will accept. Who do you propose we ask next.

All I am saying is that one has to ask himself at Immigration not go by hearsay and get it in writing.

[The Deerhunter]

On 3/31/2019 at 11:39 AM, zib said:

So I assume this also means I dont have to register when coming back from abroad? It only said "outside province"

Correct in my experience with the other branch in that province.  Sri Racha specifically told me that but it is not what is in the rule book from head office in BKK.

[Thailand]

2 hours ago, Henryford said:

My problem as well. I fully comply with the 65k a month transfer (but not on the same day each month). But how do i prove it?

Your bank statement or bank book?

[NanLaew]

17 hours ago, connda said:

How about a comment to the "Explainer."  It goes like this.

Is Thailand's Immigration Bureau is single governmental agency whose actions are governed by a single set of laws implemented and codified and published so that all of those affect by these laws can expect a single, common, equally enforced set of regulations?

Or is Thailand's Immigration Bureau a governed agency comprised of a multitude of separate divisions and districts and fiefdoms, all of whom are governed by their own upper-level managers and middle-managers who interpret regulations which are then enforced at a local level (Tambon, Amphur, Jangwat) and whose actions are then interpreted by the dictates of individual administrators and immigration officers who can override national immigration law by virtue of personal interpretation of codified national immigration law even if their interpretation is counter to published immigration law? 

Now just an observation, but would it not be more effective, by virtue of cost and time savings, to implement a single set of laws implemented and codified and published - at the national level and enforced across all districts (Tambon, Amphur, and Jangwat) so that all of those affect by these laws can expect an single, common, equally enforced set of regulations?
 

All imminently sensible but having single, national standard would have two rather serious consequences.

 

1. There would be no way lazy or corrupt immigration officers, staffers and their agents could make a living.

 

2. There would be at minimum a 66.66% drop in click-through traffic of this forum.

 

The key word in your post is "fiefdoms".

[Thailand]

18 hours ago, connda said:

How about a comment to the "Explainer."  It goes like this.

Is Thailand's Immigration Bureau is single governmental agency whose actions are governed by a single set of laws implemented and codified and published so that all of those affect by these laws can expect a single, common, equally enforced set of regulations?

Or is Thailand's Immigration Bureau a governed agency comprised of a multitude of separate divisions and districts and fiefdoms, all of whom are governed by their own upper-level managers and middle-managers who interpret regulations which are then enforced at a local level (Tambon, Amphur, Jangwat) and whose actions are then interpreted by the dictates of individual administrators and immigration officers who can override national immigration law by virtue of personal interpretation of codified national immigration law even if their interpretation is counter to published immigration law? 

Now just an observation, but would it not be more effective, by virtue of cost and time savings, to implement a single set of laws implemented and codified and published - at the national level and enforced across all districts (Tambon, Amphur, and Jangwat) so that all of those affect by these laws can expect an single, common, equally enforced set of regulations?
 

Come on now, applying logic to Thai immigration, just not on!

[micmichd]

3 hours ago, Henryford said:

My problem as well. I fully comply with the 65k a month transfer (but not on the same day each month). But how do i prove it?

Bankbook should be oK. Every transaction has a transaction code. 

[Sydebolle]

Another nail in the coffin of Thai bureaucracy - anyone who employs Thai staff knows, that more than 50% are NOT living at their registered address and our employment forms at the time has "registered address" and "present address". 

Keep the good work up; the number of aliens is getting smaller by the day and this utter nonsense is an active contribution to the fact, that you cannot herd (at least Caucasians) around like what you do with cattle. 

[balo]

I have never been asked for TM30 after 10 years here. Even if I stay in a condo, I travel a lot around the country. But never happened to me. 

I am ready to pay any 1600 baht fines if they ask me, but so far so good.  

[Sheryl]

The problem is that the actual law on this is worded so as to be open to diffetent interpretations. The actual wording of the Immigration Act (which is where both TM30 and 90 day repory requirements are trom) says something to the effect of "when a foreigner takes up residence....report within 24 hours". (I'm paraphrasing from memory).

Now to me, when a person moves into a place with intention of remaining there, and continues to own it or lease it, they have taken up residence when they initially moved in and temporary trips elsewhere don't change that, and no reason to make additional TM30s upon their return. That, to me, is the rational interpretation of the relevant section of the law. And some IOs have the same understanding.

But some do not. And among those who do not, some think a new TM30 is needed when returning from abroad (even though you indicated the address on your arrival card) only and some think it isneeded after any overnight stay elsewhete, even within Thailand.

Clearly this (like so much else) has never been cleared defined for IOs.

Adding to the problem is that there are periodic messages sent to IOs telling them to crack down on violations/be more diligent in enforcing this (still inadequately defined) rule. As far as I can tell the actual intended target of such crack downs is usually hotels/guest houses catering to illegals but if course this is not in any way spelled out, and it winds up directed at law abiding retirees who live with their families and haven't moved for decades. It is far easier for IOs to check/hassle legal stayers when they come in for extensions than it would be to track down the hotels and guesthouses which are failing to report, and illegals of course do not come into imm offices if they can help it.

When these "crack down"messages go out, it sometimes leads an office which did not use to require TM30s to start requiring them. Likewise staff overturn can lead to an abrupt change in intetpretation.

So the fact that you have never had a problem before does not mean you won't at your next extension.

For about 18 of the 22 years I've lived in my home -- falling under 4 different imm offices at different times -- no TM30 was ever needed. Then suddenly it was, from same office where it did not use to be.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Skeptic7]

22 hours ago, Mac98 said:

My U.S. SS arrives on 4th Erfnesday of the month, which this May will be on the 22nd, and in June on the 28th. "Sorry sir, we must throw you out." 

Sorry...any income payments received on Erfnesday are not accepted! ????

[jgarbo]

On 3/31/2019 at 10:04 AM, henrymeier99 said:

thanks for this important information. 

FYi, folks. Went for annual 1 yr extension to Chaengwattana. Arrived 09.00, Ticket 09.04. 
# 65, 42 in front. Withdrew Bt 2000 from BBl a/c to get get latest Bank cert letter (Bt100) of balance: Bt 810,140. Copied all docs, bank book, passport. Presented at 10.45. Docs OK, but officer wanted 90 day report slip (?). Explained I sent it certified mail three weeks ago, should be on file. Officer flustered, demanded a hand drawn map of my condo (?). Drew a masterpiece worthy of Leonardo. Officer more flustered. All docs OK, at 11.15.

"Must wait for passport after lunch, 13.00." ? But OK.

At 13.05 got passport stamped, one year.

 

The empty restaurants at 11.00 were packed with locals  - and waiting farang - at 12.05.  

Tell me I'm cynical, but the delay on visas helps the empty restaurants downstairs.

 

Also the after signing numerous documents threatening up to 10 yrs deportation, I was handed a fact sheet, dating back to 1998, advising me I must 60 yrs old for retirement, have Bt500,000 in the bank or Bt50,000/mth income.

Have I missed something, is the Immigration dept playing a game or is the system so screwed up that no-one knows what's going on? 

After all it was April 1st...