Restaurant booking refused

[samsensam]

On 4/13/2019 at 2:44 PM, NanLaew said:

The OP wanted to book a table for 10 people not just a table for two. The restaurant owner isn't being pretentious if he knows that foot traffic will easily compensate for a possible 10-seat no-show.  However, if the restaurant has a small kitchen with a somewhat bespoke menu, the owner may be aware that the chef(s) may have problems guaranteeing that a group of 10 customers will get served 10 possibly different selections at the same time as a group of 10 diners would expect. Then they could run the real risk of getting a genuine bad review on tripadvisor for an actual bad, slow dining experience rather than a pretentious one just for being unable to satisfy an unrealistically large guest party.

 

depends on the restaurant's business model/business acumen. many restaurants in my area have far more seating capacity than the kitchen facilities/staff can handle. there is often no flexibly of staff.,several waiting staff taking lots of orders and one person cooking and unable to efficiently cook the orders. when several tables get occupied in a short space of time the system simply falls apart. no planning for such eventualities e.g. train waiting staff to help out in the kitchen at busy times - the waiting staff are doing nothing once orders have been taken and drinks served, they often stand around playing on their phones.

 

it's not just locals, foreigner owned restaurants fall into this trap too.

 

 

[Speedhump]

On 4/13/2019 at 10:24 PM, direction BANGKOK said:

THey should just take a nonrefundable deposit and if a no show after 30 minutes you lost the res. 

This is the correct answer. If they are not a cash-only restaurant. 

[chuang]

Put down a deposit...

[Bangkok Barry]

On 4/13/2019 at 10:24 PM, direction BANGKOK said:

THey should just take a nonrefundable deposit and if a no show after 30 minutes you lost the res. 

 

Bingo! Why is that so hard? Instead, the restaurant turns down 10 customers who have gone to the trouble of making a reservation to ensure there will be enough room for them. That certainly shows serious intent to dine there, or why do they bother?

[Pilotman]

1 hour ago, Grusa said:

There is a restaurant in Pattaya where if you appear without a booking, you WILL be turned away - even if the place has ten empty tables.

If you are so lucky as to get a booking, and make any complaint about food or service, you get a tongue lashing from the chef/owner, and a ban from ever returning.

That said, the food is very good.

and people go there why? I wouldn't set foot in the place. Plenty of restaurants have good food. 

[fruitman]

On 4/13/2019 at 8:44 PM, NanLaew said:

the owner may be aware that the chef(s) may have problems guaranteeing that a group of 10 customers will get served 10 possibly different selections at the same time as a group of 10 diners would expect

You must be joking.

 

Even in the most expensive BKK restaurants they never serve 2 dishes for a table of 2 at the same time....and for sure never ever have i seen them serving 10 at the same time in Thailand.

 

That's still far too complicate for the Thai.

[fruitman]

34 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

On 4/13/2019 at 10:24 PM, direction BANGKOK said:

THey should just take a nonrefundable deposit and if a no show after 30 minutes you lost the res. 

 

Bingo! Why is that so hard?

How would a restaurant do that? So you call them to make a booking and they'll say please Paypal us 2000 baht right now to make your booking? And if you don't show up within 30 minutes after the booked time you'll loose the 2000.

 

That won't work.

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, Grusa said:

There is a restaurant in Pattaya where if you appear without a booking, you WILL be turned away - even if the place has ten empty tables.

If you are so lucky as to get a booking, and make any complaint about food or service, you get a tongue lashing from the chef/owner, and a ban from ever returning.

That said, the food is very good.

You remind me of a Chinese chef running a restaurant in Broome, WA Australia. Many years ago. He would storm out of the kitchen and glare at everyone. Return to the kitchen with much crashing of pots and pans.

When he thought he had enough customers, he would lock the restaurant doors to prevent anyone else coming in. He let the customers out individually after they paid their bill, and relocked the doors.

A real eccentric. However, the food was excellent.

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, Speedhump said:

This is the correct answer. If they are not a cash-only restaurant. 

Easy to get a credit card refund when you tell the bank it was a restaurant deposit.  No, does not work. 

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

You remind me of a Chinese chef running a restaurant in Broome, WA Australia. Many years ago. He would storm out of the kitchen and glare at everyone. Return to the kitchen with much crashing of pots and pans.

When he thought he had enough customers, he would lock the restaurant doors to prevent anyone else coming in. He let the customers out individually after they paid their bill, and relocked the doors.

A real eccentric. However, the food was excellent.

As a kid, working in an Italian restaurant the mushroom soup was too hot and curdled.  I told the owner a customer was upset, He said, "Tellum it's a Italian mushroom soup and suppose to looka dat way."

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, visarunner said:

Than the answer is clear. Go somewhere else, let this restaurant do their business. If that restaurant is popular already, does a good job and the people know what they doing than they do not need "you as a customer".  No business like the customer with the attitude " I have the money".    

That's what I do. Some businesses will flourish without me. Others will go under because they got ahead of themselves. Like it or not, no business can survive without cash flow.

[RJRS1301]

51 minutes ago, fruitman said:

You must be joking.

 

Even in the most expensive BKK restaurants they never serve 2 dishes for a table of 2 at the same time....and for sure never ever have i seen them serving 10 at the same time in Thailand.

 

That's still far too complicate for the Thai.

What a load of crap, all the higher end restaurants I have eaten in, in BKK, get the dishes to the table at same time.

 

[GalaxyMan]

On 4/13/2019 at 8:19 PM, marcusarelus said:

I used to do the same thing.  If I knew I'd fill with walk ins I'd refuse reservations because the reservation might not show and you have held a table for nothing and lose the money. 

Ditto.

 

There were so many people making multiple reservations -- South Florida -- and deciding at the last minute which one to keep, never bothering to call and cancel the other reservations. I instituted a $25 credit card deposit for reservations. The no-shows almost totally disappeared and it didn't affect my head count at all.

[Traubert]

Was it such a pennance to go an hour earlier and keep everyone happy?

[Benmart]

On 4/13/2019 at 11:02 PM, puukao said:

I used to make reservations for 30.  give them 25 euros so they knew i was serious.  never showed up.

 

i owned a few restaurants close by...needed to get them to go out of business.  it worked.  made them hire some friends, we all fell down and sued them for billions.  

 

party of 10.... minimum tip of 25% and no-show payment of 100,000 baht.

 

there isn't a farang in Thailand with nine friends!!!!  that's the red flag

No farang in Thailand with nine friends? I guess our 30 for Christmas brunch at the Royal Cliff doesn't count, or the 12 at Cherry's and on and on these past years. Not everyone in Pattaya are friendless, deadbeat, barstool sex-aholics. So much for your red flag.

[Pilotman]

1 hour ago, fruitman said:

You must be joking.

 

Even in the most expensive BKK restaurants they never serve 2 dishes for a table of 2 at the same time....and for sure never ever have i seen them serving 10 at the same time in Thailand.

 

That's still far too complicate for the Thai.

we had a party of 11 in a well known Bangkok venue on Suk., Soi 5.  It wasn't busy at the time. We all ordered starters and  main courses. After about 20 minutes 2 starters appeared, after another 20 minutes or so a few main courses arrived, then after another break the other starters, then the other main courses.  Needless to say, we have never been back. They have another outlet in  Pattaya, which we also don't go to,  a few friends have said that they have the same issues there.  

[richard_smith237]

On 4/13/2019 at 11:02 PM, puukao said:

I used to make reservations for 30.  give them 25 euros so they knew i was serious.  never showed up.

 

i owned a few restaurants close by...needed to get them to go out of business.  it worked.  made them hire some friends, we all fell down and sued them for billions.  

 

party of 10.... minimum tip of 25% and no-show payment of 100,000 baht.

 

there isn't a farang in Thailand with nine friends!!!!  that's the red flag

 

You're right... but its the red flag towards the validity and sense in any of what you have written... 

 

Given the comments its understandable why you may not have friends. 

 

------------

 

Usually once per week I'm out at a dinner in a large group.

 

Some restaurants are better at handling larger numbers than others. Some request that we pre-book dishes which I think is fair enough.

 

I do wonder what the no-show percentage is. We've never had to cancel. 

 

Thailand, especially Bangkok, is a diners paradise... Just call up and book, no BS with having to leave credit card details for bookings etc in the event of a no-show etc.

 

But, I do believe restaurants should be able to protect themselves somehow - perhaps Op faced a restaurant trying to protect themselves in an extremely clumsy and non-customer friendly manner.

 

 

 

 

[Deli]

Their place, their rules

[Pilotman]

Some restaurants in the UK take a credit card for a booking, with a sizeable deposit, that is returned as part of the cost of the meal, given back if you cancel outside say 24 hours of the booking,  or forfeit if you don't turn up at all.  Sounds a  good solution to me. 

[Letseng]

On 4/13/2019 at 7:47 PM, Inn Between said:

I can only guess that they've had problems with large-group bookings. where they've keep tables saved for people who don't show up during the prime dining times and lost walk-up business.

 

Then again, if you're trying to operate with standard Western logic in Thailand, you've going to hit walls a lot. 

 

The first idea is a just wild thought, and hopefully somebody who works or has worked in the restaurant business can shed some light on the situation if it is indeed a trade practice. 

They would have to keep the table free for an hour. Loss of income.

[Jaxxper]

On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 2:44 PM, NanLaew said:

 

Good answer.

[marcusarelus]

2 hours ago, fruitman said:

You must be joking.

 

Even in the most expensive BKK restaurants they never serve 2 dishes for a table of 2 at the same time....and for sure never ever have i seen them serving 10 at the same time in Thailand.

 

That's still far too complicate for the Thai.

There is a reason they do it that way.  And it makes sense if you know anything about eating habits in Thailand.  Don't expect you do.  So not surprised you don't know. 

[losworld]

On 4/13/2019 at 8:15 PM, Pilotman said:

just kick them into touch, make a negative TripAdvisor report and go elsewhere; simples. 

Best be careful with that as Thailand laws allow no real criticism of businesses or individuals.  I recall one guy getting charged for posting such a review online.

[geisha]

How can you condemn a restaurant for proposing a 18 h reservation ? Have you even thought that the restaurant might be full, or reserved at later times ? Unfortunately, in the restaurant business , you have to pick and choose to make sure the kitchen staff can cope correctly , that there is enough  staff, and once you’re full, you can’t invent extra tables, especially for 10 people . A couple might eventually be squeezed in . Lots of reasons why to legitimately refuse a booking at a specific time. That’s where competence comes in. As for posting untrue things on TripAdvisor, that is downright disgusting, nasty, vindictive and illegal !!!!

[Speedhump]

2 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

Easy to get a credit card refund when you tell the bank it was a restaurant deposit.  No, does not work. 

If they can price that they made it clear it was not refundable, or was to be used as a cancellation fee, the business should be able to challenge a refund. A credit card company cannot aid and abet fraud/breaking of contract. 

[Ctkong]

On 4/13/2019 at 7:47 PM, Inn Between said:

I can only guess that they've had problems with large-group bookings. where they've keep tables saved for people who don't show up during the prime dining times and lost walk-up business.

 

Then again, if you're trying to operate with standard Western logic in Thailand, you've going to hit walls a lot. 

 

The first idea is a just wild thought, and hopefully somebody who works or has worked in the restaurant business can shed some light on the situation if it is indeed a trade practice. 

Busy period is usually 7 -9 pm so 6 pm is ok for booking even if possibility of no show. In Thailand, there is no penalty charge for no show unlike other countries where they charge a nominal fee of US$15 per booking in case of no show. 

[Ctkong]

3 hours ago, fruitman said:

How would a restaurant do that? So you call them to make a booking and they'll say please Paypal us 2000 baht right now to make your booking? And if you don't show up within 30 minutes after the booked time you'll loose the 2000.

 

That won't work.

There are a couple of restaurants in Bangkok near my place with karaoke rooms that need booking. Need deposit for karaoke room about tb 800. Deposit done online to their bank account and we just send the acknowledgment message to the restaurant . Seems to be the practice here .

[fruitman]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

There is a reason they do it that way.  And it makes sense if you know anything about eating habits in Thailand.  Don't expect you do.  So not surprised you don't know. 

And it's too hot today to tell the forummembers what those 'eating habits' are? Why is it that my sidedishes are served (to get cold) before i get any rice?

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, Speedhump said:

If they can price that they made it clear it was not refundable, or was to be used as a cancellation fee, the business should be able to challenge a refund. A credit card company cannot aid and abet fraud/breaking of contract. 

Markup on dinner?  Average restaurant profit 3-5% https://pos.toasttab.com/blog/average-restaurant-profit-margin

 

You really going to mess with it?

[Thingamabob]

Because people book but don't show. Pretty obvious I would have thought.