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EU's Tusk says "dream" of Brexit U-turn not dead

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A post that contained a trolling image that has been posted repeatedly in these Brexit topics has now been removed as well as the earlier postings of that image.  If the image keeps being posted, the member posting that image will receive a warning. 

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3 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It's anyhow only a question of how long the UK leaves, if they leave at all.

The younger generation want to be part of the EU with a huge majority.

So if they leave now just wait long enough and they will join again.

 

I think most educated people know that the UK is much stronger within the EU. But then there are of course all those not so educated people. Maybe they need a couple of years outside of the EU to understand what they are missing.

In the current state it's easy to understand EU politicians who just want to get it over with. The English create so much headache for them. Who wants that headache?

Yes, exactly as I have said before. The old cannot cage the young up, in an idiotically narrow and bigoted vision of the future. The overwhelming majority of the young are, multicultural, outward looking, progressive, liberal, decent and  caring people. The take back control call, doesn't ring any of the usual paranoid bells with them, they know that in the long term THEY have control. Education is a wonderful thing. Fortunately for the Brexiteer leaders the young are too decent to take the revenge they are IMHO entirely entitled to. If I were in their shoes it would be "Up against the wall" although know that nowadays that approach to politics is unacceptable, which is of course correct.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It's anyhow only a question of how long the UK leaves, if they leave at all.

The younger generation want to be part of the EU with a huge majority.

So if they leave now just wait long enough and they will join again.

 

I think most educated people know that the UK is much stronger within the EU. But then there are of course all those not so educated people. Maybe they need a couple of years outside of the EU to understand what they are missing.

In the current state it's easy to understand EU politicians who just want to get it over with. The English create so much headache for them. Who wants that headache?

The tragedy (for the young)  is that the UK will probably not be able to rejoin (even if it ever wants to ) on the same terms. Despite all the negativity,  successive UK governments (from Thatcher to Blair)  had carved out quite an advantageous position for UK residents and businesses within the EU; Having many of the benefits, but staying clear of  some of the problems (present and future)  eg , and most importantly, the preservation (for ever!) of an independent currency and therefore an independent monetary policy. 

In my opinion the Remain side presented the positives poorly, partly out of arrogance (i believe) and partly because maybe they saw the positives, even though significant (IMHO) , as being too subtle and too difficult for most voters. The Leave side had the best slogans!

The scare stories on immigration won the day. I know this from my own (North of England) family most of whom seem to have voted leave, for that reason.

FWIW , my feeling now is lets go for a hard exit, as the other (May and Customs Union proposals) seem to offer nothing better than what the UK already had within the EU. Lets  go all the way and see if the UK can become a kind of (offshore from the EU) Singapore.

However this is likely to be a very very rough ride and i doubt that many in the UK will be prepared for the lifestyle adjustments that will be required!

 

  

Edited by wordchild
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Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, wordchild said:

The tragedy (for the young)  is that the UK will probably not be able to rejoin (even if it ever wants to ) on the same terms. Despite all the negativity,  successive UK governments (from Thatcher to Blair)  had carved out quite an advantageous position for UK residents and businesses within the EU; Having many of the benefits, but staying clear of  some of the problems (present and future)  eg , and most importantly, the preservation (for ever!) of an independent currency and therefore an independent monetary policy. 

In my opinion the Remain side presented the positives poorly, partly out of arrogance (i believe) and partly because maybe they saw the positives, even though significant (IMHO) , as being too subtle and too difficult for most voters. The Leave side had the best slogans!

The scare stories on immigration won the day. I know this from my own (North of England) family most of whom seem to have voted leave, for that reason.

FWIW , my feeling now is lets go for a hard exit, as the other (May and Customs Union proposals) seem to offer nothing better than what the UK already had within the EU. Lets  go all the way and see if the UK can become a kind of (offshore from the EU) Singapore.

However this is likely to be a very very rough ride and i doubt that many in the UK will be prepared for the lifestyle adjustments that will be required!

 

  

For example, in attempting to become a new Singapore do you really think the UK can be spending more than now, in future years,  on welfare, pensions and the NHS? Dream on, i say! 

The UK will need a pretty massive restructuring and attitudes to spending and welfare will need to become more realistic. 

I agree that, its possible, the UK could have a pretty good future outside the EU, however difficult choices will have to be made.  

Edited by wordchild
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Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Loiner said:


There is no tragedy about any imaginary ‘Young’ idea to rejoin the EU. It probably won’t even be there is the not too distant future. The ‘Young’ in the future will be looking back and thinking “Why did all those Remainer idiots want to stitch us up with that failed EU?”
From Ted Heath onwards, successive governments gave away UK independence to the EU, not least Major, Blair and Brown. Don’t you believe that all those concessions would also be quickly eroded after a Remain vote.
There are not very many positives to Remaining. No wonder they were poorly presented. And YES, Remainers are arrogant people. Best slogans? Well you obviously still don’t know what it was all about. Not electioneering or advertising or slogans. The majority of the electorate know they want to Leave the EU from experience of the whole of it and what it will become. Slogans don’t mean a lot.
The immigration stories are true, not for scare tactics, the Remain Project Fear. The people already know all about immigration in their own towns.
I completely agree with a hard as you like exit. The UK will prosper without the EU shackles. We don’t need to become a Singapore but a return of free trade will only enhance the UK world position.

but it wont be a Singapore (or even a free trade)  model , sadly! A free trade model would have a pretty dramatic impact on many UK businesses, likely leading to significant lay-offs and restructuring during the search for new markets and dealing with new inbound competition. In the end this might be for the better and make the UK stronger.    

 But the UK has gotten too soft over the the last 20/30 years and voters just wont take it when they see (and feel)  the consequences of their decision. Free trade might be the wet dream of the economic liberals on the right but my feeling is that, the UK will eventually swing even more to the left than it is now; ie Preserve the welfare state, and higher taxation,   retreat inwards and impose capital controls,   and thrash the UK economy  just as in the 1970,s;

IMF begging bowl (again!),  in around a decade or so?    

Edited by wordchild

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my feeling is that, in the end, the UK will eventually swing even more to the left than it is now; ie Preserve the welfare state, and higher taxation,   retreat inwards and impose capital controls,   and thrash the UK economy again just as in the 1970,s;
IMF begging bowl again in around a decade or so?    

Completely the opposite. With Marxist Jezza at the helm, we won’t turn more to the left than we already are. Haven’t you noticed the rise of ‘populist’ movement in UK and EU? There’s already two more years worth of ‘Young People’ who now realise that the promise of free university fees was a massive labour lie. They have the loans to prove it!
Firstly exit the EU, although touted as an ‘extreme right wing’ move, will place us right into free trade with the whole world, which is not really right wing at all.
The welfare state will undoubtedly be preserved; but must be restructured. Everybody knows that is it being plundered by those that are not ‘entitled’ to it. Cut out the scams and gimmigrants, then there is no need for increased taxation. Capitol controls and IMF are just Project Fear again.
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the UK isnt going to be a singapore,i wish people would wake up,the singapore type of service's and banking are LEAVING because of brexit not arriving like farage and BJ said they would,ever moggers has relocated to Dublin,STOP DREAMING

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3 minutes ago, Loiner said:


Completely the opposite. With Marxist Jezza at the helm, we won’t turn more to the left than we already are. Haven’t you noticed the rise of ‘populist’ movement in UK and EU? There’s already two more years worth of ‘Young People’ who now realise that the promise of free university fees was a massive labour lie. They have the loans to prove it!
Firstly exit the EU, although touted as an ‘extreme right wing’ move, will place us right into free trade with the whole world, which is not really right wing at all.
The welfare state will undoubtedly be preserved; but must be restructured. Everybody knows that is it being plundered by those that are not ‘entitled’ to it. Cut out the scams and gimmigrants, then there is no need for increased taxation. Capitol controls and IMF are just Project Fear again.

whats are gimmigrants,wouldnt of bothered asking but you've acted the grammar police already today,my turn now 😂   populist movements i had to google,never heard of them

Right-wing populism - Wikipedia.html

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Just now, bomber said:

the UK isnt going to be a singapore,i wish people would wake up,the singapore type of service's and banking are LEAVING because of brexit not arriving like farage and BJ said they would,ever moggers has relocated to Dublin,STOP DREAMING

I think this maybe true eventually but at the moment its still a phoney war.  For now Fund Managers and Banks just want to cover themselves in case the "worst " happens and get chips   on the board around the EU. Really its still a minority of senior positions that have been relocated plus some back office build up in places like Dublin (which was going on anyway before Brexit ) . Certainly this is the case in the business i work for. However things are likely to accelerate over the coming months and, for sure will accelerate more if we get closer to an election of a Socialist Government in the UK.

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4 minutes ago, wordchild said:

I think this maybe true eventually but at the moment its still a phoney war.  For now Fund Managers and Banks just want to cover themselves in case the "worst " happens and get chips   on the board around the EU. Really its still a minority of senior positions that have been relocated plus some back office build up in places like Dublin (which was going on anyway before Brexit ) . Certainly this is the case in the business i work for. However things are likely to accelerate over the coming months and, for sure will accelerate more if we get closer to an election of a Socialist Government in the UK.

a socialist govt that would never stood a chance before brexit. 

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