Mueller report leaves Democrats in a quandary

[webfact]

Mueller report leaves Democrats in a quandary

By James Oliphant

 

The Mueller Report on the Investigation into Russian Interference in the 2016 Presidential Election is pictured in New York, New York, U.S., April 18, 2019. REUTERS/Carlo Allegri

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Democrats clamoured for the speedy release of U.S. Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s findings of his probe into whether President Donald Trump's 2016 campaign colluded with Russia. Now they finally have them, and they are confronted with a choice - stay on the attack or move on.

 

Progressives in the party used the report to renew their calls for action, but there was little immediate consensus on how to move forward.

 

Billionaire Tom Steyer, who has pumped millions of dollars of his own money into a campaign calling for Trump’s removal from office, told Reuters that lawmakers in the Democratic-led House of Representatives should begin the process of impeaching Trump, a Republican, based on the evidence amassed by Mueller.

 

Mueller found no evidence of collusion between members of Trump's campaign and Russians, despite numerous contacts, but he amassed a wealth of evidence he said showed the president had sought to impede or control the FBI investigation. He stopped short of concluding that Trump had committed a crime but noted that the U.S. Congress had the power to address that issue.

 

Democratic strategists said Democrats in the House, spurred on by progressives in the chamber, would continue their congressional investigations into Trump, but that Democratic presidential candidates, who hope to appeal to moderates and independents next year, are likely to take a less aggressive approach.

 

"I don’t think Bob Mueller’s report is going to make a difference in Lordstown," said Robin Winston, a former chairman of the Indiana Democratic Party, referring to the auto plant in Ohio that auto giant General Motors shuttered last month.

 

Winston said economic concerns were far more pressing on voters’ minds than the Russia probe and that breathless coverage of the nearly two-year-old probe had left voters “fatigued.”

 

Opinion polls show that the U.S. public has also largely made up its mind about the probe before the report's release on Thursday.

 

A Reuters/Ipsos poll conducted last month after Mueller’s conclusions were first made public showed that about half of the country still believed Trump worked with Russia to influence the 2016 election. More than half said they believe Trump tried to block the probe.

 

Democrats in the House signaled their efforts to investigate Trump's actions would continue. It is unclear, however, what their efforts will yield. Any attempt to force Trump from office would likely be thwarted by the Republican-controlled Senate.

 

The prospect of impeaching Trump has largely been downplayed by Democrats since House Speaker Nancy Pelosi argued it would be counter-productive. But Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, a popular progressive Democratic lawmaker, raised the prospect again on Thursday in a tweet.

 

"Many know I take no pleasure in discussions of impeachment. I didn’t campaign on it, & rarely discuss it unprompted," she said on Twitter. "But the report squarely puts this on our doorstep."

 

ON THE KITCHEN TABLE

Those bidding for the 2020 Democratic nomination took a more cautious path on Thursday. While many called for Mueller to testify before Congress, there was no mention of the "I word."

 

"It is clear that Donald Trump wanted nothing more than to shut down the Mueller investigation," U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders, a Democratic candidate, said in a statement. "While we have more detail from today's report than before, Congress must continue its investigation into Trump's conduct and any foreign attempts to influence our election."

 

Democratic candidates are conscious that their voters are more interested in their positions on healthcare, the economy, immigration and climate change than whether or not Trump conspired with Russia or obstructed justice.

 

Indeed, in a two-day swing through Iowa this week, Mayor Pete Buttigieg of South Bend, Indiana did not hear a question on the topic. That has been similar to the experience of other candidates who have campaigning in early voting states.

 

Buttigieg’s campaign said it has not been a subject on voters’ minds.

 

Former U.S. congressman Beto O’Rourke may have summed up the field’s collective view most succinctly while campaigning last month.

"I think the American people are going to have a chance to decide this at the ballot box in November 2020, and perhaps that’s the best way for us to resolve these outstanding questions,” he said.

 

Democrats could be heeding the lesson of last year’s congressional elections, when they won more than 40 House seats and gained control of the chamber. Successful candidates, particularly moderates, found traction in talking more about kitchen-table issues and less about Trump.

 

"The base gets ginned up – as a presidential candidate you have to decide whether you are going to cater to the base or take a longer view,” said Rodell Mollineau, who served as a top aide to former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid.

 

(Reporting by James Oliphant; Editing by Paritosh Bansal, Ross Colvin and Cynthia Osterman)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-04-19

[rgraham]

Maybe they will do their job now instead of attacking their President.

[Jingthing]

Maybe they will do their job now instead of attacking their President.

Their president? 45 is only the president of hard core base. That's a big part of the problem.

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[ThailandPermanent]

I'm no fan of the Democrats or the Republicans (or Trump)

But the Democrats really need to approach 2020 from a better angle. Trump's base will hold their nose and support him through any screw-up he makes. They do not care about this Russia stuff. Their Russia pushing isn't winning over many new voters

 

If the Dem candidate runs on "We are all Americans", drops the excessive identity politics and proposes sensible border control, they'll win an absolute landslide

Democrats need to drop the hard-left nutjobs like AOC, and the corporate lobbyists like Clinton

Hopefully they choose Andrew Yang. Seems like a good guy

[Kelsall]

The Democratic party is toast.  They put all their eggs into the "get Trump" basket and lost.  It makes no difference who they run, it will be Trump in 2020.

[Mac98]

It will be interesting to see if a Republican challenges Trump for the nomination. 

[KMartinHandyman]

Their president? 45 is only the president of hard core base. That's a big part of the problem.

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Yes the 306 hardcore electoral college votes.

[bristolboy]

Not sure if the Democrats are the only people facing a quandary:

Mueller referred 14 criminal matters to other prosecutors, but only 2 of them are public so far

https://www.businessinsider.com/mueller-report-referred-criminal-matters-prosecutors-2019-4

[Jingthing]

Invitation to impeach. Will the democrats accept it? No idea at this point.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/04/18/mueller-report-sentence-congress-invitation-to-impeach-trump-toobin-ip-vpx.cnn

[Paul Henry]

Pity some reader don't read and understand the FACTS over 50% in the REUTERS poll say they think Trump collaborated with the Russians and over 50% believe he tried to obstruct JUSTICE. How do you think these sane fair minded people will vote in 2020 let alone all the people he has shafted with false promises on health, economy and MAGA (ha ha) a trade war thats easy to win which has cost American households price increase across the board and farmers who are unable to sell their crops and are still waiting for his promises of financial help (subsidies Protectionism) Still most of the heads of government around the world treat him as a joke. 

[Thainesss]

4 minutes ago, Paul Henry said:

Pity some reader don't read and understand the FACTS over 50% in the REUTERS poll say they think Trump collaborated with the Russians and over 50% believe he tried to obstruct JUSTICE. How do you think these sane fair minded people will vote in 2020 let alone all the people he has shafted with false promises on health, economy and MAGA (ha ha) a trade war thats easy to win which has cost American households price increase across the board and farmers who are unable to sell their crops and are still waiting for his promises of financial help (subsidies Protectionism) Still most of the heads of government around the world treat him as a joke. 

 

Id say that if those figures are even remotely indicative of the actual opinions of Trump, the left and their media lapdogs have done a pretty good job manipulating people for the last couple of years and further dividing a nation. 

 

Id also say that if the left actually cared about "Obstruction of Justice" then why did they hamstring Bernie Sanders to give hillary the nomination? She literally and blatantly obstructed justice on multiple occasions. Its just hypocrisy at this point, and tribalism, and politics. 

 

End of the day the left has no message at all, and has no chance in 2020. ALL they have right now is pandering identity politics, division, smears and hypocrisy. They've gone from the "party of the working man" to the "party of anyone BUT the working man".

[bristolboy]

1 minute ago, Thainesss said:

 

 

 

Id also say that if the left actually cared about "Obstruction of Justice" then why did they hamstring Bernie Sanders to give hillary the nomination? She literally and blatantly obstructed justice on multiple occasions. Its just hypocrisy at this point, and tribalism, and politics. 

 

You got some convictions or even indictments to support that contention?

[Thainesss]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

You got some convictions or even indictments to support that contention?

 

You got any for Trump? No? 

 

Have a million seats then. 

[bristolboy]

2 minutes ago, Thainesss said:

 

End of the day the left has no message at all, and has no chance in 2020. ALL they have right now is pandering identity politics, division, smears and hypocrisy. They've gone from the "party of the working man" to the "party of anyone BUT the working man".

What exactly is your idea of the "working man"? A lot bigger percentage of African Americans and Latinos, both working men and working women, are blue collar workers. Who gets their support?  

[bristolboy]

Just now, Thainesss said:

 

You got any for Trump? No? 

 

Have a million seats then. 

I'm not the one who contended that Hillary Clinton "literally and blatantly obstructed justice on multiple occasions."  You are. I certainly never contended that Donald Trump literally and blatantly obstructed justice on multiple occasions.

Double standards much?

[bristolboy]

7 minutes ago, Thainesss said:

End of the day the left has no message at all, and has no chance in 2020. ALL they have right now is pandering identity politics, division, smears and hypocrisy. They've gone from the "party of the working man" to the "party of anyone BUT the working man".

And once again, when Trump supporters have nothing concrete to offer, they revert to predictions about the 2020 elections.

[Curt1591]

13 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Their president? 45 is only the president of hard core base. That's a big part of the problem.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

11 hours ago, KMartinHandyman said:

Yes the 306 hardcore electoral college votes.

We speak of a "hard core base".

Well, it has been often pointed out that Hilary won the "popular" vote. But, if we remove just NYC and Los Angeles votes, Trump won the popular vote by millions.

Talk about hard-core bases ! 

[lannarebirth]

10 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Invitation to impeach. Will the democrats accept it? No idea at this point.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/04/18/mueller-report-sentence-congress-invitation-to-impeach-trump-toobin-ip-vpx.cnn

 

I think better to build a case. Dangle leaks about what may be presented and play for him withdrawing from running in 2020.  Back room deal in other words. Otherwise he'll probably start a war somewhere as  Reagan and Clinton found expedient to do when they needed a bump in the polls and to divert attention elsewhere.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, Mac98 said:

It will be interesting to see if a Republican challenges Trump for the nomination. 

IMO only if he has deep pockets to finance himself. It's unlikely the big finance boys will back a sure loser. Romney?

 

I wish the Dems would just get on and impeach. Sooner they do the sooner they lose in the senate and give Trump more ammunition for the election.

Even if they won, Pence would be a fate worse than Trump for them ( I'd quite like to see that happen ).

 

IMO there is no way they'll go for impeachment. They have to know they'll just look foolish when the senate says no, and the plan is more likely to draw the threat of impeachment out till the election. Now the Mueller report was a big nothingburger ( as some of us have been saying from day one ) they've got nothing else than impeachment to worry at like a dog with a big bone. They can gnaw away and not change anything.

[bristolboy]

4 minutes ago, Curt1591 said:

 

We speak of a "hard core base".

Well, it has been often pointed out that Hilary won the "popular" vote. But, if we remove just NYC and Los Angeles votes, Trump won the popular vote by millions.

Talk about hard-core bases ! 

Remove California and New York from elections. A Republican wet dream!

[Tug]

Imagine a president that was accused of conspiring with a hostile power to get elected said please come look we need to get this behind us let’s get it settled well that’s not what we got this man is rigging the doj to protect himsielf the redacted report is sinking in and it doesent look good for Donald he just isent the right man for the job minimize the damage then out in 2020

[thaibeachlovers]

5 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

And once again, when Trump supporters have nothing concrete to offer, they revert to predictions about the 2020 elections.

Like the Trump haters then. Nothing concrete to offer so just reverted to predictions that the Mueller report would see him gone or in jail.

How is the report working out, so far 555

[bristolboy]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO only if he has deep pockets to finance himself. It's unlikely the big finance boys will back a sure loser. Romney?

 

I wish the Dems would just get on and impeach. Sooner they do the sooner they lose in the senate and give Trump more ammunition for the election.

Even if they won, Pence would be a fate worse than Trump for them ( I'd quite like to see that happen ).

 

IMO there is no way they'll go for impeachment. They have to know they'll just look foolish when the senate says no, and the plan is more likely to draw the threat of impeachment out till the election. Now the Mueller report was a big nothingburger ( as some of us have been saying from day one ) they've got nothing else than impeachment to worry at like a dog with a big bone. They can gnaw away and not change anything.

Remember when Trump promised to finance the 2016 election entirely by himself? So he wouldn't be beholden to anyone?

[Thainesss]

4 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

What exactly is your idea of the "working man"? A lot bigger percentage of African Americans and Latinos, both working men and working women, are blue collar workers. Who gets their support?  

 

What does it matter what their skin color is or what area of the world they come from? If they are here legally then they are all Americans, and American Blue collar workers. Seems to be like you're whole schtick here is implied racism. 

 

[Nyezhov]

7 minutes ago, Thainesss said:

End of the day the left has no message at all, and has no chance in 2020. ALL they have right now is pandering identity politics, division, smears and hypocrisy. They've gone from the "party of the working man" to the "party of anyone BUT the working man".

Well if, and only if, one of the Democratic candidates did a mea culpa on behalf of the party, apologized to Trump and the nation, and threw their support into either a bipartisan commission or Special Prosecutor to investigate Sztrock, Ohr, Page, Brennan, Comey. Lynch et al, Id probably hold my nose at the genteel socialism and consider voting Democratic again...unless it was Bernie, then I would at least admire him as being honourable.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Remove California and New York from elections. A Republican wet dream!

California and N Y can't win the election on their own because of the electoral college. Clever people those founding fathers.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Remember when Trump promised to finance the 2016 election entirely by himself? So he wouldn't be beholden to anyone?

I don't think they had to spend much. CNN and MSM were giving him enormous amounts of free publicity.

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I don't think they had to spend much. 

You do love making those unsupported assertions.

[Thainesss]

8 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

Well if, and only if, one of the Democratic candidates did a mea culpa on behalf of the party, apologized to Trump and the nation, and threw their support into either a bipartisan commission or Special Prosecutor to investigate Sztrock, Ohr, Page, Brennan, Comey. Lynch et al, Id probably hold my nose at the genteel socialism and consider voting Democratic again...unless it was Bernie, then I would at least admire him as being honourable.

 

Tulsi Gabbard is your candidate then, and she's pretty cool but the left has pretty much ostracized her and the media gives her barely any play, lately favoring Buttigeg for some reason. 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

You do love making those unsupported assertions.

Just like someone else I know ????