Thailand ready to face sea-home builder in court

[webfact]

Thailand ready to face sea-home builder in court

By The Nation

 

File photo

 

Deputy Prime Minister Wissanu Krea-ngam said on Saturday that the Thai government has the right to demolish a floating sea home off Phuket seashore and welcomed the threat of a lawsuit by its builder, Ocean Builders.

 

Speaking at a press conference at the King Prajadhipok’s Institute, Wissanu said Thai officials could remove the floating structure, which is located to the southeast of Koh Racha Yai, approximately 12 nautical miles from the mainland, because its presence clearly violated Article 119 of Thailand’s Criminal Code as threatening the Kingdom’s security and sovereignty.

 

Wissanu said the structure would also be an obstacle to marine navigation as it is located near a sea drilling site.

 

Ocean Builders announced it would sue Thailand in an international court if the government removes the seastead.

 

“The Thai government would be glad if a lawsuit is filed. We want a lawsuit to be filed so that we will have a chance to explain the truth,” Wissanu said.

He said attempts have been made to build seasteads in several nations but no government had allowed them and builders were always arrested and legal action taken against them.

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/national/30368046

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2019-04-22

[smedly]

Territorial waters, or a territorial sea, as defined by the 1982 United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, is a belt of coastal waters extending at most 12 nautical miles (22.2 km; 13.8 mi) from the baseline (usually the mean low-water mark) of a coastal state.

[stanleycoin]

Think we all know what way this will go.

Wouldn't want to be sleeping on that thing at night. !!!!!!!

Splosh. 

[JimmyTheMook]

Hope he wins.

[YetAnother]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

because its presence clearly violated Article 119 of Thailand’s Criminal Code as threatening the Kingdom’s security and sovereignty.

what a foolish, insecure place thailand has become

[colinneil]

This matter is being used to divert peoples attention away from other happenings here, nothing else.

Criminal code, kingdoms security, laughable just laughable.

[stanleycoin]

1 hour ago, YetAnother said:

what a foolish, insecure place thailand has become

Nah.

It's always been like that. 

 

 

 

[Youlike]

Who put that concrete pillar into the seabed? And who's gonna remove it?

[yellowboat]

 

4 hours ago, webfact said:

“The Thai government would be glad if a lawsuit is filed. We want a lawsuit to be filed so that we will have a chance to explain the truth,” Wissanu said. 

You never want to go to court if you do not have to .   Shows the level of Wissanu's legal expertise.  Itchy trigger fingers abound in today's Thailand. 

 

The truth is states steal unclaimed land and can hold it if they have the power to do so.  

[Sealbash]

Who put that concrete pillar into the seabed? And who's gonna remove it?

Which pillar is that?


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Orton Rd]

Surely with today's technology a few clicks can tell if he is in or out of Thailand's waters?

[Hayduke]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

“We want a lawsuit to be filed so that we will have a chance to explain the truth,” Wissanu said.

 

He didn't really say that...did he?

 

 

[neeray]

6 minutes ago, Hayduke said:

He didn't really say that...did he?

 

They've already spoken. "My way or the highway".

[holy cow cm]

I can understand Thailand's point and think that in a sense that they are right. But it is 13 miles offshore not 12, and the question is then where was it built?, and what about immigration after that? You fabricate something in Thailand and transport it out there is bypassing customs rules = a crime, and therefore Thailand also considers this as a national security issue that possibility was manufactured on their soil; and then if you leave the 12 mile Thailand zone you have bypassed immigration and customs rules of departure. they will certainly lose in court. what would Russia do? Just blow it up!

[mikebell]

Maintaining a high state of vigilance against invaders is the role of the armed forces; it is their raison d'etre.  Of course the Chinese, building artificial islands, are excused scrutiny so long as they provide the subs.  Thailand cannot see the invasion that is taking place daily.

[neeray]

5 minutes ago, mikebell said:

Maintaining a high state of vigilance against invaders is the role of the armed forces; it is their raison d'etre.  Of course the Chinese, building artificial islands, are excused scrutiny so long as they provide the subs.  Thailand cannot see the invasion that is taking place daily.

Big payoffs make "blinders" work very well. Screw the future, stay the course.

[Don Chance]

1 hour ago, Youlike said:

Who put that concrete pillar into the seabed? And who's gonna remove it?

It is actually a floating metal pillar that is attached to sea bottom with 3 metal cables. It is more like a house boat with a permanent mooring.

 

I don't know how they expect to go back and forth to Thailand from a foreign country? I guess it was all just a tax dodge. Moving to Panama and getting a second passport sounds like a better plan.

[Dogmatix]

Thailand usually comes off badly in international courts where they can’t just fix things, e.g. Pra Viharn, the Expressway Land appropriation case, the jet impounded in Germany in relation to refusal to pay after losing the expressway case. I think what Wissanu means is that they can just refuse to honor the judgement of an international court.

[300sd]

The only thing that this structure threatens is the inhabitants of it, during the first couple of major storms. (if they don't starve to death first)

 

Hazard to navigation, yes only if one is dumb enough to hit it.

 

Should have made this into something positive for tourism and welcomed the idea.....but then I don't understand Thailand "much".

[Tradewind777]

It you are planning to do anything like this, you better get a navy behind you. 

[peter14]

Thailand is failing everything.. the expat and tourist exodus continues...

[Krataiboy]

3 hours ago, YetAnother said:

what a foolish, insecure place thailand has become

It's the way the military mind works, fixated on the irrelevant. Ask any ex-national serviceman who wasted endless hours picking up autumn leaves, whitewashing coal, ironing the pimples out of  boots and shrinking their berets by dunking them in hot water laced with toothpaste.

 

 

[Srikcir]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Wissanu said the structure would also be an obstacle to marine navigation as it is located near a sea drilling site.

A "site" is an area such as seabed and sea surface. It is not a structure. Wissanau does not say the seastead is located near a sea drilling rig. As Thailand owns all natural resources in the EEZ, the whole area is a potential drilling site.

What Wissanau is really arguing is that the government views the EEZ as Thailand's territorial waters and by definition it is not.

How does this small seastead impede marine navigation? It's not like setting up a seastead in the middle of the Hormuz, Singapore and Rock of Gilbrater straits that would hinder transit channels. Regarding net fishing by Thai vessels, otter trawl and push nets haven't been allowed since 1981.
If this case is heard by the International Court (and Thailand's death penalty threat might assure that), the government better have independent foreign experts to assist presenting its case. Prayut's absolute power and control of "evidence" will be meaningless.

[MartinKal]

3 hours ago, YetAnother said:

what a foolish, insecure place thailand has become

The arrogance of this ignorant and disrespectful person thinking he can park his junk on sea-lanes for which Thailand is responsible, as part no doubt of his latest tax avoidance scheme.

 

Next thing you know, he'll be defending the Rohinga and trying to convert good little Buddhists to Christianity.

[MartinKal]

The arrogance of this ignorant and disrespectful person thinking he can park his junk on sea-lanes for which Thailand is responsible, as part no doubt of his latest tax avoidance scheme.

 

Next thing you know, he'll be defending the Rohinga and trying to convert good little Buddhists to Christianity.

[MartinKal]

1 hour ago, neeray said:

Big payoffs make "blinders" work very well. Screw the future, stay the course.

Have you ever wondered why China is building defences along its Eastern, Atlantic, seaboard?

We can only wish they would have no reason to excuse this.

[alanrchase]

I wonder what the reaction would be if Mexicans or Muslims started putting seasteads 13 miles off the coast of the USA?

[stanleycoin]

12 minutes ago, MartinKal said:

trying to convert good little Buddhists to Christianity.

That would be,  a bit of an up hill struggle in Thailand. 

[Tayaout]

Yesterday there was another boat on site that left since. The AIS beacon is still active: https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/centerx:98.595/centery:7.433/zoom:19

[Srikcir]

2 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

the question is then where was it built?

It was built according to the government at a Thai "boat yard." It hasn't been established publicly as to the vessel owners. But note that while Chad Elwartowski is a US citizen, his girlfriend Supranee “Nadia Summergirl” Thepdet is a Thai national.

2 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

But it is 13 miles offshore not 12

I believe that there is a question as to exactly where the "vessel" (as the government calls the seastead!) was moored at sea. The government's stated location is confusing at best and deceptive at worse.

7 hours ago, webfact said:

Thai officials could remove the floating structure, which is located to the southeast of Koh Racha Yai, approximately 12 nautical miles from the mainland

Some OP's have read "12 nautical miles from the mainland as 12 nautical miles from Phuket. But in my read from this and other articles, the seastead is located about 13-15 nautical miles southeast of the island of Koh Racha Yai which itself is about 12 nautical miles from the Phuket mainland. The government has yet to produce a map showing the seastead's alleged location and maybe that's deliberate. In any case the seastead is not located within Thailand's territorial waters wherein Thailand has the right to unilateral control transit of air and seagoing traffic.

2 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

bypassing customs rules = a crime

What customs rules? Customs taxes imports. Exports are taxed by the inbound nation - in this case there is no taxing nation.

As the Thai government is claiming complete sovereignty over the seastead's alleged anchor site, the seastead then never left Thailand! Albeit maybe a VAT has to be paid by the buyer (who has not been confirmed) to the Thai boat yard but that has little relevance to the sea-home leaving the Thai mainland. Another possible nuance is if the seastead vessel is in Thai citizen Supranee's name (again we don't know the owner), is it a crime for her to put the seastead out to sea (assuming the builder complied with marine laws for construction of the vessel)?

2 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

if you leave the 12 mile Thailand zone you have bypassed immigration

We don't know what kind of visa Chad has to know what immigration rules apply nor do we actually know that immigration was bypassed. Immigration typically has offices at major marine ports and I'd suspect that a seaport that builds boats will have immigration presence to be aware of foreigners entering and leaving the harbor. The girlfriend is a Thai citizen which is not an immigration issue. 

To repeat, if the government claims complete sovereignty over the EEZ, the seastead and occupants never left Thailand! Thus, immigration issues are not a factor. Note that Chad has not been convicted of any crime. Yet, the government appears to have presumed him guilty and as such cancelled his visa. I guess now the government can also charge Chad for overstay without a visa. What happened to the rule of law?