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Health insurance mandatory for long-stay foreigners in Thailand

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I believe the spirit of this new requirement is that it is applicable to NEW issues, NOT historic issue and subsequent extension that in effect are O extensions.
 
So, if you had an OA 10 years ago, you are effectively on O extensions now and its not applicable. Thats my take on it.
 
Someone asked the why two types ? well, the OA is issued outside the kingdom the O is in the local IO. As the extensions to the OA are done locally they are in effect now O extension and not subject to the new criteria.
 
That is my opinion. As we all know, Offices and even Officers will vary and its all ultimately down to interpretation. I do believe many are panicking unnecessarily at this stage.
 
To infer its applicable to SELL insurance in my opinion is dispicable, as it is NOT stated nor based in fact that an extension of an OA is included in ANY police order or official statement. (That I have seen)

I don’t believe that the Thai Immigration will see it that way, there are extensions originating from an OA and also originating from an O, although the extensions are one and the same.
For example i am on an extension based on retirement originating from an OA , I have never had an O visa and immigration searching through my passport will only be interested in the OA stamp !!

If the post from Thaivisa Health Protect is correct ( they do seem a little uncertain when pushed though )then mandatory health insurance applies to me too.

Don’t get me wrong, I hope that i am incorrect in my understanding and to be perfectly honest I’m still not 100% sure of the new ruling.
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Then why was one of the conditions of obtaining it was that you had to be having a Yellow Book? A migrant worker doesn't qualify to get a Yellow Book. The condition of having to be a migrant worker was used as a cop out clause when they realised they'd messed up big time due to the amount of farang applying IMO.
It was intended for migrant workers and is still active and available for them. The mix up for resident exoats was due to vague wording of the relevant ditective.

A yellow book is not required gor this ince their work permits already show an address. (Govt hosps do need some proof of address to verify a person belongs to their catchment area if claiming care under a govt health scheme).

Migrant workers can get Yellow book and pink ID card same as resident expats.

I employ 2 migrant workers. Both are enrolled in the migrant health scheme and I pay to renew it for them every year. Only passport (with appropriate visa) and work permit required to do this.

I also got them listed in my Yellow Book and got them pink ID cards, that was in order to register their child in the local school.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

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Hi Everyone,
 
I work for Pacific Cross/Thai Visa Protect.
 
Sorry I am unable to reply to every post.  That is impossible currently, the announcement took us by surprise and was overwhelming with the amount of calls and emails that came in.  To compound matters many people thought this applied to them when in fact not.  If you have got in touch please be patient and everyone will be responded to in due course.
 
Firstly, a point I made earlier that some may have not seen.  We have a plan that meets the visa requirement for NON O A and NON O X.  If you are on a marriage VIsa or NON O yearly extension the mandated insurance does NOT apply to you.  I can't say that the government over time will not roll this out to all visas, I suspect they may, as we all may agree its difficult to say what is around the corner legislation wise.
 
Let me be very clear, we more than anyone realise what a bad initiative this is in terms of coverage.  The plans available to not provide anywhere near the same value and coverage that the former products Thai Visa Protect plans or PCHI plans can provide.
 
May I address the difference in premiums and coverage.  The underwriters and actuaries know that because this product is only applicable to over 50's the expected claims histories and loss ratios will be much higher than the historic products available.  Therefore they have priced accordingly (FYI my understanding is that of the 6 approved vendors we are more competitive than the competition).   That is why the coverage for the premium is less value than the historic plans that can insure from 0-75yrs as a new applicant.  It's a completely different risk profile.  Though on face value I would also question why the differences in ratings. 
 
We would like, more than anyone, that the government allows ANY plan, ours or not, that meets or exceeds the mandated amount to be suffice to obtain the visa.  We are not comfortable selling these designated Long Stay visa plans, not only are they terrible cover, the premiums are expensive when comparing to historic plans.  At this juncture if you need the insurance to meet the requirement we have the approved plan to facilitate that.  That is not to say this is a good plan coverage or value wise!  
 
On a more general note, as I have seen so much misinformation being posted, we can accept new applicants up to 75yrs, over 65's are required to complete a physical exam.  Unlike moratorium plans we fully underwrite each policy, SO BEFORE you decide to accept the offer or not the coverage terms will be in black and white on the offer letter, any exclusions or wait periods will be laid out on the offer letter.  We renew up to 99yrs of age.  As long as an applicant has truthfully and correctly declared everything on the application your policy cannot be terminated.   We are one of the very few onshore companies that can consider some pre existing conditions, we may load a premium to accommodate it, apply a wait period or flat out exclude it.  Each application is looked at on a case by case basis.
 
We do not impose routine inflationary increases, our base rates haven't changed since 2015.  We individually experience rate each renewal.  What does this mean?
 
This will appear 'salesy' to some but I am again trying to be as informative as possible. Most companies typically apply 8-15% year on year, irrespective of your claims history whether large small or none.  Some companies may increase less and some certainly more.  With Thai Visa protect and Pacific Cross plans, if you have made no claims we have discounts rising to 20%, if you have moderate claims (i.e. approx  
I feel awfully sorry for people on this visa type, and concerned about people who are not able to purchase insurance whether they are over 75 or un-insurable,   Again I hope the relevant parties can come to a proper well thought out structure and outcome.
 
 
Thank you for this informatuve post.

As I understand it people are not required to have a specific plan, just insurance of at least 400k inpt (ridiculously low) and 40k outpatient (unnecessary for most people).

Would there be a way for PC to offer a 40k outpt add-on (with deductible options maybe) to its main products so as to make them compliant with these requirements? As it certainly seems wasteful for people to tske out policies for only 400k inpatient max.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

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7 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Thank you for this informatuve post.

As I understand it people are not required to have a specific plan, just insurance of at least 400k inpt (ridiculously low) and 40k outpatient (unnecessary for most people).

Would there be a way for PC to offer a 40k outpt add-on (with deductible options maybe) to its main products so as to make them compliant with these requirements? As it certainly seems wasteful for people to tske out policies for only 400k inpatient max.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Hi Sheryl,

 

Thanks for the courteous reply.  Actually at this moment in time only 6 companies can provide the Long Stay Visa mandated insurance.  I hope as I have said this is opened up to any plan that meets or exceeds the mandated amount.  

 

System and regulatory wise we are not able to just sell add on OPD cover for 40k, it would solve a lot of problems for people with great IPD only plans.  

 

We will have to see how this plays out, one hopes logic prevails.

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1 hour ago, Andrew Dwyer said:


I don’t believe that the Thai Immigration will see it that way, there are extensions originating from an OA and also originating from an O, although the extensions are one and the same.
For example i am on an extension based on retirement originating from an OA , I have never had an O visa and immigration searching through my passport will only be interested in the OA stamp !!

If the post from Thaivisa Health Protect is correct ( they do seem a little uncertain when pushed though )then mandatory health insurance applies to me too.

Don’t get me wrong, I hope that i am incorrect in my understanding and to be perfectly honest I’m still not 100% sure of the new ruling.

I have been here 15yr ish my non O was obtained outside the Kingdom of Thailand my extensions done Immigration.

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Hi Sheryl,
 
Thanks for the courteous reply.  Actually at this moment in time only 6 companies can provide the Long Stay Visa mandated insurance.  I hope as I have said this is opened up to any plan that meets or exceeds the mandated amount.  
 
System and regulatory wise we are not able to just sell add on OPD cover for 40k, it would solve a lot of problems for people with great IPD only plans.  
 
We will have to see how this plays out, one hopes logic prevails.
Are you saying that international insurance is not acceptable and even people with comprehensive internstionsl policirs have to srparately purchase one of these "long stay" policies? If so then no wonder not many takers of the O-X.

The announcements re O-A specifically say that international policies will be accepted if they meet the criteria. (How Embassies and Consulates would go about determining that, is anyone's guess)

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

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I have been here 15yr ish my non O was obtained outside the Kingdom of Thailand my extensions done Immigration.

According to the latest information from Thaivisa Health Protect then you should be exempted from mandatory health insurance.
Me, on the other hand, came here on a non imm B followed by a couple of tourists visas then, my last visa, a non imm OA which gave me permission to stay which I then remained by doing extensions.
So, in effect I am here on extension ( blah blah ) originating from an OA, which if THP are correct means I now need mandatory health insurance !!

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Hi Everyone,
 
I work for Pacific Cross/Thai Visa Protect.
 
Sorry I am unable to reply to every post.  That is impossible currently, the announcement took us by surprise and was overwhelming with the amount of calls and emails that came in.  To compound matters many people thought this applied to them when in fact not.  If you have got in touch please be patient and everyone will be responded to in due course.
 
Firstly, a point I made earlier that some may have not seen.  We have a plan that meets the visa requirement for NON O A and NON O X.  If you are on a marriage VIsa or NON O yearly extension the mandated insurance does NOT apply to you.  I can't say that the government over time will not roll this out to all visas, I suspect they may, as we all may agree its difficult to say what is around the corner legislation wise.
 
Let me be very clear, we more than anyone realise what a bad initiative this is in terms of coverage.  The plans available to not provide anywhere near the same value and coverage that the former products Thai Visa Protect plans or PCHI plans can provide.
 
May I address the difference in premiums and coverage.  The underwriters and actuaries know that because this product is only applicable to over 50's the expected claims histories and loss ratios will be much higher than the historic products available.  Therefore they have priced accordingly (FYI my understanding is that of the 6 approved vendors we are more competitive than the competition).   That is why the coverage for the premium is less value than the historic plans that can insure from 0-75yrs as a new applicant.  It's a completely different risk profile.  Though on face value I would also question why the differences in ratings. 
 
We would like, more than anyone, that the government allows ANY plan, ours or not, that meets or exceeds the mandated amount to be suffice to obtain the visa.  We are not comfortable selling these designated Long Stay visa plans, not only are they terrible cover, the premiums are expensive when comparing to historic plans.  At this juncture if you need the insurance to meet the requirement we have the approved plan to facilitate that.  That is not to say this is a good plan coverage or value wise!  
 
On a more general note, as I have seen so much misinformation being posted, we can accept new applicants up to 75yrs, over 65's are required to complete a physical exam.  Unlike moratorium plans we fully underwrite each policy, SO BEFORE you decide to accept the offer or not the coverage terms will be in black and white on the offer letter, any exclusions or wait periods will be laid out on the offer letter.  We renew up to 99yrs of age.  As long as an applicant has truthfully and correctly declared everything on the application your policy cannot be terminated.   We are one of the very few onshore companies that can consider some pre existing conditions, we may load a premium to accommodate it, apply a wait period or flat out exclude it.  Each application is looked at on a case by case basis.
 
We do not impose routine inflationary increases, our base rates haven't changed since 2015.  We individually experience rate each renewal.  What does this mean?
 
This will appear 'salesy' to some but I am again trying to be as informative as possible. Most companies typically apply 8-15% year on year, irrespective of your claims history whether large small or none.  Some companies may increase less and some certainly more.  With Thai Visa protect and Pacific Cross plans, if you have made no claims we have discounts rising to 20%, if you have moderate claims (i.e. approx  
I feel awfully sorry for people on this visa type, and concerned about people who are not able to purchase insurance whether they are over 75 or un-insurable,   Again I hope the relevant parties can come to a proper well thought out structure and outcome.
 
 


It has nothing to do with risk profiling. It rather reflects the greed of your company by taking advantage of locked-in retirees. Westerners have a higher life expectancy than Thais. Therefore the premiums should even be lower for us than for them in the same age bracket.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
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1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

I have followed the various sagas of foreigners unable to pay hospital bills here in Thailand for over a decade and been directly involved in trying to help sort out a few.

Almost all entailed bills well over 400k. Usually at least 1 million.

Out of curiosity Sheryl, what was the Immigration status of these foreigners.

Tourists, Visa holders, or those on extensions of stay.

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8 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

Of course. It makes perfect sense that the Thais would insist on health insurance for those coming to Thailand to live but not for those already living in Thailand

Why does it make perfect sense ? unless only new arrivals can get sick or that new arrivals are more likely not to pay their bills, otherwise i can't see why you think it makes perfect sense, other than the people already living in Thailand option applies to yourself.

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3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Exactly.

Mandatory health insurance is fine in principal but this is so badly designed that it would both impose an undue financial burden AND leave people inadequately insured.

I have followed the various sagas of foreigners unable to pay hospital bills here in Thailand for over a decade and been directly involved in trying to help sort out a few.

Almost all entailed bills well over 400k. Usually at least 1 million.

And not a single one concerned outpatient fees.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

If you can't pay why are they here <deleted>

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