The Procrustean bed for retirees.

[Lacessit]

At age 76, I am unlikely to get the new mandated health insurance IF it passes into law. AND Immigration insists on applying it to retirement visa extensions of stay. I have top level private health cover in Australia, which is presumably worth nothing in the eyes of Thai officialdom. One size fits all.

So that raises a few questions, such as:

1/ Can I get a different visa, and go back to border hopping? Without insurance and the 800K deposit BS?

2/ If my extension of stay is denied, how long would I have to get out of Thailand?

3/ What kind of lead time should I allow to sell my possessions here? E.g. Car, Scooter etc.?

4/ Most importantly, what is the best way to remove the cash I have here back to Australia? Or to a more retiree-friendly country?

 

Constructive suggestions welcome.

 

 

[DrJack54]

Insurance required for O-A only

[scubascuba3]

Could switch to tourist visas. 6 months Philippines, 6 months Thailand. Might make life more interesting

[AlexRich]

I’m with scuba above on this. You could try to find a couple of countries nearby that you are happy to live in, and just jump around on tourist visas. Get shot of possessions and live out of a 20kg suitcase ... liberating.

 

But if that is too much hassle at your age I’d guess Australia is best. Not a bad place to live.

Edited May 15, 2019 by AlexRich

[Badrabbit]

Insurance required for O-A only

Can you explain what O-A is I thought it was the retirement extension?

Sent from my SM-G610F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[ratcatcher]

3 minutes ago, Badrabbit said:

Can you explain what O-A is I thought it was the retirement extension?

Sent from my SM-G610F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

http://www.mfa.go.th/main/en/services/4908/15385-Non-Immigrant-Visa-"O-A"-(Long-Stay).html

[DrJack54]

11 minutes ago, Badrabbit said:

Can you explain what O-A is I thought it was the retirement extension?

Sent from my SM-G610F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Non immigrant "O-A" long stay visa. Obtained in ones home country. Multiple entry. Not to be confused with non o based on such things as retirement, marriage, dependent Thai child etc. 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

Insurance required for O-A only

It really isn't as crystal clear as that especially going forward. 

[Maestro]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

...I have top level private health cover in Australia, which is presumably worth nothing in the eyes of Thai officialdom...

From yesterday's news articles I understand that your Australian health insurance would have to provide cover for treatment in Thailand. If it does not, your presumption is correct.

[Maestro]

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It really isn't as crystal clear as that especially going forward. 

Quite a lot in the news articles is not clear. We would have to get our hands on the text of what the cabinet allegedly approved last month. I wonder if it has been published in the Royal Gazette.

[Lacessit]

36 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

I’m with scuba above on this. You could try to find a couple of countries nearby that you are happy to live in, and just jump around on tourist visas. Get shot of possessions and live out of a 20kg suitcase ... liberating.

 

But if that is too much hassle at your age I’d guess Australia is best. Not a bad place to live.

Thanks for the input. It's not a bad place to live if you have your own roof over your head. Renting there is very expensive, although I have considered the option of buying a mobile home.

i was not aware one could get six months on a tourist visa alone. Would that involve a border hop every 90 days, or simply doing an extension?

[baansgr]

Although premiums not cheap, AA have a thread and you can still get cover at your age if indeed it is ever required

[Lacessit]

25 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Non immigrant "O-A" long stay visa. Obtained in ones home country. Multiple entry. Not to be confused with non o based on such things as retirement, marriage, dependent Thai child etc. 

I have been under the impression the Non-immigrant O-A is the starting point of the retirement visa, and ensuing extensions of stay. So it depends on whether Thai officialdom interprets the medical insurance requirement as flowing on from the original O-A.

[connda]

Those of us on a Non-O for retirement, marriage, support of a family member.

\\

 

The Thai government has already played its first hand in regards to Non-O retirees by mandating a transfer of wealth from those who wish to stay to the Thai banks.  
Before 800k in the bank for three months; 
Now 800k in the bank for six months and must keep 400k in the bank at all times. (Let not go down the "it's only 800k for two months road.  Thai immigration is not following that law at the local level)

So, we now have a 'shot across the bow' of all long-stay expats in the form of a law now directed at only 'long-stay' O-A visa holders - but for how long before greed wins out and the mandatory 400k/40k insurance for an exorbitant price is required if one wishes to stay?

[Lacessit]

11 minutes ago, baansgr said:

Although premiums not cheap, AA have a thread and you can still get cover at your age if indeed it is ever required

Just checked and no. Duration of travel is too long, only available to persons 70 or less.

In addition, I think the Thai bureaucracy is specifying the medical insurance must be purchased through THAI insurance companies. That m_{akes it even harder to read the fine print, no?}

[xylophone]

16 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Renting there is very expensive, although I have considered the option of buying a mobile home.

Now that sounds appealing and I could do the same in NZ............

 

I have already learned to downsize from a large three bedroomed detached house in NZ to my current 45 square meter apartment, ditching much clutter along the way, and I know now what is important to have and what isn't, and I'm sure I could get my most important things into some sort of large mobile home.

 

Food for thought, thanks.

 

[Lacessit]

5 minutes ago, connda said:

Those of us on a Non-O for retirement, marriage, support of a family member.

\\

 

The Thai government has already played its first hand in regards to Non-O retirees by mandating a transfer of wealth from those who wish to stay to the Thai banks.  
Before 800k in the bank for three months; 
Now 800k in the bank for six months and must keep 400k in the bank at all times. (Let not go down the "it's only 800k for two months road.  Thai immigration is not following that law at the local level)

So, we now have a 'shot across the bow' of all long-stay expats in the form of a law now directed at only 'long-stay' O-A visa holders - but for how long before greed wins out and the mandatory 400k/40k insurance for an exorbitant price is required if one wishes to stay?

If the exodus is sufficiently large to be a loss-maker, no-one will admit it because that will be lost face.

[Briggsy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m88aPNbdFzU

[connda]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

If the exodus is sufficiently large to be a loss-maker, no-one will admit it because that will be lost face.

Exactly.  

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, xylophone said:

Now that sounds appealing and I could do the same in NZ............

 

I have already learned to downsize from a large three bedroomed detached house in NZ to my current 45 square meter apartment, ditching much clutter along the way, and I know now what is important to have and what isn't, and I'm sure I could get my most important things into some sort of large mobile home.

 

Food for thought, thanks.

 

I've developed into something of a minimalist over the years. Started with a big house, quite liked living in a caravan when I tried it on a holiday. Downsized from big house to townhouse to studio apartment. A mobile home is not a big leap for me. All I need is a comfortable bed, TV, laptop with internet connection, and my golf clubs.

[AlexRich]

25 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Thanks for the input. It's not a bad place to live if you have your own roof over your head. Renting there is very expensive, although I have considered the option of buying a mobile home.

i was not aware one could get six months on a tourist visa alone. Would that involve a border hop every 90 days, or simply doing an extension?

 

I'm planning to come back to SE Asia in 2020, and I'm not keen on any of the options that involves keeping money in Thailand. So I'm thinking of spending time in the Philippines (central area with good facilities, like Cebu), or Vietnam, and a month in Bali, and squeeze Thailand for three months on either end. I want to look like a traveller. It's not for everyone. I'll use Air Asia to get around. Another option is a language visa ... but that restricts you to one place in Thailand.

 

 

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, AlexRich said:

 

I'm planning to come back to SE Asia in 2020, and I'm not keen on any of the options that involves keeping money in Thailand. So I'm thinking of spending time in the Philippines (central area with good facilities, like Cebu), or Vietnam, and a month in Bali, and squeeze Thailand for three months on either end. I want to look like a traveller. It's not for everyone. I'll use Air Asia to get around. Another option is a language visa ... but that restricts you to one place in Thailand.

 

 

For me, a problem with Oz is - it's boring after one has lived there most of one's life. SE Asia is a cheaper and more exciting place to live.

I suppose I could work out a plan for three months in each destination - Thailand, Philippines, Cambodia, Indonesia in terms of best logistics. Despite my age, I'm still reasonably fit and strong. It's the mental aspect of constantly uprooting myself which would concern me more.

[JackThompson]

28 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

...

In addition, I think the Thai bureaucracy is specifying the medical insurance must be purchased through THAI insurance companies. That m_{akes it even harder to read the fine print, no?}

They did that for the Non-O-X Visas, but the article-quotes I read indicated foreign-company cover would be acceptable.

 

But, the "outpatient" coverage requirement does indicate it is more of a scam, than to "protect hospitals" from significant unpaid bills.

Edited May 15, 2019 by JackThompson

[Denim]

1 hour ago, AlexRich said:

I’m with scuba above on this. You could try to find a couple of countries nearby that you are happy to live in, and just jump around on tourist visas. Get shot of possessions and live out of a 20kg suitcase ... liberating.

 

But if that is too much hassle at your age I’d guess Australia is best. Not a bad place to live.

 

Cairns is tropical and lots of Japanese women to ogle.

[BritManToo]

20 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

I'm planning to come back to SE Asia in 2020, and I'm not keen on any of the options that involves keeping money in Thailand. So I'm thinking of spending time in the Philippines (central area with good facilities, like Cebu), or Vietnam, and a month in Bali, and squeeze Thailand for three months on either end. I want to look like a traveller. It's not for everyone. I'll use Air Asia to get around. Another option is a language visa ... but that restricts you to one place in Thailand.

 

 

I avoided Cambodia for the last ten years because of everyone badmouthing it.

Then a pal moved there this year, I went to see him January in Siem Reap and loved the place.

Then I went to see him April in Phnom Penh again totally loved the place.

 

I can't believe I avoided it for 9 years .......... it was like Thailand when i first arrived ten years back.

[Date Masamune]

A constructive suggestion.

 

IF you qualify, apply for the Thailand Elite 5 year easy access programme now for 500,000 Baht. If you enter near the end of the visa you can get 6 years out of it working out to approximately 228 bahts per day no need for bank balances of proof of insurance.

[scubascuba3]

i was not aware one could get six months on a tourist visa alone. Would that involve a border hop every 90 days, or simply doing an extension?

You can get 60 day single entry tourist visa then a 30 day extension. Personally I wouldn't do another back to back I'd split it up by going to Philippines or Vietnam etc for example
90 days Thailand
90 days Vietnam
90 days Philippines
90 days Thailand

[Denim]

27 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I've developed into something of a minimalist over the years. Started with a big house, quite liked living in a caravan when I tried it on a holiday. Downsized from big house to townhouse to studio apartment. A mobile home is not a big leap for me. All I need is a comfortable bed, TV, laptop with internet connection, and my golf clubs.

 

At this rate you'll end up living in a shoe box on a rubbish dump or perhaps a golf course.

[scubascuba3]

It really isn't as crystal clear as that especially going forward. 

What's strange is if it is Non Imm O-A only why pick on that, you wouldn't think the O-As are an issue with hospital bills unpaid. I wonder if the problem with O-As is income or 800k doesn't have to come into Thailand

[Lacessit]

9 minutes ago, Date Masamune said:

A constructive suggestion.

 

IF you qualify, apply for the Thailand Elite 5 year easy access programme now for 500,000 Baht. If you enter near the end of the visa you can get 6 years out of it working out to approximately 228 bahts per day no need for bank balances of proof of insurance.

The only problem I have with your suggestion - and I'm not knocking it - is for all we know the Thai bureaucracy will declare it as a rort, and impose more requirements. It's called shifting the goalposts.