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BANGKOK 25 June 2019 08:21
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Germany designates BDS Israel boycott movement as anti-Semitic

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3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Some reasons to reconsider BDS.

 

It's been going on for several years with impact on Israel basically bupkis.

 

BDS couldn't even stop the Eurovision show in Tel Aviv which was a smashing success. Take the hint!

 

The suggestion of equivalence to South Africa is a total fail. White south Africans were actually colonial exploiters and had no historical connection to the land. Jews on the other hand turned to Zionism in reaction to thousands of years of persecution in the diaspora. The connection between the Jewish people and the land of Israel is very real and very ancient.

 

The goals of BDS leadership are not innocent. They mirror mainstream Palestinian goals of kicking the Jews out of Israel and killing the ones that won't go.

 

Many sick examples of antisemitism among BDS activists internationally. Failing to differentiate between Israel government policies and Jews and products sold by Jews in general.

 

The USA is never going to get behind BDS like it did in the case of South Africa.

 

Find another tactic if you seriously want to promote peace and change. BDS will never be that.

 

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

 

 

With regard to the last line - I don't think the concept is a total miss. More to do with the application. Had the BDS agenda actually been less into confrontation, and more into solutions (yeah, including the rhetoric and distancing themselves from extremists/bigots) it may have been more successful.

 

But then, IMO, the BDS isn't really about BDS. If it was, there are more effective ways of going about it, and it would make better sense taking a more nuanced approach. What the BDS is actually "good" for, is  making extreme criticism/demonization of Israel more mainstream. The false narrative implied is that the BDS is a civil rights movement, hence people supporting it can't be bigots, extremists, racists or whatever.

 

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2 hours ago, dexterm said:

>>The goals of BDS leadership are not innocent.

...link please.

 

 

Of course the religion Judaism has historical connections to Palestine, as do other peoples and religions, but that does not prevent Israel from being a European colonialist project.


How come in 1948 36 of the 37 signatories to the Declaration of Israel's Independence were born overseas, and only one of its 11 Prime Minsters, Netanyahu, was born in Israel (after of course Zionists renamed Palestine). His father was Polish and his grandmother Lithuanian.

 

How about some consideration for the indigenous Palestinian people who were the majority population when Zionist migration first started over 100 years ago and still are the majority today if they were given one man one vote.

 

All BDS is saying is end that colonialist racist supremacy. Give Palestinians their human and civil rights, recognise the wrongs that have been done in the past and work out a way of living peacefully together in one or two states..if the latter, start by ending the illegal occupation.
 

 

BDS positions, views, agenda and ideology were discussed on this forum plenty of times. You have taken part in many, if not most such "discussions". Pretending things were never sourced is just an attempt to derail the topic. We don't have to rehash each and every detail in order to discuss something which have been discussed many times in the past. If you're having trouble remembering what the BDS is about, go have a look at these topics, open the relevant Wikipedia pages or whatever - and cherry-pick a version to your liking. 

 

I think you'll find it difficult to come up with an example of a colonial project which was founded on much of a historical, religious and cultural connection basis. And, of course, not really what this topic is about. Same goes for the usual talking point about signatories of Israel's Deceleration of Independence - doesn't have anything to do with anything, certainly not with the OP.

 

As for "all BDS is saying...." - no. The BDS rhetoric and agenda go further than that, and so do yours. Trying to pretend otherwise doesn't cut it.

 

 

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The insult phrase "Progressive Except Palestine" typically used to attack progressive Jews in particular is related to this. So for an extremist BDS supporter a progressive Jew that doesn't support BDS for lots of good reasons (it's too much like Nazi don't buy from Jews laws, it's leadership supports destroying Israel, etc.) is a so called PEP.

Here's an interesting twist on that --

prog.jpg.55ec503ecb51efb2135b851250213150.jpg

 

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14 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

The insult phrase "Progressive Except Palestine" typically used to attack progressive Jews in particular is related to this. So for an extremist BDS supporter a progressive Jew that doesn't support BDS for lots of good reasons (it's too much like Nazi don't buy from Jews laws, it's leadership supports destroying Israel, etc.) is a so called PEP.

Here's an interesting twist on that --

prog.jpg.55ec503ecb51efb2135b851250213150.jpg

 

Until the last line I thought you were talking about Israel.

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1 minute ago, stevenl said:

Until the last line I thought you were talking about Israel.

I'm so not surprised.

Yes, the right wing is way too strong in Israel.

Another twist on PEP at the people using that lame insult is -- regressive because of Palestine. 

Not saying that is deserved anymore than PEP is but I posted this so that people might think a little bit about exactly what they are supporting by supporting the BDS movement. 

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On 5/18/2019 at 8:26 AM, Morch said:

 

I'm sure you're proud, but also not particularly informed. The amount of Israeli-related stuff in tech and medicine makes it quite difficult to avoid all related products. People into this nonsense usually focus on the more obvious, or convenient objects. Let's just say that not buying anything made in Israel doesn't really cover it. But whatever gets you through the day.

 

With regard to BDS rhetoric and politics, it usually inhabits the more extreme version of "solutions" - with a strong showing of half-cooked one-state notions. In the same manner, it is rather hard to claim wishing for peaceful, cooperative solutions when engaging in the sort of extreme rhetoric such as appearing in the post above.  

 

As for the German decision - I wouldn't label all BDS efforts and activists as being about antisemitism. There's obviously quite a lot of that, yes - but bundling everyone together is usually a bad move.

 

It is virtually impossible to avoid anything having an Israeli content particularly IT products. But these BDS supporters won’t give up their tech stuff or things they want. 

 

Better to boycott the states that want Israel destroyed and kill Christians such as most of their neighbours run by the ‘religeon of peace’.

 

BDS is a racist policy propagated by the left

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On ‎5‎/‎20‎/‎2019 at 5:29 PM, Morch said:

 

More "what if". If the Palestinians accepted the partition plan, or chose negotiation over rejectionism and violence - they wouldn't be in the sorry state they are in. But in some posters' world, the Palestinians are never ever accountable or responsible for anything, not even their own choices and decisions.

 

How was Israel's withdrawal from the Gaza Strip "pretend" isn't explained. Same goes for the connection between this bogus "argument" and rockets attacks.

 

Peace making takes both side. 

Do tell us how many Palestinian fishing boats set sail to the sea every day?

They are no more "free" than they used to be, except there are no Israelis living in the strip.

The Israelis have all the power, so it's up to them to make the concessions to gain peace.

If they don't, their great grandchildren will still have rockets fired at them

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On 5/20/2019 at 6:19 PM, Jingthing said:

The insult phrase "Progressive Except Palestine" typically used to attack progressive Jews in particular is related to this. So for an extremist BDS supporter a progressive Jew that doesn't support BDS for lots of good reasons (it's too much like Nazi don't buy from Jews laws, it's leadership supports destroying Israel, etc.) is a so called PEP.

Here's an interesting twist on that --

prog.jpg.55ec503ecb51efb2135b851250213150.jpg

 

Wow! Nice piece of bigotry. On the one hand you get indignant if Israeli Jews are all tarred with the same brush, but when it comes to Palesitinian Muslims. not so much.

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5 hours ago, Patriot1066 said:

It is virtually impossible to avoid anything having an Israeli content particularly IT products. But these BDS supporters won’t give up their tech stuff or things they want. 

 

Better to boycott the states that want Israel destroyed and kill Christians such as most of their neighbours run by the ‘religeon of peace’.

 

BDS is a racist policy propagated by the left

 

So, in your obviously informed opinion, anyone on "the left" is automatically a BDS supporter? Care to support this with....anything?

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4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Do tell us how many Palestinian fishing boats set sail to the sea every day?

They are no more "free" than they used to be, except there are no Israelis living in the strip.

The Israelis have all the power, so it's up to them to make the concessions to gain peace.

If they don't, their great grandchildren will still have rockets fired at them

 

Hundreds, if the weather permits. The issue is more to do with how how far they can go to sea. Not that this actually got much to do with the OP, or even my the post your replied to. In fact, it doesn't even relate to your own claim of "pretend". Naturally, no discussion or mention of the reason the blockade is in place, or that it wasn't always the case.

 

The logic of the two bottom lines escapes me. If one follows your argument, it would appear that the stronger party is actually at a disadvantage with regard to negotiations. Other than reflecting some wishful thinking, nothing offered to support this point of view, or the rationale behind it. As for the last bit, maybe so, but that would also imply the Palestinians' lot won't improve. Seems like the main motivation of your posts is less to do with that part of the situation.

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3 hours ago, bristolboy said:

Wow! Nice piece of bigotry. On the one hand you get indignant if Israeli Jews are all tarred with the same brush, but when it comes to Palesitinian Muslims. not so much.

 

And the deflections are off...

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

So calling someone out on a bigoted characterization of the people BDS is supporting is a deflection? You think that should be given a pass? 

Edit: I just noticed that you actually gave Jingthing's bigoted post a "like". Very revealing.

image.png.46efed090b78e3e4455466c0499f6e16.png

So you're the like police now? :stoner:

You know what I think is bigoted?
Progressives mostly in Europe but now spread to the USA telling other progressives that they are not pure enough to be real progressive because they support human rights for Palestinians, usually support a two state solution, and also support the right of Israel to exist and defend itself (even if not supporting the usual right wing governments in power). Often these progressives being attacked that way are Jews. From my POV, that's bigoted. This kind of thing has become a plague on U.S. college campuses where Jews a solid progressive base are having to deal with antisemitism not only from the "trump" style white supremacists but now purist leftists as well. 

 

Edited by Jingthing
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