Exclusive: Google suspends some business with Huawei after Trump blacklist - source

[webfact]

Exclusive: Google suspends some business with Huawei after Trump blacklist - source

By Angela Moon

 

FILE PHOTO: Visitors walk past Huawei's booth during Mobile World Congress in Barcelona, Spain, February 27, 2017. REUTERS/Eric Gaillard/File Photo

 

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Alphabet Inc's Google has suspended business with Huawei that requires the transfer of hardware, software and technical services except those publicly available via open source licensing, a source familiar with the matter told Reuters on Sunday, in a blow to the Chinese technology company that the U.S. government has sought to blacklist around the world.

 

The move could hobble Huawei's smartphone business outside China as the tech giant will immediately lose access to updates to Google's Android operating system. The next version of its Android smartphones will also lose access to popular services including the Google Play Store and Gmail and YouTube apps.

 

"Huawei will only be able to use the public version of Android and will not be able to get access to proprietary apps and services from Google," the source said.

 

The Trump administration on Thursday added Huawei Technologies Co Ltd to a trade blacklist, immediately enacting restrictions that will make it extremely difficult for the company to do business with U.S. counterparts.

 

On Friday the U.S. Commerce Department said it was considering scaling back restrictions onHuawei to "prevent the interruption of existing network operations and equipment." It was not immediately clear on Sunday whether Huawei's access to mobile software would be affected.

 

The extent to which Huawei will be hurt by the U.S. government's blacklist is not yet known as its global supply chain assesses the impact. Chip experts have questioned Huawei's ability to continue to operate without U.S. help.

 

Details of the specific services affected by the suspension were still being discussed internally atGoogle, according to the source. Huawei attorneys are also studying the impact of the blacklist, aHuawei spokesman said on Friday. Huawei was not immediately reachable for further comment.

 

Representatives of the U.S. Commerce Department did not immediately have comment.

 

POPULAR APPS

Huawei will continue to have access to the version of the Android operating system available through the open source license, known as Android Open Source Project (AOSP), that is available for free to anyone who wishes to use it. There are about 2.5 billion active Android devices worldwide, according to Google.

 

But Google will stop providing Huawei with access, technical support and collaboration involving its proprietary apps and services going forward, the source said.

 

Huawei has said it has spent the last few years preparing a contingency plan by developing its own technology in case it is blocked from using Android. Some of this technology is already being used in products sold in China, the company has said.

 

In an interview with Reuters in March, Eric Xu, rotating chairman of Huawei, struck a defiant note in anticipation of retaliatory actions by U.S. companies. "No matter what happens, the Android Community does not have any legal right to block any company from accessing its open-source license," he said.

Popular Google apps such as Gmail, YouTube and the Chrome browser that are available throughGoogle's Play Store will disappear from future Huawei handsets as those services are not covered by the open source license and require a commercial agreement with Google.

 

But users of existing Huawei devices who have access to the Google Play Store will still be able to download app updates provided by Google. Apps such as Gmail are updated through the store, unlike operating system updates which are typically handled by phone manufacturers and telecoms carriers, which the blacklist could affect, the source said.

 

The impact is expected to be minimal in the Chinese market. Most Google mobile apps are banned in China, where alternatives are offered by domestic competitors such as Tencent and Baidu.

 

Huawei's European business, its second-biggest market, could be hit as Huawei licenses these services from Google in Europe.

 

"Having those apps is critical for smartphone makers to stay competitive in regions like Europe," said Geoff Blaber, vice president of research at CCS Insight.

 

(Reporting by Angela Moon; Additional reporting by Georgina Prodhan in London, and David Shepardson and Karen Freifeld in Washington; Editing by Kenneth Li and Daniel Wallis)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-05-20

Follow Thaivisa on LINE for breaking Thailand news and visa info

[zydeco]

Good news.

[grumbleweed]

This is gonna get interesting. Huawei aren't going to take this lying down. They're already the most innovative of all phone providers.

Nothing stopping them challenging Google's dominance too, rather it's given them reason to do so 

[Basil B]

China will probably introduce its own operating system, probably ripping the best bits from Android, Microsoft And Apple.

 

 

[Srikcir]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

"Huawei will only be able to use the public version of Android and will not be able to get access to proprietary apps and services from Google,"

 

5 hours ago, webfact said:

The Trump administration on Thursday added Huawei Technologies Co Ltd to a trade blacklist, immediately enacting restrictions that will make it extremely difficult for the company to do business with U.S. counterparts.

I could see these actions as restricting free market enterprise, in effect violating anti-trust laws. But don't look to the US Attorney General to defend Huawei. If Huawei bothers (ie., if it decides it's cost effective) to challenge such in court as a plaintiff against the US and Google, it will take years to decide, especially if appeals are involved.

 

Of course Trump's initial restrictions of use of Huawei technology was based on "national security" that would override anti-trust laws. That approach was based on the presumption that the Chinese government could force Huawei to make decisions (ie., 'spy') that would be beneficial to the Chinese government and detrimental to the US government and the American people in general. Prevailing legally for either side would be tenuous, especially for the US to present evidence of such concerns.

 

There might be alternatives regarding Huawei's marketing in the US to ensure the national security of the US country and the integrity of US electronic industry - if the government really wanted to see a resolution. That would through legislation similar to limits on foreign ownership and foreign control by foreign airlines.

• By regulation, U.S. airlines must be at least 75 percent owned (as a percentage of shares) and effectively controlled (as a percentage of voting-stock) by U.S. citizens. Additionally, two-thirds of an airline’s governing board and its lead executive officer must be U.S. citizens. https://www.alpa.org/advocacy/foreign-ownership

Huawei would have to form a US subsidiary (call it Hauwei?) structured in a similar manner. Perhaps even take a step further to stipulate US taxation of any of its profits offshore, ie., to the parent company Huawei.

Then it falls to the US government agencies and American shareholders and Board of Directors to assure no Chinese political agendas in the operation of the subsidiary. Otherwise, the subsidiary should be unbridled to operate in the US free enterprise system.

 

[the guest]

This will only force companies to invent their own proprietary systems away from the control of the USA and the west, as the Chinese government are doing now with their own version of GSM, (which by-the-way is far superior). 

 

 

[rabas]

31 minutes ago, the guest said:

This will only force companies to invent their own proprietary systems away from the control of the USA and the west, as the Chinese government are doing now with their own version of GSM, (which by-the-way is far superior).

Can you suggest how the Chinese Government's own version of GSM is far superior? AFAIK, GSM is a global 'standard' meaning when you call from your phone to anywhere they must use the same codecs, encryption and everything else, otherwise you get gibberish. Chinese Government telecom technology would be most superior for Chinese spying, which is what the issue is about.

[mtls2005]

3 hours ago, Srikcir said:

I could see these actions as restricting free market enterprise, in effect violating anti-trust laws.

 

I'm not so sure here.

 

Believe Google licenses Android OS to Huawei, along with support/updates, and access to the Play Store, Chrome, Google Search, YouTube, etc.

 

Imagine that contract is iron-clad and provides Google with most of the leverage.

 

Huawei can probably continue to ship some open source version of Android (AOSP). Apps, updates, patches etc., SOL.

 

 

Google has reportedly revoked Huawei’s Android license

 

Google is currently “reviewing the implications” of the executive order from the White House, but for now, Huawei will reportedly be unable to install Google Play Service on the smartphones henceforth. The crackdown bars Huawei from applying for evaluation of devices under the Compatibility Test Suite (CTS), which any OEM must pass to be able to use the Android branding on its devices and provide services like the Google Play Store, YouTube, Google Search, Chrome, etc. out-of-the-box.

 

Fundamentally, the only way Huawei can now continue using Android onto its smartphones is building its own custom version of Android using AOSP (Android Open Source Project) code, exactly how developers of custom ROMs do. Unlike custom ROMs, however, Huawei might not be able to strap GApps along with the package without going unnoticed by Google.

 

https://www.xda-developers.com/google-revoke-huawei-android-ban-blacklist/

 

 

 

 

[AtoZ]

8 hours ago, grumbleweed said:

This is gonna get interesting. Huawei aren't going to take this lying down. They're already the most innovative of all phone providers.

Nothing stopping them challenging Google's dominance too, rather it's given them reason to do so 

haha - most innovative in stealing

 

They won't challenge shit, all the Chinese sw companies like baidu are second tier poo... they only exist because China won't allow competition

[Orton Rd]

8 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

Please explain without references to Fox News.

Google is something forced on you that as far as I know you cannot delete even if you want to. The only thing of any use is play store and if they can get round that to get apps I'd get another one of their phones just for the lack of Google. Oh they own YT though so that makes them too powerful anyway.

[manarak]

there is something going on...

 

Huawei top exec arrested in Canada, UK campaigns against Huawei, but Germany had a project to partner with Huawei for its networks...

I wonder if "networks" includes personal devices... such as devices used by government

 

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

why do the US want Huawei out of Western tech business so badly? Encryption the US can't crack and device shipments they can't intercept and implant?

 

what's the story behind it?

[ThomasThBKK]

14 minutes ago, manarak said:

there is something going on...

 

Huawei top exec arrested in Canada, UK campaigns against Huawei, but Germany had a project to partner with Huawei for its networks...

I wonder if "networks" includes personal devices... such as devices used by government

 

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

why do the US want Huawei out of Western tech business so badly? Encryption the US can't crack and device shipments they can't intercept and implant?

 

what's the story behind it?

 

Infineon (german company) just banned work with Huawei too: https://asia.nikkei.com/Economy/Trade-war/Germany-s-Infineon-suspends-shipments-to-Huawei-sources

 

Why they want them out? Not sure but its a privately owned company, that isn't even listed on the stock market so no one really knows who controls it ... I do indeed think that they could be a national security issue and europe is better off buying 5g equipment from Nokia and Ericsson ... 

[usviphotography]

3 hours ago, manarak said:

there is something going on...

 

Huawei top exec arrested in Canada, UK campaigns against Huawei, but Germany had a project to partner with Huawei for its networks...

I wonder if "networks" includes personal devices... such as devices used by government

 

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

why do the US want Huawei out of Western tech business so badly? Encryption the US can't crack and device shipments they can't intercept and implant?

 

what's the story behind it?

There are two stories going on. Three, maybe. First, US is in a trade war with China right now so and with Chinese resisting making a deal, you can expect increasing pressure from the United States at all levels. Tariffs and Huawei are in this context just the opening blows of what is to come. Second, China beat US in race to 5G tech. US feels this is an important industry, and didn't want to lose the race, so even if there wasn't a Trade War, they'd still probably use their control of Europe and the Global Economic system to handicap Huawei because it is the only shot America has of catching up in 5G. Third, and this is just a contributing factor, is that Huawei has a long history of blatantly stealing tech and trade secrets from the West. So even though this is quite obviously a "dirty trick" on America's part, it is easy to justify by saying Huawei had it coming to them. 

[mtls2005]

6 hours ago, usviphotography said:

There are two stories going on. Three, maybe.

 

Yes, for sure.

 

Just look at the ZTE saga last year, where trump fought hard FOR ZTE, against his own party, for what seemed like strange reasons.

 

Not sure if he's crazy like a fox, or just not a fox?

 

 

 

 

[manarak]

On 5/21/2019 at 6:39 AM, mtls2005 said:

Yes, for sure.

 

Just look at the ZTE saga last year, where trump fought hard FOR ZTE, against his own party, for what seemed like strange reasons.

 

Not sure if he's crazy like a fox, or just not a fox?

 

Huawei has been building its own OS named "hongmeng" since the ZTE episode.

They want to release the first public version in autumn.

 

This could be actually good news for users, as "hongmeng" must use own maps, own email, own video site, etc. I expect a lot of free stuff is on the way.

 

The US/Google might just have created a large competitor starting out with 250 million customers. Not just for smartphones, tablets and other devices, but also for the internet's largest applications, and... advertising venues.

[BestB]

40 minutes ago, manarak said:

 

Huawei has been building its own OS named "hongmeng" since the ZTE episode.

They want to release the first public version in autumn.

 

This could be actually good news for users, as "hongmeng" must use own maps, own email, own video site, etc. I expect a lot of free stuff is on the way.

 

The US/Google might just have created a large competitor starting out with 250 million customers. Not just for smartphones, tablets and other devices, but also for the internet's largest applications, and... advertising venues.

Highly unlikely . Try using Chinese websites backend and you will understand why I am saying it.

 

i work with pretty much all OTA’s. Some are more complex than others . Ctrip, Chinese largest OTA is an absolute nightmare , extremely user unfriendly, bugged from top to bottom. It is so bad that I have limited my use of it to absolute minimum. 

 

Aliexpress is another example, half of the time it either glitches or bugs out when it comes to functionality.

 

chinese are good at stealing and copying. Sadly not so good and making copies work as well as original

 

look at all the copy phones, looks same, half the functions and falls apart within months of use.

[impulse]

1 hour ago, manarak said:

The US/Google might just have created a large competitor starting out with 250 million customers. Not just for smartphones, tablets and other devices, but also for the internet's largest applications, and... advertising venues.

 

The US/Google didn't create it.  Google (and other US) services like Google search, GMail, YouTube, Facebook, and many others are blocked in China. 

 

Another unequal trade practice done under the guise of "national security" but is really about keeping out foreign competition.  In violation of everything they agreed to when they entered the WTO.

 

[manarak]

On 5/23/2019 at 11:51 PM, impulse said:

 

The US/Google didn't create it.  Google (and other US) services like Google search, GMail, YouTube, Facebook, and many others are blocked in China. 

 

Another unequal trade practice done under the guise of "national security" but is really about keeping out foreign competition.  In violation of everything they agreed to when they entered the WTO.

 

anyway the WTO was mostly about Western countries being allowed to sell their high tech wares to poorer countries in exchange for letting them export some of their agricultural and mineral resources back.

Japan and Korea led the the tech charge, and now that the West can't dominate the tech market anymore, we will witness a comeback of protectionism.

[manarak]

On 5/23/2019 at 11:38 PM, BestB said:

Highly unlikely . Try using Chinese websites backend and you will understand why I am saying it.

 

i work with pretty much all OTA’s. Some are more complex than others . Ctrip, Chinese largest OTA is an absolute nightmare , extremely user unfriendly, bugged from top to bottom. It is so bad that I have limited my use of it to absolute minimum. 

 

Aliexpress is another example, half of the time it either glitches or bugs out when it comes to functionality.

 

chinese are good at stealing and copying. Sadly not so good and making copies work as well as original

 

look at all the copy phones, looks same, half the functions and falls apart within months of use.

 

I have a feeling that Huawei will be a different story.

Their phones aren't bad, but they won't be able to compete with buggy software.

[impulse]

3 minutes ago, manarak said:

I have a feeling that Huawei will be a different story.

Their phones aren't bad, but they won't be able to compete with buggy software.

 

They come out of the box with all kinds of Baidu apps and background processes.   It don't get any buggier...