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sh2019

Has anyone ever RENEWED their 30-year lease without any problem?

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I ALMOST set up a Ltd to buy land + property. I read up on¬†Thai law and decided not to. I am now considering to lease the land and have read all about it ūüėěThere is simply no "secure" way other than the secured lease offshore option which unfortunately, is not available¬†with the villa I'd like to buy. So my question: Has anyone on this forum had a good experience with their 30(+30+30) lease contract and successfully renewed the lease after 30 years? I guess I am clutching straws, I'd just really like to hear a¬†success story between all the doom and gloom. Failing that, has anyone actually been thrown out of their home after 30 years because the lease wasn't renewed as expected? I'd like to hear some real life experience not just speculations that all hell breaks lose if you do this or that.

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Thank you. I think I have come to terms that either I accept that all I'd do is pay a rent 30 years up-front and make the best out of it OR drop it altogether :(((

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The company way might be ok if the company is paying tax as a legit business, so the shareholders are not just nominees.

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2 hours ago, Netease said:

I wouldn't do that, at any time they want you out they will find a way and you won't get your money back

No its not rent its a 30 years lease.

So he can only be kicked out after 30 years.

But its kinda like renting because i can be terminated after the lease expires 

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4 hours ago, ukrules said:

There are two houses in my street that are 'owned' by foreigners with no Thais involved, obvious company owned houses.

 

They're both attempting to sell their houses for between 6 and 8 million Baht.

 

This is a row of townhouses, my next door neighbour (a Thai) was recently booted out of the house over a debt and the 'land department' was called in to provide a proper valuation. It was 2.8 million Baht. My rent in this row of houses if 15,000 / month.

 

The other houses for sale are identical apart from refurbishments, etc.

 

The woman who I live with (also a Thai) told me after speaking to a very informed source that a 5 to 6 years ago the people who owned these houses back then liked to sell them for double the true value and waited until they found some suckers to buy them.....and it worked.

 

This is why one house in a row of houses is 'worth' only 2.8 million and the others are 'selling' for between 6 and 8 million Baht.

 

Needless to say the people who are attempting to sell the houses for 6 to 8 million Baht have had no 'luck' for nearly 2 years now....

 

This practice is kown as the 'greater fool theory' - google it if you're not sure what it means. Essentially it's a business model where you sell to the bumbest idiot you can find for the most amount of money they can afford......

 

There's no such thing as a lease that lasts more than 30 years in Thailand. There should be but there isn't.

What rubbish. The LO regularly values land where I live at 200,000-300,000 per rai whereas it sells for 10 times or more that figure. The LO appraisal (raka pramun) is very often very low I would imagine in other areas too. As for house valuation they would have no idea I'm sure.

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3 hours ago, sh2019 said:

Thank you. I think I have come to terms that either I accept that all I'd do is pay a rent 30 years up-front and make the best out of it OR drop it altogether :(((

You have a 3rd option to set up a Thai company. In 15 years of clients doing this I have never had a problem.

 

Intrigued to know what the offshore lease is too? 

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6 hours ago, sh2019 said:

Thank you. I think I have come to terms that either I accept that all I'd do is pay a rent 30 years up-front and make the best out of it OR drop it altogether :(((

 

There is no way you should ever do that. it does not work, even in in Australia. In the weekend news in Au. there was a report of an ex AFL footballer (Busustow) who paid 40 years rent up front (about $200K), the company he was dealing with went belly up. Reportedly, he may now need to sell his memorabelia to get by. Look for a better option. Why not just rent and move as it falls into disrepair.

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You have a 3rd option to set up a Thai company. In 15 years of clients doing this I have never had a problem.
 
Intrigued to know what the offshore lease is too? 
You will still have to find a Thai shareholder.

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As various people have reported, only the 1st 30 years are protected by law.  The 2nd & 3rd 30 year period renewals (not recognized by the courts) depend on the integrity of the lessor. 

 

To increase your chances....

 

a) It helps if it is a large developer (preferably even a listed co) offering this as standard to tens, if not hundreds of other buyers.  If your agreement is from an individual, his heirs could choose to not renew.

 

b) If you have an option of additional clauses, see if you can get the following added in - probably wont carry much weight, but better than nothing

- Lease payments equivalent to 1/3rd will be refundable for each 30 year lease that is not renewed.  

- If the lease is transferred to a person/entity able to hold freehold - the lease periods are dissolved and it becomes freehold. (some wording to that effect)... ie keeps it attractive if you decide to sell...

- If the laws of the land change to allow longer leases, you have the option of increasing accordingly.

 

To answer your question - I haven't come across anyone who has renewed, some lawyers may have - ie. in Phuket etc. some of the earliest developments may be coming up for renewal.  Some of the lawyers with experience can even tell you which developers to avoid. 

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I'm nearly 80. What is my best option of staying in our house until I die if my wife dies before me ? If I take the 30 year option who do I have to pay the 30 year rent to ?

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Other options to company set-up and 30-year lease include:

 

Right of Habitation (Civil and Commercial Code Sections 1402 - 1409)

Right of Superficies (Civil and Commercial Code Sections 1410 - 1416)

Right of Usufruct (Civil and Commercial Code Sections 1417 - 1428)

 

Translated Thai/English version can be found online.

 

The latter two are considered "real property rights"" and covered by the land title (chanote). Both can be set for either 30 years (inheritable) or lifetime (uninhabitable) and "basically"only differ in transferability as the key point.

 

Note that all three are under the discretion of the Land Department (Gom Tii Din) and while there were no problems in my area, one may want to have a talk with the relevant official in one's area.

 

For detailed infos and contractual hints, please PM...

 

 

 

 

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