johng Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 The increase in world population negates any advances in pollution control. Humans are a parasite in the true meaning of the word, living off and killing the host.Yes no one talks about the need for population control...its all about climate change C02 etc but the root cause is too many humans,endlessly consuming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nontabury Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: Unless they can build a battery that can run a car/ truck for at least 7 hours, towing a trailer, it's a non starter in New Zealand for the rural community, and people like myself. I used to regularly do a 7 hour journey, stopping half way to refuel. No way would we willingly use a vehicle that required a long recharge. Unless the battery can be recharged in under 10 minutes, not going to buy a battery powered car. A 7 hour journey is already long enough without a long stop to recharge. Whatever the method used to provide electricity, it can't work without the distance needed for many of us. However, no problem regarding electric cars in the city- in fact ideal. Just don't expect us all to pay a new price for a car, whatever it is powered by. Second hand cars that are not very old are available in New Zealand for less than $5,000. No way is everyone going to dump perfectly good cars and fork out many, many thousands of $ for a new car. I have read, that they have now developed a charging station that can recharge a vehicle ???? n 5-10mins. Early stages,but it’s coming. I’m no expert in this field, but my son in year 8 Grammar school has mentioned that in the future they may be able to develope nuclear fusion in order to create power,as opposed to splitting atoms. Is he correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johng Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 Ahh yes the nuclear fusion "holy grail" their still searching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overherebc Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 16 minutes ago, johng said: There is still loads of gas and coal,we should use that first like all the other countries in the world would/will. (They said oil would run out years ago) Use what we have until a cheap viable alternative is found I'm for hydrogen...derived from water...one of the most abundant sources on earth. And using it as a fuel produces water. Not sure if they have, as yet, found a safe way to use it in vehicles ( storage ) but it is something that should have have a lot more research done on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johng Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 For vehicles an "on demand" system (with very small storage) should be possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpoint Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: Unless they can build a battery that can run a car/ truck for at least 7 hours, towing a trailer, it's a non starter in New Zealand for the rural community, and people like myself. I used to regularly do a 7 hour journey, stopping half way to refuel. No way would we willingly use a vehicle that required a long recharge. Unless the battery can be recharged in under 10 minutes, not going to buy a battery powered car. A 7 hour journey is already long enough without a long stop to recharge. Whatever the method used to provide electricity, it can't work without the distance needed for many of us. Perhaps they will make modular batteries, say 5 of them in each car, which you don't own, but pay a deposit for. Driving along, you see that 3 are depleted, 2 left, so pull into a station owned by the battery manufacturer and they slide out and replace the depleted ones with fully charged units. You pay for the charge, plus a fee for the hours used on the battery, as recorded by a tamper proof meter attached to each. The depleted ones are recharged at the station and reused. Meanwhile, the car's onboard system continues depleting the two original ones sequentially before switching to the first of the newer ones. 6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: However, no problem regarding electric cars in the city- in fact ideal. Just don't expect us all to pay a new price for a car, whatever it is powered by. Second hand cars that are not very old are available in New Zealand for less than $5,000. No way is everyone going to dump perfectly good cars and fork out many, many thousands of $ for a new car. When the technology does catch up, I wonder if there will be an industry converting petrol powered cars to battery power, by replacing the engines, gearbox and fuel tank? In the news it said that the UK is targeting 2050 for the end of the internal combustion engine. If the technology allows it by then, buying a car from around 2040 onwards is going to be challenging, as petrol powered ones will be worthless unless the government provides a subsidy for getting rid of them, or converting to battery power. In any case, I think they will force everyone to self driving cars before then. No doubt some would applaud that, but, being a confirmed petrol head, who could even become a battery head if still allowed the pleasure of driving, I find that sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 3 hours ago, johng said: 4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: The increase in world population negates any advances in pollution control. Humans are a parasite in the true meaning of the word, living off and killing the host. Yes no one talks about the need for population control...its all about climate change C02 etc but the root cause is too many humans,endlessly consuming. But not all humans are equal in this regard. Humans from highly developed economies consume a lot more resources on a per capita basis than do those living in poverty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overherebc Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 13 hours ago, ballpoint said: Perhaps they will make modular batteries, say 5 of them in each car, which you don't own, but pay a deposit for. Driving along, you see that 3 are depleted, 2 left, so pull into a station owned by the battery manufacturer and they slide out and replace the depleted ones with fully charged units. You pay for the charge, plus a fee for the hours used on the battery, as recorded by a tamper proof meter attached to each. The depleted ones are recharged at the station and reused. Meanwhile, the car's onboard system continues depleting the two original ones sequentially before switching to the first of the newer ones. When the technology does catch up, I wonder if there will be an industry converting petrol powered cars to battery power, by replacing the engines, gearbox and fuel tank? In the news it said that the UK is targeting 2050 for the end of the internal combustion engine. If the technology allows it by then, buying a car from around 2040 onwards is going to be challenging, as petrol powered ones will be worthless unless the government provides a subsidy for getting rid of them, or converting to battery power. In any case, I think they will force everyone to self driving cars before then. No doubt some would applaud that, but, being a confirmed petrol head, who could even become a battery head if still allowed the pleasure of driving, I find that sad. The battery exchange roadside battery bank is being tried in at least one place in India at the moment similar to the system you posted about. Think it's being tried out on tuk-tuk style taxis. Cost is the biggest problem at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofarnorth Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 21 hours ago, overherebc said: If per plan ( timing? ) everyone is forced to drive electric or hybrid cars where is all the electricity to recharge all those vehicles going to come from. By the time of all electric vehicles will all the power come from wind farms or solar panels and all gas and coal plants will be shut down? Will everyone have to go 'off grid' and have their own wind/solar power gen' system? Is it possible to power heavy industry, say steel production, from solar/wind systems? I don't think so. You have just reminded me of something I heard several years ago. We were told to get rid of our dirty fuel gussling cars and buy new ones. Then it came out what it costs in fossil fuel emissions etc to produce a new car and it seems the world is better off with our old cars. Of course new cars mean jobs , this is the other side of the coin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeycu Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 22 hours ago, overherebc said: If per plan ( timing? ) everyone is forced to drive electric or hybrid cars where is all the electricity to recharge all those vehicles going to come from. By the time of all electric vehicles will all the power come from wind farms or solar panels and all gas and coal plants will be shut down? Will everyone have to go 'off grid' and have their own wind/solar power gen' system? Is it possible to power heavy industry, say steel production, from solar/wind systems? I don't think so. All countries should be able to generate enough power from all the hot air politicians and their associated bull s= = t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 On 6/13/2019 at 10:45 PM, nontabury said: I have read, that they have now developed a charging station that can recharge a vehicle ???? n 5-10mins. Early stages,but it’s coming. I’m no expert in this field, but my son in year 8 Grammar school has mentioned that in the future they may be able to develope nuclear fusion in order to create power,as opposed to splitting atoms. Is he correct. Fusion is probably just a matter of time, unless they see sense and start developing hydrogen for power stations, hydrogen to power vehicles etc etc etc. Electric cars are a nonsense with present battery technology, too expensive, have to be replaced, cause pollution when discarded, require rare and expensive materials to make, need too much charging time, not enough electricity production to charge every vehicle. I've heard of the 5 to 10 minute charge but I think it's along the lines of someone's wet dream. To see reality, imagine every vehicle on the planet being powered by battery, not just those of a few trendy rich people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 On 6/14/2019 at 3:31 PM, overherebc said: The battery exchange roadside battery bank is being tried in at least one place in India at the moment similar to the system you posted about. Think it's being tried out on tuk-tuk style taxis. Cost is the biggest problem at the moment. Easy for something like a tuk tuk, and zero reason why they shouldn't have been doing that for the last 20 years. Could do it on buses and trucks. Cars as they are now- no way. Would need a complete re design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 On 6/14/2019 at 2:05 AM, ballpoint said: When the technology does catch up, I wonder if there will be an industry converting petrol powered cars to battery power, by replacing the engines, gearbox and fuel tank? Already exists. Battery where the engine is now, and electric motors in the wheel hubs. Wonder why it isn't in use already? On 6/14/2019 at 2:05 AM, ballpoint said: In any case, I think they will force everyone to self driving cars before then. No doubt some would applaud that, but, being a confirmed petrol head, who could even become a battery head if still allowed the pleasure of driving, I find that sad. One solution is to ban car ownership in cities, and everyone rents a car as needed. City cars would be micros that can park sideways on the street in parking areas similar to the way we can rent a bicycle from the side of the street already. Can't see everyone agreeing to buy a NEW car if they get nothing for the old one, and how many people could even afford a new one anyway? Can't see electric in the rural areas though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 On 6/13/2019 at 11:00 PM, overherebc said: And using it as a fuel produces water. Not sure if they have, as yet, found a safe way to use it in vehicles ( storage ) but it is something that should have have a lot more research done on. The latest ( actually been going on a long time ) research makes hydrogen from water IN the car, and uses it directly, so no storage needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: The latest ( actually been going on a long time ) research makes hydrogen from water IN the car, and uses it directly, so no storage needed. Don't think so. Water is fully oxidized hydrogen. To extract the hydrogen in order to oxidize it again would take more energy than would be yielded by burning it. That would violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, bristolboy said: Don't think so. Water is fully oxidized hydrogen. To extract the hydrogen in order to oxidize it again would take more energy than would be yielded by burning it. That would violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics. The researcher that I heard talking on the subject is fully aware of that, which is why research is needed to invent some way of making it work. If it were easy, it would be powering everything already. Maybe those wonderful batteries they are inventing now will be able to power the extraction without needing to be large enough to power the car. Win win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 25 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: The researcher that I heard talking on the subject is fully aware of that, which is why research is needed to invent some way of making it work. If it were easy, it would be powering everything already. Maybe those wonderful batteries they are inventing now will be able to power the extraction without needing to be large enough to power the car. Win win. Not a question of being easy. It's impossible. For the same reason that perpetual motion machines are impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.