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Skin whitening products -- reprehensible or wrongheaded?


Jingthing

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12 hours ago, ballpoint said:

I see skin lightening products as no different in principle, and ultimately less dangerous, than the practice of lying under the sun trying to turn brown.  Neither are things that I would ever do, (not that I would need the lighteners, still being whiter than a white cat in a white room in a white house in a blizzard after over 30 years in the tropics), but I don't really care if others choose to, any more than I do about those who dye their hair or use contacts to change their eye colour.  It's their skin, their life.  

Exactly.  Every time farangs in Thailand bring up this topic, it just oozes with hypocrisy.  Thais trying to lighten their skin is EXACTLY the same as a farangs trying to get a tan.  They're both trying to change their skin color to look better...according to them.  The problem is farangs tend to bring their skin color/racism baggage with them when discussing this topic and none of that applies in Thailand.  It's mostly about people trying to feel better about themselves.  As you say, it's their skin, their life. 

 

 

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You are overthinking this.  Thais define what they find beautiful in themselves.  Who are we to say it’s right or wrong? Also, there is a very big difference between skin bleaching products and skin whitening products. Bleaching the skin is unsafe.  The skin whiteners you find in the supermarket are completely safe and really dont do very much actual whitening.  

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14 minutes ago, chilli42 said:

You are overthinking this.  Thais define what they find beautiful in themselves.  Who are we to say it’s right or wrong? Also, there is a very big difference between skin bleaching products and skin whitening products. Bleaching the skin is unsafe.  The skin whiteners you find in the supermarket are completely safe and really dont do very much actual whitening.  

Exactly.  Many of the whiteners are just high SPF sunblock.  The same stuff that people are told to slather over themselves in Australia and NZ.

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If you’re Brown, you can hang around.

 

If you’re white you are all right.

 

If you’re Tan I have a plan.

 

If you’re Black, I gotta send u back.

 

 All of these creams are crap it’s nothing but a marketing campaign they have D cream night cream whitening cream all D cream and it’s all the same stuff I tried to show my wife the only difference between the night cream and day cream and the whitening cream is they change one or two ingredients so that they can call it something else all of these creams are all the same expensive crap it’s all marketIng.

 

I tried to show her people go to college for four years to study marketing in all it is is a scam’s schemes and tricks to try to get you to buy the product it’s all crap

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1 hour ago, Captain 776 said:

I tried to show her people go to college for four years to study marketing in all it is is a scam’s schemes and tricks to try to get you to buy the product it’s all crap

The ethics of marketing? - easy answer there are none, wait until the algorithms and data mining really start to get perfected. we are in the early days now!

The social divide will continue to grow - the rich getting richer...................

The west is just as vulnerable to marketing BS, folks are convinced that their beliefs are 100% correct and don't realise that they have been pushed into that opinion by ruthless marketing, don't even try to suggest they are wrong - as they have lost the ability to see beyond what is"marketing" & the truth, just like here :shock1:

 

I wonder which is the bigger market, spray on tan or whitening lotions and potions? answer on a post card please ???? 

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Generally speaking I think it's clear that we falangs tend to like darker skinned girls better. Thai, and Lao, women want to be white. But, so many also want a falang husband. Mostly, I believe, because of our earning power or pension or whatever. We tend to have more money than local men and women want a more comfortable life and who can blame them. Also, and this may be confrontational, but I believe falangs tend to treat women better than local men.

 

It's always been a subject of cognizant dissonance to me that Thai and Lao women want a falang but they also want to be white.

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there is some misunderstanding, thais that try to have whiter skin has nothing to do with westerners who enjoy sunbathing and get tanned. Thais with darker skin are ethnically different from the "white" good-looking Chinese/Thais and they are tricked by the marketing into thinking that they will look like them if they just whiten their skin when actually, no matter the skin tone,  it is their bone structure that make them look very unpleasant for the eye. On the other hand Westerners aren't trying to look like Africans, a bit of tanning might make you look healthier and it is part of enjoying the beach life.

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On 6/16/2019 at 9:00 AM, marcusarelus said:

And most like the light skinned women because of their perceived social status.  A man is also ranked by his wife.  Trophy wife gets more points.  Trump is a good example. 

Pamela Anderson is a far, far better example IMHO.

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On 6/16/2019 at 2:11 PM, Jingthing said:

Yeah, it's about much more than sexual attractiveness. It's about perceptions of class being linked to skin lightness. Sadly we see this in many parts of the world. 

Sun tan lotion and spray tanning in the west same same only darker.

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On 6/16/2019 at 6:00 PM, marcusarelus said:

And most like the light skinned women because of their perceived social status.  A man is also ranked by his wife.  Trophy wife gets more points.  Trump is a good example. 

Pamela Anderson is a far, far better example IMHO.

 

 

 

 

No accounting for taste, both look like if they went near a naked flame, they would melt.

 

 

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On 6/16/2019 at 2:21 PM, marcusarelus said:

Falangs like light skinned Thai women better.  Check out the rental prices.  

Are you speaking for yourself only?

 

I presume not since you used the plural, unless you are two people at once.

You certainly aren't speaking for me.

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60% of the world's people are 'Philosopher's Zombies'.

 

They are followers by nature, and extremely vulnerable to social trends and marketing memes.

 

There is no great mystery here. It's only a matter of which social persuasion is dominant in a given country at a given time.

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On 6/17/2019 at 10:31 AM, Berkshire said:

Exactly.  Every time farangs in Thailand bring up this topic, it just oozes with hypocrisy.  Thais trying to lighten their skin is EXACTLY the same as a farangs trying to get a tan.  They're both trying to change their skin color to look better...according to them.  The problem is farangs tend to bring their skin color/racism baggage with them when discussing this topic and none of that applies in Thailand.  It's mostly about people trying to feel better about themselves.  As you say, it's their skin, their life. 

 

 

False equivalence.

 

Tans in the West aren't linked to a caste system, i.e., aren't seen as an indicator of one's socioeconomic status.

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9 hours ago, fusion58 said:

False equivalence.

 

Tans in the West aren't linked to a caste system, i.e., aren't seen as an indicator of one's socioeconomic status.

Nonsense.  You're stuck in the Middle Ages.  Not one Thai out there buying a skin whitening product is thinking of a freakin caste system.  Get real.  What is obvious is that Thais and farangs who want to change their skin color do so to improve their physical appearance.  That's it and that's all.  And it's why it's exactly the same. 

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I think both Thais and westerners are brainwashed by their societies. Thais may say lighter skin is beautiful and darker skin is ugly but why do they think that in such large numbers? Because lighter skin is objectively more lovely? Of course not. I think the comparison to tans is daft. White westerners seeking a tan are usually motivated because it makes them look more healthy and may have the money for tropical vacations. But very rarely do they want to change the racial appearance of their skin permanently. How many westerners get eyelid surgery to make their eyes more Asian? Hmm? 

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52 minutes ago, oruaM said:

nope, westerners are not, there is nothing wrong in the desire to get a bit tanned in summertime, on the other hand Thai girls don't realize the reason white-skin girls are preferred is not only because of their skin color. Get a stunning  white skinned Thai girl and let her get tanned and she will still look stunning, get an isaan girl and bleach her skin as white as you can and she will still look like a mongrel. They are brainwashed into thinking the skin is everything and that is what makes the business so thriving in Thailand

Westerners are not?

Ever heard of white privilege? Institutionalized racism?

White people getting tan are not trying to not be white people. 

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On 6/21/2019 at 8:47 AM, Berkshire said:

Nonsense.  You're stuck in the Middle Ages.  Not one Thai out there buying a skin whitening product is thinking of a freakin caste system.  Get real.  What is obvious is that Thais and farangs who want to change their skin color do so to improve their physical appearance.  That's it and that's all.  And it's why it's exactly the same. 

Not sure if serious.

 

Clearly, you understand very little about Thai culture and the role skin tone plays in signalling social status.

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On 6/22/2019 at 4:56 PM, fusion58 said:

Not sure if serious.

 

Clearly, you understand very little about Thai culture and the role skin tone plays in signalling social status.

No sir, it is you who are so prejudiced in your own western mindset that you would like to think of the Thais as being equally bigoted.  When I lived in the USA many years ago, skin tone (or racial group) did play a role in how one was treated, the sort of job they could get, education, pay, how treated by the police, getting a loan, renting an apartment, purchasing a home, or even hailing a taxi.  Not so in Thailand.  Nowadays, skin color is largely about feminine beauty.  You can't dispute the fact that there are plenty of light-skinned Thais in the north who are dirt poor, while at the same time there are dark-skinned folks who are wealthy.  You guys can keep trying to turn it into something else, but all you're doing is revealing your own bias.       

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11 hours ago, Berkshire said:

No sir, it is you who are so prejudiced in your own western mindset that you would like to think of the Thais as being equally bigoted.  When I lived in the USA many years ago, skin tone (or racial group) did play a role in how one was treated, the sort of job they could get, education, pay, how treated by the police, getting a loan, renting an apartment, purchasing a home, or even hailing a taxi.  Not so in Thailand.  Nowadays, skin color is largely about feminine beauty.  You can't dispute the fact that there are plenty of light-skinned Thais in the north who are dirt poor, while at the same time there are dark-skinned folks who are wealthy.  You guys can keep trying to turn it into something else, but all you're doing is revealing your own bias.       

 

Not so fast...

 

The discussion had nothing to do with racial discrimination in America.

 

You tried to equate the Western (Caucasian) custom of tanning (i.e., voluntary/intentional darkening of one's skin tone) with the use of skin whitening products by Thais.

 

You suggested the motives were the same in both instances, i.e., that the use of skin whitening products by Thais reflected nothing more than an aesthetic preference.

 

Any Western expat who hasn't recently fallen off the turnip truck understands Thais are obsessed with social status, class and pecking order. If your skin is dark, then it's assumed you're a laborer and, hence, a member of the lower class.

 

No such assumptions or judgments are made re: the well-tanned farang: he might be a laborer, or he might be a millionaire who spends his days laying out on the deck of his yacht working on his tan (i.e., exercises an aesthetic preference.)

 

Perhaps it's you who's projecting his own cultural bias here insofar as you don't seem to understand Thailand is not - and has never been - an egalitarian society comparable to the Western democracies (especially the culturally heterogeneous ones.)

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, fusion58 said:

 

Not so fast...

 

The discussion had nothing to do with racial discrimination in America.

 

You tried to equate the Western (Caucasian) custom of tanning (i.e., voluntary/intentional darkening of one's skin tone) with the use of skin whitening products by Thais.

 

You suggested the motives were the same in both instances, i.e., that the use of skin whitening products by Thais reflected nothing more than an aesthetic preference.

 

Any Western expat who hasn't recently fallen off the turnip truck understands Thais are obsessed with social status, class and pecking order. If your skin is dark, then it's assumed you're a laborer and, hence, a member of the lower class.

 

No such assumptions or judgments are made re: the well-tanned farang: he might be a laborer, or he might be a millionaire who spends his days laying out on the deck of his yacht working on his tan (i.e., exercises an aesthetic preference.)

 

Perhaps it's you who's projecting his own cultural bias here insofar as you don't seem to understand Thailand is not - and has never been - an egalitarian society comparable to the Western democracies (especially the culturally heterogeneous ones.)

 

Now you're just being ridiculous.  Social status in Thailand is largely determined by wealth and family connections.  Everyone knows this...possibly even the "Western expat who hasn't recently fallen off the turnip truck."  But you know-it-all farangs want to say it's all about skin color.  That's just idiotic.  Yes, some Thais think lighter skin is more attractive than a darker one.  Just like some farangs think having a tan is more attractive.  But to suggest that Thais walk around comparing skin color to see who has a higher social status...that's freakin asinine.  So is every farang who believes that. 

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Being a fluent Thai speaker, my hobby is to seek out the skin whitening rep in the supermarkey, and ask her (with a straight face) where the skin darkening cream is. The reactions are hilarious!!!!

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That Thai obsession with the skin color is almost insane. Many times my tgf told me that she envied my skin color and I always told her that it is stupid and childish. But nothing helps - the idea lives deep inside her brain, probably from the early childhood. White skin = beautiful in her eyes. I remember my tgf pointing on some fat and ugly farang girl and calling her ‘suay’. Just because of her skin color. What an idiocy.

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6 hours ago, Berkshire said:

Now you're just being ridiculous.  Social status in Thailand is largely determined by wealth and family connections.  Everyone knows this...possibly even the "Western expat who hasn't recently fallen off the turnip truck."  But you know-it-all farangs want to say it's all about skin color.  That's just idiotic.  Yes, some Thais think lighter skin is more attractive than a darker one.  Just like some farangs think having a tan is more attractive.  But to suggest that Thais walk around comparing skin color to see who has a higher social status...that's freakin asinine.  So is every farang who believes that. 

 

Your reading comprehension leaves much to be desired.

 

I didn't say skin color "determined" social status - I said skin color was seen as an outward indication of social status.

 

By now, it's obvious you're the guy who just fell off the turnip truck...

 

 

Quote

Generally speaking, Thai people view lighter skinned women as more attractive than those with darker skin. This is partly due to class and snobbery. One of the reasons is that traditionally in Thailand women with dark skin would be those who worked outside in the rice fields or on farms. In other words they would have been poorer people from the lower classes of Thai society. Class and money remain important to many Thai people and these traditional beliefs and prejudices still hold sway today, although probably not to the extent that they once did. Nevertheless, anybody viewing Thai television commercials can't help but notice the frequent adverts for various skin-whitening products.

 

https://www.thaizer.com/culture-shock/thai-attitudes-to-skin-colour/

 

 

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