Getting Father Home from Thailand

[Gilltom]

Think its british embassy u need to contact. But will be very surprised if they can help.my friend as been there here husband as alzimers and she couldn.t care for him herself so put him in acare home here. Where does your dad live is it pattaya area 

[Gilltom]

18 hours ago, Jingthing said:

You don't want to get him deported. That process could kill him.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

How do i reply to this i put text in but could not find send button. New to thai visa ????

[Just Weird]

3 hours ago, Formaleins said:

18 hours ago, Tagged said:

Have you tried the embassy for help or advise?

The British Embassy will do NOTHING! It is the worst of the worst, he will be lucky if they even lower themselves to speak to him let alone provide any help.

100% trolling nonsense.

[Just Weird]

6 minutes ago, Gilltom said:

How do i reply to this i put text in but could not find send button. New to thai visa ????

You've just done it!

[Gilltom]

17 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

The problem with "getting him deported" here is that a person who finds themselves in that position is likely going to end up getting tossed in a rather unpleasant Thai prison/jail called the Immigration Detention Center in Bangkok, and held there until overpriced travel arrangements are made for his airplane ticket home.

 

There's no "nice" or polite way of getting deported out of Thailand, AFAIK... There's only the very unpleasant, miserable way, especially for an elderly person who may not have his wits about him, and be likely unable to navigate matters very well on his own.

 

Can.t get this thing to work. Private mess me on messenger .gillian thompson 

[Gilltom]

18 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

The problem with "getting him deported" here is that a person who finds themselves in that position is likely going to end up getting tossed in a rather unpleasant Thai prison/jail called the Immigration Detention Center in Bangkok, and held there until overpriced travel arrangements are made for his airplane ticket home.

 

There's no "nice" or polite way of getting deported out of Thailand, AFAIK... There's only the very unpleasant, miserable way, especially for an elderly person who may not have his wits about him, and be likely unable to navigate matters very well on his own.

 

Can.t get this thing to work. Private mess me on messenger .gillian thompson 

[BritTim]

12 minutes ago, Gilltom said:

Can.t get this thing to work. Private mess me on messenger .gillian thompson 

If you want to sen someone a private message through this board, float you mouse over the username to the left, wait a few seconds for a popup box (like that below) to appear, and then click Message near the bottom of that box.

Edited June 20, 2019 by BritTim

[Gilltom]

Sorry to say this but think it would be much better if u could come here.to sort it out unless u have a very reliable person u know well to sort out at this end. My friend as just been through this here with her hubby but was very difficult at the beginning cos he kept denying there was anything wrong. Had to wait till he was very bad before she could put him in a homr here 

[Monkeyrobot]

19 hours ago, Williams9 said:

Just tried ringing the Thai emabassy in London but phone keeps ringing and no answer. Will try again

You need to call the British Embassy, also if he has been in Pattaya for 15 years he must have some friends there. 

[Lemonltr]

Fake lawyers abound here. Make sure that your Thai lawyer is a certified "Thanaikwam" 

His visa status must be clarified and corrected urgently. If you are unable to understand them then contact a Farang visa agent for help. At least this will hopefully give you time to sort things out. 

[Alex2554]

7 hours ago, Benmart said:

"Most" means little. It has provides no examples to measure and in this instance is of little value. From experience, the US Embassy handles each case based on its unique circumstances. As for story of the the nursing facility dropping the person off at the doorstep, I would like to hear an Embassy official opine.

[Williams9]

Thank you for all your responses. It's taken me a while to read through them all.

 

I'll try and answer a few points, questions & address some of the harsh critisism.

 

• Girlfriend - There seems to be one around and I have discussed this with my father and he says he doesn't pay her a lot, but I have my suspicions regarding her as she soon disappeared when I arrived in March and all of a sudden she didn't understand any engilish when I tried to talk to her on her own briefly. The local police liaison officer has had a word with her and told her they are watching her. I don't know if she is still around.
• Finances - He was having over £2,500 going into his account every month. Over the last few months he would be on the phone the day after that had gone in saying he needed more as he's used it. Managed to get access to his online banking and could see that once it went in he was taking it out in cash. Some of his friends can remember seeing him with a lot of cash on him all the time. But he has no idea what he's been spending it on.
• Friends - He has few friends but the circle is getting smaller due to their age some have moved back to the UK some have passed away. Also some have been pushed away as he can become aggressive when questioned about certain things when they are trying to help him.
• Care Homes & Dementia - I'm offended by the talk of the percieved image of care homes in the UK. Our family business is a Care Home based in Wales and this is what we do. I'm fully aware of the progression of dementia and how it affects people. We have been a family run care home for the last 25 years with a very high standard of care reflected in our annual reports by our inspection body.
• Coming to Thailand - I have been out in March but as mentioned he is very adamant that he will not come back to the UK and gets very cross and aggressive when it's mentioned. He will also not move from where he is living at the moment.
• Condo - He owns his own Condo in Pattaya 

 

If anyone could PM me useful contacts/agencies in BKK or Pattaya or Embassy that would great.

 

The thing that is that we want to do our best for him and leaving him out in Thailand the situation is only going to get worse.

 

Many thanks again

[Gilltom]

1 hour ago, Williams9 said:

Thank you for all your responses. It's taken me a while to read through them all.

 

I'll try and answer a few points, questions & address some of the harsh critisism.

 

• Girlfriend - There seems to be one around and I have discussed this with my father and he says he doesn't pay her a lot, but I have my suspicions regarding her as she soon disappeared when I arrived in March and all of a sudden she didn't understand any engilish when I tried to talk to her on her own briefly. The local police liaison officer has had a word with her and told her they are watching her. I don't know if she is still around.
• Finances - He was having over £2,500 going into his account every month. Over the last few months he would be on the phone the day after that had gone in saying he needed more as he's used it. Managed to get access to his online banking and could see that once it went in he was taking it out in cash. Some of his friends can remember seeing him with a lot of cash on him all the time. But he has no idea what he's been spending it on.
• Friends - He has few friends but the circle is getting smaller due to their age some have moved back to the UK some have passed away. Also some have been pushed away as he can become aggressive when questioned about certain things when they are trying to help him.
• Care Homes & Dementia - I'm offended by the talk of the percieved image of care homes in the UK. Our family business is a Care Home based in Wales and this is what we do. I'm fully aware of the progression of dementia and how it affects people. We have been a family run care home for the last 25 years with a very high standard of care reflected in our annual reports by our inspection body.
• Coming to Thailand - I have been out in March but as mentioned he is very adamant that he will not come back to the UK and gets very cross and aggressive when it's mentioned. He will also not move from where he is living at the moment.
• Condo - He owns his own Condo in Pattaya 

 

If anyone could PM me useful contacts/agencies in BKK or Pattaya or Embassy that would great.

 

The thing that is that we want to do our best for him and leaving him out in Thailand the situation is only going to get worse.

 

Many thanks again

There are care homes here my friend as just ad to put her husband in 1.but unless he agrees to this i can.t see how u can do it .you are in a cery difficult situation being as u are not here.don.t want to say ti much on here pm on messenger.gillian thompson 

[Gilltom]

1 minute ago, Gilltom said:

There are care homes here my friend as just ad to put her husband in 1.but unless he agrees to this i can.t see how u can do it .you are in a cery difficult situation being as u are not here.don.t want to say ti much on here pm on messenger.gillian thompson 

What do u want the agencies to do for your dad.?

[Skallywag]

2 hours ago, Williams9 said:

 

• Finances - He was having over £2,500 going into his account every month. Over the last few months he would be on the phone the day after that had gone in saying he needed more as he's used it. Managed to get access to his online banking and could see that once it went in he was taking it out in cash. Some of his friends can remember seeing him with a lot of cash on him all the time. But he has no idea what he's been spending it on

 

The thing that is that we want to do our best for him and leaving him out in Thailand the situation is only going to get worse.

 

So are you sending him more money every month? 

If you are, you are enabling him.  He may actually be hoarding money if he cannot remember

If you have access to his online banking you could force him to sign a power of attorney or else stop his next monthly payment?  Cruel and unusual but maybe necessary?  

 

You say friend mention "he has cash on him all the time.  But he has no idea what he is spending it on" ?

Has he been paying his cell phone bill to call you overseas?  Paying his electric bill at his condo? Paying for daily meals,  getting his laundry done, etc... ?   

 

 

 

 

 

[Gilltom]

34 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

So are you sending him more money every month? 

If you are, you are enabling him.  He may actually be hoarding money if he cannot remember

If you have access to his online banking you could force him to sign a power of attorney or else stop his next monthly payment?  Cruel and unusual but maybe necessary?  

 

You say friend mention "he has cash on him all the time.  But he has no idea what he is spending it on" ?

Has he been paying his cell phone bill to call you overseas?  Paying his electric bill at his condo? Paying for daily meals,  getting his laundry done, etc... ?   

 

 

 

 

 

Think is visa should be looked at as well.did u say is passport said may. If so he is on overstay .have to do immigration every 90 days depending what visa he is on. 

[Gilltom]

7 hours ago, Just Weird said:

100% trolling nonsense.

Yes that i can believe .to many ex pats here for them to deal with i think

[Gilltom]

18 hours ago, Bang Bang said:

What a terrible situation. Choices seem to be:

(1) Trick or force him back to the UK where he'll be locked up in an old home in a country which he hasn't lived in for 15 years and away from the one which he chose to make his home apparently as soon as he could (like most of the rest of us).

(2) Leave him be here to enjoy the few passages of clarity he has as he slides toward the inevitable.

 

I know which I would prefer.

 

Have you thought of finding him a full or part time caregiver? I am guessing 5-10k b. a month would get you one. If the person is trustworthy you could let them handle finances. Might be the best compromise. You love your dad but part of that might be letting go.

Whats he supposed to do.trust a stranger.think not

[Gilltom]

8 hours ago, Just Weird said:

You've just done it!

Thanks didnt scroll down far enough ????

[DaRoadrunner]

6 hours ago, Williams9 said:

Care Homes & Dementia - I'm offended by the talk of the percieved image of care homes in the UK. Our family business is a Care Home based in Wales and this is what we do. I'm fully aware of the progression of dementia and how it affects people. We have been a family run care home for the last 25 years with a very high standard of care reflected in our annual reports by our inspection body.

You own a care home and then come on TV here asking us what to do?

[TPI]

On 6/19/2019 at 6:35 PM, Jingthing said:

I do not know that. I said could not would. Nobody in their right mind would try to get a loved one deported. That is a serious situation in Thailand typically involving detention. That should strictly be a very last resort. Not an opening idea.

 

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

Isn't it irritating that keyboard warriors (KR) instead of either saying nothing, question whether or not you have done your due diligence? Going into Immi. detention must be the last, desperate, thought for anyone caring for "lost" love ones! 

[Williams9]

16 hours ago, DaRoadrunner said:

You own a care home and then come on TV here asking us what to do?

I'm asking how to get him out of Thailand and what processes I need to do out there. If he was in the UK then I could deal with Social Services etc etc. 

I'm looking for service to help me get him back to the UK. I'm aware of all the power of attorney laws processes in the UK and how it works. The problem I have is accessing those types of services in Thailand or if they even are an option to ex pats out there.

[Gilltom]

19 minutes ago, Williams9 said:

I'm asking how to get him out of Thailand and what processes I need to do out there. If he was in the UK then I could deal with Social Services etc etc. 

I'm looking for service to help me get him back to the UK. I'm aware of all the power of attorney laws processes in the UK and how it works. The problem I have is accessing those types of services in Thailand or if they even are an option to ex pats out there.

Really feel for you.you are in a difficult situation.Maybe try british embassy here .if u can get through to them.think u best been here to see a good lawyer because he might get pulled for been on overstay.that would be terrible for him especially with him having dementia

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, Williams9 said:

I'm asking how to get him out of Thailand and what processes I need to do out there. If he was in the UK then I could deal with Social Services etc etc. 

I'm looking for service to help me get him back to the UK. I'm aware of all the power of attorney laws processes in the UK and how it works. The problem I have is accessing those types of services in Thailand or if they even are an option to ex pats out there.

The thing is, if you really are involved with elder care, then you will realize the issues around managing someones expectations and beliefs.. It does seem odd to be posting here in that case. 

 

The fact is there is little to none of 'those types of services' here... Your not going to get social services assistance, you might be able to request or bribe police to assist you an a kind of involuntary forced removal but even that drastic action is likely the absolute best you could hope for. With the options getting far worse from there very rapidly. 

[murraynz]

how old is your father ???   do you know somebody that you trust, who could live in pattaya to 

'watch over him',daily- or maybe he has a reliable 'friend'...you have funds, maybe offer a small cash incentive, not to thai lady though....

perhaps somebody in his condo building, can watch over him...

im very sympathetic,i live in pattaya, but sorry, i cant be a volunteer...

unfortunately, there are too many people in thailand that would be very happy relieving your father of any money he gets...to them, its soo easy for farlang, we have BIG  money---it grows on trees..

i hope your father doesnt drive..that could be lethal...

[murraynz]

3 hours ago, Williams9 said:

I'm asking how to get him out of Thailand and what processes I need to do out there. If he was in the UK then I could deal with Social Services etc etc. 

I'm looking for service to help me get him back to the UK. I'm aware of all the power of attorney laws processes in the UK and how it works. The problem I have is accessing those types of services in Thailand or if they even are an option to ex pats out there.

im no expert, but i very much doubt if there any authorities in thailand, who can help you..

a forced departure ,due to overstay ,seems cruel and brutal to me...as a previous poster said---maybe several of his family or friends can come to pattaya, then trick him into a 'one -way' holiday back to the uk---then you may have bigger problems with him, if he retaliates..once in the uk.

im sure that you dont want him in a locked room...

[NokNokJoke]

What happens if the family does an 'intervention' of sorts, come to thailand under the pretense of a visit, maybe get him to BKK or wherever it will be quicker for him to be deported and on  a plane,  and hand him over to immigration?  Possibly with some donations for expediency and comfort?   He should be banned from coming back into thailand, not sure how willing he will be to stay in the UK or the process to take control over him legally in the UK?

[Williams9]

2 minutes ago, NokNokJoke said:

What happens if the family does an 'intervention' of sorts, come to thailand under the pretense of a visit, maybe get him to BKK or wherever it will be quicker for him to be deported and on  a plane,  and hand him over to immigration?  Possibly with some donations for expediency and comfort?   He should be banned from coming back into thailand, not sure how willing he will be to stay in the UK or the process to take control over him legally in the UK?

I have been on the phone to him again this morning and tried saying I would come over for a week to sort more things out and then for him to come back with me for a while. All I got was a firm NO. He said there is no way I'm getting on a plane to go back. I've pleaded and begged but then the conversation starts again due to the dementia.

If I were to get him to the airport I think he would cause a big scene and refuse and become aggitated and possibly aggressive which would stop us boarding the plan I'm sure.

Friends of ours have just been over last week and have mentioned that he is adamant that he's not returning, they even tried to bring him back on the premise of a short break back home to meet up with old friends & family.

 

As I mentioned before all the ex pat friends that has in Pattaya he has alienated as he becomes cross with them when they try and help etc.

It's a shame that he chose Thailand to live in as it seems that all government & police all need bribing to get anything done and also trying to find someone who speaks Thai and is willing to help is very difficult.

 

I've made contact with the British Embassy in BKK and am waiting a reply

[Williams9]

27 minutes ago, murraynz said:

how old is your father ???   do you know somebody that you trust, who could live in pattaya to 

'watch over him',daily- or maybe he has a reliable 'friend'...you have funds, maybe offer a small cash incentive, not to thai lady though....

perhaps somebody in his condo building, can watch over him...

im very sympathetic,i live in pattaya, but sorry, i cant be a volunteer...

unfortunately, there are too many people in thailand that would be very happy relieving your father of any money he gets...to them, its soo easy for farlang, we have BIG  money---it grows on trees..

i hope your father doesnt drive..that could be lethal...

My father is 74. I've been in contact with the manager at the condo and am looking to see if they can assist.

[Sheryl]

You definitely need to get in touch with the British Embassy in Bangkok. If you can't get through to them from the UK maybe try talking to someone in the Foreign  Office but it is the Brit Emb who will, sooner or later, end up involved in this.

 

The requirements for maintaining a retirement extension of stay ("visa") have recently been made much more complicated and no one with dementia is going to manage it. Hence sooner or later he will be on overstay. When we don't know as the slip of paper you referenced would have been for 90 day reporting not the expiration of his current extension. But regardless of when it is, he is very unlikely to  succeed in getting it extended and thus will be on overstay. (If he does manage it that would call the dementia diagnosis into question!).

 

Once he is on overstay, with the help of the Brit Embassy it might -- just might -- be possible to arrange for police to pick him up for transport to the airport without putting him in the Immigration Detention Center (IDC) but it would have to be carefully finessed. The kind of thing NancyL described happening in Chiang Mai would be unusual in any other part of Thailand. But if it is possible, it would be the Embassy who would know about it.

 

While the Brit Embassy in Bangkok does not seem to  get very high marks from Brit expats  (the Hon. Consul in CM is an anomaly), they will have no choice about getting involved if he ends up in IDC and knowing that, they  might be amenable to trying to avert what will otherwise be a very bad and messy situation.